MIDI Volunteer Sought

Subject: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 03:44 PM

I am looking for someone(s) who would like to take on entering melody lines for about 200+ items from Allen Slave Songs (online) and similar sources, in Noteworthy Composer. Note/lyric matching is desired but not required. This would be part of the African American Spirituals project here at Mudcat, which is already a unique resource. Adding MIDIs would be a huge contribution to the world's opportunity to appreciate this body of folk music.

The reason for prioritizing these specific collections is that recorded versions, MIDIs, and print versions for most other known spirituals already exist, many in an online, downloadable form. Also the Allen, Hampton, and Higginson material tends not to duplicate other material in known print works.

Questions, answers, and coordination of efforts-- right here in this thread.

~Susan

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 03:50 PM

If you want this doing, why don't you do it yourself? It's hardly arduous.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 03:51 PM

Wys- what's the URL?

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 03:55 PM

Let me add something, the "African American Spirituals" is not a 'Mudcat Project' You've filled this place with stuff that only two or three people are interested in, and Max, Joe etc. have been gracious enough to keep stum.

We are NOT interested!

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 04:23 PM

Lest anyone thing Guest raves right, not so-- have discussed Spirituals with Dick and Susan several times, all lights green.

Mmario, is this for a look-see? ALLEN COLLECTION

If you're diving in, best leave a few breadcrumbs here in case others want to pitch in!

Guest volunteers also welcome!

~Susan

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 04:27 PM

Whatever, Susan.

Did it never cross your mind that a 'Yes' from Dick and Susan was the easiest way to shut you up?

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Joe Offer
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 04:28 PM

The online text of Allen's Slave Songs of the United States is here (click). It's too bad the University of North Carolind didn't provide MIDI transcriptions for those of us who can't hear a tune just by looking at the sheet music. There are many of us who would be very interested in hearing MIDI transcriptions of these tunes. I have the Dover edition of this book, and I do transcribe hundreds of tunes for Mudcat, but I don't have the time or interest to do the entire book. I can understand susan's request for a volunteer transcriber - transcribing hundreds of MIDI files is a daunting task, but some people like to do it.

I think that Susan's "Spirituals" project is a very worthwhile effort, although I disagree with her practice of posting songs by flooding Mudcat with hundreds of individual threads. I still haven't figured out how to organize them into a useable form.

If somebody want's to do the MIDIs, I'm sure we can work out a way to post them here. However, I think that Jeff and I should be consulted on how they are posted, and I will not tolerate the posting of one ADD tune thread for each song. Since the songs are available in an online document at a stable institution like the University of North Carolina, I see no need for them all to bere-posted here at Mudcat.

If somebody is doing a study of a particular song and its various versions, then it makes complete sense to post all versions of a song in a thread, along with links to MIDI files.

So, in summary, it sounds like a good idea to me - but I don't like the idea of inundating Mudcat with information that isn't organized or indexed.

-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 04:30 PM

I think this is a GREAT project and just might be able to help a little. I have Cakewalk instead of Noteworthy, so I'll PM you for more info.

Thanks!

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 04:59 PM

My apologies, especially towards Susan. I'm sorry to say that I find 'WYSIWYG' difficult to deal with online, and I get cross. The majority of that difficulty is down to me. I apologise for that.

Good luck in the project everyone. I'm sure that it'll be worthwhile.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 05:10 PM

Joe-- don't worry so much! Many of the posted songs are grouped, as the project evolved, by similarity of song*, and no, I do not foresee adding all the lyrics for the Allen, Hampton, or Higginson collections here at Mudcat. (I do keep a copy of thoses collections saved on my puder, in case those sites ever stop offering the spirituals.) Nor do I see any need to add any tune-add threads. It would be silly, since we can index them in the permathread along with links to their location at these other sites. (This is how I handled the Max Hunter gospel material in another thread.)

As to posting requirements-- if they are posted at Mudcat, they will certainly follow Mudcat guidelines on collected and posted tunes, and obviously the first two who have responded about helping know these guidelines well. I may offer these MIDIs to the people whose sites contain the collections, first, as well as keeping a set on my computer as I do all the materials in the project, and it may be that what we will post here is just the set of links. I need to know if there will be a result, before I offer the MIDIs to these folks and ask how THEY would like them done.

Mmario, Mary, I do want to go over any MIDIs before they are submitted to the Mudcat MIDI page, so please email me anything you work on. There are issues of filenaming, tempo, pickup notes, etc., and I want to be sure these are handled consistently, however many help and however each one goes about their effort. Also, by reviewing each one I will be able to hear how they may relate to melodies used for other spirituals or later blues.... and be sure to post those relationships. I have a theory that tunes floated in much the same way the verses did, now that I have listened to and performed a lot of the Lomax stuff at LOC.

Mary, do you want to send me one as a .mid in Cakewalk so I can see how NWC likes it?

~Susan


* The reason they are grouped that way, and not by source, is because as we find similar songs in new collections, sources, and recordings, we search up the existing thread for that song (by text/title fragments) and we continue to add the new details there. This has been working well for those of us doing the work as well as for those accessing it. I always enjoy snagging Jerry Rasmussen's interest (by song title) when we pop up an "old" thread; he tells us how he and his group do them now, or offer different variants and recorded versions, and he often has some history/origins stuff to offer since his guys go WAY back in time.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 05:16 PM

Well, thanks, Guest. I'd be happy to communicate further; maybe we might arrive at a better understanding! :~)

Are you the same Guest who posted in the permathread that since all the posts there are mine, no one else is interested? If so, there were later posts in response to that.... I'm offering this as info-- not rebuke-- about the project details that you might not have been aware of.

~Susan

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 06:33 PM

I sent the first one to Susan. These MIDIs are a little more involved than one might think at first glance. There is syncopation, lots of 1/16 notes, funny words (ones I've never heard before), etc. Plus, there are a few things that Cakewalk does by default that we'll probably have to work around. All in all though, the tunes are very nice, and I'll enjoy learning some of them!

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 06:55 PM

Hope if your program does not allow for pickup notes you will add rests so the measure dividers match what's online. We can let people match the words up themselves, since they will be able to see the image at the Allen site. IMO our job is just adding clickable sound to what is already a good resource.

~S~

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Mark Clark
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 09:57 PM

Encoding these songs seems to me a worthwhile endeavor but I can't see the purpose in the gratuitous requirement for a proprietary format. Why not encode them as ABC per the ABC Plus project and use abc2midi to generate the MIDI files? Then we'll have the songs in a format everyone can use.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 29 Dec 03 - 10:17 PM

Most sites now have MIDIs if they don't have a performance soundfile. And it's going to require a lot of posting if we go with ABC tune add threads, isn't it? Also since they are already notated melody lines, wouldn't it be quicker just to copy and enter them as they are? Can they be converted midi2abc?

~S~

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Mark Clark
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 01:35 AM

MIDI files generally don't convert well to other formats because they often lack much of the information expected in a score. It's much better to type the ABC and convert it to MIDI. This is probably faster too since a midi2abc conversion will require a lot of tweaking to get the ABC right. ABC, on the other hand may be typed in very quickly from a simple score such as we see in this effort. Lyrics in ABC may be easily synchronized with the melody as requested and the software needed to produce excellent scores and (possibly rhythmically enhanced) MIDI files is simple to use and free. You can get many more people involved in the effort using ABC notation and make the result useful to more people.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 06:37 AM

Mark, I think the speed bit depends on the user. I for one can not read music and create abc using a graphical programs where I can copy what I see. I use Noteworthy/ abc2nwc and then some tweaking of the abc to get it right with abcm2ps so it takes me longer than producing a MIDI. On the other hand, I think a sight reader who has got to grips with abc will find they can type abc in very quickly.

Oveall though, I have thought for some time that MIDI is a throughly bad format for songs... You have mentioned many of the reasons to use abc. Others are in addition to MIDI conversions the project may require, all the songs in a 200 song project could also be supplied in one simple text file and that one can also produce high quality graphics from abc.

Also, I don't know the feasibility with the ammount of trafic and demands on processing Mudcat gets but even on the fly conversions may be in the realms of possibility. Here is an example of a project I tried to get going but seemed to die. In this case, I just take a simple abc text file for each child group and extract and process what is requested on demand. It would be a simple step to add the ability to put the songs in any key requested too. The programming required to do such things is very easy.

Just putting ideas around and expanding on Mark's thoughts...

Jon

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,pavane
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 07:25 AM

Jon, It might be quicker for you to learn a little music theory then. Learning to 'read the dots' for just a melody shouldn't take very long at all. They teach it to kids learning piano in the first few lessons, after all.

I agree that using abc would probably be quicker and easier than direct input to MIDI via a sequencer, especially for adding aligned lyrics.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 07:44 AM

Pavane, I knew the theory, at least for reading off a treble and bass clef before learning about it in primary school(Pip/mum plays piano). It's just a "blindness" I have.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Pied Piper
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 08:28 AM

At the Noteworhy composer site it says that it can export a piece as a mid file.
NWC

TTFN
PP

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 08:57 AM

yes - noteworthy can export midi's and with embedded lyrics!
with a third party add-on it can also produce ABC files - though they sometimes have to be corrected manually.

Jon - I'm still working on Bronson - but have to proofread all my files - and as I *should* have gottom bifocals on my last visit to the eye doctor but didn't - that is a bit difficult at the moment.

Pavane - ditto what Jon said - both about producing ABC and reading music!

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 09:31 AM

Mmario, you can add a pair of cheap reading specs from the drugstore and have instant bifocals.

~Susan

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 09:58 AM

I can read music quite well, and until I started working on some ABC formats at Jon's site, writing a midi was much faster than writing ABC. Now that I've learned a little ABC, it's starting to get faster. All this to say -- Jon was right about "depends on the user." ABC may seem easier, and it may be if you are starting to learn both note reading and ABC from the beginning -- but those of us who have instilled sight reading of notes for many years, and do it quite well, find that easier at this point in time.

Susan, I can do either. The point is, these songs are nice, and I enjoy learning them.

My main problem today is that I don't have ink for my printer. And even though I can sightread the notes so well I can "hear" the song -- transcribing it is difficult when I can't see a hard copy in front of me -- and for some reason I can't keep two windows open when I use Cakewalk.

************************************

Just another thought here -- IMO, the casual user (me until about a year ago) would get more use from a midi. Usually all I want is to hear a tune quickly. I now use the tune-0-tron at concertina.net to convert an ABC file to a midi quickly. So I can use either format, and it really makes no difference to me.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Jeri
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 10:47 AM

This is just a thought, as I don't have the time or stick-tuitiveness to volunteer:

The end product you want is a MIDI. It shouldn't matter what programs people use to create it.

If it looks funny when you import it into Noteworthy, it may be Noteworthy that makes it look funny. If it sounds right, it shouldn't matter. In other words, if you listen to it and it sounds fine, then import it into Noteworthy and exclaim "Holy Crap - all those dotted quarter notes should be half notes!" it might just be Noteworthy that did something weird.

NOTE: I'm not fond of Noteworthy. I don't like how many steps are required to enter notes and find that Noteworthy-created MIDI files often have shortened note lengths and skewed placement, both with re-play and when I look at it in Cakewalk.

Mary, it may be a pain in the neck, but you can right-click on the image of the sheet music to save it, then make it your wallpaper while you're doing the MIDI. (I have no problem having 2 windows open when using Cakewalk, but maybe it's just that the size of the two programs are too big to run together on your machine?)

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 11:00 AM

Thanks to all for their thoughts. I guess I don't care what program originates it, as long as I get it as a .mid. I would think that the input should match what is on the Allen site as to note durations, so that anyone accessing it will find easy word match with the Allen site's page image, but if a program alters the note values-- whatever!

We do need to name the files by the song numbering at the Allen site ot it will be a mess to organize.

~Susan

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 11:14 AM

Interesting Mary... Good feedback.

I've no personal interest in this project, though I think the idea is excellent and really hope it does go through here and have aimed to provide some feedback from what I think I have learned.

I think the most important point is that an abc does convert to midi but the reverse need not be true. We have been through much of this before... To sumarise, abc is based on music notation and with projects like the abc plus project, abc can also handle words well. MIDI, was never built to do that it is built on the idea of sending signals like play this note for so many miliseconds now. (MIDI is great at what it does BTW).

Another notation possibility Mudcat may like to investigate is Lilypond. It's something I've never had an "in depth" look at but think can do more than abc. My own opinion is that using it would add complexity where there is no need but it has to be said the Yet Another Dt site which offers more in terms of formats than the current MC version does use it...

Whatever, best of luck and good wishes with the project,

Jon

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 11:24 AM

Jeri, I'd agree if all that was required was a MIDI. I guess part of what I'm thinking in terms of (even though it's nothing to do with me) is how much more you can do with abc.

MIDI just gives things like note on/note off instructions and attempts are made from that to construct a score by some programs, all of which may handle things differently. It may not be important for this project but with abc, you still can produce a sound MIDI and for the abc give instructions as where to show slurs, where to beam notes, etc and get close to original documents.

Jon (not wanting to argue or to try to push in on a project but wishing others may learn the advantages of the likes of abc for certain tasks and why midi is avoided for some tasks).

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 11:25 AM

Mmario, are you in? If so, what range of song numbers do you want to work on?

~Susan

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 11:42 AM

yup - I'm in. I'll take pages 55 through 61 - which is songs 74-82

If that's allright?

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,pavane
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 12:00 PM

Actually, my program HARMONY can also produce (straight from abc) MIDI files with embedded lyrics, OR, by a menu option, embedded chord symbols, which can be displayed karaoke style.

It can also produce abc from MIDI. It would probably be suitable for the task.

(Trial version is at www.greenhedges.com )

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,pavane
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 12:05 PM

Just a thought.
If you want a GOOD MIDI, you have to ensure that your software inserts appropriate initialisation (SYSEX and control setting) sequences into the file. Many MIDI programs do not do this, with the result that the equipment may remain incorrectly set up from a previous file.

HARMONY always adds a full set of initialisations as used in professional MIDI files.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 12:17 PM

We just want a simple melody line input by people who have software they are comfortable using to do that. Trying to keep it simple.

~S~

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,pavane
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 12:56 PM

These initialisation codes are not visible to the user, and are always included by Harmony - it takes no effort at all.
It is when you DON'T have them in the file that the user may have problems. These can include incorrect instruments, wrong pitch, and a number of other faults.

A great many of the MIDI files found on the net do NOT have these codes present, which means that most people who create the files are unaware of the problem, or using software which does not provide the facility.

An inexperienced user may not be able to identify and correct the fault, so it is better to be safe.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 12:59 PM

yup- I think that may well be some of the problems with Noteworthy midi's - and I have had the problem with some others as well...

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 01:05 PM

But let's make sure we don't get caught in an endless planning loop, and not get any of these entered because we can't agree on the best way to do it. OK?

~S~

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 01:12 PM

pages are printed and about to be input - but I have to knit 18 more stitches first.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 01:20 PM

LOL!

You are a purl!

~S~

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 01:24 PM

SSUS and a number okay for file name? just a plain number can lead to confusion...

So for Example #74 Nobody Know the Trouble I've had would be file SSUS74

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 01:55 PM

I think just SSand the number.

~S~

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 02:11 PM

and you want just the midi file? or the NWC if we use that?

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 02:35 PM

Do I need NWC for Dick or just .mid?

~S~

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 02:43 PM

Both, OK?

~S~

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Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 02:43 PM

You'd have to ask him which he prefers.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 02:54 PM

Past instrux on DT tune submits specify NWC for Dick so if that is what you are starting with, go ahead and send me a copy of that too. OK?

~S~

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 06:33 PM

I'll do songs 1-20 first, maybe more later. These are really pretty tunes; I can't believe I missed these songs earlier.

Susan, I'll name them ssandthenumber. (ss1) You can see how they sound and look. I found the lyrics add to be extremely easy, possibly because I have a little experience with ABC lyrics (when to add hyphens, etc). In a few instances I had to interpret what the book meant...They would have one word under two notes, and it was obvious how it should be sung, but I had to divide the word into syllables, and I may not have done that according to correct English grammar. (Where's Masato when we need him? ;-)) Also, I guess you realize that there are repeats in the music, but not in the lyrics...And I'm only putting the first verse in the midi, do you want all verses?

Jeri, I managed to finagle the windows so I can see one line of music at a time. It seems that the Cakewalk window won't minimize when I use the staff view option. But I can move the staff view around and minimize the Explorer window and it is workable.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 09:55 PM

Yes on the filenaming convention; Mmario & Mary are naming them the same. Mmario has one with a variation that he has named with this convention: ss--b, where the dashes are the song number.

Tempo-- err on the side of slow.

I've been out all evening and got to hear two of Mmario's real quick, before I left. It sounds obvious to me, tunewise, how a call/response pattern must be involved, although the transcription does not specify this. Melodically, one person just would not sing the two phrases involved putting them together as one song, although it is possible one person did sing it as one song for the purposes of transmitting it to a transcribing collector. (I have presented them the same way myself in fact, when trying to teach them to new audiences; I have to sing my part and theirs, too, until they see the pattern and take their part off my hands.) So on the one I heard in particular, it MUST be a leader/group call/response thing.

I'm going to be looking/listening to them one by one as they come in and see if other things emerge from being able to look and hear at the same time. But I can say this already-- as one who has performed many of this genre in recent years, as well as blues gospel-- it makes a huge difference already getting to hear the tune echoing in my head without making any effort at all as a musician to produce it. It sneaks in and makes itself at home and starts me off improvising, just as the genre is meant to do.

THESE WERE MEANT TO BE TRANSMITTED BY HEARING, not reading!!!!!

This is SO COOL I hope we will be able to get enough people involved to do them ALL.

Woo hoo!!!!!

My boat floateth.

~Susan

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Mark Clark
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 10:26 PM

Naming suggestion — Instead of naming files ssn where n is the number assigned by Allen, why don't you agree to use ssnnn where nnn is Allen's assigned number filled to the left with zeros so every file name will be exactly the same length. This will be a big help when people want to sort the songs in sequence. If you don't use the zero fill to a standard length, songs 1, 10, and 100 will come out next to each other as will 11, 110, and so on.

Susan, the idea that these songs were somehow especially designed to be learned aurally is probably not correct. The people who made and learned these songs were legally prohibited from gaining literacy. Had they been educated in the use of western notation, I'm guessing they'd have written them down. Not only would they have written them down but I doubt they'd have used the awkard dialect language that Allen employed. Just because they used informal pronunciation in speech and song doesn't necessarily mean they didn't know the proper English word. It's easy for us, white middle class Americans, to forget that depriving people of education doesn't, by itself, make them stupid.

And you're quite right about the project being “SO COOL.” I'll play around with some of the tunes and decide whether I think I can offer any useful assistance.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Mark Clark
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 10:45 PM

Another thought: what is the prefered "'patch” or standard MIDI instrument number for the MIDI files? Grand Piano (000) is probably the default if no instrument is specified. What about the “voice” instruments (052, 053, 054)? Would they enhance a listener's ability to learn to sing the song?

Also, the very first song, Roll, Jordan, Roll, includes an alternate melody for measures 5 - 7 where the F# is replaced with an accidental F natural. How do you wish to represent these alternates in the finished product? Allen doesn't seem to prefer one variant over the other but suggests that he collected it both ways, perhaps from among his list of informants singers.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 11:07 PM

I had the same question with the variant. Also, my version of Cakewalk won't allow a fermata -- so I took some liberties in adding a measure and some longer notes. That makes it sound right, but I don't like changing the notation. Should we include these notes in some documentation? Or can you fix that, Susan? Also, there were obvious mistakes in several places in the book I followed (the online images). (things like an eighth note when it should have been a dotted eighth, or something similar) Once again, I took the liberty to make it add up to a full measure.

I've already mentioned the tempo to Susan. Many of these are in 2/4 time and the Cakewalk default is a little fast...I'd like to hear Jerry sing them! Then one was in 3/4 and sounded a little slow to me. There is no suggestion in the book, so what should be done?

*******Note to Cakewalk users: I found that it makes a better (intended notation) transcript if you use "snap." But in syncopation (sixteenth note, eighth note, sixteenth note) it won't accept the eighth note where you want it. My solution is to enter a sixteenth note at that spot, then increase the note lenth to 60.

Subject: RE: MIDI Volunteer Sought
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 30 Dec 03 - 11:08 PM

Mark, MIDI is so dependant on the synth/sound card... I'd forget the fussy bits which can sound great on one system but crap on another and settle for grand piano which usualy works out reasonably.

Jon (who mourns the loss of an old Yamaha daughter board which made much better sounds than the SB live I have now)