 sj |
||
|
||
Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016)
|
|
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Dave the Gnome Date: 27 Nov 16 - 04:54 PM So, no substance to the allegation then? I thought not. Thank you for the confirmation. DtG |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: akenaton Date: 27 Nov 16 - 04:16 PM :0) Your last post is a typical example. You have been described as such by moderation on several occasions...and no I am not about to go looking for them, but I remember just after the new rules on Guests were brought in you were mentioned in dispatches.....shortly afterwards you disappeared for some time. It was lovely. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Dave the Gnome Date: 27 Nov 16 - 04:09 PM Of course they can say anything they like. I made no demands, just a polite request. It can be either acted upon or ignored. As to That is hilarious coming from the most widely recognised troll on the forum. I shall make the same point I made on another thread. When allegations are made the people they are made against can either ignore them or refute them. I chose on this occasion to do the latter. The allegation is that I am 'the most widely recognised troll on the forum'. I refute this and challenge the accuser to substantiate that allegation with proof and recent examples of what can be deemed as trollish behaviour. Of course the accuser can chose to ignore this request as well but I am pretty sure that would prove it is a completely unsubstantiated accusation and can be treated with the contempt it deserves. I eagerly await the results. DtG |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: akenaton Date: 27 Nov 16 - 04:00 PM Jeri can say exactly as she pleases as can Joe, Acme, or any other member......."Please stop it" That is hilarious coming from the most widely recognised troll on the forum. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: akenaton Date: 27 Nov 16 - 03:56 PM "Rubbish Medical science is on top of HIV and you know it. People who have the virus can lead full-length, normal lives" Oh is that so Dr Shaw? Nobody understands the long term effects(30, 40, 50 years) of anti retroviral medication; and the costs are horrific, almost £400,000 per patient at present rates. Isn't it better that the virus is not transmitted at all? Fidel's policy stopped transmission in it's tracks and to equate HIV/AIDS with Downs' syndrome or mumps and measles is stupid and insulting on many levels. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Greg F. Date: 27 Nov 16 - 03:50 PM Now Trumpists, they're absolutely defective. As for Jeri, at least she's consistently ephemeral. Until she flexes her mod alter-ego. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Dave the Gnome Date: 27 Nov 16 - 03:41 PM I seriously dislike the drive by shootings Jeri sometimes makes. Dip into a thread, make a vague accusation at an unspecified group of people and then leave. It is uncalled for and unfair on the rest of the population who have no idea who the scatter gun is aiming at. Please stop it. DtG |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Steve Shaw Date: 27 Nov 16 - 03:12 PM i wouldn't use the word defective. My friend's daughter who has Downs is one of the most gorgeous and loving people you could ever wish to meet. I've met far more defective "normal" people in my life, many times over. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Greg F. Date: 27 Nov 16 - 03:03 PM People who have the virus can lead full-length, normal lives. That's as may be, but to Ache they're still disgusting Godless faggots. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Nov 16 - 03:03 PM C'mon lads, don't let this homophobic troll wreck a good thread Jim Carroll |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Mrrzy Date: 27 Nov 16 - 02:59 PM As an aside, homosexuality and Down's Syndrome don't compare well - both are innate but only the latter is both genetic and a way of being defective, albeit of course still human. And it can be transmitted to the genetic offspring. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Steve Shaw Date: 27 Nov 16 - 01:27 PM Rubbish Medical science is on top of HIV and you know it. People who have the virus can lead full-length, normal lives. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: akenaton Date: 27 Nov 16 - 12:44 PM Hiv/Aids is not like mumps or measles Steve and if you can remember, at the time all medical opinion thought that it might cross over to the heterosexual population at the same infection rates rates. that of course would have meant the end of society as we know it. Fidel took appropriate action and it worked. We did not and are now left with the consequences.....whatever they may turn out to be. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Steve Shaw Date: 27 Nov 16 - 12:44 PM Pathetic, Jeri. Typical negativity with nothing to say. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Nov 16 - 12:40 PM By the way - how does moaning Minnie work as alliteration - not that I'd ever be so ill-manners as to resort to such a term to a fellow member? Jim Carroll |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Nov 16 - 12:38 PM Jeri This is the first contribution you have made to this discussion - a complaint about other peoples contributions. Nobody has prevented you from making a point before now - how about treating others with the same respect Yes - you are right - we do get involved with each other's arguments, but that is no excuse for your, or other people not making a contribution It's hardly a fact that we have interrupted an ongoing exchange of ideas. Up to now, I have responded to what others have said - I have also attempted to prevent this thread being used as a soapbox for a bigot. How about a comment on this, or are you happy to tolerate it? As far as I am concerned, I have said all I have to on Ake's homophobic bigotry and am happy to continue where I left off earlier. As far as I am aware, there is no limit to the number of postings a member can make on one topic. Jim Carroll |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jeri Date: 27 Nov 16 - 12:22 PM Sorry, looks like we're down to four, but the alliteration still works. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jeri Date: 27 Nov 16 - 12:21 PM Oh, for fuck's sake... I'll be surprised if anyone other than the Flatulent Five contributes to this thread, other than the possible one-off sad attempts to communicate. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Steve Shaw Date: 27 Nov 16 - 12:20 PM Well I suppose we could lock up everyone who caught the pox or the clap. Come to think of it, or colds and flu. Or kids with mumps or measles. Lock 'em up, I say! Protect the rest of us! Or salmonella. Or anything else nasty and catching. But all you ever go on about is HIV in male homosexuals. You really can't see your own homophobia, can you, you sad man. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: akenaton Date: 27 Nov 16 - 11:26 AM So you think Fidel was a "homophobe" for setting up a policy to combat AIDS and save lives? If other countries had adopted such a policy HIV/AIDS would not be affecting homosexuals at epidemic rates. The reason that I have taken up this point is that someone accused Fidel of exactly that further up the page. I am simply clarifying the situation. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Nov 16 - 11:15 AM Take your homophobic hatred elsewhere Ake (rapidly becoming Ache) It has no place in a decent democratid debating forum Like your and your friends' Islamophobia and other forms of bigoted intolerance, it effects members of this forum as much as it does the population in general. Hatred like yours gave rise to a culture of "queer bashing", just as Islamophobia gets petrol poured through letter boxes. By no stretch of the subject does it qualify to be discussed on this thread. Leave it Jim Carroll |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: akenaton Date: 27 Nov 16 - 11:01 AM Are you really that dim Jim? When the Aids was first diagnosed as a condition almost every victim was homosexual, that's why Castro confined them in sanatoria and that is why the infection rates are so low in Cuba compared to almost every other country on earth. Political correctness demands that we refer to these early victims as "prostitutes when in reality they were almost all homosexual. Lack of action to contain the condition by "liberal" governments has contributed to the massive transmission rates we see today in developed countries. Castro was no monster, he was a realist. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Nov 16 - 10:42 AM "He came to power lying about his objectives and pursued a despotic rule " He came to power to overthow a despotic ruler who opened up Cuba to Amrican sex yourists, widespread prostitution and corruption, the despotic ownership of land by a handful of families Following the revolution, Over 200,000 Cuban families own land for the first time in their lives. Cuba has been kept in the situation that prevails because of a half-century blockade of trade - still in operation. Jim Carroll |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Greg F. Date: 27 Nov 16 - 10:19 AM He came to power lying about his objectives and pursued a despotic rule where his opinion of right and wrong was made to suffice for an entire people Sounds rather like Trump, does it not? |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Nov 16 - 08:09 AM Cuba's attitude to homosexuality had changed radically before all of these irrelevant statements were made - as had the rest of the world's. Enlightenment and understanding brought those changes - the repression of what was regarded as wrong in Cuba (elsewhere, homosexuality was still illegal - in parts of the U.S. that was still the case in 2014) never at any time involved Aids. It seems that Ake is using it as another window of opportunity for his world crusade. As homosexuality is now fully accepted throughout the civilised world, I ask that if he cannot control his one-man campaign against a sizeable proportion of the world's population, he at least attempts to suppress his hatred here. A number of members on this forum have declared themselves to be gay and I have no doubt that there are many others who regardd their sexuality as purely their own business - so his persistent attempts to denigrate homosexuals as 'disease carriers' are aimed at fellow Mudcatters. I think it's about time he stopped or was stopped - don't you? He'll be be demanding we ring back hanging, drawing and quartering and the branque next Give it a rest Ake and pretend you're a human being for a minute. Jim Carroll |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: akenaton Date: 27 Nov 16 - 07:25 AM There has always been a moral argument in every country on homosexuality, in part of the UK and most of the world homosexual "marriage" is still illegal. I am talking about the medical response to HIV/AIDS in Cuba regardless of political ideology. This from the New York Times, hardly a supporter of Fidel. HAVANA — Yudelsy García O'Connor, the first baby known to have been born with H.I.V. in Cuba, is not merely still alive. She is vibrant, funny and, at age 25, recently divorced but hoping to remarry and have children. Her father died of AIDS when she was 10, her mother when she was 23. She was near death herself in her youth. "I'm not afraid of death," she said. "I know it could knock on my door. It comes for everyone. But I take my medicine." Ms. García is alive thanks partly to lucky genes, and partly to the intensity with which Cuba has attacked its AIDS epidemic. Whatever debate may linger about the government's harsh early tactics — until 1993, everyone who tested positive for H.I.V. was forced into quarantine — there is no question that they succeeded. Strangly, the NYT's article makes no mention of male homosexuals, but states that "the Cuban regime concentrates on "high risk groups like prostitutes". Actually, the rates among "sex workers" are only a fraction of those amongst male homosexuals. Related Coverage H.I.V./AIDS: Voices From Cuba MAY 7, 2012 Cuba's AIDS Sanitariums: Fortresses Against a Viral Foe MAY 7, 2012 Recent Comments Gail Reed May 9, 2012 For an indepth look at HIV/AIDS in Cuba see the special issue of peer-reviewed journal MEDICC Review at http://www.medicc... Eyes Open May 9, 2012 I've been to Cuba twice. It is a remarkable place. This cogent article demonstrates yet another way in which it is remarkable. I wonder if... Tufik Habib May 9, 2012 As most things in life, things are not fully good or bad. Definitely, it seems this is the way to manage an epidemic. Indeed, it looks... See All Comments |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Nov 16 - 06:55 AM Just been informed of this by Sandra Kerr THE POWER of COMMUNITY Sandra and other members of the Critics Group were guests of the Cuban Goverment as performers in 1969 Jim Carroll |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Nov 16 - 05:58 AM "Jim the confinement of homosexuals in Cuba WAS a direct response to the HIV/AIDS epidemic" PLease do not be as incredibly stupid as your hatred of homosexuality appears to have made you The moral clampdown in Cuba began at the beginning of the 1960s Aids did not surface as an issue until 1982 Unless Cuba set up a secret crystal ball factory to predict two decades into the future - how the **** could that clampdown be related in any way to Aids You forgot your pill again this morning, didn't you? Jim Carroll |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Thompson Date: 27 Nov 16 - 05:20 AM Channel 4 made a documentary, 638 Ways to Kill Castro about the many attempts by the US to assassinate this foreign head of state. I suppose if America and Europe want to show how dastardly Castro was, from a more level playing field, the best way would be to institute the same policies of free universal healthcare, equality of income and free education to degree level. In Cuba, the policy was that even if no one had a lot, everyone had a fair share of whatever there was. Sometimes - as in the 1990s when Cuba was impoverished by the US embargo and the loss of help from Russia - this meant terrible things; adults and children were going blind from malnutrition. Cuba's response was to investigate and develop a State response - distribution of B vitamins - which saved thousands. I can't understand why America continues this embargo. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: akenaton Date: 27 Nov 16 - 05:11 AM Steve, it was not me who brought up the subject of homosexuality in this thread. Jim the confinement of homosexuals in Cuba WAS a direct response to the HIV/AIDS epidemic.....The excellent Cuban Health system had worked out that the main "at risk" sector of the population was male homosexuals, something that other health agencies cannot yet bring themselves to admit. In the interim, many lives have been lost and the epidemic continues unabated. The actions taken in Cuba were not persecution, but common sense health policy. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Dave the Gnome Date: 27 Nov 16 - 05:09 AM Down's Syndrome is not "a disease". It's a way of being human. I know that, Kevin, and you know that and we also know that homosexuality is not a disease but there are those on here and elsewhere that believe that can be cured or treated as well. Usually by restricting their rights - Hence my reference to restricting the rights of people with Downs in my post. Apologies I that I did not make that clear in my 26 Nov 16 - 04:08 PM. I thought that by referring to doing the same to people with brown eyes or black skin made it obvious I was being ridiculous. I would offer my condolences to all who loved him but, although I have no strong views on his regime, it was wrong to imprison people because of their sexuality. When people think that is a good thing I begin to doubt humanity. DtG |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Hrothgar Date: 27 Nov 16 - 04:54 AM I don't want to get into the argument, but I would like to tell this story. In around late 1959 or early 1960 (very soon after Castro came to power, anyway) the Reader's Digest, which can be fairly be described as leaning to the right, had a laudatory article about the heroic revolutionaries who had toppled the brutal dictator, Batista. ... then they found out they were Commies ... I laughed until the tears ran down my leg. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Nov 16 - 04:49 AM "Cuba was massively supported and kept afloat by the U.S.S.R." It was not - Russia bought some of their sugar - not enough to make a significant difference. The aftermath of the Cuban missile Crisis precluded any more involvement than that. Cuba needed to evolve from a basically poor rural economy into a self-supporting country with industries of its own. The small amount of income it got from Russia only managed it to keep its head above water - just. I really don't see too many eulogies for Castro here Bozo - rather, it is an attempt to discuss the achievements and failures of Cuba as a nation and could do without the mindless, right-wing snide. Castro had his faults, but whatever they were, it was the world-wide embargo of its goods that kept it poverty-stricken. That Cold War embargo still exists log after the fall of world Communism - the melting of it began with Obama but don't stand a chance in the mind-freezing fascism of Trump's America. I'd like to agree with Ake's 'Aids' comments, but I'm afraid the morality clampdown came before the 'Gay Plague' hysteria. The clampdown came to break with Batista's allowing the development of a society which freely used sex as a tourist attraction for rich Americans. The partial clampdown on the church had one eye on the use made of religion to suppress and enslave peoples throughout Latin and South America - as the ghost of Archbishop Romero and the raped and murdered Salvadorian nuns, if you want to check. Jim Carroll |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Teribus Date: 27 Nov 16 - 03:37 AM Strange that the people here mentioning the "embargo" and offering it up as the catch all excuse for the ills of Cuba fail to mention the fact that from 1959 until 1991 Cuba was massively supported and kept afloat by the U.S.S.R. The only relaxation of repression came once the U.S.S.R. collapsed and Cuba internationally had to be seen as cleaning it's act up. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 27 Nov 16 - 02:47 AM There's no reason to be so confident that "he came to power lying about his objectives". It seems more likely that faced with reality of persistant hostility from the US his expectations of what was possible and what was necessary changed. During World War Two, Britain too was a dictatorship in all kinds of ways. But after six years it was over. With Cuba the condition of wartime persisted for generations, and is only starting to relax now (and very much under threat of that reversing now). As Jim points out the attitudes towards homosexuality in the 1960s were very much in line with those in the US and Britain and other countries, including the threat of imprisonment. Castro's attitude was totally characteristic of the time. Indeed if Cuba had been out of line and as accepting as present society is, that have been used as another reason to condemn the regime - and would not have gone down well with Cuba's desperateely needed lifeline, the USSR. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: robomatic Date: 26 Nov 16 - 11:48 PM Reinaldo Arenas described his experiences of artistic and homophobic persecution in Cuba in "Before Night Falls" and described his personal perception as follows: "the difference between the communist and capitalist systems is that, although both give you a kick in the ass, in the communist system you have to applaud, while in the capitalist system you can scream. And I came here to scream" Castro can best be described as a predictable disappointment. He came to power lying about his objectives and pursued a despotic rule where his opinion of right and wrong was made to suffice for an entire people. He was ably lampooned by Woody Allen in Bananas as the revolutionary leader who went bonkers with success who commands: "In addition to that, all citizens will be required to change their underwear every half-hour. Underwear will be worn on the outside so we can check." Leaders like Castro, Mugabe, DaEsh, and the Kim ils suck all the air out of the room, institute rules that are not only cruel but BORING, and make average humans sorry to be alive and rob them of hope for their children. Perdition to 'em all! |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Steve Shaw Date: 26 Nov 16 - 08:50 PM Well I think he was a lot more good than bad, but it does behove us to acknowledge that he was less then perfect in many regards. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: The Sandman Date: 26 Nov 16 - 08:47 PM I think he was great. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Steve Shaw Date: 26 Nov 16 - 08:47 PM It's somewhat ironic that Trump has called Castro a brutal dictator when it was the US who propped up the vicious and corrupt Batista regime for years before Castro eventually got rid of it. Castro failed in his promise to make Cuba democratic, but he achieved a lot for his people in spite of desperate and repeated attempts by the US to undermine him or even assassinate him, and in spite of that dismal embargo. I tend to get indigestion whenever I hear US politicians criticise anyone else at all for human rights abuses. That is hypocrisy of the highest order. |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Steve Shaw Date: 26 Nov 16 - 08:38 PM We didn't have two threads, did we? I checked in case someone had beaten me to it before posting this thread. Still, I may be bemused but I'm not bothered.
-Joe- |
|
Subject: RE: Obit: So long, Fidel Castro (1926-2016) From: Joe Offer Date: 26 Nov 16 - 08:13 PM I renamed this to an obituary thread because I don't think we need two separate threads to mark his death. Can't say I always agreed with what he did, but he certainly did a good job of reminding us Americans of our hypocrisy. I think that for the most part, he was good for Cuba, and he was good for the Americas. I wish we could have had a more cordial relationship with him. That would have been of benefit to both nations. -Joe- |
|
Subject: RE: BS: So long, Fidel From: Steve Shaw Date: 26 Nov 16 - 06:18 PM Well yeah, "slightly" doesn't cut it! |
|
Subject: RE: BS: So long, Fidel From: Bonzo3legs Date: 26 Nov 16 - 05:32 PM "Well I didn't exactly expect a string of eulogies, but something a bit more measured than "good riddance" would be good. Perhaps you're yearning for a return to something like a Fulgencio Batista regime. Yeah, that would keep those pesky third-worlders in line... " Crikey, Batista wasn't exactly a bundle of fun was he, seems like the Cubans may have been slightly better off under Castro!!! |
|
Subject: RE: BS: So long, Fidel From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 26 Nov 16 - 05:19 PM I could also save thousands of lives. Maybe if we stopped all people with Down's syndrome from procreating we could eliminate that disease. Or if we killed all those with cystic fibrosis at birth it would save a lot of heartache. It doesn't work like that with Down's syndrome - it's people who haven't got it who have Down's syndrome babies. But of course wer're working hard as a society to eliminate people with Down's syndrome in other ways. Plus people with cystic fibrosis and a lot more... Down's Syndrome is not "a disease". It's a way of being human. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: So long, Fidel From: Steve Shaw Date: 26 Nov 16 - 05:13 PM "The confinement of homosexual in sanatoria was to combat the epidemic of HIV/AIDS which was taking place worldwide...In all probability, the policy saved the lives of thousands of homosexuals." Well we'd save a whole lot more lives by banning childbirth, banning alcohol, banning Big Macs, banning fags, banning pork belly, banning people from going up ladders, banning cars, banning diesel, banning military aid to Israel, banning weaopns sales to Saudi, banning the DWP, banning air-conditioning...stop me somebody... But you've picked on homosexual love. You sad bugger. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: So long, Fidel From: Dave the Gnome Date: 26 Nov 16 - 04:08 PM Interesting to note the difference between the statements from the president elect and the president on his way out. I know which one shows most humanity. Also interesting to note that like seems to attract like. I could also save thousands of lives. Maybe if we stopped all people with Down's syndrome from procreating we could eliminate that disease. Or if we killed all those with cystic fibrosis at birth it would save a lot of heartache. Or maybe those with brown eyes... Or those with black skin... Some of the comments on here just make me sick. Sorry. DtG |
|
Subject: RE: BS: So long, Fidel From: akenaton Date: 26 Nov 16 - 03:25 PM In all probability, the policy saved the lives of thousands of homosexuals. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: So long, Fidel From: akenaton Date: 26 Nov 16 - 03:24 PM The confinement of homosexual in sanatoria was to combat the epidemic of HIV/AIDS which was taking place worldwide. The policy resulted in the lowest rates of hiv infection anywhere in the world. The rates have since been slowly rising but are nowhere near infection rates in UK or USA. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: So long, Fidel From: kendall Date: 26 Nov 16 - 02:39 PM How many of us remember F. Baptista? owned by the Mafia, corrupt to the core. I was in Cuba in 1956 before the revolution. Baptistas armed thugs patrolling the streets with AK 47s. Not a fun place to be. Just another country that had wanted we wanted so, Randolph Hurst talked President McKinley into starting a war. The Cubans did not blow up the Maine. It was proven years later. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: So long, Fidel From: Jim Carroll Date: 26 Nov 16 - 12:21 PM Further to above - homosexual acts in parts of the United States remained a criminal offence until 2014. The law repealing enforced chemical castration for homosexuality was not repealed until 1967 Wonder how this fits in with Bobad's "there have been few examples of repression of homosexuals in history as virulent as in Cuba." Jim Carroll |
| Share Thread: |