Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming

20 Feb 07 - 09:19 AM (#1973595)
Subject: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: wysiwyg

We bought the best available at the time, 6-7 years ago. This last year, it's been whining.

It's the kind of UPS that came with software to save open docs, close any programs running, and safely shut down the computer with the battery when that's necessary, while beeping madly to call attention to the phenomenon in case you want to do something else.

It was tested to see if it had enough juice to run the puder briefly with power off. It did have enough juice. However, the puder does shut down on a regular (but unpredictable) basis and, sometimes, is unwilling to restart when asked until the UPS, apparently, has had a good long rest; then the puder will mysteriously restart itself and boot up at a time of its choosing.

The puder itself has been thoroughly bench-tested and found to be fine.

Our tech suspected various puder problems and replaced those-- expensively I might add-- but the shutdowns have continued sporadically and I BLAME THE UNIVERSAL POWER SUPPLY!

OK, that's the background.


NOW the newest wrinkle is that the UPS will start beepig madly, and NOT shut anything down. (It doesn't need to: the house power is fine when this happens. How do I know? The TV and lights don't even flicker or dim AT ALL. I would know-- we have a few clocks that are very sensitive to power flux and they are not reacting at all.)

After awhile it stops beeping. After 6-8 panicked runs to the puder from the kitchen where I will have been up to my elbows in something, only to find absolutely nothing happening with the puder itself-- I've begun to simply ignore it.

Does this mean that my UPS is now merely a glorified outlet strip, which I should replace when I can? Or does it mean my puder is going to blow up any time now if I don't replace it or shut down NOW?

Replies in simplest terms, PLEASE. It's not that I'm dumb, but my brain lacks RAM at the moment.

~Susan

---

20 Feb 07 - 09:47 AM (#1973628)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: Stilly River Sage

There are batteries inside the UPS that need to be replaced periodically. I have one that does the same thing so I stashed it in the back of a closet. If I ever decide to get it out to use again I'll have to change out the rechargable batteries. (What brand is yours?)

I think it's like the truck battery--it will run the lights but doesn't have enough juice for the starter. That's when the automotive battery gets replaced, not when it's completely dead. Same thing for yours.

I don't think they're cheap. You might have to buy a new UPS and get those new batteries. It's a waste, I know--I'd rather not toss an entire device because of the expensive batteries (it happens with cordless phones all of the time--the phone new costs $19 on sale, but a replacement battery costs $50).

I would first check with some of the aftermarket battery places to see what you can come up with. Another analogy is like the printer/toner situation. Companies that sell printers at cost are actually in the business of selling ink and toner. If you believe their rhetoric, you'll buy the name-brand expensive ink to keep your printer in warranty. But you don't have to, you can find good after market brands for a fraction of the price. So with this pep talk on the habit of batteries and the perfidy of the marketplace, go forth and find a replacement rechargeable battery (then tell the rest of us where you found it!)

SRS

---

20 Feb 07 - 09:52 AM (#1973634)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: wysiwyg

Thanks, bigtime. GREAT analogy.

The one we have doesn't have rechargeables, but I will look for one that does-- new wrinkle I hadn't heard about.

I do already know I need to find one that lets me plug in other stuff-- the newer ones cover more than just the uder and phone.

~Susan

---

20 Feb 07 - 09:54 AM (#1973636)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: JohnInKansas

The UPS contains a battery. At 6 or 7 years, you may have reached an "end of life" condition for the battery itself. (Five years is considered a normal time-to-failure for auto batteries, even if you pay for the extended warranty.) The beeps may mean that the battery is not holding stable voltage and/or is overloading the charging circuitry in the UPS. (Just a guess, of course.)

Another possibility is that the power circuit (input) is seeing transients that trigger the warning, but don't last long enough to initiate a shutdown cycle.

A third possibility would be a problem with the charging/sensing circuitry in the UPS.

Product documentation that came with the UPS should have included some explanation of what various beeps and flashing lights mean(?).

The UPS manufacturer's website may have a downloadable Operator Manual and/or Service Manual? Or an on-site FAQ?

If the problem is with the battery, it probably can be replaced, but you really should check the manufacturer's recommendations on how to get to it. You likely will need a "gel-cell" (non-spillable) battery, which will be similar in price to, or possibly a little higher than, a "spill-resistant" motorcycle battery. An exact replacement would be preferred, but you might find a "close-enough" from one of the "handicapped mobility vehicle" shops.

If the problem is short duration transients due to the pending failure of your refrigerator, you're on your own about repairs.

If it's due to transients caused by the squirrels that ate your pole transformer, it should at least make a good story.

John

---

20 Feb 07 - 09:57 AM (#1973639)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: wysiwyg

I forgot to say, I can't see the brand name, where we have the unit located now, and I'm not going in there to look!

Thanks, John.

~S~

---

20 Feb 07 - 10:14 AM (#1973666)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: JudyB

Must confess I once took one of mine and left it in the trunk of the car for a couple of weeks. At the time it started doing the mad beeping Charlie was away for the weekend, I wasn't strong enough to pry the battery out of its tight little compartment to unhook it, and the noise was driving me bonkers.

By the time I brought it back in, the beeping had stopped and we could remove the battery without earplugs. Turned out the replacement battery was more than a new UPS by the time we'd factored in shipping and such, so the old battery was carted off to battery recycle land.

Good luck,
JudyB

---

20 Feb 07 - 06:42 PM (#1974272)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: The Fooles Troupe

My UPS used to do that sort of trick a bit when new - there is an on/off button on it which I switch off before turning off at the wall. You see, I often unplug which I will be not using it, especially for a couple of days.

---

20 Feb 07 - 06:43 PM (#1974275)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: wysiwyg

... often unplug [when] I will be not using it, especially for a couple of days...

Oh yeah, I do that too.

~S~

---

20 Feb 07 - 06:48 PM (#1974284)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: The Fooles Troupe

The problem then WYSIWYG, may be that the battery is not getting fully charged before being 'used' - rechargeable will always lose a bit of charge when standing. When i have been away, I turn the UPS on and leave it charging for an hour or two before turning on the PC.

This may not be of much help for you now though... the batteries will 'die' eventually...

---

20 Feb 07 - 06:53 PM (#1974293)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: wysiwyg

I just wanted to know if I was risking the sytem by ignoring the beeping. It does stop, after awhile. We'll get a new one when we can.

~S~

---

20 Feb 07 - 07:10 PM (#1974304)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: GUEST,.gargoyle

Computer batteries (nicad) have about a five year lifespan.

Just like automobile batteries they need to be replaced. Also like automobile batteries they tend to "go bad" during colder weather (chemical reations - like the one in batteries - slow down in the cold.)

If it IS the battery, your repair is about 5.00 US and a hot cooked meal for the geek down the street.

It ALWAYS helps if you can specify MAKE, MODEL, OPERATING SYSTEM.

There is a standard "beep code" for your motherboard....ie. "three short beeps" or "two short one long beep" AMI and Phoenix and IBM all have similar...but different codes.

IBM Beginners GuidePC/IBM

Beep Codes BIOS beep codes chart

Long Chart Beep Codes Faster Chart BIOS Beeps

Keep your machine on 24/7 during cold weather, it will cost about 15 cents a day.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

---

20 Feb 07 - 07:11 PM (#1974307)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: GUEST,.gargoyle

Don't be silly.

You need a MINOR repair....not a whole new computer system.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

---

21 Feb 07 - 10:16 AM (#1974935)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: Stilly River Sage

Gargoyle, this isn't the little battery in the computer, this is the external battery backup unit. APC is a common brand here in the U.S.

link

SRS

---

21 Feb 07 - 10:21 AM (#1974940)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: Scrump

Is 'puder' a common term in the US for 'computer'? Never heard it before, and just wondered if you made it up, WYSIWYG.

---

21 Feb 07 - 10:44 AM (#1974961)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: wysiwyg

Common, yes.

Puder = computer (some poeple spell is puter)

Addy = email address

piccies (ick!) = photographs, as in the kind you want to share with friends via email; I prefer "pix"

~S~

---

21 Feb 07 - 11:16 AM (#1974983)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: Scrump

Thanks WYSIWYG. I've heard of addy and piccies/pix - all used in the UK.

I don't think 'puder' is so easily portable to the UK though, because it probably requires a US accent! 'Puter' would work better here. I usually abbreviate it to PC anyway (unless referring to a Mac, which I rarely do as I don't use them!)

---

21 Feb 07 - 12:15 PM (#1975038)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: wysiwyg

Scrump, wouldn't it be cool if all US/UK usage differences could be sorted out so quickly and simply? There is SO MUCH I don't "get," on so many posts here! Just yesterday I ran into one in a PM I STILL can't wrap my head around-- I'm so grateful Mudcat lets us see a little bit from the other side of the pond.

~S~

---

21 Feb 07 - 12:22 PM (#1975043)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: JohnInKansas

The literate ones usually spell it " 'puter " (with the prepostrophe) but it is pretty common 'mongst those who think it gives a cachet of "familiarity" and friendliness.

The other common "friendly name" is something like " $@#!%*!! ."

John

---

22 Feb 07 - 08:00 AM (#1975868)
Subject: RE: Tech: Puder Battery Backup Alarming
From: wysiwyg

Thanks, Garg, I got the help I needed.

~S~

---