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21 Sep 06 - 04:15 AM (#1839766) Subject: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,Dazbo Has been seriously injured in an attempt on the British land speed record. He apparently crashed at about 300mph (480kph). latest here |
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21 Sep 06 - 04:49 AM (#1839781) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: The PA I think is really sad and hope he recovers. ......... However, surely this kind of thing was an accident waiting to happen. When JCB broke the land speed record (350.094 mph) to be exact, in August this year, their 'car' was 'driven' by an experienced, qualified jet fighter pilot. These machines cannot be called cars. |
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21 Sep 06 - 05:07 AM (#1839785) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: catspaw49 From most of the racing community on the boards I read, most wish him well but agree he had no business in that car. I hope he fully recovers and remains in the broadcast end of the sport or at the most in amateur racing Spaw |
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21 Sep 06 - 05:23 AM (#1839796) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST So are we expected to feel sorry for someone who drives like a fool ? |
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21 Sep 06 - 05:26 AM (#1839804) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Paul Burke My first reaction was that he who lives by the sword should remember it's got sharp edges. Top Gear is to my mind an utterly destructive program, encouraging irresponsible attitudes to driving and its social and environmental impact. But that said, he's a young bloke with a young family. I hope he recovers soon and learns from the experience. |
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21 Sep 06 - 05:38 AM (#1839819) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST I agree. I see this programme and feel proud that I drive their hated Vauxhall Vectra (and I tow a caravan!). Their preoccupation with style and speed over all else was bound to end in tears one day. We can only be grateful that it wasn't some innocent bystander who copped it. |
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21 Sep 06 - 05:58 AM (#1839824) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,wordy Agree with the above about this dangerous programme. This accident is just another manifestation of what we see in all forms of entertainment, the idea that the amateur can do it just as well as the pro. ("Richard Hammonds...you are Malcolm Campbell!") Well, no they can't, and this is a classic example. It's like putting someone in a jet fighter who's only flown a Chipmunk trainer. The BBC should be ashamed, and the people who okayed this stunt should be fired. |
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21 Sep 06 - 06:38 AM (#1839843) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie Well I wish 'The Hamster' a speedy and full recovery. I also hope that Top Gear returns to reality and becomes a car programme again, and not a series of Hooray Henry type silly arse stunts. Giok |
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21 Sep 06 - 07:30 AM (#1839866) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Paco Rabanne Come back William Woollard! His segments on servicing an Austin Allegro were great. |
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21 Sep 06 - 07:31 AM (#1839867) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Mingulay History has a habit of repeating itself. Back in the early 70's I was heavily involved in drag racing and a group of us race marshals were invited to help crew a jet car at Elvington driven by a mad Swede called Arnie Sundvquist. The car was basically a jet engine (with afterburner) with a Volvo wheel at each corner of the RSJ chassis. During an attempt at the flying kilometre a gust of wind hit the car side on, he popped the 'chutes an flew off into the middle of nowhere. When we reached him he was just climbing out of the cockpit the top of his bonedome (not crash helmet) having been grazed by a 4" diameter wooden stake from a trackside hoarding. Peering into the cockpit we noticed the air speed indicator jammed at just over 300 knots. He was lucky, shaken but unscathed. I hope Richard Hammond recovers and goes off to recuperate with a long caravan holiday. |
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21 Sep 06 - 08:12 AM (#1839891) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Dave the Gnome I add my good wishes for 'the Hampsters' speedy and full recovery. I agree with the other comments as well and hope Top Gear will become a bit more down to earth again. I don't want to loose the reviews of the latest supercars, after all we can all dream ca't we, but Clarkson is at his abosolte best when slagging off the latest clone churned out by the big companies:-) Cheers DtG |
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21 Sep 06 - 08:49 AM (#1839913) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker way back in the 60's.. anyone remember those little blue NHS invalid 3 wheeler cars.. or even the self-propelled wheel chairs powered by hand pedals.. maybe if he survives and is seen to be presenting motoring TV from one of those more gently paced vehicles it might make a more constructive impression on the injury & death mongering boy racer ****s who plague the town where i live.. and will most probably be the cause of me or the wifes premature demise as we get older and try to walk across roads.. |
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21 Sep 06 - 09:30 AM (#1839949) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie Ah yes boy racers, you'll never get me driving like that in my new [to me] 240 BHP Toyota MR2 Turbo. That's if it ever arrives from Japan, where it currently resides. I suppose I could become a Grandad Racer! Giok |
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21 Sep 06 - 11:13 AM (#1840053) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Richard Bridge MR2? Hairdresser! What about a TR2 or a Healey 3000, or a Healey Alvis or an Allard J2R or X, or an XK150? - all much better mannered at the limit, not least because the limit was lower. The E type driven hard was a bit like the Audi TT widowmaker - too sudden! I did from time to time think that Top Gear was irresponsible, particularly when street-racing things like the Ford Asbo as Clarkson dubbed it. Hammond could be a conceited git - his piece in the Mirror advocating queue-jumping at obstructions had me reaching for my horsewhip (and how I chortled a few weeks ago when an artic put a little twonk like Hammond right off the M1 when the said little twonk tried to jump the queue on the inside). But we don't know whether driver error or overenthusiasm (like Donald Campbell) caused this crash, which did not endanger others, so to that extent I sympathise. |
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21 Sep 06 - 11:33 AM (#1840074) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie TURBO hairdresser if you don't mind matey! G ☺ It is the MkII Evolution 3 after all! |
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21 Sep 06 - 01:00 PM (#1840146) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: catspaw49 LOL......Richard, you couldn't get a TR2 going fast enough to get into trouble! And today's hi-perf lines are far better mannered at speed than anything you suggest. I'd love to believe that my '71 Vette with all of it shaking, roaring, and ground pounding excitement, could outperform an '06 but I would only be kidding myself. Thinga have progressed......***sigh***.....and more's the pity. But you just can't go home again. Spaw |
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21 Sep 06 - 01:11 PM (#1840156) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,Shimrod I shouldn't be admitting this but I love 'Top Gear' - and I hate myself for it!!!! Get well soon, Hamster - you silly, silly boy! |
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21 Sep 06 - 01:14 PM (#1840159) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Georgiansilver Anyone who is brave enough to attempt any world land or water speed record has my admiration.....better had it been successful but heres praying and hoping for a speedy recovery....Have another go mate.... |
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21 Sep 06 - 01:20 PM (#1840164) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Mr Red One has to say that a programme and presenters who treat dangerous weapons in such a cavalier fashion cannot be other than circumspect about the dangers. The whole tenor of the program treats cars as playthings rather than the dangerous bludgeons they can be. What it does to the yoof and their driving habits can only be conjecture - but it doesn't make the roads safer - IMNSHO. |
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21 Sep 06 - 01:20 PM (#1840165) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST BBC are hopeful he will make' full recovery' but has a 'significant brain injury.' I think it is unfair that he be called to book for boy racers. There have always and will always be idiots on the road. He was off road and the only person at risk was himself. Yes I think as a father of two young children he should have thought of the risk more. But wish him all the best. |
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21 Sep 06 - 03:05 PM (#1840221) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST Likewise, I don't blame Top Gear for boy racers. Who do I blame? Well, quite often, THEIR FATHERS. |
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21 Sep 06 - 03:15 PM (#1840231) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Darowyn My late father was one of the area engineers who ran the department that were responsible for the blue three-wheeler invalid trikes. Some were made by AC - the sports car company (the Shelby Cobra was originally an AC) some were made by Greeves, who also made Motocross bikes. Both companies produced "special" versions for the Ministry engineers- using 380cc MX motors instead of the 200cc versions. My dad and his colleagues used to play at pulling wheelies and doing traffic light drag races on Blackpool Prom. Some people only become engineers because of the thrill of speed. The problem with Top Gear is the wilfull ignorance about any of the technical stuff - except of course the "nearly FOUR HUNDRED brake horsepower" phrase which come into every car review. Having said all that, I wish Richard Hammmonds a full recovery- because I know full well that if I'd been there, and I'd been offered a run, I'd have gone for the record. Cheers Darowyn |
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21 Sep 06 - 04:41 PM (#1840274) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: SCUNNYBEEKEEPER I consider Top Gear one of the most amusing programmes on the beeb. I hope the hamster soon recovers and returns to verbal jockeying with Jeremy Clarkson . |
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21 Sep 06 - 06:55 PM (#1840361) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Richard Bridge Hmm, another post eaten soddit |
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21 Sep 06 - 07:02 PM (#1840364) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Dave the Gnome Well, if you feed your posts soddit what do you expect, Richard? Treat them with respect and feed them real food. They will thank you for it... :D (tG) |
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21 Sep 06 - 07:03 PM (#1840365) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Lanfranc My wife's uncle mated a Rolls-Royce Merlin to a Morria 8 Series E chassis in the late '40s. Engineers do things like that. Mostly they don't expect the result to handle like a Porsche 911. All the best, Hamster, here's to a full recovery! Alan |
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21 Sep 06 - 07:09 PM (#1840367) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST I think the programme represents the worst of the moronic male. Were I to lead a revolution Clarkson would be the first to go! |
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21 Sep 06 - 07:58 PM (#1840401) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,female driver Jodie Kidd who is very female won the time challenge in the last series. |
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21 Sep 06 - 11:59 PM (#1840515) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Gurney Two of the presenters are bloody loonys, and one of them is the hamster, and I hope he gets well soon. Perhaps they will get that German bird to stand in while he's off. It says on our news that he'd finished his sixth run and something went wrong when he popped the 'chute. I fixed one of those AC trikes for a paraplegic bloke, and had to take it for a test run. Of course. Bloody awful, tiller steering coming from the left side, auto gears, twistgrip throttle and press-down-on-the-tiller brakes. All you had to do with the left hand was turn signals, which didn't self-cancel. If memory serves. |
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22 Sep 06 - 03:08 AM (#1840562) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: The Walrus I'm not a great fan of Top Gear (I'll quite happily watch it, but I wouldn't put myself out to do so). That said, Here's hoping the Hampster has a full and swift recovery. W |
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22 Sep 06 - 03:23 AM (#1840574) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: The PA I dont think I've ever seen so many different spellings of 'hamster'. The only horsepower I'm familiar with is the large hairy kind with four legs and the gas guzzler which pulls his trailer, but my son (16) and I always watch Top Gear and find it mainly hilarious. My husband who is a mechanic and professional engineer thinks its total tripe and never watches. As I said in my original post I hope Hammond makes a full and speedy recovery, I wouldn't wish that sort of injury on anyone, regardless of how it occurred. |
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22 Sep 06 - 04:51 AM (#1840620) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,Dazbo Latest reports say that Richard has suffered serious brain damage but the doctors are hopeful of a good recovery (not a full recovery I notice). Best wishes from me too. |
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22 Sep 06 - 04:53 AM (#1840622) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,Dazbo Sorry, that should read significant brain damage |
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22 Sep 06 - 05:52 AM (#1840651) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,Shimrod One of the television reports, on this incident, suggested that the programme's producer had to fill out a "full risk assessment" before filming could commence. Presumably he concluded that a rocket-propelled car, capable of reaching speeds in excess of 300 mph, didn't represent any sort of significant risk? Just goes to show what a meaningless 'hoop-jumping exercise' most risk assessments actually are! |
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22 Sep 06 - 06:01 AM (#1840656) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Mr Fox You mean he's actually GOT a brain? So should perish all boy racers. Hopefully, the fastest thing he'll be driving from now on will be an electric wheelchair. Clarkson next - with any luck. |
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22 Sep 06 - 06:07 AM (#1840661) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie That is without doubt one of the nastiest posts I've ever seen on this site "Mr Fox" I only hope nobody is wishing the same fate on you, although I could be tempted after that post! Giok |
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22 Sep 06 - 06:07 AM (#1840663) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,Jon Come off it, Mr Fox. I can't stomach the program or its presenters either but I'm not about to wish brain damage or being wheelchair bound on them. |
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22 Sep 06 - 06:13 AM (#1840666) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: skipy If I hate to vote to lose a single member of this "club", Mr Fox it would be you! Skipy |
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22 Sep 06 - 06:54 AM (#1840682) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: The PA Mr Fox has obviously never had to cope with anyone who has undergone any form of brain injury/surgery as I have. I hope Richard Hammond makes a full recovery, and Mr Fox I hope you live to regret your words. Shame on you. |
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22 Sep 06 - 07:56 AM (#1840708) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST Are we supposed to feel sorry for some clown that shows no respect for his wife and children and wants to climb out of a car waving and expecting to be a hero ? His actions were foolish to say the least. My neice was was killed two years ago by a guy driving the oppose direction at 123 mph. No pity for him at all. He brought it upon himself |
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22 Sep 06 - 08:07 AM (#1840715) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,green very cross code man if he's still able to talk after his recovery.. how about he presents a new style responsible road safety tv show co-hosted with Eddie Kidd.. and.. http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/g/grenxcod.htm |
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22 Sep 06 - 08:12 AM (#1840719) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie Not a valid comparison Guest 07:56. G. |
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22 Sep 06 - 08:17 AM (#1840724) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Mr Red If we wish him well can we also wish him circumspection and not a little humble pie? Top Gear is about real people and real cars - it has a duty to respect the dangers implied in HORSPOWER. That is why the presentation is a serious issue. The programme is not a drama, film or soap, it is about real deathtraps. It is only at times like this we can say anything with any impact. Cars kill a lot of people. And 4X4 's (so loved by the programme) kill more per car as a type than any other. And that is just the occupants, we all know about those killed outside the 4X4. Will we see any caveats in Top Gear from now on? Answers are required.................... |
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22 Sep 06 - 08:22 AM (#1840732) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker when i was younger, i used to work as a para-medic in an hospital amputees ward.. most of the young male patients had lost limbs on the roads.. ..at best.. fast cars are natures way of culling surplus macho idiot bloodlines from the genepool.. ..shame about the tragic consequences for the innocent victims of these cretins.. |
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22 Sep 06 - 08:33 AM (#1840741) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Bunnahabhain Yes, it was a silly and risky thing to be doing, but not stupid. Stupid would be taking the same car out onto a public road, and trying the same kind of stunt without emergency personnel standing by. Risk assesments are not about eliminating every risk, that's simply impossible, they're about removing as many of the non-intrinsic ones as possible. |
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22 Sep 06 - 08:48 AM (#1840754) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker btw.. apart from environmental fuel emissions considerations.. i see no problem at all with amateur enthusiasts enjoying testing and racing fast powerfull vehicles in specialist self-contained pro-staffed race tracks and venues.. who wouldn't fancy a go at such an occasional treat and stress-busting playtime.. [me.. i'd jump at the offer of an expensive gift voucher to hurl a tank around a military firing range !!!] but please just keep it safely off the public highways.. |
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22 Sep 06 - 09:03 AM (#1840768) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Grab Presumably he concluded that a rocket-propelled car, capable of reaching speeds in excess of 300 mph, didn't represent any sort of significant risk? Presumably he concluded, like Donald Campbell, Andy Green and numerous others before, that the risk had been minimised as far as possible, and what risk was left was worth taking. This is a classic mistake. The point of risk assessments or any similar formal ways of assessing potentially-dangerous situations is *NEVER* to remove all risk. (If you want to remove all risk, stay at home in your armchair and get fat and lazy, while the rest of the world actually *does* things.) No, the purpose is simply to *assess* what the risks are. When you know what the risks are, you can do something about them - for instance "the brakes fail and I do a Stuka into the wall at the end" has a mitigating action "fit a couple of parachutes". There's still the risk that the brakes *and* the chutes fail, but you've done what you can to reduce the overall risk. In this case, one risk they should have covered was "driver error". Maybe they thought his existing experience was enough. More likely they thought that with some trial runs at lower speeds, he'd be able to see whether he could handle it at full whack - which is exactly what they did (remember that this was his 6th run). Top Gear is about real people and real cars Really? Well, OK, they're real people and real cars, but only in the same way as the Queen driving a Rolls Royce is a real person in a real car. Back in the real world, it's completely outside the experience of just about everyone watching. Consider other motorsport - F1, for instance; that's got real people in real cars, going incredibly fast in difficult conditions. But we don't all rush out to accuse Michael Schumacher of causing their niece's death. And nor do we say "I'm glad Ayrton Senna ran into that wall and died - he was a menace to society". Or maybe a better example would be touring cars, which are actual cars you might be driving every day - no-one says that they're inciting boy racers. Or if they do, (a) I haven't heard them, and (b) they're talking rubbish. Graham. |
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22 Sep 06 - 10:24 AM (#1840817) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie I can't actually remember Top Gear going sentimental over many 4x4s, in fact the only one I remember them featuring was the new Dicovery. I do remember them being very scathing indeed about the poor crash test results on a Freelander. Ken Livingstone has the same rabid response to the words 4x4, in his prejudiced mind it conjures up Toyota Land Cruisers and Humvees, while in reality most 4x4s on the road today wear the badges of Subaru and Audi. Not forgetting this 11'8" 980 kg monster ☺ Giok |
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22 Sep 06 - 10:43 AM (#1840831) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: skipy Breaking News (BBC):- Richard is able to talk again. Skipy |
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22 Sep 06 - 11:00 AM (#1840845) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,Dazbo F1, for instance; that's got real people in real cars, going incredibly fast in difficult conditions. But we don't all rush out to accuse Michael Schumacher of causing their niece's death No but there are plenty of boy racers who do try and drive like that on public roads, and yes some of them have been F1 drivers. |
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22 Sep 06 - 11:09 AM (#1840856) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: skipy It was road speed that put Sir Frank Williams in a wheelchair. Skipy |
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22 Sep 06 - 11:22 AM (#1840869) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie Jeez what a load of po faced killjoys we do have around here, a car doing 10mph can kill somebody. You can't uninvent the motor car, and you can't stop people doing dangerous things in them That is the kind of mentality that would have Mount Everest flattened in case somebody fell off it and got hurt. When asked why he wanted climb Mount Everest Sir Edmund Hilary reportedly said "Because it's there", well cars are there so get over it! Another thing to remember is the old saying about guns, 'Guns don't kill people, people kill people' You could apply the same adage to cars! Giok |
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22 Sep 06 - 11:34 AM (#1840880) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker anyone wants to climb everest ?? let 'em. i dont give a **** what personal risks they take up there as long as they respect the natural mountain environment.. but dangerous assholes driving cars at any speed..?? **** 'em if they get injured or killed ! though the NHS money spent repairing & rehabilitaing them and getting the ****s fit enough to get back on the road.. i can think of more deserving health spending priorities.. |
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22 Sep 06 - 12:00 PM (#1840894) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: JennyO That is the kind of mentality that would have Mount Everest flattened in case somebody fell off it and got hurt. That puts me in mind of parts of Denis Kevans's poem "Concreeto" - "The Mountains are very crooked, very rough job, Full of cracks, very rough, rough rocks, Got to fill it up with the concreeto,..................... ........................................................................ Because concreeto is beautiful…it's a beautiful colour grey-ey-ey…nice and smooooth Nice and square, nice and straight, with the concree-eeto, So the bushwalkers can walk straight up and straight down, Saves time walking round the crooked mountains............" |
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22 Sep 06 - 12:01 PM (#1840895) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Paul Burke Giok, it's easier to kill people if you've got a gun, or a fast car (in a public place). The actual conditions of Hammond's crash are not the issue; the problem is that Clarkson's attitude encourages people to take risks (self- assessed, and usually ill- assessed) in public places. Maybe there ought to be subsidised racetrack burnups for drivers who want them, and instead of fining speeding or dangerous drivers, they lose their entitlement to their day out at the fair. |
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22 Sep 06 - 12:06 PM (#1840897) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST Still I do not think this guy deserves understanding. What comes first in your life, your family or being a smart ass on television. The hospital should bill the producers of the programme. As least this smart ass won't be doing it again. |
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22 Sep 06 - 12:07 PM (#1840899) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: catspaw49 Morris dancing leads to dangerous acting out in public where innocent people are exposed to assholes. Spaw |
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22 Sep 06 - 12:29 PM (#1840908) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie "Maybe there ought to be subsidised racetrack burnups for drivers who want them, and instead of fining speeding or dangerous drivers, they lose their entitlement to their day out at the fair." Track days Giok |
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22 Sep 06 - 12:57 PM (#1840920) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Richard Bridge Actually, there is not a single - I'll repeat that - not a single proven case of an off-roader 4x4, being used for recreational greenlaning on minor highways - ie byways RUPPs UCRs or other unmetalled routes with vehicular rights of way (as distinct from off-road racing or trials, which do NOT use public rights of way) injuring any other user of such routes. Yuppies in Porsche Cayennes in Sainsbury's carpark however - scary! I have been a petrolhead all my life, and I still think there is a serious case to answer that Top Gear encourages irresponsible driving on public roads. The worst culprit is Clarkson, for example dubbing a particular Ford hot-hatch the "Ford Asbo". Hammond, too, encouraged queue-jumping at partial road obstructions. He wrote an article in the Mirror newspaper on it. Very antisocial. And if you saw the piece on caravans on Top Gear you would have seen what a bunch of total idiots they all were (incidentally, people don't queue behind my caravan, usually they have trouble keeping up unless I am obeying a speedlimit which I sometimes do). I feel sorry for his family, but he wasn't a hero, and it was a risk he knew or ought to have known he was taking. Even if it turns out not to have been driver error - it was still a risk he knew he was taking. |
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22 Sep 06 - 01:21 PM (#1840932) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Grab No but there are plenty of boy racers who do try and drive like that on public roads Yep, plenty of prats in the world. When you can show me that they're doing that because they've been influenced by F1/touring cars/World Rally/Top Gear/Herbie Goes Bananas, instead of just because they're prats, then you might have a case. Just saying "they drive fast, and Top Gear presenters drive fast, therefore Top Gear is at fault" is clearly bogus. What comes first in your life, your family or being a smart ass on television. Ask Neil Armstrong and Michael Collins - two out of three of the first moon-shot astronauts were married with kids. I doubt either of them put "being a smart ass on TV" top of their reasons for doing it. Or if it comes to that, try all the professional stuntmen/women working in films and TV who happen to be married. I agree with Paul's idea of getting kids to learn about going fast somewhere where they won't damage anyone other than themselves. I think that'd be a great idea - unlikely to happen, but it's a great idea. Graham. |
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22 Sep 06 - 01:27 PM (#1840936) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST Train drivers take risks, astronauts take risks, motorcycle couriers take risks, vets take risks, farmers take risks, miners take risks, pilots take risks, hot air balloonists take risks, the military take risks, fishermen take risks, lifebost men take risks... none of them have a gun to their head making them do it and none of them are wished an untimely death. |
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22 Sep 06 - 01:28 PM (#1840938) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST, Topsie Richard Bridge - The Top Gear caravan feature was a wind-up, and all the mishaps were quite obviously staged. You weren't supposed to take it seriously! |
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22 Sep 06 - 01:43 PM (#1840944) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST likewise.. prove "top gear" does not contribute to the general malaise.. encouraging a macho culture of selfish and stupidly dangerous behaviour on public roads.. theres still a genuine case to be argued.. even if some individuals are too obtinately biased to consider it valid.. |
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22 Sep 06 - 02:19 PM (#1840958) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Bernard The real morons are those who use their vehicles as weapons on public highways, and put innocent bystanders at risk. When one of these types kills someone, often because their judgement was impaired by alcohol or some such, it is rare they are punished adequately for the deed they have done, simply because they 'had no intent to kill'. I'm afraid there are much worse programmes for glorifying such behaviour on television - I'm thinking particulalry of the 'Real Police Chases' type of voyeurism. It would be interesting to know if any research has been done to examine the effect of such programmes. No matter what our opinions, Hammond was only putting himself at risk, and seems to have been the unfortunate victim of a tyre failure which can happen to anyone with disastrous consequences. Perhaps he was ill advised in taking the risk... but hindsight is such a wonderful thing! |
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22 Sep 06 - 03:03 PM (#1840998) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Interesting comment in a newsreel about the crash, a comment which wasn't followed up. The statement was that the car went out of control after he popped the chute, so driver error may not have been a factor. It amazes me how many people seem to know exactly who to blame before there is ANY hard evidence on which to base a conclusion. I wish I was that clever.........Well actually, NO I DON'T! Don T. |
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22 Sep 06 - 06:15 PM (#1841138) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Gurney James May (the non-loony, just eccentric) presenter, has been to see the hamster, and although he is still very ill, he seems to be 'there.' In Top Gear they do their maddest driving away from public roads, and in cars that boy racers could never afford. I can't remember them ever doing anything exciting in a family car. However, if anyone is expecting political correctness from that programme, don't hold your breath whilst you are waiting. Her Indoors says that if we were waiting for a lead from the non-adventurous, we would still be in the trees. |
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22 Sep 06 - 06:33 PM (#1841147) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST why are the the more conservative libertarians here constantly willfully confusing 'adventurous individualism' with 'stupidly selfish dangerous sociopaths' i cant see anyone here who says theres anything intrisicaly wrong with a spirit of adventure and hedonistic thrill seeking.. just as long as its kept at a safe remove from public roads and town centres |
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22 Sep 06 - 06:52 PM (#1841158) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Richard Bridge And so long as the loonies pay for the helicopter rescue, and the air ambulance, and the hospital treatment. It's what they say about smokers and drinkers and the fat, isn't it? |
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23 Sep 06 - 03:43 AM (#1841322) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie Fans of Richard Hammond have been showing their appreciation of the service they rendered, by making donations to the Yorkshire Air Ambulance Service! Giok There ya go! |
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23 Sep 06 - 04:31 AM (#1841337) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: George Papavgeris When you buy a car, you want it to have been tested to its limits for your own safety. When you are given advice about a car, you want the same rigorous and sometimes extreme testing to have preceded it - for your own sake. When you buy a medicine, you want it to have been tested on (volunteer) humans, for side effects. To then turn round when things go wrong and accuse such testers or volunteers of being irresponsible seems a tad off to me. They take a calculated risk, supervised by professionals, and all for some gain that inevitably will never outweigh loss of life or permanent damage to their health or well-being. My hat off to them. |
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23 Sep 06 - 05:58 AM (#1841377) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Richard Bridge Is that what Hammond was doing? |
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23 Sep 06 - 06:05 AM (#1841383) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: George Papavgeris Indeed, Richard, in my view anyway. Though you might want to argue that the market for jet-powered 300mph cars is rather small ;-) - but the market for his TV programme is bigger. |
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23 Sep 06 - 06:52 AM (#1841427) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Bernard Explorers are a breed apart from the rest of us. Without them, the world would be a boring place. They do what we would like to do, and enable us to do it 'by proxy' via media coverage. Everyone makes mistakes, as the hedgehog said climbing off the scrubbing brush... |
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23 Sep 06 - 07:51 AM (#1841450) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST According to the Beeb Richard has taken his first steps since the accident on Thursday and has talked and is smiling. Onwards and upwards Richard! |
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23 Sep 06 - 08:14 AM (#1841461) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: George Papavgeris I liked Clarkson's comment to him: "The reason you're here is because you are a crap driver". I had to smile at that, and the obvious camaraderie that allows him to say it - typical Clarkson. And Hammond of course smiled back. Nevertheless, I wonder how long it will be before someone registers an objection to Clarkson's statement labelling him "insensitive"...Any takers? |
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23 Sep 06 - 11:12 AM (#1841501) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Firecat Good news that Hamster is able to walk. I just hope that he recovers quickly. It must be horrible for his wife and kids to have to see him like that. |
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23 Sep 06 - 04:06 PM (#1841574) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Firecat Latest update on Hamster (I was reading the Teletext news pages): He's been moved to a general ward. |
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23 Sep 06 - 04:22 PM (#1841579) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST Great news and what a remarkably 'safe' car. How did he get out of that alive???? |
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23 Sep 06 - 04:56 PM (#1841608) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie Have you seen the cage that the driver sits in? G. |
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23 Sep 06 - 05:31 PM (#1841637) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: HuwG Recognising that "Top Gear" has little relevance to everyday motoring, I wish the Hamster well, and am pleased that he seems to be recovering. Top Gear gnerally restricts itself to playing with toys few people can afford, in exotic locations most humdrum wage-slaves can only dream about (not including Elvington, of course). In my opinion, it does not encourage "boy racers" nor advocate the purchase of unduly expensive, thirsty and obstructive SUV's. The programme did once take issue with the proliferation of speed cameras, pointing out that a 150 percent increase in revenue from speeding fines could claim statistically to have saved only four lives. (There are of course lies, damned lies and statistics.) |
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23 Sep 06 - 05:44 PM (#1841651) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST point is though; neither does Top Gear accept any responsibility to actively discourage fukwit lethal boy racers |
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23 Sep 06 - 06:01 PM (#1841664) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: George Papavgeris No, that is precisely not the point, GUEST. To blame any one TV programme - or indeed TV as a whole - for the existence of the "boy racers" is not just wrong; it is extremely simplistic and misguided (& -ing). It may sit well with the prevalent "find someone to blame" culture, of course. But it does not wash parental responsibility away - the prime driver - or that of education or surrounding culture and peer pressure, all much more significant factors in the creation of these so-called "fuckwits". |
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23 Sep 06 - 06:38 PM (#1841677) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST no sorry george.. did anyone here say top gear is the sole primary causal factor for these halfwit speedwanks.. nope.. does anyone here even think anything that simplistic or misguided.. again.. nope.. but is it not too much to ask that the producers of an extremely popular BBC light entertainment show should maybe just take a teensy weensy bit extra responsibility in attempting to 'guide' and educate these impressionable daft young chaps who forever lust after faster street racer deathtraps |
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23 Sep 06 - 07:13 PM (#1841691) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: George Papavgeris I think your expectation is unrealistic. The days when the Beeb was educational are largely gone. I wonder (don't know) even if it is stated anywhere in their goals or objectives to educate (though it should). Nowadays it's just another group of ratings-chasing channels, and little more beyond that. So, not too much to ask; but probably too much to expect. Before the Beeb, others have even higher responsibility to educate; and I fear they don't. |
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23 Sep 06 - 07:29 PM (#1841694) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: Bernard The wording was changed from 'Educate' to 'Entertain' at the recent licencing review... The people who manufacture such vehicles for use on the Public Highway have a far greater responsibility, I believe. No-one can argue that Hammond's 'vehicle' would ever be seen anywhere but on a special track... |
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24 Sep 06 - 03:54 AM (#1841832) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: John MacKenzie George is right in saying that the blame culture is eroding many people's sense of self responsibility, and the tendency to blame irresponsibility and thuggery on an unhappy childhood is laughable. One side bleats about poor little Johnny who was brought up in poverty with a drunken father, and it's not really his fault that he turned out as he did, and they mentally spread the blame. Another side blames one person like Maggie Thatcher, for the sins of a whole system of government, which is patently misguided, and possibly just a tad prejudiced. So it goes with Richard Hammond, he's now being held up by some as epitomising a certain type of antisocial driver behaviour, for making his living on private land with safety and rescue people on standby, he is blamed for yobbos driving stolen cars through council estates! That's some extrapolation! Giok |
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24 Sep 06 - 07:17 AM (#1841924) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammonds From: GUEST A news summary just announced that the amount so far given to the Yorkshire Air Ambulance service following Richard Hammond's accident is £130,000. |
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24 Sep 06 - 09:16 AM (#1841988) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST,TV Addict oh so it was just another grand BBC publicity stunt appeal for charity.. maybe it can become an annual event just like red nose day.. perhaps the audience will be encouraged to vote in mass on a premium rate phone line to select next years celebrity they most want to see crash at over 300 mph.. yeah !!!! Clarkson next.. or maybe Johnathon Ross.. or who's that realy irritating woman on .. errmm you know that show with all those annoying women.. oh whats her name..??? anyway heres to next years BBC "Celebrity Skid'n'Crash" charity day event.. |
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24 Sep 06 - 09:28 AM (#1841997) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: John MacKenzie Cynical but predictable lapse of taste there. G |
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24 Sep 06 - 09:35 AM (#1841998) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST,Head of BBC Light Entertainment Please desist in leaking confidential information regarding future BBC programme schedule highlights. Thank you. Btw, vote lines will be open at £1.50 per minute from the end of this week. Star contestants will be announced very shortly. |
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24 Sep 06 - 10:44 AM (#1842036) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: John MacKenzie I'm afraid that you'll have to do it on radio, as there is no Head of Light Entertainment on TV only on radio, and he is Paul Schlesinger. Car crashes sort lose their impact on radio don't you think? So you may be a figment of your own imagination ☺ G ☻ |
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24 Sep 06 - 11:12 AM (#1842053) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: Bunnahabhain Boy racers have been around alot longer than cars. People have probably been blaming each other for going too fast since someone first fell off a horse.... |
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24 Sep 06 - 12:02 PM (#1842091) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: John MacKenzie Ben Hur ! |
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25 Sep 06 - 05:58 AM (#1842693) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: Keef Excuse slight thread power drift. Those er invalid trikes, when I was a lad we used to call them Spastic Carriages/Chariots, with characteristic teenage sensitivity. They looked like they were designed to create disabilities more so than assist with them. Are there any websites that show anything of the history and performance of these strange conveyances? |
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25 Sep 06 - 06:04 AM (#1842695) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST Over £150,00 has now been donated by Hammond fans,the air ambulance charity is considering using it to buy a new helicopter and name it after him. He'll love that! |
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25 Sep 06 - 06:09 AM (#1842696) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST, Topsie BBC news last night said it was over £170,000. |
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25 Sep 06 - 06:50 AM (#1842712) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST,Doris So there we have a stupid bloody programme which is watched by men in their late 40 plus and a few 17 year old dreamers. The 40's plus brigade (who can now afford a 10 year old sports car) see themselves as cool, dispite a thin crown, chest to stomach the same width and a dodgey walk,sorry almost forgot the jeans, minus an ass. They think this will get the young girls looking at them. The programme is "must see" viewing for this crew. They go down to their local and over a swift half, tell the guys about some sports car well outside of their price range as if it was sitting at their front door. Then they talk about some second rate presenter, who half the country never heard off until he almost produced a widow, as if he was some kind of hero ! Yeah, Hammond is a great guy, would I or would I not love to get a chance at the wheel of something like that ! Then go into a rant about what he did wrong, as if they knew the pit falls of the accident. Boys, sadly you only get money in your pocket (for that ten year old Z3)when too many birthdays came first. Settle for a drive to the car wash on a Saturday morning and a look through the car mags, when your wife is in another part of the store getting the weekly shop. Sad really. |
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25 Sep 06 - 06:57 AM (#1842717) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: George Papavgeris Doris, what is truly sad is seeing someone using such an opportunity for generalising, grumpy-old-person-ing and venting. My daughter and wife would both disagree with you, because they have enjoyed the programme regularly over the years; and guess what - they look or behave nothing like the descriptions you provided. In the end, someone was hurt. Whether man or woman, stupid or clever, unknown or famous. Be glad that he is getting better now, and that the charities are £170,000 richer, and leave it at that. |
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25 Sep 06 - 07:27 AM (#1842727) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: John MacKenzie Doris may I extend my sincere condolences on your loss. G |
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25 Sep 06 - 07:27 AM (#1842728) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: John MacKenzie And on reaching your century too G |
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25 Sep 06 - 07:36 AM (#1842734) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: The PA For those who dislike Top Gear and anything remote associated with it the answer is simple, switch to another channel. You can drive in the manner you prefer, in the vehicle you prefer at the speed you prefer. For goodness sake stop moaning on about those who may choose to do things differently! Any just to really hack you off, I drive a great big gas guzzling, air poluting Range Rover. Its my vehicle, my choice and nothing to do with anyone else. |
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25 Sep 06 - 10:03 AM (#1842859) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST,punkfolklrocker do we realy feel any sympathy for the multitude of affluent inexperienced mid-life crisis noobie bikers.. spending their big fat corporate bonus's on harlys and/or other exotic top of range speedster road bikes.. who are aparently now [ie. theres probably statistics somewhere, but i cant be arsed looking atm..] a significantly increasing serious road injury/death casualty demographic group.. oh well.. i'm off now for my regular walk of a couple of miles to the gym.. |
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25 Sep 06 - 11:28 AM (#1842915) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST Don't trip on the kerb. |
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25 Sep 06 - 11:39 AM (#1842922) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: catspaw49 Yeah, by all means don't trip off the curb! I'd hate to see a fast moving Kawasaki jammed up your ass.....I mean, who would pay? ........gimmee peace............. Spaw |
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25 Sep 06 - 11:48 AM (#1842927) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker ..i haven't gone out yet.. still finishing off a nice mug of tea [no milk.....] yes kerbs are a theoretical risk.. [at least one recorded instance of impact of stubbing the toes causing death from percussive brain damage..!!!] and thanks for the reminder... but.. i've already so far survived nearly 1/2 a century as an active and fit pedestrian and cyclist by learning to keep eyes and ears wide open monitoring for approaching halfwits in vehicles too powerful for their limited driving abilities, social awareness.. or inteligence.. BTW.. last night me and the mrs watched a movie double bill for a bit of a laugh "the fast and the furious" and its sequel "2 fast and 2 furious" .. ..we both fell asleep during a monotonous extended car chase in the 2nd movie.. but at least the producers payed lip service to including a 'disclaimer' road safety advice message in the closing titles.. we'll try to finish off watching it tonight.. |
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25 Sep 06 - 11:56 AM (#1842933) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: Trevor None taken Doris and punkrockfu... ronkfupocke..... oh, can't be arsed on account of the fact that my advanced years, thinning crown, jeans with no arse(?)and all those other things that I apparently must have, have also resulted in some significant brain damage, so I obviously can't help myself laughing like a drain at Top Gear, enjoying the enthusiasm and non PC piss-taking of the presenters. Maybe I'll turn into a big responsible grown-up one day, and find somebody on whom to wish brain-damage. |
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25 Sep 06 - 11:59 AM (#1842935) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: John MacKenzie Gosh matey,what's it like to be perfect and infallible? Giok |
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25 Sep 06 - 12:12 PM (#1842946) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker ah.. talking of piss-taking.. 25 odd years ago when i was subsidising my punkrock band playing activities by working as an orderly in an amputees hospital ward.. one of my daily duties was helping blokes of all ages go to the lav when they needed to.. either wheeling in the legless and giving them a disposable bottle.. or 'helping' the armless to aim & empty their bladders.. [i think thats as much as needs to be detailed in a family friendly website] a very humbling and embarrasing situation for myself at the age of 20 and for the guys around the same age as me who must have truly believed they were invincible road warriors. and who would now need to spend the rest of their lives disabled and dependant on professional health workers and their families.. |
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25 Sep 06 - 12:14 PM (#1842949) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker ps.. dunno 'Giok' ?? you'd have to ask my mrs..!!! |
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28 Sep 06 - 10:41 AM (#1845033) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST BBC NEWS: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5388296.stm "Six month recovery' for Hammond Richard Hammond is making good progress in his recovery Top Gear presenter Richard Hammond, who crashed in a jet-powered car, could be "back to his old self" within six months, according to his neurologist." http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5387568.stm "Road casualty figures falling Road casualties in Britain fell last year, although figures show the decline in deaths has now reached a plateau. The Department for Transport released contributory factors for the first time, showing drivers' failure to look properly featured in 32% of accidents. But in fatal crashes, loss of control was most common, with 35%, and excessive speed was reported in 15% of all accidents and 26% of fatal crashes. The government has a target to reduce death and serious injury figures by 40% by the year 2010, compared with the average figures between 1994-1998. While there has been a major drop in serious injuries, deaths have remained relatively static. Numbers of cyclist deaths rose 10%.." |
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28 Sep 06 - 12:07 PM (#1845120) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: catspaw49 "...excessive speed was reported in 15% of all accidents and 26% of fatal crashes...." GEEZIZ!!! 26% of all fatals are the result of excessive speed. Hmmmmm...So that means 74% happen when you're going slow. Just as I always thought....A lot of people just drive way too damn slow! Personally, I'm going to speed up and live....What a great slogan! SPEED UP AND LIVE!!! Spaw |
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28 Sep 06 - 12:14 PM (#1845128) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST SPEED UP AND MOW DOWN CHILDREN AND ELDERLY PEDESTRIANS AND CYCLISTS AND LIVE!!! |
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28 Sep 06 - 12:28 PM (#1845143) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: John MacKenzie It may be only a small percentage of the deaths cause, but it's a very large percentage of the fine revenues raised. Oh what a milch cow the motorist is to the Chancellor of the Exchequer. G. |
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28 Sep 06 - 12:50 PM (#1845162) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST another way to view these statistics is; "most road injuries and deaths are caused by drivers' lack of attention and speeding" to paraphrase a BBC TV news announcer earlier this evening. |
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28 Sep 06 - 01:37 PM (#1845210) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST Hammond has been moved to a BUPA hospital today nearer home. So now what can the whiners find to moan about? |
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28 Sep 06 - 01:53 PM (#1845221) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST,a killjoy lefty whiner plenty !!! Bastards Undermining Public Amenities .. couldn't think of a better one for "A" at the moment.. it'll 'ave to do.. |
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28 Sep 06 - 05:48 PM (#1845424) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Cyclist deaths up 10%? Hard to figure when about 70% of the cyclists in this country ride on the pavement (sidewalk, for our American friends). Round where I live, elderly, slow moving pedestrians are safer walking in the road. Don T. |
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28 Sep 06 - 08:37 PM (#1845579) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: Richard Atkins So glad to see the news today. First week is so important regarding prognosis. Man done so well, Hard work and fustration for half a year though. Can this thread regain the original plot!! |
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23 Oct 06 - 01:29 PM (#1866597) Subject: RE: BS: Top Gear's Richard Hammond From: GUEST This little weed who wasted many medics time when he drove one ego trip too far, appears to be trying to get back into the public eye again, not nice when the public forget you. A great hero among the boy racers, and middle aged wannabe boy racers ! With a little luck he will do the stunt again ! |