Origin: Wild Mountain Thyme

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: Doctor John
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 03:03 PM

Aldus, One of the McPeak family said quite unambiguously that their father or grandfather had actually written the song and that was the end of the matter. I think this was in a programme about the Mc Peaks on Radio 2, almost certainly Jim Lloyd's "Folk on Two" and about five years ago. Dr John

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 02:01 PM

I recorded it for Elektra Records in 1959 (and taught it to Judy Collins in that year when she and I worked together at the Exodus in Denver). I had learned it from a field recording made of the McPeakes which I found in the BBC Recorded Programmes Library which was then housed at the Cecil Sharp House in London. Elektra was never sued by the McPeakes, which makes me wonder about the date of their copyright filing. Perhaps it was simply the obscurity of my Elektra album that served to protect Elektra. It did not, to put it mildly, overwhelm the early folk revival world. (wry smile emoticon inserted here)

In earlier threads on this subject, I think I have pointed to several other traditional versions of the song, including those collected from Carrie Grover in Maine. There is plenty of evidence to show that Francis McPeake's song is an adaptation of an older Scottish song derived from a Tannahill poem. I'll let the chips off of the old copyright block fall where they may.

Sandy

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: GUEST,Bruce O.
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 01:58 PM

Songs that have been around as long as Robert Tannahill's are bound to have a number of variants. There are three early 20th century tunes for two texts in 'The Greig-Duncan Folk Song Collection', IV, #862. Two others have tunes that were published in JFSS 9 (1906). These latter are stressed note and mode coded in file COMBCOD2.TXT on my website. Tannahill's songs were almost all originally published in small magazines in and around Paisley, and it's practically impossible to find original copies of his songs now.

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: Scotsbard
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 01:44 PM

Darn ... can't c&p from photos ...

Points of interest from Bill D's photo of Songs of Scotland (G.F.Graham c.1850) pages for those who don't wish to load 300kb of graphics:
Written by Robert Tanahill of Paisley, b.1774June03, d.1810May17.
Reference cited to similar airs in S.Fraser's 1816 Collection and R.A.Smith's (no date).

The origin of the words seems soundly in early 19th century Scotland, although possibly late in the 18th. The melody might be significantly older. Claiming copyright to more than arrangement certainly would seem inappropriate for anyone born within the last century.

Interesting links ... thank you!
~S~

ps: "Rambling Jack" did a decent show here last week.

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: GUEST,aldus
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 01:36 PM

My Grandfather came from Galway and I can recall hearing him sing this long before the sixties. Is Mr. McPeake the arranger or does he actually claim to have wriiten it ? I am very curious.

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 01:31 PM

The original version was by Robert Tannahill, the 'weaver bard of Paisley' and has been given in an earlier thread.

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: Doctor John
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 01:13 PM

Yes, the Mc Peaks say they wrote it in which case it's an Irish songs which is thought to be Scottish and was once recorded by a Geordie singer who everybody's thinks is Scottish. Did I hear somewhere that "Danny Boy" is in fact Scottish? Dr John

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: bill\sables
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 12:56 PM

In about 1962 I was in the Birtley Folk Club County Durham England, the home of the Elliot family, when the guest singers were the Mc Peak family from Northern Ireland and old Francis Mc Peak said, as he introduced Wild Mountain Thyme, that he had written it. Jack Elliot (not rambling Jack, stumbling Jack) said there and then that this song would be sung at the end of every folk club session in Birtley and as far as I know it always has been. Cheers Bill

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: SDShad
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 09:29 AM

Is there more of a story attached to that, Dick? Makes one curious.

Chris

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 04 Apr 00 - 08:26 PM

The only definitive answer is that if you make a record of it, Mr. McPeake will sue you. Whether or not he wrote it.

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: katlaughing
Date: 04 Apr 00 - 07:11 PM

Our own Sandy Paton is responsible for bringing it over to the US

Subject: RE: Help: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 04 Apr 00 - 06:05 PM

In case you missed the most recent thread, there's a list of links to earlier discussions  here.  As for a definitive answer...well...

Malcolm

Subject: real origin of Wild Mountain Thyme
From: Kim C
Date: 04 Apr 00 - 05:39 PM

This may have come up before but I'm sort of a newbie so -please indulge me, if you will. I have heard a lot of different things about the origin of the song Wild Mountain Thyme. That it was written by one of the McPeakes in this century, based on an older song. That it was written by an adversary of Rob Roy's in the 18th century. (Really. I actually read that somewhere. But only ONE somewhere.)That it's older than the hills. I can't find any information anywhere to prove or disprove anything I've heard. The only thing I know is that the words to the old Braes o'Balquidder are almost identical to Wild Mountain Thyme... but the melody isn't even close. Ideas? Thanks!!!!!!