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Subject: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Bill D Date: 10 Jul 07 - 11:47 AM to try to keep the program planning thread clear... We are in a constant struggle to balance the most desirable qualities for a camp...cost, heat, capacity, dates, food, sleeping arrangements, spaces for concerts/workshops and accessibility for folks with handicaps of various sorts....we ALWAYS sacrifice one or two. With West River, we have gained heated venues and flat, accessible spaces and sacrificed a bit in food (so far) and capacity & sleeping arangements. Next year, we get October date again....but there will always be small bedrooms with a lot of bunk beds, making capacity 'probably' around 170-180. I wish it were easier...but those who climbed those hills in cold weather at Ramblewood may take some solace. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: katlaughing Date: 10 Jul 07 - 11:48 AM There are close-by motels, right? |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Amos Date: 10 Jul 07 - 12:03 PM Kat: I'd say a few miles, probably -- there is a small town nearby but it is scattered along very rural roads by the water. I know there's a good restaurant nearby, but don't recall a motel--Google would know for sure. A |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: MMario Date: 10 Jul 07 - 12:05 PM and, of course, it depends on your definition of "close". Since the site isn't that far from either Washington OR Baltimore. . . |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: katlaughing Date: 10 Jul 07 - 12:23 PM Not close enough, Leo!**bg** Tks, Amos. I'll do some checking. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Maryrrf Date: 10 Jul 07 - 12:26 PM The food at Ramblewood was certainly a lot better but hey - forewarned is forearmed - I plan to take lots of snacks ! Mind you the food didn't taste particularly bad but it was dished out like it used to be in the school cafeteria - with child sized portions. The cabins are cleaner than they were at Ramblewood and more comfortable. As you said, Bill there are trade offs and I think things will run even more smoothly at the upcoming Getaway. I thought FSGW did a grand job last year at the new venue and am looking forward to November! The setting at West River is really gorgeous - beautiful view of the water! |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Charlie Baum Date: 10 Jul 07 - 12:45 PM We found West River, and realized last year that it's the near-perfect site for the Getaway--it suits our needs even better than Ramblewood, in term of many spaces to make music, comfortable heated bedrooms, flat and easy to get around for mobility-impaired people. The glitch was that as newcomers, we couldn't get one of the coveted October weekends the first year or two, and had to settle for November. Now that we're becoming regulars, we've snagged the first weekend of October for 2008, and hopefully, we'll stay in October, though of course, we may have to move to dodge Jewish holidays in certain years (like 2011). Yes, the food is utilitarian, but most of us are coming for the music and not the gastronomy. The nearest motels--there's one small place in Galesville, and most of the rest of the nearest lodgings are either in Annapolis or Camp Springs--a drive of 15 to 20 miles or 25 to 30 minutes. --Charlie Baum |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Genie Date: 10 Jul 07 - 01:13 PM Wow, I actually made space in my calendar for the right weekend this year, and I have enough frequent flyer miles that I should be able to afford the flight. I hope I can come. Is there still space at the camp? I still need to check out ground transportation options. If people are carpooling, etc., I'd prefer that to renting a car for the duration (since the car would be sitting for a day or two), but if there's bus service to the camp area, that would be fine too. As for the child-sized portions, Maryrrf, that might be a blessing in disguise, at least for me. I have a bad habit of gaining a pound or two at camps where they provide tasty food in generous portions, plus between-snack munchies, etc. Genie |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: GUEST,Nancy King at work Date: 10 Jul 07 - 01:18 PM We are planning to try a little negotiating with the camp regarding the food, hoping for a bit of an upgrade. Not sure yet how this will play out, but we are trying. Nancy |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Maryrrf Date: 10 Jul 07 - 01:19 PM Ha Ha Genie - I know what you mean! I spent six months going to Weight Watchers and the main thing they stressed was cutting down on portion sizes! I did NOT go away hungry from any of the meals, but COULD have scarfed down more if it had been available. And there were ample snacks provided in the adjoining building! |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Leadfingers Date: 10 Jul 07 - 01:20 PM Next Year I will be there -Especially as it IS Back to early October ! |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: kendall Date: 10 Jul 07 - 01:23 PM Even November can be iffy up here by the Arctic circle. I used to like driving in the worst weather, but I'm too smart for that now. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: katlaughing Date: 10 Jul 07 - 01:43 PM My Rog and I feel the same way, Kendall!:-) Here's one place in Galesville, bit pricey, though: Pirate's Cove and Marina. Maybe we could get a discount if we dragged the shanty singers over for a serenade.**BG** I also see this listed: Top Side Inn 1004 Galesville Road Galesville MD 20765 (410) 867-1321 Sounds as though it's the choice of the locals and have good and reasonably priced meals and a few rooms to let. My Rog would like that. I am not saying we won't stay over at the camp, but I know we'll both sleep and feel better if we sleep in a private room. No offence to anyone! |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Bill D Date: 10 Jul 07 - 01:56 PM yep, kat..private rooms are kinda scarce. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Micca Date: 10 Jul 07 - 05:53 PM Bill, especially if people wake you up to tell you that you are snoring!!!! |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: SINSULL Date: 10 Jul 07 - 05:56 PM We had four people in one tiny room. Literally - only two people could be standing up at a time. There was no place to put clothing so our suitcases were under the bunks. I visited some of the other rooms and ours was the smallest I saw. That aside, there was a misunderstanding about Quiet vs. Noisy cabins last year. I for one miss the central room in the Ramblewood cabins where there was constant comings and goings as people looked for smaller gatherings than the crowd in the cafeteria. I do not miss that slippery rubber mattress cover that creaked and squeaked at every movement. I do miss being able to leave things in the cafeteria especially the fridge where we could keep perishables chilled. Strange but true - a neighbor and I were talking about camping. He hates it as much as I do. Then he told me that he and a number of his policemen buddies go twice a year to summer camps during off season. This year for the first time they are going in October to a place called Ramblewood. Seems the camp had a free weekend and gave them an incredible rate which included meals and snacks. I warned him about the mattress covers. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Bill D Date: 10 Jul 07 - 06:35 PM LOL! a "free weekend" huh? amazing.... I'd sure like to pick all the good qualities of ALL the 4 camps I've spent Getaways at... |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: SINSULL Date: 10 Jul 07 - 06:47 PM I meant a "weekend free". He made it clear they have to pay. heh heh |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Charlie Baum Date: 10 Jul 07 - 07:05 PM Sinsull-- "I do miss being able to leave things in the cafeteria especially the fridge where we could keep perishables chilled." There's a refirgerator in the Retreat Center kitchen (next to the registration) that we can leave stuff in. There's also a freezer. Unfortunately, last year some folks mixed the two of them up, and therefore preserved ice cream soup and frozen soda. --Charlie Baum |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: GUEST,Nancy King at work Date: 10 Jul 07 - 07:56 PM We're also aware of last year's confusion about quiet/noisy cabins (I was acutely aware of it myself...) and will be doing our best to make it work better this time. It always takes a while to work out the bugs when we go to a new place, and as Bill has noted, there's no one "perfect" place, so we have to do the best we can. Nancy |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Genie Date: 10 Jul 07 - 09:10 PM I'll be sure to bring my sleep mask and ear plugs, just in case. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Bill D Date: 10 Jul 07 - 09:58 PM *grin*...always a good idea, as snoring is the one thing we can't possibly control...(well, not in any pleasant way....) |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Janie Date: 10 Jul 07 - 11:15 PM While I miss Ramblewood and the camaraderie that shared shivering and dorm style accomodations offer, the new location is certainly heated and easier to navigate on foot for the many who have some problems with ambulation. I find myself wondering what could be done to improve on the space for the workshops. The big lounge was a nice space and a great place for workshops and sing-arounds. I thought there were some significant problems with the other workshop spaces, and I wonder what could be done to improve on them. 1. The classroom where the gospel, jug and (I think shantie) workshops were held was inadequate because much of the space was clogged with tables. (The accoustics were also lousy with the sound bouncing off the linoleum floors.) Once a number of people were in, it was hard to get in and out, some people were trapped in the infirmary, and people who made it in after the circle of seats was full had to arrange themselves at odd distances and far corners between and among the tables. For those of us who haven't mastered cloning who were catching the 1st half of one workshop and the last half of another, it was hard to enter or leave. 2. Clogged entry ways were a problem with the workshops and mini-concerts in the cabins. Also, since the cabin lounges are small it wasn't possible to get back to one's room or to the shower facilities when a workshop or mini-concert were in progress without causing major disruptions. I can't remember if there were no separate doors to the outside from the narrow corridors off which the bunkrooms opened, or if there were exits that could not be opened from outside the building. (I think there was a rear door that did not give access to the side corridors.) As I recall, (and maybe I misremember) there were back-to-back workshops or concerts in the lounge of the cabin I was in, which made our rooms particularly inaccessible. If there are side entrances that give direct access to the sleeping corridors that were locked, can they be unlocked? If there are no entrances, would it be possible to not schedule events back to back in the same cabin so that inhabitants have a greater window of opportunity to get to and from their rooms or the showers? 3. Dining Hall stuff a. Remember to have a PA for announcements in the Dining Hall. b. I don't think there is an alternative to having the Saturday Night concert in the Dining Hall. Could the 'stage' be reoriented against one of the shorter walls? Those of us on the far ends couldn't really see the performers, and really couldn't hear that well either since the accoustics are so very bad in there. c. Can we not arrange to have coffee, tea, etc., available throughout the day? (That may have worked itself out with the kitchen in the other building, but I don't remember for sure.) d. There may not be a better alternative, I didn't think having small workshops in assorted corners of the big dining hall worked very well. 4. Other Stuff. It would be good if the big room outside of the nice comfy lounge with the fireplace could have more open or congregatible space. The silent auction suffered from lack of 'flow' through that area. I don't know if there is room for it in the dining hall, or even if there is any improved flow in the dining hall, which is not a very hospitable place. I seem to remember the dining hall was off limits for fairly big chunks of time during the day. Maybe we just need to look at how that space was organized and try to do a better job of it this year. Please hear these as suggestions and not as complaints. Ain't nothin' perfect. If everything stays exactly the same this time as it was arranged last year, it will, as always, be a wonderful weekend that is one of the top highlights of my year. Seeing this and Nancy's thread posted in early July is a good reminder of just how much thought and planning you guys and gals put into making the Getaway happen year after year. It takes time, hard work and commitment, and all of you are volunteers. May you 'live long and prosper,' and may there be another generation coming behind you, ready and willing to carry on the wonderful work of preserving and promoting folk music and lore that FSGW does. YEEEHAWWWWW!!!!! Only 4 more months! Janie |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Linda Goodman Zebooker Date: 10 Jul 07 - 11:38 PM I love the Getaway. It's the happiest part of my year. But I had trouble with some things last year - the first year at West River. I did appreciate not having to worry about sleeping in just-above-freezing temperatures, but the heat was on way too high most of the time. I hated the Saturday night concert in the Dining Hall - the heat was on 80 degrees and I practically couldn't breathe. I just couldn't wait for it to be over. I got an awful headache that lasted most of the night and I was so groggy I couldn't stay on key in the singing afterwards! In the central rooms of the cabins, where there were workshops and jamming it was the same. No matter what we did with the radiators they continually poured out heat. We did the best we could by propping open the windows (when it was in the 40's and 50's outside), but it was still stifling much of the time. Also it was difficult to find where non-scheduled singing and playing were happening, since it was behind closed doors. I found one jam as it was breaking up, and didn't know about two of the others -in the Paz cabin, and in the hallway outside the bathroom in the central building - until I read about them on the Mudcat the week following the Getaway. I imagine that these (unlike the hills or lack of heat at Ramblewood) are FIXABLE problems, so I'm glad of the opportunity to air them now, well ahead of time! --Linda |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Janie Date: 10 Jul 07 - 11:55 PM Good point, Linda. I forgot about the heat problems. Too much of a good thing?! And I also was unaware of the music and jams going on in other places 'after hours.' Because they are impromptu, that may be unavoidable to a certain extent. The terrain is much easier, but the places to come together to make music into the night are more scattered. Since we will have a clearer idea of which are 'quiet' cabins and which are not, it should make it easier to know where to look for some of the impromtu sing-arounds and jams this year. Also, I'll repost here what I said in the program suggestions thread, I'm an eager worker ant and will be priviledged to help out in any way I can. Janie |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: beardedbruce Date: 11 Jul 07 - 02:44 PM OK, is there any desire for me to bring a few tens of kilos of crystalized ginger? Payment to go to the scholarship fund. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: SINSULL Date: 11 Jul 07 - 03:31 PM Important footnote: my comments are not to be construed as criticism. FSGW does an amazing job of coordinating this event every year and I appreciate it. Now...about Jacqui's snoring. If you could get her to snore on the intake instead of the outflow and see to it that she does it EVERY time, we might all sleep better. I found myself reviewing CPR protocol. heh heh Deborah's comment: "She stopped snoring...I think she's dead...GOOD!" |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Barry Finn Date: 11 Jul 07 - 03:40 PM Is Kendall coming? Can't he put her nose in his arm pit? Ha,Ha,Ha Barry |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Bill D Date: 11 Jul 07 - 03:45 PM What Jacqui needs is a Metro-Gnome....a little man who stands by her bed and whacks her with a rolled-up schedule when her rhythm gets off. (I once had to sleep in a room with *3* world-class snorers, all of whom had different cadences and breathing patterns!) |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Barry Finn Date: 11 Jul 07 - 03:53 PM harmony snoring |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Genie Date: 11 Jul 07 - 04:40 PM I"d be down with the ginger, bruce. :) On another subject, I'm wondering if there is any kind of amplification available for the Sat. night concert -- or if it's needed in this particular facility. Yeah, I know there are some "purists" (usually those who can play and sing loudly) who turn their noses up at the idea of any kind of mics and amps, but it can get ridiculous when the venue is too large and/or the ambient noise is too loud for a lot of the performers to be heard. I had that experience the one time I went to Rainy Camp (near Seattle). Not only did a lot of people have trouble hearing me beyond the first 8 rows, but from halfway back in the very large room (with kids running around at the back of the room) I could barely hear the voices of several of the other singers. If the room is very large and/or there's competing background noise, it can really make for a better experience if a low-power amp and mic are on hand. (Ironically, at Rainy Camp, people WERE singing into microphones -- but the mic was just feeding into a recording system, so that did not serve to make everyone audible to the whole room.) |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Big Mick Date: 11 Jul 07 - 04:43 PM Genie, are you coming this year??? |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Bill D Date: 11 Jul 07 - 05:02 PM we 'usually' have a sound system for at least the Sat. concert. We hope there will be a better facility for this year, as the room had no stage and was hard to arrange. (couldn't get round tables out of the way)...we shall see.. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Genie Date: 11 Jul 07 - 07:35 PM Hi, Mick. I really hope I can come, and it turns out I did clear my calendar for the right weekend this year (unlike last year). With my frequent flyer miles, I should be able to afford the flight. I'm really hoping to come. However, I just found out that my dad is fading rapidly (He's almost 92 and has been officially on hospice care at home for some months now). There's a growing probability that I may need to use that "free time" in my calendar to fly to San Diego to help my mom out, one way or the other. I'm going to go ahead and see if I can book a flight with my FF miles, since there's no penalty for cancelling or rescheduling. Then I'll have to play it by ear and see how things are going with my folks in So. Cal. If it doesn't work out for this year, I've already circled the date for 2008. Good to know there's a possibility of a sound system for Sat. night, Bill. Genie |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: TRUBRIT Date: 12 Jul 07 - 12:07 AM I spent the first night in a cabin with Sins, Jacquie and tami and calldd my husband first thing next morning and said -- fidn me a room -- any room - so I can sleep!!!!! The nearest hotel was about 20 mins away but it was worth it for a silent bed -- I shall plan on being there this year too........ |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Genie Date: 12 Jul 07 - 01:50 AM FWIW, I can deal with cold -- very cold -- but what the heck do you do when your're lying there stark naked and you're still too hot to sleep? (Don't answer that, Mick,) Genie |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Maryrrf Date: 12 Jul 07 - 11:46 AM I slept very comfortably in one of the top bunks. I was in the same cabin as Sins, Jacqui C, etc. but a different room. Even on the evening that our cabin was confused with the 'all night music' cabin I still climbed into the bunk and went to sleep immediately! I like the fact that the cabins are nice and warm! |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: GUEST Date: 12 Jul 07 - 11:48 AM Why....... Genie ......... I am wounded ........ that you would think me such a cad ........ now ........ how do I get this image out of my head............. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Bill D Date: 12 Jul 07 - 12:14 PM ..."how do I get this image out of my head."... Mental floss? Extra vile black stuff? |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Big Mick Date: 12 Jul 07 - 12:31 PM Bill, old buddy, you are a genius. Vile black stuff chased with some of John Jameson's very finest Irish Whiskey. Might not get it out of my head, but I will enjoy the image!!!!!!! Mick |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: SINSULL Date: 12 Jul 07 - 12:36 PM We opened the window and were fine. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: MMario Date: 12 Jul 07 - 12:36 PM Now - there is a topic for a workshop. "Mental Floss" - songs that drive everything else out of your head. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Dan Schatz Date: 12 Jul 07 - 12:54 PM Folks, the West River site is a thousand times better than Ramblewood. The heat is adjustable (though I can't offhand remember the trick) the music-making spaces are nice, if a little small, the food is no worse than most camp food (though a far site below the artistry of homegrown chefs Debby McClatchy and Pete the Spy). The site is beautiful and clean! The last year at our previous location we had to contend with: 1) a bat in the toilet upon arrival 2) a complete loss of ability to play instruments due to frozen fingers 3) the detritus of previous renters - including some flyers I'd rather not have to explain to our youngsters (I'm no prude, but can't the camp at least clean up the trash?) 4) a rough time for vegetarians (tuna is not a vegetable) 5) a lot of dirt 6) an utter lack of accessibility 7) a week of back-aches due to antiquated mattresses I can't imagine coming with young children to a site like that. So even though the new site is much less convenient for me personally, I am overjoyed that we will be returning. And if our family goes to a hotel, it will not be for ourselves, but for everyone else's sake. (Do you really want to be awakened by a 6 month old in the middle of the night?) And Kendall? You're coming. 'Nuff said. Dan Schatz |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: katlaughing Date: 12 Jul 07 - 01:08 PM Dan, by the sounds of it there will be plenty of folks awake in the middle of night. Maybe you will get some sleep while they sing lullies! MMario, is that same as an ear-worm?:-) |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Big Mick Date: 12 Jul 07 - 01:23 PM There is no comparing West River to Ramblewood. What made Ramblewood special was the folks that made such wonderful music IN SPITE of the surly camp staff, cold weather, and ridiculously poor facilities. I have some things about West River I don't like (like the imposition of the "giving thanks" time, and the poor food), but all things considered, it is far and away an improvement over Ramblewood. As to the giving thanks time, I will do this in my own way, thank you, and don't need anyone to impose their thing on me. But it is a small price to pay for warmth, cleanliness, and the camaraderie I experienced last year. And if the wee lad, Kiran Schatz, decides he needs some attention at 2:30 AM, just call Uncle Mick. I will take care of walking him so's Dan and Geeta can get some sleep. Have you seen this kid's eyes? What a doll. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: MMario Date: 12 Jul 07 - 01:47 PM Mental floss is not the same as an ear-worm. Ear-worms you can't get rid of, they lurk and drive you nuts. Mental Floss doesn't drive you nuts because while it's in your head you are unable to think about anything else. In other words - songs that grab your attention,focus, emotions, rationale, heart and soul and put them through the wringer; leaving you either totally drained or invigorateed depending on your makeup and the type of song. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Bill D Date: 12 Jul 07 - 01:55 PM "As to the giving thanks time, I will do this in my own way.." There's Methodist in their madness.... (I was one myself until..I dunno, maybe age 16 or so...just drifted away.) |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: jacqui.c Date: 12 Jul 07 - 04:36 PM Same with me Bill. |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: katlaughing Date: 12 Jul 07 - 04:43 PM Thanks, MMario! |
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Subject: RE: Getaway 07- general discussion/kibitzing From: Genie Date: 12 Jul 07 - 05:56 PM Hmmm ... Some interesting workshop suggestions here: Mental Floss Ear Worms Songs To Sing When It's Too Hot To Sleep Songs To Sing When You're Naked Songs To Drown Out Your Bunkmate's Snoring ;D Genie |
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