England's National Musical-Instrument?

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Sailor Ron
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 06:14 AM

Without going into the 'ancient history' of English folk instruments, I would state that the traditional instument for English folk song is none. With very few exceptions, as far as I am aware,traditional singers sang unaccompanied. So England's National Musical-Instrument, as far as folk song goes is the voice! If 'folk song' is to accompanied does it matter then with what instrument? To my mind it does not;electric guitar, banjo,cello,concertina, church organ,Black Sea fiddle, aye and recorder are all as valid,or invalid depending on your personal view.My own view is, its not the instrument, but how it is used that matters.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: TheSnail
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 06:35 AM

NOTHING like the violin?

The violin wasn't developed for chromaticism and virtuosity? It's never been a solo orchestral instrument?

Don't take me too seriously, IB. I'm just amazed by the knots people tie themselves into and the tosh they talk in the totally unnecessary task of proving WAV wrong. He must be delighted at all the attention he receives.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Spleen Cringe
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 07:19 AM

Ron said:"My own view is, its not the instrument, but how it is used that matters"

Absolutely, Ron - agree with you 100%... mind you, I can think of a couple of excellent uses for the recorder!

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 07:53 AM

I'm just amazed by the knots people tie themselves into

It's you that's tying the knots here, TheSnail - thus obfuscating a point that was simple enough - i.e. that, whatever other points of commonality the two instruments may or may not have, the violin became a folk instrument whereas the recorder did not. What the recorder is now of course is a different issue altogether, other instruments likewise; as SailorRon says above, all as valid,or invalid depending on your personal view... its not the instrument, but how it is used that matters.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 09:30 AM

"We could argue forever, to what end?" (Ralphie)...awareness...a very well known and respected English folkie, Martin Carthy, dared to say, on the BBC, "English don't know who they are any more."
"WAVs theory of Monoculturalism" (Ralphie)...ridiculous...I love our WORLD being multicultural.
Curious Scot - I've seen "The Water is Wide" given English origin in a few places, and, in Wiki., as you say, Scottish. Certainly, there is now a Scottish and an English version.

"Other examples abound, including our very own Walkaboutsverse who wields his plastic tenor in a manner that is most un-virtuosic, but hardly traditional," (IB)...whatever the quality, I play and then sing just the TUNE, which IS traditional...Baroque playing, however, certainly would involve much more ornamentation.
And, once more, at The Rothbury Traditional Music Festival, they have a competition for whistles AND recorders.
"Bit like the violin then." (IB perhaps in a rush)...I said in terms of their capabilities of mimicking the human voice.

Speaking of which, Sailor Ron, I agree with you in part - but you forgot all about the accompaniment of English folk dances.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 09:45 AM

Mea Maxima Culpa.
I know I shouldn't, but........
I Quote....WAV

"I play and sing, just the tune"

Don't make me laugh.

I have listened to your recordings.
You can't play to save your life.
You can't sing in any recognisible key known to man.
If your recordings are supposed to represent quintessential Englishness, I'm off to Australia.
WAV....JUST GO AWAY.
And learn some humility.

Spaw, when you read this. Please don't go to WAVs MySpace page.
I would worry for your health.

PS FYI WAV MWR lives in England, and is very welcome.
You live in England, and I don't think the same can be said for you.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Phil Edwards
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 09:45 AM

"WAVs theory of Monoculturalism" (Ralphie)...ridiculous...I love our WORLD being multicultural.

You love the WORLD being multicultural, you just want our COUNTRY to be monocultural. Correct?

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 09:47 AM

'Speaking of which, Sailor Ron, I agree with you in part - but you forgot all about the accompaniment of English folk dances. ' as a response to:

'I would state that the traditional instument for English folk song is none. '

Analyse the sentence, notice the word 'song', playing a tune to accompany dance is a different matter altogether. Sometimes I doubt your academic credentials.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 09:59 AM

"Bit like the violin then." (IB perhaps in a rush)

That was actually TheSnail, WAV. Otherwise, I've said all I intend to say on these threads - life really is too short to be wasting time on an arrogant attention-seeking racist buffoon who has neither the humility to listen nor yet the nous to learn.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYlA4q1IcB0

Meanwhile, if anyone wants to discuss any of the matters above, please PM me - I won't be looking in here again.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Curious Scot
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 10:10 AM

Try reading your wiki again wav. - It says - It is doubtful that the ballad is English, although it is popularly considered so. The oldest lyrics which exist show the song to be of Scottish origin.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 11:13 AM

"And, once more, at The Rothbury Traditional Music Festival, they have a competition for whistles AND recorders."

They also include one for highland bagpipes, so I assume that is E. trad as well.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 12:25 PM

"'Speaking of which, Sailor Ron, I agree with you in part - but you forgot all about the accompaniment of English folk dances. ' as a response to:
'I would state that the traditional instument for English folk song is none. '
Analyse the sentence, notice the word 'song', playing a tune to accompany dance is a different matter altogether. Sometimes I doubt your academic credentials." (Joe)...what's the title of the thread we are on, Joe?

Volgadon - I do like the Scottish Highland Pipes but disagree with Rothbury, ENGLAND, on that one.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 12:31 PM

But you are saying that if they have an competition for a certain instrument, said instrument is part of the tradition. Merely following your own logic.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Sugwash
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 02:11 PM

Let's adopt the banjo as England's national instrument. That will give those of other countries a coherent focus for their dislike of the English. I post as a proud Englishman and unapologetic banjo player.

There is a distinct English style of banjo playing, Rob Murch is an admirable proponent of it.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 02:14 PM

Logically, Volgadon, the Rothbury Trad. Mus. Fest. board see both as trad. instruments - as do I...whether there should be a Scottish pipes comp within the borders of England is another matter.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 03:05 PM

Going back a bit to Insane Beard's comments about the recorder as a folk instrument. There is something in that position, but it suffers from the problem that it was mainly the bourgeoisie that documented what they were doing with them. Here are a few data points outwith the world of the English diarist.

- The recorder is listed in a chronicle of the reign of Mary Queen of Scots as one of the instruments played by a drunken rabble outside her window; she detested the whole lot of them (and in her customary Red Queen style, subsequently created a law imposing the death penalty for street festivities). Somehow I doubt they were playing Sermisy and Binchois.

- The Georgian salamuri is a type of recorder, and as far as we know it has always been used as both a folk and art music instrument.

- One of the oldest recorders extant is from a time and place which has no known art music: Rhodes under the Knighta of St John, around 1500. I noticed this thing a few years ago in a museum there (nobody before me had spotted the octaving thumbhole). It's rather crudely made from an animal bone, about the same proportions as my Susato G sopranino. (I told Anthony Rowland-Jones about it and he wrote a note in a recorder magazine; I left it to others to argue with the rather unhelpful museum about getting it properly measured and photographed). The Knights' sphere of influence extended from Portugal to Scotland to Egypt to the Caucasus, so this instrument could have come from anywhere in Europe, but it sure doesn't *look* like an art music instrument (no decoration at all, no sign of lathe work) and we know of no art music it could have played. What does that leave?

- Several different sizes of recorder are mentioned in the adverts at the back of one of the Gows' Scottish music collections of the early 19th century; you could buy them from the Gow & Shepherd shop. As far as I know, this is the last mention of it in print in Britain before the revival nearly 100 years later. You couldn't buy printed music for them at that point, so what would people have played on them? Not much option but music like that in the Gows' books, surely.

- The Scottish recorder manuscripts of the early 18th century seem not to be the work of the leisured elite, but of working musicians. They were *really serious* about getting these tunes right, John Dow in particular. These manuscripts are much like those the Village Music Project has documented. Not the sort of thing an illiterate ploughman could have produced, but quite likely made by a player he danced to. (Probably the recorder was a second instrument, though. Thomson seems to have been a trumpeter, and Dow focuses on very complex versions of song tunes for listening rather than dances, the dances would probably have been played on the fiddle).

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 04:50 PM

"Logically, Volgadon, the Rothbury Trad. Mus. Fest. board see both as trad. instruments - as do I...whether there should be a Scottish pipes comp within the borders of England is another matter."

Actually, logicaly, I think that they see them as SIMILAR instruments which can play the same sort of music, so why not.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Sugwash
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 05:50 PM

Oops, Rob Murch is an exponent of the English banjo style.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 02:25 AM

WAV
Just so that I understand.
Please define this wierd term for me.
I haven't come across it before.

E Trad.

(That should shut you up)

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Woody
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 03:29 AM

From: GUEST,Joe
...Sometimes I doubt your academic credentials.

Glad to see I'm not the only one that doubts the veracity of WAVs qualifications. If he does have a BA he must have forgotten pretty much all that he learned.

From what I've seen most of the things he says about himself don't fully stand up to scrutiny...

e.g.
He goes on about English culture but he's culturally Australian

He pontificates about music but from his recordings & opinions he hardly qualifies for the title 'amateur'.

He goes on about his 'technical certificates' but they turn out to be of no significance unless you work in a factory.Using his standards I've got 12 "technical certificates". Does that make me an academic or highly qualified - no it does not.


...Presumably in time we'll find out that "BA" stands for "burger arrangement".

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,banksie
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 04:18 AM

Sugwash wrote: Let's adopt the banjo as England's national instrument.

Well, there is a history. There were several English companies making banjos in the 19th century - Windsor was just one popular make.

My mother used to play in a banjo band in the early 20th century, playing dance tunes such as Polkas and Jigs, so it wasn't `art' music. I still have some of the sheet music, published by John Alvey Turner (Turner's Banjo Budget series). Titles include The Fusilade Polka for two banjos(by Harry Nicholls) , and the Skipping Rope Dance (another Polka, by Herbert Ellis). And I still have her banjo, though I'm damned if I can play it as well as she did, even late in life. One more thing to practice, I guess :-)

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 04:30 AM

Thanks for those details, Jack.
Ralphie - "WAV
Just so that I understand.
Please define this wierd term for me.
I haven't come across it before.

E Trad.

(That should shut you up)"...not from answering:
E. for English; Trad. for traditional...used mainly to describe English traditional SONGS.

Woody - apart from the remnants of my Australian accent, I'm culturally English: my repertoire is English; I play the recorder/English flute; I keep fit with Lawn tennis; my staple is pottages; I've read widely from the canon of English verse; I grow hedera helix; and I think I know England's geography, history, etc., quite well. (Also, as said, I did Australianise during my 26 years there - but not that much: occasionally people there would note my English background, and they certainly would nowadays, if and when I make a VISIT to Aus.).
The formal courses I've mentioned (only when defending strong criticism of my character/abilities) are true; and a Bachelor of Arts Degree is meant to be relevant to lots of occupations (human resources, supervision, etc.), rather than just the arrangement of burgers.
Also, "no significance unless you work in a factory." (Woody)...one of the four is actually an Advanced Certificate in Manufacturing Technology (= a HNC, HR people here have told me), but some of its production-management modules were taken by people in other fields, such as from airlines.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 04:35 AM

But practicing what you think is English culture does not make you culturally English.

And I have a Silver Swimming Certificate, a lot of Olympians probably earned this prestigious award at some point in their career.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Joe P at work somewhere else
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 04:42 AM

Sorry that was me, it seems that despite my various qualifications and experience working with a wide range of IT packages, as well as my Key Skills qualification(!) I forgot to put my name.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Woody
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 06:08 AM

From: WalkaboutsVerse
Woody - apart from the remnants of my Australian accent, I'm culturally English

Hee hee hee. All together now - "Oh no you're not!" You're a fake. Delusional.


Regarding the BA. A degree is supposed to develop you're skills in study, analysis and reasoned argument. I see no evidence that you've achieved anything there given that your postings tend toward the unreasoned, ignorant and simplistic.

Regarding the anthropology bit... well surely the bedrock of Anthropology is the attempt to understand humanity objectively (as far as is possible) without imposing your own subjective prejudices and preconceptions. You've come to England, but rather than using your "qualification" to help you understand the culture, you've come with a set of preconceived ideas and prejudices that bear no relation to the reality, and then you seek to impose them on others. If you did ever attend Anthropology classes you must have slept through them.


Back to the original subject. As another poster said, if we had an English national instrument, we'd know about it. If we don't know about it, it's hardly a national instrument.

There is however one instrument which can be found in most English musical genres over a period of hundreds of years, as at home in modern English Folk, Classical, Jazz, Pop, Rock as it was in 18th century dance music. It's called the fiddle, but it's not specifically English.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 09:20 AM

You've ALL got it wrong!

England's National Musical-Instrument:


TA DA!


from the 50/60s to today - Transistor radio, morphing to Walkman, then CD Walkman, now iPod and Blackberry...


:-P

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Stu
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 09:34 AM

BA = Bugger All

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: TheSnail
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 09:41 AM

On the banks of red roses my love and I sat down
And I took out my iPod to play my love a tune....

Hmmm. Not sure that the symbolism works.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 09:44 AM

"Hmmm. Not sure that the symbolism works."

Oh, yes, it will, just make sure you pack fresh batteries with the condoms...

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 10:19 AM

Are you calling me a woody Englishman, Woody?! And as for, yawn, "If you did ever attend Anthropology classes you must have slept through them." (W)...and somehow got mostly distinctions for my essays! It was actually IB (above) who found that Wiki has England's nat. inst. as the bell, and quite a few agreed on that (above). Also, curiousity killed/muddied the cat, but are you the Woody I've seen/heard on the NE folk scene once or twice?

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 10:52 AM

The shakey egg.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Woody
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 02:47 PM

From: WalkaboutsVerse

and somehow got mostly distinctions for my essays!

You say that, but then you say a lot of things that are patently untrue. Judging by what and how you write, you're being economical with the truth.


It was actually IB (above) who found that Wiki has England's nat. inst. as the bell

Yep the streets round here are packed with kids playing their bells all day and all night. How could I have missed it?


are you the Woody I've seen/heard on the NE folk scene once or twice?

How should I know?

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Terry
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 04:05 PM

and somehow got mostly distinctions for my essays!

WAV, is there any chance you could upload these essays to somewhere on the 'net? (There are loads of hosting places)

Lots of us would really like to read them, I'm sure.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 10:17 PM

"the streets round here are packed with kids playing their bells all day and all night"

Didn't you have a typo or two there?

The streets round here are packed with kids playing (with) their balls all day and all night...

:-P

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 11:25 PM

"Lots of us would really like to read them"

GUEST Terry.
WAV doesn't do irony. He really doesn't get it.
QED. WAV is not English!

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 04:04 AM

I hope IB is still looking in. I really want to go for a drink with him sometime. So long as it's not feckin' mead. Mind you, mead is as scarce in the pubs round here as are bells in the streets, citterns in barber shops and 'pottage of the day.'

Newcastle sounds great. I'm going up soon for the first time. It sounds like a wonderfully vibrant city. I look forward to looking in on the folk degree and spending time with some great English singers and musicians who, like IB, have forgotten more than WAV will ever know about the English tradition.

Btw, wavey davey: Martin Carthy also said that the only harm you can do to a folk song is not to sing it. Given his participation in projects like the Imagined Village, I'd guess his vision of England, and of what is acceptable to do with English music, is a lot closer to IB's than to yours, and if I know the Carthys, no member of the family would want their words hijacked and misinterpreted to support the sort of xenophobia you espouse. Eliza has told you as much herself, and I don't think her dad would feel any differently.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,a still cookieless ruth
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 04:07 AM

guest above: me.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 04:48 AM

Message to the Snail.

"And I took out my IPod for to play my love a tune"

Brilliant!
(Should be added to the Bright but Dim Knight thread)

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 04:50 AM

Sorry.
That should read "The Nice but Dim Knight"

As for WAV waxing lyrical re Concertinas.
I play the McCann Duet. If I only played the tune, what exactly would my left hand be doing?

(McCann Duet.....look it up)

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Oldguit
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 04:55 AM

I don't know if this has been mentioned before, if so, apologies.

How about "spoons" I don't know if they are played anywhere else.

Oldguit Arr

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: TheSnail
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 05:01 AM

If I only played the tune, what exactly would my left hand be doing?

Playing with your iPod?

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Surreysinger
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 05:09 AM

"I play the McCann Duet. If I only played the tune, what exactly would my left hand be doing?"

Waving ? Making obscure* gestures ? Being musically redundant ??

*spelling mistake ??

"(McCann Duet.....look it up)"

Here you go!

And just in case WAV should come back on your spelling of the name,Ralphie, perhaps it should be pointed out by a nerd like me that for years the name was spelled the way you do, whereas in recent years the more recognised spelling adopted is the one in the article - which it is now known is the way the revered Professor Maccann spelled his name. A rose by any other name, and all that ... still a great instrument however you spell it. Not England's National musical instrument ... but I suppose actually an English instrument (unless Maccann proves to have been Polish, Scottish or Irish ????)

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: Phil Edwards
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 05:12 AM

Indeed. But then, looking back at WAV's list...

INSTRUMENTS OF (OR CLOSELY ASSOCIATED WITH) ENGLAND

Northumbrian Bagpipes (bellows blown), Leicestershire Bagpipes (mouth blown); English Concertina, Anglo Concertina, Duet Concertina (and important developments to – if not inventions of – other keyboards, such as piano and organ, have also occurred in England); Dital Harp/Harp-Lute, English Cittern; English Flageolet, Penny Whistle, Recorder/English Flute

...they're all chordal instruments apart from the whistles. Apparently 'English traditional' means what he says it does, except when it doesn't.

But we already know it's impossible to argue with this guy. A reminder for anyone still tempted...

WAV: [the recorder]'s certainly been played in this land for a long time; and, at the Rothbury TRADITIONAL Music Festival, there is a competition for whistles AND recorders.

Volgadon: I see that the Rothbury TRADITIONAL Music Festival also has a competition for highland bagpipes

WAV: Volgadon - I do like the Scottish Highland Pipes but disagree with Rothbury, ENGLAND, on that one.

It's all evidence for WAV's argument - unless the evidence doesn't support him, in which case he's right and the evidence is wrong.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: DaveM
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 05:14 AM

I nominate the Hohner Pokerwork as Englands national instrument.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Mr Beard's Inane Apprentice
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 06:06 AM

I hope IB is still looking in. I really want to go for a drink with him sometime.

Hi Ruth - I've been instructed to keep an eye on pertinent developments as and when they occur & am assured that a drink would be well in order. IB and the missus are often over in Newcastle, generally on the first Saturday, thus coinciding family visits with a trip to Joe Crane's Come-All-Ye at The Cumberland Arms in Byker - one of the finest sings in the North East, in one of the last remaining traditional pubs wherein singers young and old gladly celebrate in the traditional manner, accompanied, unaccompanied, or otherwise. And we're assured it's a WAV free zone on account of that particular personage preferring to listen to folk radio (whatever the hell that might be) than actually partake of a living, breathing singaround - so no fears there Dave (Bridge). Good beer, no mead, and the only sign of daft Davey is his pathetic promotional poster on the noticeboard bearing his Jack-boot stamp on the face of human freedom directing you to his FREE WEBSITE which openly promotes racial hatred and intolerance with such slogans as:

English culture is taking a hammering and, when people lose their own culture, society suffers.

And talking openly promoting racial hatred and intolerance (or is it just a case of puerile attention seeking at this stage? Either way it garners no sympathy in this camp), we have the following little piece of total(itarian) crap:

whether there should be a Scottish pipes comp within the borders of England is another matter.

Ominous stuff! No doubt WAV has plans to sort out that little aberration once his Glorious World Reich Dictatorship is in order (sorry, a stronger UN with greater powers of regulation) and all nations are ethnically & culturally cleansed of such noxious pollutants.

And for those caught up in the recorder hullabaloo a while back, our thanks to Jack Campin for his fascinating information, none of which, of course, supports WAVs insane idea of the recorder as a Traditional English Folk Flute. But as Pip points out a little way above unless the evidence doesn't support him, in which case he's right and the evidence is wrong.

To close, here's a picture taken by IB whilst out and about in Liverpool yesterday. These are young traditional English folk dancing their traditional English folk dance. Well, as traditional as Morris anyway, certainly as far as these guys are concerned.   

Liverpool Dancers, 24th September 2008

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 06:24 AM

"I play the McCann Duet. If I only played the tune, what exactly would my left hand be doing?"

I dread to think...

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 07:00 AM

You're still calling me a woody Englishman, Woody, and, as for my essays, I've kept those papers in a folder, Terry, but, frankly, have other things to do before thinking about typing them onto the web; e.g, I'm still working out the tunes, using my tenor English-flute and keys, to my 17 "Chants from Walkabouts"; incidentally, for a while I was asking folks about "Finale" software to help with this but, although slow compared with some of the folkies I've met, I'm okay now - via mimicking my singing.
Then Ralphie went further than Woody - "WAV is not English!", even after my response to this matter, above.
Oldguit - for what it's worth, I think I'll add "spoons" to the list on my site, which has already changed slightly, due to this this discussion, from what Pip took the liberty of posting here at - Date: 25 Sep 08 - 05:12 AM. And to Pip - you forgot that folk is not the only English genre (how about our hymns and composer music) and/or didn't READ the titles properly, which don't have the word "traditional" in them; indeed, on the up-to-date list, you'll find the stylophone...
But not the Hohner Pokerwork, DaveM - the melodeon being of Viennese origin; although, like the Italian fiddle/violin, played a lot in England nowadays.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 07:45 AM

Hello Surrey(pedant)Singer.

I reserve my right (as an Englishman) to alter peoples names as often as I like, so there!
It's called the "Folk Tradition"

Back to your practising, wench.

To all others, what I do with my left hand is my own affair.
At least it's done behind closed doors with the curtains shut and the lights off.

What WAV does with his left hand, doesn't bear thinking about.

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 08:08 AM

"What WAV does with his left hand, doesn't bear thinking about."

He calls it 'English Folk Traditional Music'...


"But not the Hohner Pokerwork, DaveM - the melodeon being of Viennese origin; although, like the Italian fiddle/violin, played a lot in England nowadays."

Ah So! WAV, being of English Origin, could never be called an "Aussie" while he was here, so he was forced to go back home...

In joyful strains then let us sing, "Advance Australia fair!"

Subject: RE: England's National Musical-Instrument?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 08:09 AM

300!


:-P