BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Raggytash
Date: 10 Nov 15 - 10:19 AM

Guest, I posted the question to see if anyone could throw light upon the subject. I thought that was the purpose of a discussion forum.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: MikeL2
Date: 10 Nov 15 - 10:29 AM

Hi BBCW

I don't know where you live or what you do there, but where we live most of the people we see in the High Street or the pubs and around our home are wearing poppies. What I have noticed though is a gradual reduction of poppies fastened to the front (mainly) of cars and other vehicles. We both wear our poppies in remembrance of all the people who died in all the conflicts and wars. Not with pride but in sorrow of the devastating losses on all sides.

My Grandfather fought in WW1 and my father in WW2 when he was badly injured and taken prisoner. He always wore a poppy and went on the Remembrance Parades.

I was in the RAF and though I went to Suez I was not involved in any
fighting. I was awarded campaign and service medals which I never wore once I came out of the RAF. I used to go on the Parades but I don't now-a-days. I will observe the silence as I watch it on TV.

In Remembrance

MikeL2

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 15 - 11:21 AM

The questions (all reasonable IMHO) still stand:

- Were those who were spreading these rumours knowledgeable?
- Were those spreading the rumous credible?
- What did they do? Did they work for the Haig Fund, the Haig Charitable Housing Trust or the Royal British Legion?

Additional question - what on earth led you to believe that they had access to the financial records of any of the following:

- The Haig Fund
- The Haig Charitable Housing Trust
- The Royal British Legion
- The personal banking transactions of Haig or any member of his family

Because unless they had then the source of the baseless rumour-mongering was probably just good old plain tooth-sucking envy as your father was ex-RN he'd know the meaning of the phrase. Nothing at all so despicable as besmirching someone who is unable to defend themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Raggytash
Date: 10 Nov 15 - 12:37 PM

Guest, I have no idea of how to respond to your post. I have told you I was a child at the time when I first heard these rumours. Thats all they were rumours. Now in an attempt to try and get clear, truthful and precise answers to those rumours I have posted to this thread.

I am afraid your negative response to my query does nothing to dispel those rumours.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 10 Nov 15 - 02:35 PM

They don't seem to sell poppies in our village, tho they used to bring them to the doors with their collection tins up to a few years ago. I expect the villager who organised it has died; but if I find any on sale I will spend a pound or two on one.

Meanwhile I shall wear my National Service Medal tomorrow, as I generally do on the actual anniversary of the 1918 Armistice, 11 November.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 15 - 04:05 PM

VD&Bar?

Don't worry Raggytash. Mudcat seems to have the odd creature who trolls like the guest having a pop at you. The internet gives them an outlet for getting a stiffy that normal real social interaction could never deliver. Personality disorder is difficult to countenance but the internet is full of them.

Calling it The Haig Fund is bound to have attracted such concern, justified or otherwise. In addition, years ago before discredited people such as Max Hastings and others were asked to revise history to sanitise our inglorious past, Haig's justifiable reputation as The Butcher of The Somme would have made people suspect of any attempt to rehabilitate him.

de Groot was financed by Haig's family for his kind history. Perhaps Wilipedia accidentally forgot to mention that?

Isn't life strange?

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 10 Nov 15 - 10:52 PM

Guest, could you give us a source for the information that the Haig samily funded deGroots biography ? I am very curious about that!

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 Nov 15 - 11:37 PM

Can't remember seeing any red poppies fixed to front of cars - I suspect that the Red Nose days did for that.

Actually, in the light of the fuss about public figures not wearing red poppies, I'd love the same principle to be applied to Red Nose Day. Parliamentary Question Time would be greatly improved by this.

As for the matter of respect for veterans, my father was with the 8th Army in North Africa and up throuh Italy, and never wore a Red Poppy in his life. Never sung God Save the King, or the Queen either.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Thompson
Date: 11 Nov 15 - 03:24 AM

Anyone know anything about William Coltman's family and childhood? He sounds like some man for one man!
If we're going to go back to talking about fighting Hitler, does anyone have access to British newspaper archives online? It might be instructive to look for the editorials on 4 March 1933 (I think it was) when Hitler swept into power, and see whether the Establishment represented by those newspapers approved or disapproved of this very thuggish party taking over Germany, which until then had been the intellectual light of Europe even during the days of starvation when English Quakers ran soup kitchens to feed the starving children in the 1920s.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Nov 15 - 07:03 AM

Look, the cocoon of smug patriotism is what gets the buggers through the day.

Don't upset them by relating real rather than jingoism tainted history...

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Nov 15 - 12:40 PM

So Raggytash a rumour you heard over 50 years ago sticks in your mind yet you have no idea as to how you came to hear this rumour, or who was spreading it - frankly I find that unbelievable and totally lacking in credulity.

As you cannot provide any detail relating to these "rumours" of yours then it can only be assumed that those you heard them from had no connection and therefore no inside knowledge related to the working of any of the organisations that Haig and his family were supposed to have ripped off. Exactly why someone who had been elevated to the peerage and awarded £100,000 by Parliament in 1919 (Equivalent of £3.61 million today) should rip-off a charity that he created is beyond me, added to the fact that Haig had his own private income courtesy of the Haig & Haig Distillery worth roughly £10,000 per year serves not only to dispel your rumour commonsense would lean towards your rumour being blown to smithereens.

Come back and peddle your rumour when you've hung some meat on it's bones.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Nov 15 - 12:44 PM

Hi Teribus. Lost your cookie?

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler
Date: 11 Nov 15 - 02:18 PM

An update on poppy wearing.
I have seen 10 people wearing poppies today. 8 of them were my MP, council members and BT representatives, at a meeting with over 50 members of the public.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 11 Nov 15 - 02:55 PM

Calling it The Haig Fund is bound to have attracted such concern, justified or otherwise.

You are sadly deluded Guest.
It was a huge plus for the campaign.
The man was a great national hero.
He was revered.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 11 Nov 15 - 03:26 PM

Guest, I will say it again.

These were rumours I heard as a child.

BECAUSE there were rumours of course I have no evidence to support them.

What I am trying to discover by asking the question is have they any substance.   

You, merely dismissing the proposition, neither dispels or confirms the rumours, although I am sure there are those who would suggest it tends towards a substantiation of the same.

I gather that is not a premise you would wish to expound.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 03:34 AM

Yes Keith.

And Rolf Harris was revered too

Jimmy Saville was a national hero

Haig was put on a pedestal representing justification of the carnage, slaughter and waste. Rather fitting given his contribution to it. History relates a less glorious account, despite the recent revisions to sanitise the butcher of The Somme.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 04:27 AM

He was revered, especially by the men who served under him.
You were wrong to assert, "Calling it The Haig Fund is bound to have attracted such concern,"

No other name in the world would have been as good for the cause.

Rag, as neither you nor anyone else can find anything to remotely support the "rumours" you claim to have heard as a child, we can safely say they were, and are, bollocks.

As a child, I heard some rumours about where babies come from.
I won't bother to make enquiries here about their veracity though.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 05:13 AM

As a child, I heard some rumours about where babies come from.
I won't bother to make enquiries here about their veracity though.

I would say here (Mudcat) was the perfect place to make such enquiries, Keith, and an ideal place to bring up any old rumours or fairytales. They are, after all, part of folklore and to find out how and when they started should be part of the folklorists studies. In fact, I will start a thread forthwith.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 05:13 AM

Professor, I'll try and keep this simple just for you.

I said I had heard rumours. I did not say they were correct. I asked if there was any justification for them.

I asked that because I didn't know. It's called trying to find out information.

Simples................

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 05:34 AM

Here it is.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 06:12 AM

Rumours you heard as a child - strange that you cannot remember who you heard them from - strange that no other poster to this thread heard any similar rumour - that because it was extremely "local"?

If the rumour was spread by Earl Haig or his wife's Bank Manager they might be credible, likewise any office-holder within the British Legion who had any form of budgetary responsibility. If the rumour was spread by some disaffected Joe Bloggs in the street then it is not credible. If the rumour was spread by someone wishing to tarnish the reputation of a man long dead then the rumour is not credible.

People act as they do for motives that they can justify to themselves. The motive for "ripping off" a charity would be financial gain, in this case in the years between 1919 and 1928 in this period Earl Haig would have received £200,000 (Over £7 million) perfectly legally a massive sum, so financial gain could be reasonably and logically ruled out as a motive.

"The Butcher of the Somme" a title Haig never heard in his lifetime and a title that was only dared to voiced after his death by far lesser men with guilty consciences - I will go with General Pershing's opinion voiced immediately after the end of World War I that Haig was "the man who won the war".

A question for Haig's detractors on this forum, tell me what great tactical changes and innovations were introduced by Moltke, Falkenhayn, Hindenburg, Ludendorff or Groener? What great tactical changes and innovations were introduced by Joffre, Pétain, Nivelle or Foch? On the other hand I could detail many backed and introduced under Haig's command in the British Army.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 06:24 AM

Guest, if you can remember every detail of your childhood, which in my case is over 50 years ago, you're a better man than I am Gunga Din.

I keep repeating they were RUMOURS, nothing more nothing less. Just something I picked up more than 50 years ago.

Rattling on about Haig the General does nothing to alter that one iota.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 06:29 AM

I know what you are getting at, Guest, but your statement so financial gain could be reasonably and logically ruled out as a motive. is ludicrous. Have you never heard that a rich man will always want more? Do you really believe that earning £7m would stop a rich landowner from kicking a poor family out on the street to earn an extra £100 a week in rent? I am not saying that Haig was such a man, but to rule out the possibility that he wanted more money is, at best, naive and, at worst, dishonest.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 02:07 PM

Rag, I am sure you would have done a few Google searches for evidence of your claimed rumours before putting them to the forum.
Obviously you came up with nothing, or you would have mentioned it.

You ridicule people for believing things without evidence, so you must now agree with me that your "rumours" are complete bollocks and a waste of everyone's time.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 03:21 PM

I realise Professor I have no evidence, AGAIN it was a rumour from my childhood.

That is why I posed the question on this forum.

Is that really too difficult for you to comprehend.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Paul Burke
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 05:53 PM

Haig was "the man who won the war".
Rubbish. Here is The Man Who Won The War. He's a bit overwhelmed by the antihuman road system around him and the glitzy but tawdry buildings (is there a word, "glazen"?), and lookedfar more the hero when he dominated the rundown factories and shops at the end of Oldfield Road in Salford. But I had it direct from a couple of 7-year old boys on a 57 bus that this was the man that did it.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 06:15 PM

I recognised it right away, Paul. Even without the TGWU headquarters :-)

Did the 57 go round Swinton and come back though Pendlebuty or was that the 77? One did that and the other went though Pendlebury and came back though Swinton. Either way, they passed my Grandparents place on Bolton Road. They became the 56 and 57 before they were stopped altogether and one of them went to Belle Vue where I used to watch the speedway and I usually missed the last one back :-(

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Allan Conn
Date: 12 Nov 15 - 06:46 PM

As I understand it Rag asked if there was any truth in certain rumours he'd heard when young. Why would we suggest he hadn't heard it somewhere? He isn't suggesting it is true as much as asking if anyone else had heard the same and asking if there is any substance to it. Surely we should take it that someone had said this to him at one time even if there was nothing behind it? Why would he make it up?

I noticed the clip from this book rag on Haig and Kitchener. Haig's home Bemersyde is not far from where I live. This book suggests that a private subscription was raised after the war to purchase this for him. Perhaps someone in the past mixed up this private subsciption with the slightly later Haig Fund for veterans and mistakenly thought the Haig Fund was for his private use? Certainly a possibility!

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=7jj34GGDFB8C&pg=PT17&lpg=PT17&dq=haig+fund+c

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 03:16 AM

@Dave the Gnome:

"Have you never heard that a rich man will always want more? Do you really believe that earning £7m would stop a rich landowner from kicking a poor family out on the street to earn an extra £100 a week in rent? I am not saying that Haig was such a man, but to rule out the possibility that he wanted more money is, at best, naive and, at worst, dishonest."

The type of rich man you describe above is the sort that started out with nothing and acquired wealth. The sort of person who values money above all else. Haig's chosen career was as a soldier - so that simply does not fit, it does not gel or make any sense.

Haig was not a rich landowner, his family distilled whisky and made a very good living out of it. Had Haig been interested in money he would have gone to the family business and expanded and diversified it. The fact that he did not, the fact that he remained a soldier, tends to indicate that Haig had little or no interest in acquiring wealth.

You seem to consider "possibilities" yet ignore "probability". Lots of things are "possible" most of those things however can be ruled out when "probabilty" is taken into account. A man in NEED of money might risk his social standing and his reputation by "ripping off" a charity (That is both "possible" and "probable") much less "probable" is a man with wealth, position, reputation, recently honoured by the nation ever doing so.

If such a rumour was ever in circulation, and so far only Raggytash has ever heard it, then I would say that Allan Conn's explanation of what gave rise to it is the most likely. I would also have thought that the rumour would have been strongest in and around Edinburgh and the borders as people would have to have known about the house being built to comment on it.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 03:19 AM

"Lesser men with guilty consciences "

Lesser because they were less callous? Guilty because they didn't order men over the top to certain death in the absence of a competent military plan?

Haig was revered through a propaganda campaign to deflect attention from veterans with missing limbs begging in the street. From the gaps in every town, village, family and community.

He was called the butcher of The Somme by those hanging on his meat hooks.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 03:42 AM

Haig was revered by those he led, if you doubt that then look at and read the accounts of his funeral, explain the house purchased for him by public subscription, explain the award of £100,000 and his elevation to the peerage voted for by Parliament by way of thanks.

Haig retired from active service shortly after the war and devoted the remainder of his life to looking after the welfare of those who served under him and in that regard did a damned sight more for "his" veterans than David Lloyd George or any other bloody politician or Government ever did. The charities that he was responsible for setting up look after and house ex-servicemen and their dependents to this day. That should not really be necessary as that really should be the Government's job, as it is always the Government of the day that deliberately puts our servicemen and women in harms way.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 03:47 AM

Wartime rumours tend to carry with them grains of truth, just as the behaviour of the great and the good tend to get swept under the carpet.
I grew up with the story of the conversation between two politicians during World War Two who were overheard describing the reports of the extermination of the Jews in Germany as "Lies invented by whingeing Yids"
I have heard the story repeated many times from many sources, yet there is no recorded evidence of it having been said.
I have little doubt it was said; it was certainly the opinion of many right wing politicians, who, while the war was in full spate, were taking part in Antisemitic activities and preparing for the day when "Herr Hitler would win".
Similarly with Lady Asquith's "D-Day dodgers" remark - no documented evidence of it ever having been made, but it certainly reflected the attitude that the troops fighting in Italy were wine-swigging, womanising wasters enjoying "a soft touch".
There is no reason at all to doubt that these events took place - put into context, it would have been inconvenient for us proles to learn how 'our betters' regarded us.
The Haig rumour carries with it the same grains of truth - he was presented as a war hero, yet his 'heroism' was based on his ability to send young men to their deaths efficiently, nothing more.
There was little strategy connected with World War One, just the sending over the top of enough young men to fight each other until one side or the other gave up - not a matter of leadership or heroism (except on the part of those who went over the top, of course).
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 03:49 AM

Correction - Lady Astor - of course
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 03:53 AM

'many right wing politicians, who, while the war was in full spate, were taking part in Antisemitic activities and preparing for the day when "Herr Hitler would win".'
.,,.,.

Name some of these 'many', please, Jim.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 03:57 AM

...to clarify my doubts. Your use of the word 'politicians' suggests those actively involved in politics. Obviously I exclude from my query the likes of the Mosleys, Jeff Hamm, other ex-members of BUF & such, who were interned under provisions of Emergency Regulation 18b. to prevent their being so actively involved.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 04:00 AM

You seem to consider "possibilities" yet ignore "probability". And if I may say, Guest, you seem to be doing the opposite. You simply cannot exclude the possibility that it could have happened. I am not saying it did and fully understand your points but to dismiss anything out of hand because it is not likely is a dangerous path to tread.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 04:13 AM

Haig was revered through a propaganda campaign to deflect attention from veterans with missing limbs begging in the street.

There was no such campaign.

He was called the butcher of The Somme by those hanging on his meat hooks.

No he was not.
Did you read the story of the widow who proudly called her daughter Somme?

but it certainly reflected the attitude that the troops fighting in Italy were wine-swigging, womanising wasters enjoying "a soft touch".
There is no reason at all to doubt that these events took place

Yes there is, and there was no such attitude.
The lie about Astor came from Nazi propaganda. Sad to see that you are still disseminating Nazi lies Jim.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 04:22 AM

Nazi propaganda eh,


taken up by the troops

We are the D Day Dodgers way out in Italy
we're always on the veno, we're always on the spree
Eighth Army scroungers and our tanks
we live in Rome and fight the Yanks
we are the D Day Dodgers, way out in Italy

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 04:27 AM

Yes Rag, a song I sometimes perform.
The Germans claimed Astor made the remark in Parliament, and so the rumour started, but it was a lie.

The story of a girl called Somme,
thread.cfm?threadid=158533&messages=6

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 04:35 AM

There is no evidence whatever of where the D day Dodger story came from - certainly not that it originated as Nazi propaganda, and it was a story widely believed by British Servicemen at the time - just reading an account of growing up in forties and fifties Glasgow, where it is described as being sung at veterans' funerals there.
You appearing to suggest that many thousands of British servicemen were gullible enough to have fallen for Nazi propaganda (that you have yet to give evidence for).
As I say, whatever it's origins, it certainly is an accurate depiction of how 'the lower orders' were regarded by 'our betters'.
Little surprise that you should continue to sing the praises of 'The Butcher of the Somme' - nothing changes.
Whatever the truth of the matter about Haig, he certainly was regarded as the Butcher of the Somme by many millions of people (though not you)
This, from a Times review of a book on the history of the war, published some years ago:
"He is the most pilloried military leader in British history, caricatured as a butcher and a bungler who sent hundreds of thousands of men over the top to their deaths. Now a new biography pins a further damning indictment on Field Marshal Sir Douglas Haig. Late in the final year of the First World War, it argues, he was pushing for a peace that would have left Germany as the real winner of the war".
Take your pick - you have chosen yours, and why not?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 04:48 AM

IF it was written as a result of Nazi Propaganda (the evidence for which I'm sure you provide) it is strange that Lady Astor was not mentioned in the original lyrics written by Harry Pynn in November 1944.

Stranger still if you consider that Astor was seen by some as "Hitlers woman in Britain"

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Derrick
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 05:19 AM

I've heard the Nancy Astor story many times,it's the first time it's been blamed on the Nazis.
She was very much a "Marmite" person you loved or hated her.
In Plymouth where she was an MP and prominent in local affairs there are people to this day who love her or hate her.
There are many stories of how she treated those who opposed her and how she favoured her chosen causes.
The D Day Dodgers claim is one of those urban myths,widely believed without proof.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 05:23 AM

"widely believed without proof."
Quite - but not without foundation
Interesting that someone considers criticism of the aristocracy as "Nazi propaganda" though
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 05:59 AM

You have posted a couple of times since, Jim, so one knows you have been on the thread. But you still have not identified, as I requested (explicitly excluding 18b detainees), a single one of those 'many' actively antisemitic, muttering pro-Nazi quasi-Quislings, whom you asserted back at 0347 to have existed among our politicians thruout WWii.

Identify some, or withdraw such a defamatory allegation, please.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 06:09 AM

I take it you have heard of the Cliveden Set Michael?

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 07:11 AM

Been there, done that at great length Mike – thought you were privy to that and didn't see your request.
We discussed this at length in the past – Keith dismissed it as harmless eccentricity" at the time and passe3d of the songs as comparable to the Dad's Army theme.
A wartime organisation of politicians, businessmen, industrialists and members of the House of Lords was set up tp prepare for power when Hitler won.
It was extremely Anti-Semitic and produced Anti- Jewish songs supporting what was happening in Germany.
One of the founders and leading members was the then Duke of Wellington, who died cursing "The Yids" from his deathbed.
THE RIGHT CLUB
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Teribus
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 07:40 AM

So having waded through the link supplied by Jim Carroll, I find it not in the least surprising that your question wasn't answered directly MGM. It would appear that the number of politicians = ONE and that he was arrested and imprisoned then released in 1944 when he was deemed harmless and more of a threat to himself than to anyone else.

Like most of Jim Carroll's dearly held beliefs it simply amounts to Made Up Shit

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 07:57 AM

Ahem, Teribus you didn't mention the Cliveden Set. One speaker of the House of Commons, one Foreign Secretary, one Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs to say nothing of Nancy Astor herself.

Cliveden Set


Again a nice try though.

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 08:18 AM

As the article points out, despite having supposedly to have ceased activity during the war, it continued to operate and meet.
Its support extended far beyond its membership and its supporters issued statements saying they were preparing an interim Government Ramsay, despite his Nazi sympathies, Ramsay was returned to parliament.
"Capt. Ramsay was also interned for several years, until September 1944 when, in a "breathtaking act of chutzpah" (Saikia's words yet again), the first thing he did upon his release—the war was not yet over—was to resume his seat in Parliament. He then called for a motion to reinstate the 1275 Statute of Jewry, a pernicious piece of medieval anti-Semitic legislation first introduced during the reign of Edward I that, among other things, required Jews to wear a yellow badge and that also outlawed usury. Ramsay died an unapologetic fascist."
Far from "made up shit" methinks appeasement to British Nazism - not the first time for your team.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Why a veteran is not wearing a poppy
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Nov 15 - 08:35 AM

SOME MORE
Jim Carroll