BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Jun 09 - 06:47 PM

? I am uninformed.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 15 Jun 09 - 06:51 PM

Just satire that didn't work, sorry!

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Jun 09 - 07:47 PM

Yeah, what Bill said... I am a gun owner... I learned gun safety thru the NRA... Ain't about me being uneducated...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 15 Jun 09 - 07:53 PM

Well, a small point might be when the news media goes off on so-and-so being armed with an AK-47, when it's often just some semi-automatic that looks kind of military, or when an Eastern Block military is actually using AK-74's.

             It's not that is such an important mistake, it's just that they take so much pride in making it that seems to label them idiots.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Bill D
Date: 15 Jun 09 - 08:13 PM

gee, bruce....that was part of my point. The criminals don't seem to care much about those laws. I am interested in ***PRACTICAL*** ways to control things, not recitations of the rules.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Jun 09 - 08:37 PM

Yeah, we're like a cancer patient and we see the doctor and he says that that if ya' do chemo and radiation that you have the best cahnche to survive yer cancer... Except we don't take the doctors advice and do nothin' or maybe some of the chemo???

That's purdy much what we are doing now... We aren't trying stuff because there isn't any argument that puts the survival rate at 100%... So we do nothin' hoping that things will get better???

Thinks ain't getting better... Unfettered access to guns by the ***wrong people*** has made US less safe and made us a very violent country... The cost to our nation on having this unfettered access to guns has not been, to the best of my knowledge, figured but if it were, I would guess it to be half a trillion dollars a year... Just think about the number of hospital days a year are spent on gun shot vitums... Or the cost on law enforcement... Trials... Lawyers... Families having to live withpout slain members...

Sometimes tyhe only thing that folks think about is money and right now the only folks makin' out with their constant lie that Obama is going to outlaw guns are the arms manufacturers, their PR firm the NRA and the gun shop owners...

In the words Walter Cronkite, "That's the way it is."...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Ron Davies
Date: 15 Jun 09 - 09:56 PM

I've made my views on the "gun rights" situation clear before. I won't belabor that.

But I'd just like to put in a word on behalf of accurate history.   Huey Long a "Righty"?   Only if you want to also include Lenin, Stalin and Mao in that category also.   He gathered power to himself, fine.   But in the 30's he was accused of being a Communist.   Wrote "Every Man A King". One of the original "Power to the People" types--though he felt the power had to flow through him, partly in response to tough corporate opposition.   FDR thought of Long as the threat on the Left.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 15 Jun 09 - 10:27 PM

Ron - It would seem to make sense that if one thought of Lenin, Stalin, and Mao as threats, they would think of them as threats on the Left.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Midchuck
Date: 16 Jun 09 - 08:50 AM

There was a probable murder in Brattleboro yesterday. According to the paper, it was the SECOND intentional murder IN THE STATE, for this year up to now.

Vermont has the most liberal gun laws in the US - or maybe I should say the most conservative. You can't get a concealed carry permit because there aren't any, because there aren't any restrictions on concealed carry in the first place. You just do it, if you want to. I never have, because I never felt the need. When I go to New York City or Boston, I feel the need strongly, but I can't.

Maybe the availability of guns might not be the primary cause of murder?

Incidentally, both the two murders in VT up to now were stabbings.

If knives are outlawed, only outlaws will have knives.

Peter

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Bill D
Date: 16 Jun 09 - 10:02 AM

Low murder rate in Vermont is not because of easy gun access....it's because it is VERMONT.
There are just different demographics up there. No large urban areas where poverty mingles with affluence.

   But don't fret...Vermont will gradually accrue a population that sees how 'useful' guns are when folks disagree or want their neighbor's TV. You'll have 'interesting' statistics in a few years.

(prove it? I can't prove it, but I'd make a small bet....and hope I lose.)

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 16 Jun 09 - 10:04 AM

"Low murder rate in Vermont is not because of easy gun access....it's because it is VERMONT. There are just different demographics up there."

                So it's not the gun laws that need to be changed, it's the demographics. I knew the right answer would pop up on this thread sooner or later.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Bill D
Date: 16 Jun 09 - 12:49 PM

My, what interesting ways you can 'spin' a simple comment.

"Demographics is as demographics does."... said the wise Philosopher.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Ron Davies
Date: 16 Jun 09 - 08:02 PM

Rig--

Go to the head of the class: re: Lenin, Stalin etc.

And so was Huey Long considered a threat--on the Left, not the Right.   Which is exactly my point--in my continuing, sometimes lonely, struggle to bring historical accuracy to Mudcat.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Jun 09 - 08:32 PM

Doesn't much matter, Ron... The original statement that I made was that the righties seem to be the ones who think that offing the lefties is perfectly okay... Forget Huey Long... The point still stands...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Ron Davies
Date: 16 Jun 09 - 08:35 PM

Fine, the point stands. I'm still interested in historical accuracy. Can't help it. It's my curse.

As long as all parties realize Huey was not a "Righty", let the bell ring for the next round on the real topic.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Jun 09 - 08:43 PM

Okay... Maybe a Huey Long thread would be interesting... He was, afterall, a real character...

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 16 Jun 09 - 09:44 PM

One might make the observation that while all of these people seem to have something in common, Lenin was actually trying to do something positive for the ordinary people. He might have been misguided, but the others, it seems to me, were pretty much out for themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: robomatic
Date: 18 Jun 09 - 05:14 PM

One might make the observation that while all of these people seem to have something in common, Lenin was actually trying to do something positive for the ordinary people. He might have been misguided, but the others, it seems to me, were pretty much out for themselves.

Same applies to Hitler, only blaming Jews instead of Capitalists or the beorgeoisie

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 18 Jun 09 - 06:34 PM

Of course, there is a difference between blaming and killing. Besides, the bourgeoisie as still to blame.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 18 Jun 09 - 09:29 PM

"is"

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Jun 09 - 07:22 AM

Anybody who thinks Lenin was not responsible for quite a few deaths should start reading some history. For once.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 19 Jun 09 - 10:23 AM

Still being responsible for deaths is not the same as committing murder. Lincoln was responsible for a lot of deaths, so was Harry Truman.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Bill D
Date: 19 Jun 09 - 11:21 AM

...and any law school graduate could tell you the difference in what Lenin did and what Truman & Lincoln did.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 19 Jun 09 - 01:41 PM

True, Lenin didn't use nuclear weapons, of course, Lincoln didn't either.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Jun 09 - 10:03 PM

"Lenin didn't use nuclear weapons". Thank you, Mr. Cutsier- than- thou.   Just let us know when you're interested in favoring us with more than classically facile and fatuous (look it up) remarks--and actually willing to try to discuss--anything.   Doesn't seem like it'll be anytime soon.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 19 Jun 09 - 10:45 PM

Ron - I don't know why you insist on telling people to "look up" ordinary words. But if you want to lump Lenin in with the rest of them, it's all right with me. At least he tried to rid Eastern Europe of the scourge of religion. I think he deserves credit for that, anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Jun 09 - 10:55 PM

Congratulations to the poster--he maintains his perfect record of missing the point.   One might even think it's intentional. Well at least he knows what "facile" and "fatuous" mean. Good thing--that is virtually the only kind of posting he seems capable of.

Certainly remains blissfully ignorant of history.   But I suppose you can't expect more from a giant intellect who told us that Hitler had no choice but to be a mass murderer--after all, he was raised a Catholic.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 19 Jun 09 - 11:47 PM

Wow, when's blast off?

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Ron Davies
Date: 20 Jun 09 - 11:49 AM

QED

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: robomatic
Date: 20 Jun 09 - 01:17 PM

Lenin did NOT try to rid "Eastern Europe" of religion. He tried to impose a state religion known as Communism, which was (unfortunately 'is' in N Korea) a blend of state controlled economics with the culture of deification of the ruling class, in a word "totalitarianism". Folks like Orwell Koestler and Rand sussed it out pretty well in print.

The book "Eleni" takes some time to get down to specifics on what rural Greek life was under Communism, as well.

A nice Jewish lady tried to assassinate Lenin but only succeeded in shortening his life, which of course, led to Stalin.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Riginslinger
Date: 20 Jun 09 - 01:26 PM

Like I said, throw Lenin back in with the rest of them. History will sort it out.

Subject: RE: BS: shooting in DC? - U.S. Holocaust Museum
From: Ron Davies
Date: 20 Jun 09 - 02:25 PM

"state religion" is exactly right.   Which is why I pointed out, in another thread, that atheism has been a disaster for the world-- since it makes it so easy for the leader of the country to be deified.   And since the leader of the country is then God, it's not so easy to contradict him--in anything.

See Stalin, Mao and Hitler--and now on a smaller scale North Korea. In Iran, however, which is not an atheist state. many people draw a distinction between Khomenei and Allah-- a distinction which is becoming more and more apparent these days.

Subject: BS: Security Guard Killer dies in Prison
From: Ebbie
Date: 07 Jan 10 - 12:20 AM

Did you see that the old white supremicist who killed the museum security guard died today? Pity. I would have loved to see him be challenged as to his beliefs.

Dies of natural causes.

Subject: RE: BS: Security Guard Killer dies in Prison
From: Amergin
Date: 07 Jan 10 - 01:37 AM

Well all I can say is good riddance, but I do agree with you Ebbie....it would have been interesting to see him defended by a Jewish lawyer.