BS: Some people are so stupid...

Subject: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Apr 11 - 05:09 PM

I was on the bus last weekend when a couple of female chavs got on.

'D'yer stop at Salfod preeky?' one asked. The driver (East European I think )looked blank for a minute so I translated

'She is asking if you go via Salford Precinct.'

'Oh, sorry' he replied 'No - You are better with the 37. It will be along soon.'

Well, she gave us both a look that could kill.

'Fuckin wogs. Can't even talk proper...'

They both stormed off amidst fits of giggles from most people in earshot.

I was very tempted to say something but kept quiet as I guess they would not have responded well. Mind you, I know a lot of people like that. No sense of humour. Some would not know if you were taking the piss unless you inserted a catheter. With a mallet.

:D

MP

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: gnu
Date: 13 Apr 11 - 05:22 PM

Chavs are retards who think that they're rebels and also think that their local McDonalds is a 5-star restraunt.

Male chavs wear clothes and jewellry which come from a market, they have a attitude problem and smoke since the age of 11.

Female chavs wear tight trousers and when they sit down they're thongs show, have fake blonde hair as straight as an ironing board or they have the "croydon face-lift", they lost their virginity at the age of 14, they have a attitide problem and they have really really bad teeth.

Chavs also use stupid words such as "safe" or "mint" or "y'wot?" or "quali'ee" or my favourite "innit" what are they trying to say?, it's like trying to communicate with a dog.

you usually find them in your local bus stop or your local town.

... from an urban dictionary I found on Google.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Apr 11 - 06:06 PM

Shucks, we got a whole bunch of those up at the State House in Boise....

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Apr 11 - 06:27 PM

Gnu and Mad Polly- Chav? a new word for me.

market? you mean Walmart?

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Mrs Olive Whatnoll
Date: 13 Apr 11 - 06:46 PM

I carn't stand them fecking chavs! Wot a stupid lot o' bleedin' knownuffin's they are! Vicky Pollard is a fecking chav of the worst sort. 'As anyone 'eard 'ow she goes on? I 'ave. I fink the Queen must get roight bloody well sick and tired of all this sub'uman ghetto trash loiterin' about in the streets and givin' England a bad name in the world. Sodding degenerates, the lot of them! Their kind ought to be incarcerited is wot I say. For fecking life! I will vote for any politician wot promises to get tough on crime and give criminals and delinquents and troublesome foreigners and such the maximum sentence. Why are we not sendin' these scum off to the penal camps in Australia loik we used to???

- Olive Whatnoll

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Leadfingers
Date: 13 Apr 11 - 07:16 PM

Q - A Market in UK is a collection of Cut price traders who would generally make Walmart look REALLY Up market !! Usually small stall in an open area in a Town Centre

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Don Firth
Date: 13 Apr 11 - 07:17 PM

Some years back I remember hearing some ignoramus in a coffee shop going on and on about how there ought to be a law passed limiting the English language to no more than 350 words.

He was actually serious!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: kendall
Date: 13 Apr 11 - 08:13 PM

Mediocrity know nothing higher than itself.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Apr 11 - 08:50 PM

Kendall, some mediocrity doesn't even reach that high.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: J-boy
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 01:01 AM

Stupid people aren't the problem. Assholes(politicians and capitalists,mostly) who make use of them to service their own needs deserve most of the blame. Sorry if I sound a bit Marxist but from what I've seen it's all too true.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:15 AM

Gnu, ditto almost everything you said. It seems that we all have towns like that near us. I presume you mean open town markets with stalls selling counterfeit clothes, tatty t-shirts, chunky jewellery, dodgy food, dodgy watches and electrical goods. Some of the ones in market towns like Salisbury or Hay on Wye are a little bit better but I know what you mean.

But I don't see a solution to chavs when their inspiration are the biggest chavs of all Katie Price and N-Dubz, their lifestyles are another world to me so I just ignore it now.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:50 AM

When I first to the North West (of England) around 40 years ago the old covered markets (like Stockport, for example) used to be fun. They were a bit scruffy and full of character and characters - and there was a sense of history about them. There was also, at least the possibility, of obtaining a bargain. Now they've been tarted up and they're just dull, dull, dull, dull! They're also full of cheap Chinese tat that's not worth buying.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Musket
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 04:35 AM

Oscar Wilde pointed out that we are all lying in the gutter, only some of us are looking up at the stars.

Speaking to many people whom some would dismiss as chavs, you will find that aspirations are low, expectations even lower.

I wonder if those pointing out the issues could point towards the solution?

When I worked down the pit, many of us had two languages. That which we spoke at work and that which we spoke at home. The main difference being that at work, most nouns were preceded by an adjective. Normally beginning with the letter F. I'm not sure the vocabulary was shortened, and neither was the inherent intellect. I'm sure the armchair psychologists can tell me why that was, but I reckon it was about tribal belonging. Much the same as the chavs as they are referred to?

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: gnu
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 04:50 AM

Q, Patsy... I cut and pasted - "... from an urban dictionary I found on Google." I had no idea what the word meant.

You're welcome.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 05:57 AM

However I have experienced in particular at our local Mall shopping area where I live the behaviour of some people who do point a finger and sneer at 'chavs' loud enough to be overheard, that makes me feel more uncomfortable.

I might be mistaken but I think chavvy/chavi might also be a Romany meaning for girl child.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 05:59 AM

I object to the word "retard" as a term of abuse.

I don't object to the flashing of thongs (unless the relevant area is in itself unsightly).

I don't object to other people losing their virginity at the age of 14 - I wish I had lost mine at that age (ah those wasted few years...)!

And I don't promulgate different behavioural rules for the different genders.

I do object to the sort of ignorance and offensiveness described by the OP.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 08:04 AM

Unhappy meal for drinker

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 08:08 AM

A Chav habit I deplore is this ghastly desire to expose ones very pregnant abdomen, complete with distended navel, between a crop-top and a low-slung pair of jeans. I've even seen a navel-piercing proudly displayed on top of the bump like a cherry on a cake. My friend Ronda made me giggle, as she described recently a pregnant lassie so attired walking past Ronda's table in a coffee shop. The first thing she noticed was a profuse bush of ginger pubic hair passing in front of her nose. It rather put her off her scone.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 08:10 AM

That kind of stuff is no more and no less typical of people who get labelled "chavs" think it is of any other category in society. The accent involved and the clothes worn might differ, but the offensiveness lies in the attitude involved, and that can crop up- anywhere.

Not too far from that involved in the term "retards", for that matter. Or in the way many people throw around the termm"chavs".

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: kendall
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 08:20 AM

Jacqui and I were driving along on the main road when a nut on a motorcycle came up on our right, ignored a yield sign and tried to bully his way in front of us. He was right alongside when I blew my horn and he backed off and gave me the finger! I wonder who the hell he thought he was.
Naturally, I gave him the finger and hoped he would follow me and we could stop and discuss our differences but he pulled a left and was gone.
Can you imagine a motorcycle trying to argue with a van? It's beyond stupid.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Mrrzy
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 08:46 AM

Do we live in a mediocracy?

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 11:53 AM

Kendall, I'm trying to visualize the scene: the motorcycle guy came up on your right- but then turned left and was gone? Doesn't that mean he turned in front of you?

Too early in the morning for me- as yet I have had only three sips of coffee.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 12:17 PM

"Can you imagine a motorcycle trying to argue with a van?"

I can remember more than one push bike trying to argue with the seven and a half tonner I was driving!

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 12:32 PM

Ah Dave but they have moral right on their side, since they are saving the planet by pushing pedals.

And no, McGrath, "retards" have no option but to be mentally what they are. Chavs could learn to behave and speak properly if they so chose.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 12:57 PM

The trouble is, they believe that this 'moral right' supercedes the Highway Code. Usually they were objecting to me taking action to avoid actually killing them.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 01:16 PM

You were quite right in your analysis of the meaning of the OP, Mr Bridge.

Funny thing is I wasn't going to use 'chav' at all. Around these parts they are more commonly 'Scallies'. A Rose by any other and all that. It is indeed the attitude, and stupidity, of some people that I am astounded at. Not just the girls in question either. The more I read in some quarters the more I despair as well ;-)

MP

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 01:31 PM

I can't see why people who would be embarrassed to describe others as "common" when insulting them feel it OK to call throw around the label "chavs" with the same intent.

How people speak and dress varies. There's also a lot of variation in whether they are unpleasant people. But there is no particular connection between those two things.

What's the term for people who aren't "chavs" anyway?

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 01:41 PM

Wikipedia, the 'chav' answer to Encyclopaedia Britannica and OED, and thus an authority on chavs, has a long entry with many references.
Innit, Chav is defined "as a stereotype of certain people in the United Kingdom. Also known as a charver in Yorkshire and NE England "chavs" are said to be agressive teenagers, of working class background, who repeatedly engage in anti-social behaviour such as street drinking, drug abuse and rowdiness, or other forms of juvenile delinquency." (Alison Smith, BBC News)

Posts here suggest that the term has been extended to older humans than teenagers, or to anyone who is obnoxious and perceived as a lower form of humanity.

(Canadian, trying to understand English english as it is spoken there - and apologies to the Wikipedia contributors but I couldn't resist my little demon)

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: maple_leaf_boy
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 01:50 PM

Richard, Gnu's post was a quote from Urban dictionary. Anybody can add an entry to it, and they don't always use appropriate vocabulary or subjects. There are often entries that would never be recognized in a real dictionary or encylopedia.

By some of the definitions provided, it sounds like they would also be
called "neds". A term that's also used in the U.K.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: goatfell
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 01:54 PM

her in Scotland they are called NEDS and they too are stupid as well

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 02:53 PM

When this subject is discussed in the UK I can't help noticing that it ALWAYS descends into a debate (OK - slanging match) about social class. Those on the political Right look down on chavs because they consider them to be socially inferior. Those on the Left immediately jump to the defence of chavs because they consider them to be members of the hallowed 'working class'; in spite of the fact that the majority of people on the Left, these days, are usually fairly comfortably off members of the middle class. Actual chavs couldn't give a flying f*ck because they choose to know nothing about politics and never, ever vote. And that is the real problem with chavs: their wilful ignorance. Unfortunately we now live in a society in which it is fashionable, among a significant percentage of the population, to present oneself as stupid, ignorant and anti-social. Some of these people (although by no means all) are disadvantaged - but that is not sufficient reason to defend the stance that they have chosen to take. If people on the Left were really striving towards a truly progressive society they would be challenging wilful stupidity - not defending it!

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:01 PM

I'm wondering if the dreaded word 'taste' comes into the definition of chav behaviour, speech and appearance. While admitting that no-one has the right to decide what is or isn't 'in good taste', I think we all generally have a rough idea of tasteful/tasteless. This sounds terribly snobbish, but when someone/something is described as 'tacky' we all know what is meant. Society itself seems to influence these standards of public behaviour, not individuals, and interestingly, they are changing and evolving all the time. 'Tacky' now could be 'desirable' in a decade or less. Even Estuary English is becoming quite the thing!

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: gnu
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:08 PM

Estuary English... is that a Fallopian language?

Yeah, it IS a long reach. Sue me.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Lox
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:12 PM

The term Chav is just another dehumanizing pigeonhole with which to generalize about disenfranchised sections of society in a way that allows them to become easy scapegoats for the problems of others.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Penny S.
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:34 PM

I do think the opinions about markets are off. Now that greengrocers are thin on the ground, they're a good place to get fresh fruit and veg, though no tin small quantities. There are also stalls which sell branded cosmetic goods at a discount. Ours had, until recently, a good stall for electrical goods. There's a good plants stall, and a fish stall supplied from port. It depends what you're looking for. There is tat, but other stuff as well.

Not easy to use them if you are working, because of the opening hours, but on the traditional stalls, you're dealing with people who know their stuff, and who, as one stall advertises, will be there next week.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:48 PM

The term Chav is just another dehumanizing pigeonhole...

Was that a serious post, Lox, or are you taking the mickey? It's difficult to tell on here sometimes! Very funny if it was tongue in cheek but just in case you are serious...

While I agree that there are occasions on which that statement would be right - Anyone of any authority using it for instance, I am afraid you are WAY off the mark in this case. I have already explained that I need not have used the term 'chav'. Scally would have done. Pillock probably would have been better. But at the end of the day we are talking semantics. It's just a word to describe, generaly, anti-social and loud-mouthed people who, while not quite criminal, are bordering on it. If I did not get that across in the opening post then I apologise for my lack of lucidity.

On the other hand I could just agree with Shimrod - and I do . To hell with not being allowed to use the words I want to because they are not PC. If I want to have a gay old time sucking on my black shag who is to stop me? :-)

MP.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:57 PM

Gnu observed (and I have to assume he's accurate) that

Chavs also use stupid words such as "safe" or "mint" and so on.

I'm just wondering, what's the matter with the word "safe"?

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:58 PM

"The term Chav is just another dehumanizing pigeonhole with which to generalize about disenfranchised sections of society in a way that allows them to become easy scapegoats for the problems of others."

If they don't vote they've 'disenfranchised' themselves, surely?!

I came from a working class background - as did many of my friends. The difference between me and my social circle and chavs is that we chose education and responsibility while they choose wilful ignorance and anti-social behaviour. I bet many of them disrupted lessons while they were at school and bullied those who wanted to learn.

I fervently believe that we need much more social mobility in our society but we're not going to achieve that by wringing our hands over people who make no effort to help themselves.

If these people are really dehumanised and disenfranchised they should be at the barricades like many of their brave ancestors. But they really can't be 'bovvered', can they?

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 03:59 PM

Penny, yes! We love our markets here in Norwich and Norfolk. There's a huge variety of goods on sale, one can browse for ages and get a bargain. Some of us are not well-off enough to be able to get things from the big chain stores. I also love the little craft stalls, good for finding a gift. The stallholders have often been there for donkeys' years, and everyone knows them and can have a chat.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 04:02 PM

BTW - I have just got back from the Gym (yes I know shouldn't but the doctor said it could help with the re-hab...) and while bored on the treadmill was amazed to see a big shiny new Mercedes pull into a disabled spot and 3 very fit looking young men get out to go and play football in the sports hall. On leaving I double checked that there was no disabled sticker. There wasn't. So I went back in to inform the receptionist and she said 'Oh, it's OK. Not many disabled people come at this time of night.' I wonder why that is, thought I, but decided that if I said anything it would probably be lost anyway. You can't make this stuff up can you!

Maybe they weren't chavs but the attitude was the same. Stuff everyone else. The only ones worse are the female of the species in their Chelsea tractors picking up little Chardonnay (yer lickle bleedor) from school...

MP.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: gnu
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 04:12 PM

MP... you could have left a note on the Merc... you had your car keys with you, no?

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 04:13 PM

Poor Jade Goody, she was an example of unbelievable ignorance. She thought 'East Angular' was 'abroad', and that Rio de Janeiro was a person. No-one would suggest she was not a good lass, and I was so sorry when she died of cancer at such a young age. But how could a woman who had the benefit of full-time State education be so woefully ignorant?

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: leeneia
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 04:14 PM

Let's go back and analyze the first post, step by step.
============
'D'yer stop at Salfod preeky?' one asked.

Here's a person who has made the simple error of prouncing the c in 'precinct' as if it had a hard c rather than a soft c.

Why might a person do that?

1. Never heard it pronounced and is sounding it out wrong.

2. Is deaf or partially so.

3. Is autistic or similar.

4. Learned the pronunciation from someone else with similar problems.

None of this qualifies a person as stupid.
================

The driver (East European I think )looked blank for a minute so I translated

'She is asking if you go via Salford Precinct.'

This violates one of the basic rules of politeness in our culture. We don't speak of a person who is present in the third person. Not unless we are teasing or the person is a baby.

I'd give you odds of 9 to 1 that 'She is asking if you go via Salford Precinct' was spoken in an openly contemptuous tone.
============

'Oh, sorry' he replied 'No - You are better with the 37. It will be along soon.'

Well, she gave us both a look that could kill.

'Fuckin wogs. Can't even talk proper...'

They both stormed off amidst fits of giggles from most people in earshot.
============
I bet the giggles weren't giggles at all. They were sneers and sniggers. And I bet they preceded the exit. But I also bet they didn't come from most people. Just a few.   

And then the 'chavs' responded with the first rude things that came to mind.

I'm not surprised.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 04:48 PM

But how could a woman who had the benefit of full-time State education be so woefully ignorant?

I've heard blunders virtually as a daft as that on University Challenge - maybe it's a generational thing, great gaps of ignorance even in people who are pretty highly educated and intelligent.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 04:58 PM

Rapparee: "Shucks, we got a whole bunch of those up at the State House in Boise...."

What is even stupider, is the crooked lying politicians in Washington!..the only thing more stupider than them, is the fools and moronic clowns that believe their lies!!!...and get this!....even fight with each other, based on their deceptions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Both parties!!!
I think the obviousness is over the top, by now!
GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 05:22 PM

I'd give you odds of 9 to 1 that 'She is asking if you go via Salford Precinct' was spoken in an openly contemptuous tone.

I'll have a couple of grand on that. When do I collect my £18K? :-)

Now, I am not going to argue so I will just point the major flaw in the analysis.

I was there. You was not. Any attempt to analyse the event based on pure supposition is, I'm afraid, doomed to failure.

Now, in the spirit of friendship and understanding, I am happy to let anyone know that I have lived, worked, loved and played in Salford for almost 60 years. I know it's people. I know it's places. I know the majority of both are good. No, better than that, excelent. I also know it's flaws and will readily admit them. Including the vocal minority of anti-socialites. Now, can you explain on what basis your suppositions are made? Do you live in Salford? Do you know it's people? Were you on that bus? I realy do want to know.

Cheers

MP.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 05:24 PM

Oh - just out of interest - Solfod (note there is no 'r') preeky is the local accent. She had no speech impediment or learning difficulty. We all speak like that - Ever see Terry Christi'o'n (yes pronounced with an 'o') on the box? Someone who's first language is not English would be genuinely bemused. It has happend for years - Railway staff were once given an example of an elderly lancashire miner asking for a ticket. 'A munanadug t'ert bongs and bibluddyandy surry.' I know what he means. Would you? :-)

MP

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 05:32 PM

Damn - I knew I would forget something. Leeneia, rather than turn the thread into a confrontation which was never intended would you please PM me if you would like to continue. Thanks

MP.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 06:25 PM

For what it's worth, I worked in Salford for 15 years. The people I worked with were great - very warm-hearted and funny. Some of them had turned swearing into an art form - but none of them were chavs - they were mainly people from working class stock (like me) who had taken the trouble to get themselves a decent education. I've got absolutely nothing against Salford or Salfordians and I imagine the ratio of decent people to anti-social, wilful idiots is about the same as anywhere else.

And yes, I was probably a bit harsh re. my comments on markets - but I still think they're a bit dull these days. Unless, of course. you're prepared to spend £100 on a 100 grams of free-range, organic, teak and frangipani smoked Parma Ham with crushed Javanese peppercorns at a 'Farmers' Market'.

Subject: RE: BS: Some people are so stupid...
From: Lox
Date: 14 Apr 11 - 07:01 PM

Oh well, now that we've established how "they" behave (all of them) and we are clear about "their" attitude (identical in every case - because they aren't individuals with their own thoughts) and understand their motivation (uniform - homogenous - without merit or meaning) we can easily conclude that "they" bring it on themselves.

I'm very pleased that somebody enjoys a spot of black Shag.

I like Black Coffee.

What relevance does that have to Chavs?