Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts in May?

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts in May?
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Sep 22 - 04:21 PM

For when this thread is revived in 20 years time it may be worth noting that hawthorn used to come into bloom in May. Even now in 2022 waiting until May is a thing of the past in many parts of England.

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts in May?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 29 Sep 22 - 01:02 AM

With all this talk about open air sex, how am I ever going to sing this song with a straight face to kids again? ;-)

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts in May?
From: r.padgett
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 09:56 PM

"Lawrence Silverman sent us this email about the song, "Nuts in May" with the note, "I grew up (a long time ago) in the depths of rural England when many old customs now forgotten were still observed. I don't like to think of them being altogether forgotten...

About the children's song, 'Here we come gathering nuts in May', it tells of things long forgotten that were associated with May Day, There are, of course, no nuts to gather in May. They come in the autumn.

I believe the original was not nuts but knots and referred to the knots (bunches) of the mayflower tree (aka hawthorn) that are out at that time when it starts to get warm enough to put aside winter clothes. The mayflower is a symbol of spring and was gathered by young people in the woods on May Eve to make posies -knots of May- to give to the people in their village to commemorate the coming of new life, but particularly a member of the opposite sex they hoped to win as a bride or groom.

Like many May Day customs, which were originally fertility rites, it often got a bit out of hand. Some of the young folk would not come home till morning and not a few weddings would have to be solemnized in the following months. They were known as 'greenwood marriages' having been consummated in advance in the woods when the new growth was still green. This makes the original meaning of the song pretty clear."

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts in May?
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 09:52 PM

It is also unlikely to have been a cold and frosty morning in May. I guess it could be poetic licence in the same way that no-one sings about going out walking one morning in November.

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts in May?
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 07:19 PM

Nutting was sexual imagery for sex in the open air. My source is Bill House, an interview given to me re The Brisk Young Ploughboy (Nutting we will go), Available on the BL Sound Library.

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts in May?
From: Reinhard
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 05:50 PM

Why go so far away, Joe? Nuts in May in the Digital Tradition

---

Yeah, I missed that - and there's a good chance Mamalisa got the song from the Digital Tradition.
-Joe-

Subject: ADD: Nuts in May
From: Joe Offer
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 04:16 PM

I found lyrics for "Nuts in May" at https://www.mamalisa.com/?t=es&p=4980. Mudcatter Monique is affiliated with that Website.

NUTS IN MAY

Here we go gathering nuts in May,
Nuts in May, nuts in May,
Here we go gathering nuts in May,
On a cold and frosty morning.

Who will you have for nuts in May,
Nuts in May, nuts in May,
Who will you have for nuts in May,
On a cold and frosty morning.

We'll have [name] for nuts in May,
Nuts in May, nuts in May,
We'll have [name] for nuts in May,
On a cold and frosty morning.

Who will you have to take her away,
Take her away, take her away,
Who will you have to take her away,
On a cold and frosty morning.

We'll have [name] to take her away,
Take her away, take her away,
We'll have [name] to take her away,
On a cold and frosty morning.


This song can be played as a game with the object of pairing a boy and a girl from the group.

It's sung to the tune of "Here We Go 'Round the Mulberry Bush".

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts?
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 04:09 PM

> nuts in may

I once heard or read of this being a corruption of "knots of may", meaning may blossoms; and I did check, and lo! wikipedia doth agree with me. I'll leave it at that, as my net connection's taken on the bit-of-wet-string nature.

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts?
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 02:03 PM

Kentish cobnuts are usually eaten when they are green and fresh; however they are also eaten later in the season when they become sweeter and the kernels begin to dry. Kentish cobnuts are available from late August-December depending on the season. The peak is usually late September/early October. (Roughway Farm, Kent) Similarly, wet walnuts from Kent can now be found in greengrocers' shops. So I doubt that they were gathering nuts in May.

Common Hawthorn, also known as May Blossom, Crataegus monogyna, may tree, quickthorn. Flowering in the middle of May, its folk name of may blossom derives from the older calendar when 1st May, or May Day, coincided with its flowering. (Plewsgardendesign)

The annual Garland Day in Lewes took place on Bank Holiday Monday. The colourful event is organised by women’s morris group The Knots of May, named from the tradition of gathering knots or garlands of flowers to mark the arrival of spring. So the custom is to pick knots of may or knots in May.

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts?
From: r.padgett
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 10:23 AM

Poetic licence I think probable all double entendre

thanks
Ray

Subject: RE: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts?
From: Long Firm Freddie
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 07:53 AM

Some say that Gathering Nuts in May should really be Gathering Knots in May, knots being another word for garland, and may being the flower of the hawthorn.

The song Nutting Girl refers to the girl rising on a summer morning to go nutting; just about feasible for hazelnuts if it was very late summer. She meets a farmer a-ploughing of his land.

By late summer the harvest would presumably have been gathered in and ploughing wouldn't normally have started until after Christmas. So perhaps the farmer/ploughboy and the girl were unlikely to have met in the way described.

Maybe we just put it down to poetic licence.

LFF

Subject: Origins: Nutting girl ~ Nuts?
From: r.padgett
Date: 28 Sep 22 - 07:20 AM

So a recent quandry at Barnsley folk club ~ Nuts in May?

Suggested was that Nuts were not available, that is growing in May and that Nuts referred to "flower garlands" picked and constructed in the summer# suggestions or comments, please

Ray