Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 20 Feb 17 - 03:13 PM

Hi Steve,

I couldn't find any UK versions of Careless Love either, Steve. I do have Kelly's Love by Odum but it's in 1911 JAF- is that the version? I'll check out the Gardiner. TY.

Here's a version of Sailor Boy named Black is the Color:

BLACK IS THE COLOR- sung by a Missouri woman with a guitar; from a field recording in the possession of the late Bil Godsey, Champaign, Illinois before late 1950s

Chorus: Black, black is the color of my true love's hair,
His face is like some lily fair.
If ever he returns it will give me great joy,
For none can I love but my sweet sailor boy.

Oh Ma, oh Mother, go build me a boat
That I may on the ocean float,
And call to the ships as they pass by,
Tell me, pray, have you seen my sweet sailor boy.

She built her a boat on the deep, deep main,
And she spied three ships come out from Spain,
And she called to the captain as they passed by,
Tell me, pray, have you seen my sweet sailor boy?

Chorus.

"Oh no," said the captain, "That never can be,
"For your love was drowned in the deep salt sea,
"There off Rock Island as we passed by,
"It was there that we lost your sweet sailor boy."

She stove her boat into the rocks,
And I thought that the poor lady's heart was broke.
She wrung her hands and she tore her hair
Just like someone in deep despair.

Chorus.

Go dig me a grave both wide and deep,
Place a marble slab at my head and feet,
And on my breast place a mourning dove
To show to the world I died for love.

Richie

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 20 Feb 17 - 02:45 PM

In all of my searches through collections I have never come across anything in the British Isles that relates to the Careless Love stanza. I was singing this song back in the early 60s before I became fully immersed in English trad song so I would have spotted anything had I seen it and noted it down. Personally I would treat Peggy's comments in the same vein as Bert's or Ewan's. Peggy was interested in singers and immediate sources but not really histories to the extent that we are.

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 20 Feb 17 - 02:37 PM

Do you have this unique piece from the Gardiner manuscripts?

Through Lonesome Woods (Roud 3461) On the EFDSS website it is ref. GG/1/20/1304

The last line of st 1 and all of st 2 are from the alehouse stanza, and stanza 3 appears to be an echo of stanza 3 in 'She's Like the Swallow'. The rest seems to be unique, unless you can trace any of it. To me it looks like a garbled made up piece from half remembered fragments.

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 20 Feb 17 - 02:24 PM

Have you got the Mississippi 1909 version of Careless Love from JAFL?

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 20 Feb 17 - 02:01 PM

Hi

Steve, glad you're back. In this case its the position of "letter writing" stanza in the ballad (before she dies) that creates a commonality. A number of writers including Malcom Douglas (on Mudcat) have pointed out this 'letter writing' stanza as a common stanza between Died for Love and Sailor Boy. I guess it seemed obvious to me. Do you want further evidence?

Steve, do you have any early broadsides of Sailor Boy not listed by me? Are there any Sailor Boy broadsides with stanzas of Died for Love?

By the way I created a study of "The Colour of Amber" on my site: http://www.bluegrassmessengers.com/7m-the-coulor-of-amber.aspx It will include the Sailor Boy/Black is the Colour relationships as well as the two different songs titled "Colour of Amber".

Still plugging away,

Richie

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 20 Feb 17 - 01:10 PM

Hi Richie,
You will probably know from your many Child Ballads you have studied that the letter writing motif is extremely common in both Child Ballads and broadside ballads. It should not be taken as an indicator of borrowing or relation unless there is more text in common.

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 20 Feb 17 - 11:41 AM

Hi,

I started the headnotes of Sailor Boy/Sweet William but left them, here's a link: http://www.bluegrassmessengers.com/7a-the-sailor-boy-or-sweet-william.aspx

The Died for Love stanzas are found only in traditional versions. Here are two good examples from the UK in the late 1800s:

Sweet William- Collected by Lucy Broadwood from Mrs Harley, Bewdley, 1893

O father, father, build me a boat,
That on this wild ocean I may float,
And every ship that I chance to meet
I will enquire for my William sweet.

I had not sailed more than half an hour,
Before I met with a man on board (man of war?)
"Kind captain, captain, come tell me true,
Is my sweet William on board with you?"

"Oh no, fine lady, he is not here,
That he is drown-ed most breaks my fear,
For the other night when the wind blew high
That's when you lost your sweet sailor boy."

I'll set me down, and I write a song,
I'll write it neat, and I'll write it long,
And at every word I will drop a tear,
And in every line I'll set my Willie dear.

I wish, I wish, but it's all in vain,
I wish I was a sweet maid again,
But a maid, a maid I never shall be
Till apples grow on an orange tree.
For a maid, a maid, I shall never be,
Till apples grow on an orange tree.

* * * *

"Early, Early All in the Spring." Sung by Mrs Hollings, originally from Lincolnshire (c.1870?); collected by Frank Kidson; published in JFSS, 2 (1906), 293–4.

Early, early all in the spring,
My love was press'd to serve the King ;
The wind blew high and the wind blew low,
And parted me and my young sailor boy.

"O father, father, make me a boat,
That on the ocean I may float,
And every [French, fresh, king's] ship as I pass by,
I will enquire for my sailor boy."

She had not sailed far across the deep,
Before five king's ships she chanced to meet,
"Come, jolly sailors, come tell me true—
Does my love sail in along with you?"

"What clothes does your true love wear?
What colour is your true love's hair?"
"A blue silk jacket, all bound with twine;
His hair is not the colour of mine."

"Oh no fair lady, your love's not here—
He has got drown'd, I greatly fear;
For on yon ocean as we passed by,
'Twas there we lost a young sailor-boy."

She wrung her hands, and tore her hair,
Like some lady in deep despair,
Saying "Happy, happy is the girl," she cried,
"Has got a true love down by her side."

She set her down and wrote a song—
She wrote it wide, she wrote it long;
At every line she shed a tear,
And at every verse she said "My dear."

When her dear father came home that night,
He called for his heart's delight;
He went upstairs, the door he broke,
He found her hanging by a rope.

He took a knife and cut her down;
Within her bosom a note was found,
And in this letter these words were wrote:
"Father, dear father, my heart is broke.

Father, dear father, dig me a grave—
Dig it wide and dig it deep;
And in the middle put a lily-white dove,
That the world may know I died for love."

* * * *

The broadsides and Christie's "Sailing Trade" have no stanzas in common with Died for Love songs. Here's a short list of broadsides-- maybe Steve Gardham can add to this and provide an early print date:

1. Sailor Boy ("Down by a crystal river side") printed by Pitts c. 1820.
2. Sailor Boy and his Faithful Mary ("A sailor's life is a merry life") printed J. Harkness, printer, Preston: Printed at 121, Church-street; between 1840 and 1866 and also by Pitts.
3. A New Song call'd the Young Lady's Lamentation for the Loss of her True Love ("'Tis early, early all in the Spring") printed c.1867 by P. Brereton, 1, Lower Exchange St., Dublin.
4. The Sailor Boy and his Faithful Nancy, a Catnach broadside--Harvard College, 25242.17, vii, 198.
5. The Young Lady's Lamentation for the Loss of her True Love ("'Tis early, early all in the Spring") printed by James Guthrie, Illustrated by Jack Yeats, 1909 County Dublin.

The "Colour of Amber" or "Black is the Colour" stanza is the maid's response to the question 'What did her sailor boy look like?' (see 4th stanza of "Early, Early" above) after she hails a ship in search of her sailor boy.

The other stanza in common with Died for Love that's not as obvious is the "writing a letter/note (or song)" stanza which the maid does after she learns her sailor boy has drowned. This is similar to the writing of the note by the maid before she hangs herself in the Died for Love songs such as Cruel Father, Rambling Boy, Butcher Boy and Maiden's Prayer.

Richie

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 19 Feb 17 - 05:32 PM

Hi,

To consider which to include, let's look at both. Roud lumps them - he gives both versions, Mary Ann Haynes UK version and the Newfoundland versions as Roud 1716 when they are different songs that share a similar first stanza.

"The Colour of Amber" sung by Mary Ann Haynes in 1974 (on Voice 11):
   
Oh, the colour of amber was my love's hair,
And his two blue eyes they enticed me,
And his ruby lips, they being soft and fine,
Oh, many a time they've been pressed to mine.
   
Oh, I'll go a-fishing in yonder's brook
There I'll catch my love with a line and a hook,
And if he loves me, oh, like I love him,
No man on earth shall part us two.

Now, I wish, I wish, now this is all in vain.
Oh, I wish to God I was a maiden again.
Oh, a maid again I shall never more be,
Whilst apples growed on a orange tree.

This has one stanza of Died for Love and the first stanza is found similarly in a relative- Sailor Boy. here's one of several Newfoundland versions.

The Colour Of Amber- Collected in 1951 from Nicholas (Nick) Davis of St Shott's, NL, by MacEdward Leach. This is a variant of "Early, Early in the Spring" which is Laws M1, Roud #152:

Oh, the colour of amber is my love's hair,
And her rosy cheeks do my heart ensnare;
Her ruby lips so meek and mild,
Ofttimes have pressed them to those of mine.

As I sailed down the London Shore,
Where the loud cannon balls they roar,
In the midst of danger ofttimes I've been,
Ofttimes I have thought on you, Mary Green.

As I sailed down the London Shore,
I kept writing letters o'er and o'er;
I kept writing letters to you, my dear,
Out of all of them I received but one.

If you wrote letters back to this town,
Out of all of them I received but one;
You're false, oh, false love is none of mine,
Don't speak so hard of a sailmaker.

Straightway I went to her father's house,
And it's on this fair maid I did call;
Her father spoke me this reply,
Sayin', daughter dear, don't you love the boy.

I asked this father what he did mean,
Or would his daughter married be,
To some other young man to be a wife,
For I will go farther and take a life.

Now since my love has a man received,
A single life I will still remain;
I will plough the seas till the day I die,
I will split the waves till 'neath them I lie.

Very different songs with a similar first stanza. The Newfoundland version, a variant of "Early, Early in the Spring" which is Laws M1, Roud #152, is curiously similar to the Georgia version "Betsy, My Darling Girl"-- which is one thing that attracted me to the song. Although "The Colour of Amber" (Black is the Colour) stanza with variation appears in some versions of Sailor Boy, the Newfoundland ballad, "The Colour of Amber" has a different plot. See: "Early, Early in the Spring" Laws M1, Roud #152 for details.

Richie

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 19 Feb 17 - 05:01 PM

Hi,

Moving on to other related songs/ballads. We haven't covered Sailor Boy or Sweet William which borrows from Died for Love and other songs.

One other song is "The Colour of Amber." A similar stanza is also known famously as "Black is the Color/Colour." A single version of three stanzas (with one Died for Love stanza) was collected in the UK by Mike Yates in 1974. A number of Newfoundland versions use the title which are unique variants of Sailor Boy (divergent plot some similar stanzas):

The Colour Of Amber (MacEdward Leach)

Oh, the colour of amber is my love's hair,
And her rosy cheeks do my heart ensnare;
Her ruby lips so meek and mild,
Ofttimes have pressed them to those of mine.

and here's a stanza from NC collected by Sharp from William Wells:

2 Yellow was the colour of my true love's hair,
Cheeks was like a lily fair.
If he returns it'll give me joy;
Never love any but a sweet soldier boy.

This 1916 version is a variant of Sweet William. The question is: should these be part of the ballads related to Died for Love?

Richie

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 18 Feb 17 - 08:41 PM

Hi,

The only other variant that could possibly be related, is this odd version found in "Folksongs of Florida," Morris, 1950. Morris identifies this as a variant of "Butcher Boy" by the melody and a few related stanzas.
Mrs. G. A. Griffin, an outstanding informant for both Morris and Lomax, was born in 1863 in Georgia. By the time she was thirteen she learned the bulk of her older ballads from her father, John Hart, who was a fiddler. This is therefore dated pre-1877 -- the date when she left her father and moved to Florida.
In my opinion this too is an unusual rendition of the "Cruel Father" (see last post) sung from the man's point of view. The plot would be similar: When the lovers were discovered her father presses the young man to sea where he must spend his "wretched life" with out his lover. He utters the famous Died for Love ending. Suddenly, he is visited by his true love (this could be a dream sequence or it has simply turned into a "night visit" ballad and he is a ghost). He pledges, "I love her now until I die."
This is all speculative. Since the song by its melody and text is placed as a version of Butcher Boy by Morris and it has the cannonball reference, it makes some sense. Morris says that the song has, "an existence of its own," however, he doesn't have an idea what that could be.

67. BETSY, MY DARLING GIRL
(Archive 956-81).

"Betsy, My Darling Girl." Recorded on March 19, 1937, from the singing of Mrs. G. A. Griffin, Newberry, Florida, learned from her father in Georgia by 1877-- with music.

1. I'm going up yonder to yonders town,
Where the cannon balls flash round and round,
And there I'll spend my days and years
My weeks, my months, my wretched life.

2. I called for a chair to seat myself upon,
And a pen and ink to write her name down,
And every line I shed a tear
For Betsy, O Betsy, my darling girl.

3. So dig my grave both steep and deep,
And marble stones at my head and feet,
And on my breast put a snow white dove
To show the world I died for love.

4. Who's at my gate, that darling girl?
Who's at my gate, that darling girl?
Who's at my gate, my own true love?
I love her now until I die.

5. Come in, my own true love,
Come in, come my darling girl;
Come in, come my own true love,
For I love you now until I die.

6. O give to me your lily-white hand,
O give to me both your heart and hand.
She gave to me her lily-white hand,
For I love her now until I die.

Richie

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 18 Feb 17 - 07:50 PM

Hi,

Great news!!! I finally got the Leach ballad, Beam of Oak. His book, "Folk Ballads and Songs of the Lower Labrador Coast" (by MacEdward Leach) came in the mail today. Beam of Oak was mentioned in the Died for Love first thread (see link above- closed thread). It is an excellent traditional version of B, similar to the broadside-- "Cruel Father or Deceived Maid." This is one of only three extant traditional versions that are reasonably close to the original.

Beam of Oak - Sung by Stuart Letto of Lance au Clair, Labrador in July, 1960.

1. A farmer's daughter, you may understand,
She fell in love with a servant man.
And when her father came this to hear,
He separated her from her dear.

2. We haven't been scarce three days at sea,
When they fell into a bloody fray.
It was this young man's lot to fall;
He lost his life by a cannon ball.

3. Scarce three days after, this young man was seen;
His deathly ghost to her father came,
With his deadly wounds by his bedside stood,
With his arms and shoulders all covered with blood.

4. So when this lady came this to hear,
How she had lost her own true dear,
That very night to the beam of oak
She hung herself with her own bed rope.

5. Her father he came home late that night,
Inquiring for his own heart's delight,
He went upstairs and the door he broke;
He found her hanging to the beam of oak.

6. The servants, they all gathered round,
All for to cut this fair maiden down,
And in her bosom there was concealed
A written note of true loves revealed.

7. It was wrote with blood by a woman's hand.
She wrote these words, as you may understand.
Saying, "Father father the worst of men,
Twas you that brought me to this untimely end.

8. "You sent my Willie away from me,
Which caused my ruin and his destiny."
Her father, he did speechless remain,
And the tears ran down his cheeks like rain.

9. Her father, so we are told, went mad;
Her mother being almost as bad;
May this sad tale now a warning be
Of this sad, doleful sad, tragedy.

This is the title of The Traditional Ballad Index entry which gives Roud 18830 as the Roud number. According to Steve Gardham, Roud 18830 is Rambling Boy, a different ballad with the same ending (suicide). If you look at Roud 18830 only two versions are Cruel Father (Beam of Oak and Rambling Boy- the cowboy song of c. 1916). Apparently Rambling Boy and Cruel Father have not been separated yet, or some confusion exists, which is typical of the Died for Love ballads. As far as I know, I have every version of "Cruel Father"-- all 19 versions-- except most of them are very corrupt. If you remember in the Died for Love II thread (link above- closed) I posted an old Hicks/Harmon version from Rebecca Harmon that could date back to the 1700s in Virginia. Harmon's version is typical of most US versions- it's very corrupt. There is not actually a Roud number for Beam of Oak (assuming Roud 18830 is Rambling Boy) but Steve Gardham told me to use Roud 23272. So I'm petitioning the brilliant Steves (Gardham and Roud) to get this str8ened out!!!!

The "beam of oak" is what the daughter ties the rope upon which she uses to hang herself. The suicide by hanging and the similar opening is what ties this variant to Rambling Boy and some other Died for Love songs. The suicide, for example, is also found in Foolish Young Girl. The plot of Cruel Father is this: A father finds out his daughter has fallen in love with an apprentice and presses the young man to become a sailor aboard a man-o'-war. Soon after going to sea, the sailor is killed in battle by a cannonball. That very night the sailor's ghost haunts the father. Shortly thereafter the father comes home and finds his daughter "hanging from a rope." After he cuts her down he finds a note on her breast calling him the worst of all men. Only the Queen of Hearts shares this plot, but in the Queen of Hearts the plot is only two stanzas added at the end- as an afterthought.

It seems possible that Cruel Father is the progenitor of the Rambling Boy which is the same ballad without a distinct plot and uses floating Died for Love stanzas. In Rambling Boy the girl's suicide is the result of her unrequited love.

Richie

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 18 Feb 17 - 06:54 PM

Hi,

Lastly-- I'll be adding to my headnotes of Careless Love before moving on. Here is a link http://www.bluegrassmessengers.com/7l-careless-love.aspx to the rough draft with a close-up of a painting I did of Careless Love about 10 years ago-- it depicts a young pregnant girl standing in the doorway on the porch of a cabin in Appalachia. Before her is a large hound dog sleeping and beside her is her father-- whittling. Her lover, who just passes by but doesn't stop in, is confronted by her mother who stands on the porch-- waving a shotgun! The close-up is poor resolution so it looks fuzzy but you get the point.
There are other scenes in the full-view of the painting but they are hidden- I've done about 36 song paintings which can be viewed here: http://mattesonart.com/careless-love.aspx Several of the paintings are displayed at the KY Music Hall-of-Fame.

Comments and different versions are welcome. Anything that can relate the identifying stanza

Love, oh love, oh careless love,
Love, oh love, oh careless love,
Love, oh love, oh careless love,
Oh look what careless love has done.

to a version in the UK would be appreciated,

Richie

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 18 Feb 17 - 04:41 PM

Hi,

Aunt Molly Jackson of Kentucky obviously thought these two songs were woven from the same cloth. In the 1930s Jackson sang the words to "Butcher's Boy" with the melody of "Careless Love" which was recorded by Lomax. Listen: https://lomaxky.omeka.net/items/show/59 Each two lines of Jackson's "Butcher Boy" makes a stanza- so it takes twice as long to sing!!!

The following stanzas are similar to the Appalachian lyrics my female singer sang in my bluegrass group in the early 1990s:

Careless Love

Love, oh love, my careless love,
Love, oh love, my careless love.
Love, oh love, oh careless love,
Oh look what careless love has done.

Once I wore my apron low,
Once I wore my apron low.
Once I wore my apron low,
I could not keep you from my door.

Now my apron strings won't pin,
Now my apron strings won't pin.
Now my apron strings won't pin,
You pass my door and won't come in.

I love my mama and papa, too,
I love my mama and papa, too.
I love my mama and papa, too,
I'd leave them just to go with you.

When I die, don't bury me deep;
When I die, don't bury me deep,
When I die, don't bury me deep,
Place a marble rock at my head and feet.

Upon my breast, place a lily-white dove,
Upon my breast, place a lily-white dove,
Upon my breast, place a lily-white dove,
For to show to the world I died for love.

We also did a version with floating lyrics that I sang with,

Sorrow, sorrow to my heart (3X)
Since I and my true love did part.

Oh I wish that train would come (3X)
And carry me back where I come from.

, &etc. with Careless love as first verse and chorus.

Richie

Subject: RE: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 18 Feb 17 - 03:27 PM

Hi,

I'd like to find any UK versions that are not Died For Love that have the "Careless Love" text. The following may better explain the ballad and what I need as a UK example--here's an excerpt from my headnotes:

[This famous song has been adapted by a number of singers of different genres (folk, blues, jazz, country, pop) of music in the US and abroad. The song is identified by this stanza which is sometimes used as its chorus:

Love, oh love, oh careless love,
Love, oh love, oh careless love,
Love, oh love, oh careless love,
Oh look what careless love has done.

Although a number of floating stanzas have been attached to Careless Love and in some versions its identifying stanza and theme have been lost, this song/ballad was either derived from or is similar to "The Died for Love Songs" and in particular the "apron" stanzas relating to the maid's pregnancy as found in the "Brisk Young Lover," "Alehouse" and "I Wish, I Wish" songs.

It's clear "what careless love has done." The maid is pregnant and bewails her pregnant condition. If she'd have listened to what mama said, she would be sleeping in Mama's bed[]. Instead she must face the stigma associated with being an unwed mother- not a happy proposition either in Scotland or rural Appalachia. As in the Died for Love songs she faces the prospect of being abandoned. Here's a stanza sung by Miss Grace Hahn, Fayetteville, Arkansas, 1941[]:

Go hand me down my old valise,
And bundle up my dirty clothes,
And if my momma asks about me
Just tell her I'm sleeping out of doors.

Many of the standard Careless Love stanzas directly correspond to those found in the Died for Love songs. It's already clear that the "apron" stanzas are related. Now consider these other stanza from Mrs. Lillian Short, Galena, MO, 1942:

Ain't this enough to break my heart, (3 times)
To see my man with another sweetheart? [He takes another girl on his knee]

Now my money's spent and gone (3 times) [She has more gold than I]
You pass my door a-singing a song.

Oh I love my mamma and my papa too (3 times) [I'd leave my mother, I'd leave my father]
But I'd leave them both and go with you.

Naturally, different blues type lyrics have become attached to Careless Love that are not part of the fundamental song. By the 1920s the stanzas about pregnancy were being replaced and other floating stanzas were added:

I wish that eastbound train would run
I wish that eastbound train would run
I wish that eastbound train would run
And carry me back where I come from

Times ain't like they used to be
Times ain't like they used to be
Times ain't like they used to be
Carry me back to Tennessee.

This is especially true of many of the early country texts by Riley Puckett and others. The song then becomes a song with the Careless Love stanza and floating "blues" or "abandonment" type lyrics. Even more confusing is when the floating lyrics are from other similar songs as in this stanza from Perrow (MS of 1909, Mississippi Whites):

I'm going to leave you now;
I'm going ten thousand miles.
If I go ten million more,
I'll come back to my sweetheart again.

These lyrics are from "Ten Thousand Miles" a different song, with a similar sentiment. Careless Love is listed as Roud 422 and unfortunately a number of different songs are also part of Roud 422. This is not a lament about "turtle doves" or "lonesome doves" leaving their mate or about a lover "leaving and going away."

Richie

Subject: Origins: Died for Love Sources: PART III
From: Richie
Date: 18 Feb 17 - 02:51 PM

This is an edited PermaThread®, used for a special project. This thread will be moderated. Feel free to post to this thread, but remember that all messages posted here are subject to editing or deletion.
-Joe Offer-

Hi,

This is a study of Died for Love songs as suggested by Steve Gardham, who also studied these ballads/songs and has provided a number of excellent versions and broadsides.

From this I've organized the ballads/songs as such: (link with unfinished rough draft: http://www.bluegrassmessengers.com/7-died-for-love-brisk-young-sailorrambling-boy.aspx)

A. Died for Love-- Roud 60 ("I Wish, I Wish") Roud 495
   a. "The Effects of Love- A New Song," broadside; 1 sheet; 1/80. British Library 11621.k.4(158), London c.1780.

B. The Cruel Father ("A squire's daughter near Aclecloy,") her love is sent to sea- dies of a cannonball; Roud 23272
   a. "The Cruel Father or Deceived Maid," from the Madden Collection, c.1790.
   b. "Answer to Rambling Boy" from a chapbook by J. & M. Robertson, Saltmarket, Glasgow; 1799.
   c. "The Squire's Daughter," printed by W. Shelmerdine and Co., Manchester c. 1800
   d. "Answer to Rambling Boy," four printings from US Chapbooks: 1. The Harper: to which are added, Shannon's flowery banks, The rambling boy, with The answer. Bung your eye, Henry and Laury [i.e. Laura]. London [i.e., Philadelphia : s.n., 1805?] 2. The Rambling boy, with the Answer : to which is added, Blue bells of Scotland, Good morrow to your night cap, Capt. Stephen Decatur's victory, Green upon the cape. From Early American imprints., Second series, no. 50722. [Philadelphia]: [publisher not identified], 1806; 3. The Bold mariners: The rambling boy, and the answer: Roslin Castle, to which is added the answer: Flashy Tom. [Philadelphia? : s.n.], January, 1811; 4. Ellen O'Moore. The Bold mariners. The Rambling boy. Barbara Allen. [United States : s.n.], January, 1817.
   e. "Sweet William," as written down about July 1, 1915, by Miss Mae Smith of Sugar Grove, Watauga county, from the singing of her stepmother, Mrs. Mary Smith, who learned it over forty years ago. submitted by Thomas Smith, Brown Collection, c.1875.
   f. "Rambling Boy" Cowboy Songs and Other Frontier Ballads, John Lomax 1916 edition.
   g. "Cruel Father" sung by Fanny Coffee of White Rock, Virginia on May 8, 1918. Cecil Sharp Manuscript Collection.
   h. "The Wrecked and Rambling Boy" from Mrs. Audrey Hellums, Tishomingo, Mississippi. Hudson C, 1926
   i. "Oh Willie" from Mary Lou Bell of Staunton Virginia; 1932
   j. "The Isle of Cloy" collected by E.J. Moeran in the 1930s in Suffolk from George Hill and Oliver Waspe.
   k. "I Am a Rambling Rowdy Boy," sung by Rena Hick of Beech Mountain, NC collected in December, 1933 by Melinger Henry. Songs Sung in the Southern Appalachians, by Mellinger Henry, London c.1934.
   l. "Black Birds.' Miss Lura Wagoner of Vox, Allegheny County, NC, 1938
   m. "Oh Willie" sung by Rod Drake of Silsbee Texas; See Owens, 1952.
   n. "Rude and Rambling Boy," Buna Hicks Sugar Grove, NC , 1966. Warner

C. The Rambling Boy ("I am a wild and a rambling boy") Roud 18830, c. 1765
   a. "The Wild Rover," The Musical Companion (British Library) London, c. 1765.
   b. "Rambling Boy," To which is Added, The New Vagary O, Shepherds I Have Lost My Love, The Drop of Dram, Fight Your Cock in the Morning. Published by W. Goggin of Limerick BM 11622 c.14, dated 1790.
   c. "Rambling Boy," from a chapbook by J. & M. Robertson, Saltmarket, Glasgow; 1799. Same text as "Rambling Boy" printed by William Scott in Greenock no date, probably early 1800s [c. 1812].
   d. "Rambling Boy," broadside J. Pitts, 14 Great St. Andrew Street, Seven Dials, London c. 1806
   e. "The Wild Rambling Boy," T. Birt, Printer, 39, Great St. Andrew Street, Seven Dials; London c. 1833.
   f. "The Rambling Boy" broadside first line "rake and rambling boy" (Manchester Reference Library, Ballads Vol. 5, page 392) Gardham 5A

D. Brisk Young Lover ("A brisk young sailor courted me,") Roud 60
   a. "The Lady's Lamentation for the Loss of her Sweetheart," from the Manchester Central library; c.1775. It is mixed with Oxfordshire Tragedy c. 1686 (after stanza 4) and called a sequel to Oxfordhire by Ebsworth.
   b. "A New Song Call'd the Distress'd Maid," London, (no imprint) in the Madden Collection Cambridge University Library (Slip Songs H-N no. 1337) c.1785.
   c. ["A Faithful Shepherd"] - from John Clare (b. 1793 in Helpstone), MS dated 1818
   d. "Brisk Young Sailor," broadside by W. Pratt, Printer, 82, Digbeth, Birmingham; c.1850
   e. "Brisk Young Sailor," broadside by Bebbington, Manchester; c. 1855
   f. "Brisk Young Sailor" sung by Starlina Lovell, gypsy, in Wales area. Collected by Groome, published 1881.
   g. "There Was Three Worms," sung by Mr. Bartlett of Dorset in 1905; collected by H.E.D Hammond. From: Songs of Love and Country Life by Lucy E. Broadwood, Cecil J. Sharp, Frank Kidson, Clive Carey and A. G. Gilchrist; Journal of the Folk-Song Society, Vol. 5, No. 19 (Jun., 1915), pp. 174-203.
   h. "A Brisk Young Sailor." Sung by Thomas (William) Colcombe, Weobley, Herefords, noted F.W. Jekyll, Sep. 1906.
   i. "A Brisk Young Sailor." Tune noted by Francis Jekyll in 1908. Tune and 1st stanza given by Mr. Ford of Scaynes Hill, Sussex; additional words by Mrs. Cranstone. From the George Butterworth Manuscript Collection (GB/12/3).
   j. "Died For Love" (A bold young farmer) Isla Cameron

E. Butcher Boy ("In Jersey city where I did dwell") Roud 409; Roud 18832
   a. "The Butcher Boy." broadside [Philadelphia]: J.H. Johnson, song publisher, 7 N. Tenth St., Philadelphia., c. 1860
   b. "The Butcher Boy," broadside from H. De Marsan (New York), 1861-1864 Bodleian, Harding B 18(72) c. 1860
   c. "The Butcher Boy of Baltimore," words and music by Harry Tofflin. "Wm. J. Schmidt, 2507 W. North Ave. NY c. 1865
   d. "The Butcher Boy" Henry De Marsan's New Comic and Sentimental Singer's Journal, Issue 1, p. 16, NY, 1871
   e. "The Butcher Boy." Broadside by Henry J. Wehman, Song Publisher, No. 50 Chatham Street, New York City; c.1880.

F. Foolish Young Girl, or, Irish Boy ("What a foolish girl was I,") Roud 60
a. "The Irish Boy," Elizabeth St. Clair of Edinburgh, c.1770; Clark, The Mansfield Manuscript (2015) pp.4-6.
b. "The Maid's Tragedy," a broadside from St. Bride's Printing Library S447 (my ref BS 1900), c1790.
c. "A New Love Song," Gil, No. 6, printed by Bart. Corcoran, Inn's Quay, Dublin c. 1774?
d. "The Irish Boy," a broadside, Poet's Box, 80 London Street, Glasgow, c. 1872
e. "Sailor Boy," sung by Georgina Reid of Aberdeenshire, about 1882 Duncan C
f."Foolish Young Girl" From John Strachan, of Strichen, b. 1875 heard the song as a child. His mother used to sing it, c. 1885.
g, "Student Boy," sung by W. Wallace of Aberdeenshire about September, 1908 Duncan B
h. "Foolish Young Girl," sung by Jean Elvin, Turriff, 1952- recorded by Hamish Henderson. From "Tocher: Tales, Songs, Tradition" - Issue 43 - Page 41, 1991.
i. "The Young Foolish Girl," sung by Jeannie Hutchison, Traditional Music from the Shetland Isles (online) SA1974.13.3

G. Queen of Hearts ("The Queen of Hearts and the Ace of sorrow") Roud 3195
a. "The Queen of Hearts" Pitts Printer; Wholesale Toy and Marble warehouse 6, Great St. Andrew street; 7 Dials, London- c.1820
b. "The Queen of Hearts" Wright, Printer, 113, Moor-Street, Birmingham c. 1833
c. "Queen of Hearts" Collected Baring-Gould as sung by a workman engaged on the Burrow-Tor reservoir at Sheepstor, the water supply for Plymouth, 1894

H. The Darling Rose ("My love he is a false love,"); an imitation of a minstrel version.
a. "The Darling Rose," a broadside (GPB 585) Air- Beauty and the Beast; October 4, 1851

I. "There is a Tavern in the Town" by William H. Hills, 1883. ("There is a tavern in the town") Roud 18834
a. "There Is a Tavern in the Town" from 1883 edition of William H. Hill's Student Songs. Also R. Marsh songbook od similar date published Marsh & Co., St. James's Walk, Clerkenwell, London.
b. "Randoo, Randoo, Randoo" which has the chorus of "There is a Tavern" which should pre-date 1883. Earliest print is circa 1883 in R. Marsh songbook published Marsh & Co., St. James's Walk, Clerkenwell, London. Also W. S. Fortey's "The Popular Songster" and W. S. Fortey's "Yankee Barnum's Songster" [no date given] and in the 1888 fictional book, "The Right Honourable": A Romance of Society and Politics, by McCarthy and Campbell-Praed; published by D. Appleton and Company.
c. "Tavern in the Town" by F. J. Adams, 1891.
d. "The Drunkard Song." Rudy Vallee, 1934

J. Maiden's Prayer ("She was a maiden young and fair") c.1918; Roud18828
a. The Soldier's Love- sung by Fred Cottenham (Kent) c.1925
b. Maiden's Prayer- Airman's Song Book, p126 by C Ward Jackson and Leighton Lucas, dated c. 1933.
d. "All You Maidens Sweet and Kind." From Hamish Henderson's "Ballads of World War II" (Caledonian Press, Glasgow, 1947). Recorded (almost) verbatim on Ewan MacColl's "Bless 'em All and Other British Army Songs" (Riverside, 1959).
e. Maiden's Prayer- sung by Doreen Cross of Hessle, East Riding, Yorkshire in 1974. From "An East Riding Songster," 1982 by Steve Gardham.
f. Sailor Boy- sung by Tony Ballinger of Brockworth. Recorded by Gwilym Davies, Upton St. Leonards, Gloucestershire on 14 April, 1977; Gwilym Davies Collection.

* * * *

Only a small number of ballads have been added under each letter (only B is nearly complete) but it's clear what the ballads are. So far I've finished around 200 UK ballads and about 80 US/Canada variants. These are available under "British & other versions" and "US & Canada versions." The UK versions are nearly complete although some are missing.

Since these ballads are also related to a number of different ballads, I've begun separate studies of each one- the following ballads/songs are ones that I've started and as of today several are finished or I've written at least part of the headnotes:

7A. The Sailor Boy, or, Sweet William (Soldier Boy; Sweet William; Pinery Boy; Early, Early in the Spring)
7B. Love Has Brought Me to Despair (Constant Lady; Love Has Brought Me to Despair; False Lover;)
7C. Sheffield Park-- Roud 860 ("The Unfortunate Maid;" "The Young Man of Sheffield Park;" "In Yorkshire Park" )
7D. Every Night When The Sun Goes In (Every Night When The Sun Goes Down)
7E. Will Ye Gang Love, or, Rashy Muir (Rashie Moor; Rashy Moor)
7F. My Blue-Eyed Boy (Bring Back My Blue-Eyed Boy)
7G. Early, Early by the Break of Day (The Two Lovers; (broadside): A new song called William and Nancy or The Two Hearts)
7H. She's Like the Swallow (She's Like the Swallow; The Constant Lady and False-Hearted Squire)
7I. I Love You, Jamie (Foolish Young Girl)
7J. I Know my Love by his Way of Walking (I Know My Love)
7K. Love Is Teasing (Love Is Pleasing)
7L. Careless Love (Reckless Love, Loveless Love, Careless Love Blues)

* * * *

If you would like to be part of this thread, you may post a traditional Died for Love version with source or just make a comment. Thanks to Gwilym Davies who has sent me MP3s of several versions he's recorded. I am also missing a number of versions which you may have access to. Posting them would help. I'll be bring missing versions up as we go.

We've talked about Careless Love briefly but I've added it as 7L. Clearly it's related to Died for Love. One question I have is from an online statement from Peggy Seeger's website:

Peggy Seeger says 'Careless Love' descends from an English song 'You've Been Careless Love,' and she sings it in 3/4 time or waltz rhythm.

What is this English song? And what are the UK variants that use the "Love, oh love, oh careless love" verse? Are there any?

Richie