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BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3

Backwoodsman 22 Sep 24 - 03:44 PM
Dave the Gnome 22 Sep 24 - 03:16 PM
Backwoodsman 22 Sep 24 - 10:22 AM
MaJoC the Filk 09 Sep 24 - 06:43 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Sep 24 - 12:02 PM
The Sandman 03 Sep 24 - 09:44 AM
Backwoodsman 08 Aug 24 - 03:42 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Aug 24 - 03:20 AM
SPB-Cooperator 07 Aug 24 - 05:15 PM
Dave the Gnome 07 Aug 24 - 10:23 AM
Backwoodsman 07 Aug 24 - 09:44 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Aug 24 - 08:55 AM
Backwoodsman 07 Aug 24 - 05:21 AM
Backwoodsman 07 Aug 24 - 05:20 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Aug 24 - 05:18 AM
The Sandman 07 Aug 24 - 03:16 AM
Backwoodsman 07 Aug 24 - 02:34 AM
Big Al Whittle 04 Aug 24 - 05:31 PM
Dave the Gnome 04 Aug 24 - 07:00 AM
Dave the Gnome 04 Aug 24 - 06:05 AM
Rain Dog 23 Jul 24 - 08:31 AM
Rain Dog 23 Jul 24 - 06:29 AM
SPB-Cooperator 20 Jul 24 - 07:16 AM
The Sandman 20 Jul 24 - 05:52 AM
Dave the Gnome 18 Jul 24 - 08:19 AM
DMcG 17 Jul 24 - 11:02 AM
Dave the Gnome 17 Jul 24 - 09:35 AM
Rain Dog 17 Jul 24 - 02:19 AM
Rain Dog 11 Jul 24 - 01:25 PM
Dave the Gnome 10 Jul 24 - 05:20 PM
Dave the Gnome 10 Jul 24 - 10:33 AM
MaJoC the Filk 10 Jul 24 - 09:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Jul 24 - 03:27 AM
Rain Dog 10 Jul 24 - 02:54 AM
DMcG 08 Jul 24 - 01:49 PM
Dave the Gnome 08 Jul 24 - 12:19 PM
Nigel Parsons 08 Jul 24 - 05:21 AM
Backwoodsman 07 Jul 24 - 05:58 AM
DMcG 07 Jul 24 - 04:16 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Jul 24 - 04:45 PM
The Sandman 06 Jul 24 - 03:50 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Jul 24 - 03:41 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Jul 24 - 10:36 AM
The Sandman 06 Jul 24 - 07:55 AM
Nigel Parsons 06 Jul 24 - 07:07 AM
The Sandman 06 Jul 24 - 06:49 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Jul 24 - 06:25 AM
The Sandman 06 Jul 24 - 06:19 AM
Backwoodsman 06 Jul 24 - 06:18 AM
The Sandman 06 Jul 24 - 06:14 AM

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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 22 Sep 24 - 03:44 PM

I’m pretty sure that all influential MPs receive gifts, and I have no real problem with that as long as they are declared through the Members’ Register of Interests procedure (which the gifts in question appear to have been). Unfortunately, the Tories have chosen to weaponise gifts received by Labour Cabinet Ministers, presumably in an attempt to undermine the LP Conference and draw attention away from positive things the government are trying to do.

It should come as no surprise, after all the Tories demonstrated that they are The Party of Dirty Tricks with their character-assassination job on Corbyn in 2019.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Sep 24 - 03:16 PM

Just read that the sum total of donations to Starmer is £12500 less than hust the cost of Bozos flat redecoration. I don't think either is right - just putting it in perspective


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 22 Sep 24 - 10:22 AM

Very amusing this morning to hear the ferret-faced Shadow Leader of the Opposition, Chris Philp, complaining about the PM and Deputy PM accepting gifts from Labour donors of a few suits, posh spectacles, and the loan of an apartment in New York for a few nights, declaring with outraged, righteous indignation that “It’s wrong!”.

Funny, I don’t recall him exhibiting righteous indignation and declaring “It’s Wrong” over his own party spaffing billions on the contracts they gave their own members, donors, and pub landlords for PPE that never materialised or proved to be useless during the Covid pandemic, or filling the House of Lords with Russian oligarchs and friends of Putin.

Those Tory has-beens have no shame, nor any sense of irony.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 09 Sep 24 - 06:43 AM

Just seen this quoted in RISKS Digest 34.44*:

Subject: Visa required for EU entry starting next year

[via Dave Farber's IP distribution]

What has not been mentioned in most reports is that the set of planned EU restrictions on non-EU (non-Schengen, actually) citizens are all modeled on measures the U.S. has already implemented and encouraged other countries to adopt, as I discuss in a report for the Identity Project:

Planned new European travel restrictions follow U.S. precedents and pressure

[...]

But U.S. citizens who object to these new European measures should direct their objections and, more importantly, their agitation for changes in travel rules to the U.S. government.

These impending new European travel control and surveillance measures are modeled on systems developed, already in use in, and actively promoted to European and other governments around the world by the U.S. government.

By its precedents and international pressure, the U.S. government is making travel more difficult for everyone, including U.S. citizens, everywhere in the world including in Europe. [...]

MaJoC's €0.02: Once it affects US tourists, Something Might Be Done. But then again, there's now an entire industry behind the border checks, so that methinks is that.

* Apologies for the nonstandard location. The official archive site, with links to individual sub-articles, has database and certificate problems.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Sep 24 - 12:02 PM

It was a rhetorical question that came with a ready answer.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: The Sandman
Date: 03 Sep 24 - 09:44 AM

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=farage+latest+news since you asked a question about Farage.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Aug 24 - 03:42 AM

A big “Amen” to all of that, Dave.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Aug 24 - 03:20 AM

Early days yet but when I see mass support for immigrants and Muslims, and against the thugs that have been in the news lately it gladdens my heart. Last night was a ray of hope in what had been a week of criminality coordinated by right wing manipulators to destabilise the country for their own ends. The vast majority of people have seen through their ploy and have stood against it. The justice system has shown them what will happen if they continue. Next step is to cut off the head of the nazi beast. Get Yaxley-Lennon in court. Make Farage answer for his shit stirring. Ensure the online safety act goes ahead and hit Musk hard if he continues to let his platform be used for hate.

I have been watching for riot apologists on friend's Facebook feeds and politely putting posters right when the start to parrot the misinformation put about by right wing puppet masters. It still surprises me that some folk are so gullible but, hopefully, even my little efforts will make a difference. My lad was at the demo in Stoke last night where they outnumbered the fascists by the hundred. The communities affected by the riots have reclaimed their streets from the criminals. Long may it continue.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 07 Aug 24 - 05:15 PM

Their bottle-o, their bottle-o, the racists lost their bottle-o
   So earl-eye in the evening, the far-right lost their bottle-o
Society came out in force, so the bigots lost their bottle-o
   So earl-eye in the evening, the far-right lost their bottle-o


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Aug 24 - 10:23 AM

I was just wondering how Farage is going to answer all the questions that other (IE Decent) MPs are going to ask him. But then I remembered that he will probably just never turn up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 07 Aug 24 - 09:44 AM

…or even to question how the then Home Secretary, who went on to become Prime Minister (albeit a pretty poor one) managed to conveniently ‘lose’ the 149 files containing details of the cases against those white TV celebrities and MPs.

Funny, that…


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Aug 24 - 08:55 AM

Sorry - I just realised I shortchanged averyone before by referring to 30p Lee as 10p Lee. Mind you, it probably reflects his value to humanity better...

Just saw a brilliant post on Faceache. The answer to anyone complaining about a "two tier" police system is to say, yes it is. Just ask any young people of colour about stop and search :-)

I would go further and wonder why the police who, quite rightly, quickly clamped down on the Asian grooming gangs were so willing to ignore the complaints about the priveledged white grooming and child abuse going on amongst white TV celebrities and MPs for so long.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 07 Aug 24 - 05:21 AM

A-a-a-and…..700.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 07 Aug 24 - 05:20 AM

”Farage, 30p-Lee, and Yaxley-Lennon are not to blame for that, but i agree their behaviour in whipping up racial hatred is despicable.”

And they are far from being alone in that. There are plenty of other well-known figures doing precisely the same - including at least one challenger for the position of Tory Party Leader. They are all utterly reprehensible and despicable.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Aug 24 - 05:18 AM

The only thing we currently know about his mental state is that he is diagnosed as having an autistic spectrum disorder. There are currently nearly half a million people with that diagnosis in the UK and it is estimated that between half and one million are on the autistic spectrum but undiagnosed. Do you think that they all should be supervised, Dick?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: The Sandman
Date: 07 Aug 24 - 03:16 AM

one of the classic ways to divide society is to divide and rule
whipping up anti immigrant feeling falls in to this category imo
.Why was someone who was mentally disturbed allowed to be unsupervised and attack and murder.
Farage, 30p-Lee, and Yaxley-Lennon are not to blame for that, but i agree their behaviour in whipping up racial hatred is despicable.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 07 Aug 24 - 02:34 AM

Some very dark humour around, concerning the rioting and looting currently happening around the UK on the pretext of protesting the murder of three children in Southport.

In one cartoon yesterday, a young boy asks his father, “What did you do in support of the three murdered girls, Dad?”. Dad’s response - “I broke into Gregg’s and looted a Steak-bake, son”.

The likes of Farage, 30p-Lee, and Yaxley-Lennon have a great deal to answer for.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 04 Aug 24 - 05:31 PM

Its a very weird situation. Riots on Weymouth seafront tonight. Just watching it on telly. Most of the rioters look well struck in years. Used to they would blame this stuff on teenagers.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Aug 24 - 07:00 AM

Here is an example of how gullible people are -

Go to the Twitter page of Tommy Robinson, see the videos, listen to his documentaries. This man is NO racist, but he stands firm against muslim terrorists. Don't you? He knows more about the cult of Islam than most. He's the man who was telling the police for years about the muslim grooming gangs...and police ignored, leaving thousands of young girls to be raped by these evil men. Watch his doc. on the evil 'Hope Not Hate' group who malign him all the time. They are truly wicked, paying people to tells lies about those they seek to destroy. He has repeatedly called for peaceful protests.

This person genuinely believes this. There is little hope for us while the hard of thinking are allowed to post their vile nonsense. Social media sites need to step up to the mark and fact check posts like real news outlets do.

Talking about fact checking, have you seen "10p Lee" Anderson's latest faux pas? Would be hilarious if it wasn't for the fact that this idiot has a say in running our lives :-(


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Aug 24 - 06:05 AM

I started a thread about the Southport tragedy and subsequent riots but things have progressed now and the right wing thuggery needs to be called out here instead.

It is despicable how these thugs are using the tragedy for their own nefarious purposes. Yet I am seeing people on Faceache trying to justify their actions as patriotic and even necessary because "Muslims are taking over the country" or we have a "2 tier police system which favours immigrants". I have even seen an erstwhile poster on here (long since banned) saying that the vile Yaxley-Lennon is right and proves that the government are hiding things from us.

WTF has happened to people? Where has common sense and decency gone? Rhetorical of course as I know that the vast majority of people fully understand that the right wing shite is just that - right wing shite.

Trouble is that while the nicotoned stained man-toad, Farage, and his cronies are given the facade of respectability, we are going to see more of this. Maybe it is a good thing that Reform UK is supporting the "protesters". As long as they do there is a chance that they will be classed as a terrorist organisation and banned from holding office. We can but hope.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Rain Dog
Date: 23 Jul 24 - 08:31 AM

Article from The Press Gazette June 25th, on Tristan Kirk

The Evening Standard‘s Tristan Kirk has been fighting a lone campaign to shine a light on nearly a decade of secret criminal trials.

"Kirk, who is the Evening Standard’s courts correspondent, won the Private Eye-run Paul Foot Award this month for his work exposing how the “single justice procedure” for Covid-related offences had created a “conveyor belt” justice system and led to miscarriages of justice.

Under the single justice procedure, introduced in 2015 for those accused of minor crimes, there was is no longer an automatic hearing. Instead, a letter sent to the accused specifies the dates between which their case will be dealt with by a magistrate and features a form they can use to respond to the charge.

The form has three options: the accused may say they are guilty and do not want a hearing, that they are guilty and they do want a hearing or that they are innocent, which automatically results in a hearing.

If there is no hearing, there is nothing for reporters to sit in on, meaning decisions are made with little, if any, scrutiny."

++

It is another example of how in this modern age we are getting less coverage of court, council proceedings etc. Not a healthy state of affairs.

I used to look at Tristan Kirk's Twitter page before Elon Musk limited access to non-users like myself.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Rain Dog
Date: 23 Jul 24 - 06:29 AM

I was unsure which thread to post this message in. It is about the Post Office/Horizon inquiry. I have posted on this topic in the Belief in Technology thread. I thought this thread might be more appropriate.

It is from the Nick Wallis blog Post Office Scandal.

Ed Davey: Chocolate Teapot


It is a fine example of how the Government and Civil Service acts at times.

A word of warning for those of you who are not too fond of Tories. A well known Tory MP makes repeated attempts to get answers on behalf of a constituent to no avail. Sometimes those we are not fond of do try.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 20 Jul 24 - 07:16 AM

It is one of those classic experiments - to prove once and for all how bad the pandemic was handled is to have another, equally virulent and lethal one, but get the response right. even then this des not eliminate the covid pandemic providing the learning curve as we cannot revert back to the same experiential baseline.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: The Sandman
Date: 20 Jul 24 - 05:52 AM

Advocates of capitalism are very apt to appeal to the sacred principles of liberty, which are embodied in one maxim: The fortunate must not be restrained in the exercise of tyranny over the unfortunate.”
— Bertrand Russell, Sceptical Essays (1928), Essay, XIII: Freedom in Society, p. 103


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Jul 24 - 08:19 AM

Some interesting reading in the Hallet Covid enquiry findings. Nothing surprising though seeing as the whole pandemic was managed by a set of spivs out to get what they could and a prime minister who was only interested in furthering his own career and those of his cronies.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Jul 24 - 11:02 AM

I am afraid Proportional Representation always looks less attractive to those who got a big majority under FPTP ...

I was interested to read in the King's Speech that "Legislation will be brought forward to introduce a duty of candour for public servants.”

That remains to be seen. I am strongly reminded how Blair wanted to introduce Freedom of Information for the same reason, got the Green paper, realised that it could lats of problems for the government and set Jack Straw to produce the White Paper who cut a lot of it out. Even so, I have heard comments that he regrets the idea.

Much more recently, Sunak promised to bring integrity to the government, and we know how well that lasted.

I hope Starmer follows through with strict rules on 'duty of candour', but it would not surprise me if this went the way of similar ambitious ideas.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 17 Jul 24 - 09:35 AM

I think you are right with your last line, Rain Dog, but it is a step in the right direction as far as I am concerned.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Rain Dog
Date: 17 Jul 24 - 02:19 AM

Article in The Guardian today.

Labour divided over calls to scrap first past the post after landslide win

"Sandy Martin, a former Labour MP who now chairs the Labour Campaign for Electoral Reform, says thinking about a move to PR should be a priority for the party, despite the way it benefited so handsomely from the current system.

“It would only take Reform and the Conservatives to unite and they might have a majority on the same scale we had this year,” he said. “But under PR, Labour would most likely be able to form a government quite comfortably with the Liberal Democrats or the Greens, and this would be preferable to a Conservative-Reform government.”

As well as self-interest, Martin said, first past the post felt increasingly inappropriate when only 58% of the vote share went to the main two parties: “In England we now have five parties, and in Scotland and Wales you have six. You can’t run a first past the post system – where one party is basically trying to beat the other party – when you’ve got five or six parties to play with.”"

++

Probably unlikely to see any changes during this government's term of office.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Rain Dog
Date: 11 Jul 24 - 01:25 PM

Mr. Control Freak starts to make his move.

Nigel Farage stirs tensions in Reform UK as he ousts deputies


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Jul 24 - 05:20 PM

In the finals now. Starmer is doing great :-D


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Jul 24 - 10:33 AM

Did they lean to the right? :-D


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 10 Jul 24 - 09:53 AM

> I can just see Liz Truss as a plasterer. Jacob Rees-Mogg
> as a chippy.

Slapdash is what they were. I wouldn't trust either of them with any building-trade tool.

.... I wonder if they were responsible for the front room in our first house: every wall leaned slightly in or out, and there was not one corner of the room that contained a true right-angle. The entire row of houses was built on a slope, and they were only kept from sliding down it by the tops of the porches, like a row of drunks propping each other up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Jul 24 - 03:27 AM

It was a bit of hyperbole to gee up our American friends :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Rain Dog
Date: 10 Jul 24 - 02:54 AM

Dave the Gnome posted in the American Presidential thread:

"Far right kicked out in the UK
Far right kicked out in France
Come on, USA. Give us the hat trick! :-)"

Probably more accurate to say that the Far Right did not get in in France, at least not yet. It remains to be seen how things are going to work out there.

I would not call the Tory party Far Right, especially this last government which had ended up with some policies which were not the usual Tory fare.

I don't think the Far Right has been kicked out in the UK. The vote for the Right was split between the Tories & Reform. We are in an unhealthy position, especially when you consider nearly 40% did not vote.

Labour are in a position to be able to improve things and hopefully convince more people to vote for them at the next election. It will not be easy, especially dealing with the immigration issue. There are no easy answers for dealing with that, as can be seen by how other countries are trying to deal with it.

I wish Labour the best of luck.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: DMcG
Date: 08 Jul 24 - 01:49 PM

I've just read this in John Crace's latest column:
Still, I suppose there are a lot of unemployed ex-Tory MPs, so maybe they might like to retrain for the construction industry. I can just see Liz Truss as a plasterer. Jacob Rees-Mogg as a chippy.
when I suddenly recalled those posters suggesting ballet dancers retrain in IT.

I might see if I can mock up an equivalent.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Jul 24 - 12:19 PM

:-D


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 08 Jul 24 - 05:21 AM

From 2016 (when it was topical)

It still seems topical now:

BOJO (ET TU GOVE)
Nigel Parsons 2016
Tune: Bobby Shaftoe

Boris Johnson, Dearie me.
Oh dear, the ignominy.
Will Gove prosper? Wait and see.
(But) Boris has been shafted!

   Boris Johnson, bright & fair.
   Can't control his shock of hair.
   Like a cuddly teddy bear.
   Bonnie Boris Johnson

Boris fought against Remain.
Thought he might the 'top job' gain.
Gove reneged, and, oh the pain.
Boris has been shafted!

   Boris Johnson, bright & fair.
   Can't control his shock of hair.
   Like a cuddly teddy bear.
   Bonnie Boris Johnson

Michael Gove has gone astray,
Let's support Theresa May.
Possibly he'll rue the day -
That he shafted Boris.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 07 Jul 24 - 05:58 AM

Good to see that Starmer has filled the Cabinet to a great extent with the people who had covered their ‘shadow’ briefs whilst in opposition, and thus have experience in their areas - in contrast to, for instance, Johnson’s weeding out of those who disagreed with him in 2019. Country first, party second - way to go.

And I strongly approve of the appointment of James Timpson - a man who has spent a lot of time in prisons, working with prisoners on rehabilitation projects, and who actively employs ex-prisoners in his shops.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: DMcG
Date: 07 Jul 24 - 04:16 AM

Well, Labour have only been in power one day... What more can people want?

What they seem to be doing, namely appointing ministers with some knowledge of the subject of their departments. For the most of last 14 years, ministerial appointments have been about party management, which is how we ended up with something like 10 Education ministers in 14 years, with them tending to be in place for shorter and shorter terms. That was a pattern of all the ministries.

One newspaper had a moan that the ministerial appointments we just removing the 'shadow' for ministers. Obviously, the writer wanted excitement rather than people who had actually spent time thinking about the relevant ministry.

I am particularly taken with the appointment of Patrick Vallance to a a role in the Department of Science, and James Timpson to a role in prisons.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 04:45 PM

:-D Nice one Dick


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 03:50 PM

Southgate and Starmer seem to have something in common, both play a boring game but win


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 03:41 PM

Well, Labour have only been in power one day. The Rwanda nonsense has been cancelled and England are in the Euro semi finals. What more can people want? :-D


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 10:36 AM

Thanks Dick. Glad we cleared that up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 07:55 AM

he out manouvered the members of his cabinet, unlike Cameron he knew what he was doing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 07:07 AM

Seven members of the Cabinet, including Tony Benn and Michael Foot, favoured withdrawal.
Wilson overode them


No, as others have made clear, Wilson did not override them. He gave the UK public the choice to agree with either them or him.
A totally different way of dealing with the matter. If the public had agreed with Benn & Foot, Wilson had committed to accept the outcome.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 06:49 AM

Yes, I should have said for remaining in the common market. we all know the uk joined The Common Market or EEC, NOT the EU in 1973


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 06:25 AM

I am confused, Dick. You said (06 Jul 24 - 04:27 AM) "Harold overode cabinet minsters WHO WERE MPS to press for joiniing Europe", (emphasis on "joining") implying that Wilson called the referendum to JOIN the EEC (As it was) That was NOT, as I said, the purpose of the referendum in 1975. You then go on to point out exactly the same thing that I said. It was whether to remain in the EEC. Was your first statement a mistake?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 06:19 AM

Seven members of the Cabinet, including Tony Benn and Michael Foot, favoured withdrawal.
Wilson overode them


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 06:18 AM

No problem Dave. I find it really useful, and very easy to use. I wish I could remember, and thank, the member who wrote it - maybe Dave-Ro?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 3
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jul 24 - 06:14 AM

The 1973 enlargement of the European Communities was the first enlargement of the European Communities (EC), now the European Union (EU). Denmark, Ireland and the United Kingdom (UK) acceded to the EC on 1 January 1973.


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Mudcat time: 23 September 9:29 PM EDT

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