BS: Bush's Opium War

Subject: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 02 - 01:33 PM

Kim Jong-il, dictator or North Korea, said "If they, ignorant of their rival, dare provoke a nuclear war, the army and people of the DPRK led by Kim Jong-il, the invincible commander, will rise up to mete out determined and merciless punishment to the U.S. imperialist aggressors with the might of single-hearted unity more powerful than A-bomb."

http://channels.netscape.com/ns/news/story.jsp?floc=FF-PLS-PLS&id=12240345000222492&dt=20021224034500&w=RTR&coview=

(Let me translate more precisely...North Korea's major export, opium, took a major hit from the Bush Drug Cartel's forced re-planting of opium in Afghanistan. The Taliban had nearly eradicated opium production, but U.S. marines helped distribute poppy seeds ASAP so the Bush Drug Cartel could diversify...expand from South American cocaine into Middle Eastern opium. And now, with the first new crop of Afghani opium hitting the markets, North Korea's income has just been cut in half. Farmers in North Korea can't grow anything BUT opium, under penalty of death, yet the country's GNP is suddenly half of what it was last year. And since Bush sold the North Koreans nuclear materials, why not use them? Clinton may have been bad, folks, but Bush...what can you say? He's gonna fight two major wars to protect his family's oil and opium interests and kill your kids to do it. And his old man is making money selling both sides armaments.)

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 29 Dec 02 - 01:38 PM

Please supply independent and verifiable documentation of your assertion of American promotion of the Afghan opium crop.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Dec 02 - 01:46 PM

There are no doubt interesting things to discuss and facts to share about North Korea, but a thread opened in this way by an obvious troll is no place to discuss them, I suggest.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 12:39 PM

I won't do your brainwork for you. I've made an assertion, and if you want to disprove it, go ahead. And in case you haven't noticed, the Bush family is now sending more American troops to Colombia to help the drug cartels down there drive their small competitors out of business. The Bushes are second and third cousins to the royal family of England. The drug activity is just a continuation of the old East India Trading Company activity carried out by the British in the 19th century to disseminate opium throughout the world. The Bushes are gangsters. They're now equating drugs with terrorism, while THEY control the CIA drug activity which puts the drugs on our streets. On Sept. 24, 2001, Rumsfeld said America would deal with the drugs in Afghanistan while we were over there, yet now we have a bumper crop of Afghani opium. We sure helped deal with it. The Bushes are using America's armed forces as mercenaries in a gang war to increase the family's drug profits. And one of the other gangs -- North Korea -- is now gearing up to produce a hundred nukes a year from the materials the Bushes Carlyle Group sold them.

Personally, I believe the Bushes are doing this in order to FORCE a two-front war. All our troops are being shipped overseas, and we already have foreign troops on the ground in the U.S., so when the Bushes start a war with Iraq, and the CIA commits another terrorist attack in the U.S., GWBush will have no choice but to call on Chinese and Russian troops to help restore order in the U.S. Only half of us will make us through that, but the remaining half will have plenty of government-prescribed opium to soothe our troubled minds.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: curmudgeon
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 01:05 PM

This "guest" must be Lyndon LaRouche or his clone, still wildly accusing Queen Elizabeth II of being the world's greatest drug dealer.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Amos
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 01:06 PM

Brainwork, schmainwork, Faceless One.

If you have facts on which to base your far-flung accusations, why not provide them? Otherwise, ya know, you sound somewhat...what can I say?....schizophrenic?

A

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 01:18 PM

You folks are either lazy or mindless defenders of the mass murderers of Sept. 11. The Bushes had plans to invade Iraq BEFORE GW ever took office. Oil and Opium and Cocaine and Armaments fuel the Bush Company, and you'd better wake up or it'll roll over you. All this is public record, and naysaying it won't make it go away. If you are Americans posting from within America, your kids will die in U.N. whorehouses because of your traitorous backing of the organized crime junta now fouling the air of the White House. Grow up so your children will be able to.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Amos
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 02:23 PM

Oh, my!! I had no idea the situation had gotten so bad. Thanks for the alert!

A

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: sadidlady
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 02:37 PM

i too am very much against all this war bullshit, and i can even believe that America might distribute opium poppy seeds in Afghanistan- but what kind of idiotic government would forbid its citizens to grow anything but opium? The N.Korean government may not be the most intelligent bunch of dictators, but nobody is that stupid.
Besides, to my knowledge, most of the worlds opium is produced in Kashmir and Southern Pakistan, and has been since the Opium Wars in China.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 03:06 PM

Kim Jong-il may be the most insane leader on the planet. He is only interested in a cash crop, and damn the people. North Koreans are resorting to cannibalism in order to survive, and they are fleeing north across the Chinese border in droves. And now the Bushes have cut into the country's main export. Do some searches at www.google.com for 'north korean farmers cannibalism', 'north korea farmers flee to china', etc. You might be surprised at what you find. And GWBush and his father are arming Kim Jong-il to the teeth through the Carlyle group and other companies.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Naemanson
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 03:58 PM

It's amazing what a fevered imagination can come up with. From my point of view Bush couldn't pour [expletive deleted] out of a boot if the instructions were written on the heel. However, this troll has come up with actions even I wouldn't ascribe to that bunch in the White House.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 05:17 PM

North Korean human rights
another view
and a bunch of stuff here

Guest, (if you are the one I think you are) ((from MN)) I've said it once and I'll say it again. I wish you would learn to do the blue clickie thing! I think you have some interesting views here.
Rustic

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's (fill in the blank) War
From: Donuel
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 05:28 PM

There are a few givens that are not conspiracy theories.

1. All governments lie and murder. (if Sweden is an exception let me know)

2. The loudest voice in the ear of government is the most profitable.

3. Dubya's daddy put Noreiga in power, then in jail only after drug profits were not distributed to his liking.

4. Yes the Afgan opium trade is reinstated.

5. If we want a regieme change of our own despite the Military Industrial Complex straglehold on our lives...

the rational approach, I think, is for enough concerned people to speak up and remind those in power whom they're supposed to be working for. It's not that those in power are stupid--it's that they work for the ones who pay them the most. When individuals join their power together to the point that they require attention, something will happen. Until then, money donations from corporations will call the shots, as they do today. I personally don't believe that personnel changes will accomplish much as long as the present system of who owns the government (corporations and lobbyists) operates.

http://www.commondreams.org/views02/1226-04.htm

http://thomhartman.com/unequalprotection.shtml

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Donuel
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 05:41 PM

...and if that does not work...then you have to kill their hit men and finally the small elite group of industrialist whores and dictators and their wives and children. But a revolution is not what this country was founded on...or so they would have you believe.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 09:43 PM

Well, I'm not from the fine state of MN, but I appreciate the links, and I appreciate all the serious thought posted above.

My problem with leading people to the stories themselves is that it kills initiative. If you launch a search for Korean cannibalism, maybe you'll end up with a story far more meaningful to you. So now I just contend that what I say is 'the truth' and challenge people to disprove it. It's what got GWBush the Republican nomination. McCain was about to mop up with him in South Carolina, and the Bush people started the rumor that McCain had an illegitimate child from a black prostitute. The Bush camp spread that rumor among South Carolina Republicans and then more or less told McCain to disprove it. And it won Bush the nomination, after which he decried such tactics. I mean, it works.

But you don't have to stretch too far for the outrageous when it comes to the Bushes. I mean, there's a big fuss over Clinton pardoning Marc Rich, but Bush # I pardoned 5-time convicted felon Poindexter, and you don't hear about that. Poindexter should have been executed for treason, but now he's threatening to snoop on 'every keystroke you make'.

The Bushes are the worst this country is capable of producing, and I'm saying this from deep in the heart of the Republican state of Texas. The Bushes should all be locked away, and their compound at Kennebunkport should be burned to the ground and the earth beneath it salted. It is the assigned task of the Bushes (assigned to them by the global banking cartel currently plotting a bloody transformation to a new feudal society), it is the task of the Bushes to destroy the American economy and American sovereignty.

Buy guns. Buy ammo. Say no to forced injections, because the Bushes have also been assigned the task of implementing U.N. population reduction programs.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Donuel
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 09:58 PM

When the first Bush was president I wondered what he meant when he said over and over again the phrase "the new world order".
I have a better idea of what he was saying now.
When his favorite saying to quell questions and investigations regarding his CIA and administration was "lets not keep asking who shot John" , I worried about what he meant.
Now I know.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST,Peach
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 11:04 PM

Gremmie! Mommie told you not to bother the nice people! Now get outside and feed them hogs like she done told you!

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST,John Lee Malvo
Date: 30 Dec 02 - 11:17 PM

Guns.... Ammo.... Population reduction.....
Sign me up!

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 31 Dec 02 - 12:40 PM

I keep telling you people not to feed these lunatic wackoids, they just might follow you home...

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST,Helen
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 12:12 PM

There is nothing lunatic about this thread. Iran-Contra was all about drugs, and the senior Bush ran that show. The CIA imports drugs to America and the Bush family has controlled the CIA for decades now. Calling people names doesn't change that fact.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: leprechaun
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 12:21 PM

As you can see, there are many people on this forum who are just as kooky as GUEST. Perhaps this GUEST should join the club and get a nickname, so as not ot be confused with the other GUESTs. May I suggest Dribbling Idiot?

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Amos
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 01:19 PM

Did Ollie know about the drugs? From the testimony I've read he thought he was trading missiles for money to send to the anti-communist Contra rebels of Nicaragua, in direct despite of the COngress. If you'd told him he was dealing drugs, he'd a been gone from there in a New York minute. Why didn't you TELL him, man??

:>)


A

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 01:32 PM

It is the nature of people to defend their established identity, and all the beliefs and opinions which make them what they typically are...and to deny or ridicule beliefs and opionions of a widely differing nature. Politicians take advantage of those tendencies, in order to divide and conquer the public, and they serve the highest bidder.

And so, we all play out the games we are already most familiar with...until those games blow up in our faces or until we die...or until we transform ourselves into more loving beings...whichever comes first. A trul loving being loves regardless of the circumstance, but that can only be done be realizing who you actually are...and who everyone else actually is.

All are well intentioned...according to their own understanding. All are capable of loving and useful conduct...through practicing love. All are also capable of grievous errors in judgement, and all are capable of unwittingly serving destructive forces of command...through giving in to fear.

It is plain to me that I live in a drug-obsessed, drug-pushing, drug dealing society, with a lot of legal drugs and a few illegal ones. It's a tossup as to which set of drugs, legal or illegal, yields the highest profit to the guys at the top. I don't think they much care, as long as the money rolls in. They are blinded by greed. They have no idea what existence is about.

GUEST, if you are fairly much on the mark, I can well understand why you would choose to remain anonymous...

If you're not so much on the mark, well, there are a number of other nightmare scenarios to consider which could also end this society as we know it...severe weather changes, comets, war, disease, planetary shift on its axis, alien invasion, biological warfare, economic collapse, starvation, shortage of pure water, overpopulation...

Take your pick. The bookstores and Internet are absolutely full of it. Ask Art Bell. He seems to be making a good living off such stories.

Nothing intrigues people as much as disaster.

But what does disaster have to do with your growth as a living soul, learning about life and embodying love? It could be an opportunity to demonstrate that love, I suppose, couldn't it?

Why should I obsess about death, when I WILL die anyway, regardless, and when I already HAVE died a few thousand times before this lifetime anyway???

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 02:52 PM

No speculation on this. The CIA-controlled government of this country has created a 'drug menace' in order to steal our rights. And if you roll over and accept it, you deserve whatever you receive.

Weed Watch: The Tampa, Fla., City Council is currently considering passage of an ordinance that would outlaw "drug dealer behavior." Under the proposed ordinance, flagging people down on the street, exchanging packages on the street, or getting in and out of more than one car on the same street would all become behaviors that could get you arrested, according to the Drug Reform Coordination Network. In a recent story on the proposed law, the Tampa Tribune wryly noted that the ordinance would be in sharp contrast to current law, which proscribes that police "must actually see the drug deal happen." Not surprisingly, the ordinance has the backing of the city's police. The Tampa council is expected to vote on the measure Jan. 16. -- J.S.

http://www.austinchronicle.com/issues/dispatch/2003-01-03/pols_naked2.html

That is in a Bush state. Jeb Bush. This is absolute, total tyranny, in our midst right now. And this is just a drop in the bucket. It is all around you, yet people say America is 'the greatest country ever', 'love it or leave it'...this is SOVIET Amerika, people. For Tampa to even CONSIDER this is an abomination.

And to love people like this (the ones who would inflict this kind of tyranny on you) is to hate your children. Even animals protect their young, yet most of America seems intent on embracing rather than facing tyranny the kind of garbage Tampa is going to vote on.   

Buy guns, buy ammo, love your family enough to fight for them. America's 'war on drugs' is nothing but a way to allow total Federal control over the drugs coming into the country, and now they're trying to extend that 'war' to prevent you from even walking down the street. Grow up. Buy guns.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 03:18 PM

I fairly much agree with your dark assessment of the CIA, GUEST. And I agree with your dark assessment of America. What are you planning to do about it?

Do you intend to launch another 1775 rebellion and fight it out in the streets with the government's hired guns? Those guys are well trained to kill people like you, and are good at doing it. They have the military's firepower to back them up.

So, I am asking you, what do you actually intend to do?

If it is an "honorable death" you are seeking, well, you have free will and that's your choice, and I won't criticize you for it. I did that in certain other lives...

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 03:47 PM

We wouldn't be fighting American troops. The twentynine palms survey conducted by the military 30 years ago showed that American troops couldn't be trusted to fire on Americans. So now our troops are stationed in 120 nations around the world, and more are being rushed out right now for the manufactured crisis in the Middle East. So the troops engaging American citizens will be foreign mercenaries. What would YOU do if you saw a Pakistani mercenary walking up to your door? Would you protect your family?

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 04:31 PM

Hello GUEST, What color is the sky on your planet? A thirty year old survey at a Marine Air Station about shooting other Americans?

You give an order to a Marine and he shoots, or his officer will.

"American troops can't be trusted to fire on Amaericans"... two words... Kent State ( some thirty-two years ago - ain't facts a bitch).

Now as for your delusions about CIA controlled governments and drug induced reductions of your Rights; I find it's more fun to read your hallucinations than to correct you...

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 07:06 PM

Gangs are by and large cowards whether they are cops or military. Put them in a uniform (and nowadays a ski mask) and they'll do a lot under cover of anonymity. Not mass-murder their countrymen though, the way the Bush Company is hoping for. And Kent state was National Guard...not real military. The Twentynine Palms survey has molded U.S. military recruitment and training practices for the past three decades. Not enough psychos in the armed forces, so an attempt has been made to correct that. But still Americans don't test well when asked whether they'd kill their grannies. That's why American troops are overseas and foreign troops are here. Sounds like you're a bit behind the times. Perhaps you should learn Chinese for 'Please cut my throat BEFORE you rape me.'

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Hrothgar
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 09:02 PM

Troll. Don't feed it.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Troll
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 10:19 PM

GUEST, just because you refuse a nickname, do you really think they find you?
And why in the world would they walk up to your door? They can simply wait until you come out to walk the dog and you'll be dead before your survivors hear the gunshot from the sniper a half mile away.
Have a nice day!

troll   ***Boy! Ain't I jolly today.***

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 10:52 PM

Who's worried about being 'found'? I only leave off a handle because someone will refuse to click on the post if they see a name they don't like.

But anyway, this illegitimate government holds no fear for me. With all the talk about the 'Echelon' snooping system and five-time convicted psycho-felon John Poindexter turning over all our information to the Pentagon, none of us is making out of here in one piece. And I'd rather go out speaking what I regard as the truth. Better a bullet in the head tomorrow than 20 years eating rats in a concentration camp. Screw em.

The USA PATRIOT Act is unconstitutional and does NOT have to be obeyed. GWBush does NOT have the power to grab your kids, declare them enemy combatants and execute them on the spot, no matter HOW many Executive Orders he signs. What the hell is wrong with you people? In America, any law which contradicts the Constitution is null and void UPON IT'S PASSAGE.

The last major hurdle to the hundred feudal concerns trying to take over the world right now (big-money concerns like the Sicilian Mafia, the Eurpoean royal families, the Russian mafia, the American bankers and armaments companies...all of which have pooled their assets behind the U.N.), the last major hurdle to world domination by these people is the U.S. Constitution. And all the Constitution does is outline rights...that's all. It doesn't 'give' rights...it just enumerates them. We're born with them. No one can take them. That's what the document says, and it is so absolute and simple in it's statement that it terrifies the people trying to destroy it. They KNOW it is worth fighting and dying for, and the globalists have no core value to equal the Constitution. Money? Plunder? Not good enough. The U.S. Constitution is the greatest document ever conceived by humankind. The people who fight for it are going to make the most formidable army the world has ever seen.

So let them 'find' me and take my right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. There are HALF A BILLION weapons in private hands in this country, and a LOT of people like me who KNOW our government had a hand in Sept. 11 in order to crush the Constitution. I fully expect to die for what I'm typing right now, but between now and then I'll pass on something to someone that will light some fuse somewhere. America will never fall. Millions and millions of us are too pissed off. And YOU are going to get sucked into the maelstrom eventually, so get over your fear now. Immediately. Without our Constitution, we have nothing. And without it, I don't want to live.

I'll go walk my dog now. The Constitution allows me to move about freely and carry a pistola as I do it, after I've said what I damn well want to say.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Troll
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 11:47 PM

You're scared.
You wouldn't be trying so desperatly to get your message out if you weren't; wouldn't be trying so hard to rally support of any kind to your cause- whatever it is- if you weren't scared shitless.
So strap on your pistol and walk your dog and pray to God that you don't get jumpy and blow some poor bastard who's out jogging away 'cause you thought he was one of "them", whoever they are.
Your arguments are of the "potatos are poison 'cause everyone who ate 'em in 1850 is now dead" variety. You string together a batch of marginally related "facts" and come up with your reason for living; a vast conspiracy.
Oh well. Everyone needs a hobby.
Mine's collecting eggcups.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST,Frances
Date: 04 Jan 03 - 02:09 AM

He doesn't sound very scared to me. Or her.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Troll
Date: 04 Jan 03 - 03:28 AM

Sheer bravado. Whistling in the graveyard.
See how easy it is?

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Pied Piper
Date: 04 Jan 03 - 07:16 AM

O dear, O dear, O dear.
Another pointless thread.
I wonder if Amos will be providing us with facts to back up his belief in Reincarnation soon?

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Jan 03 - 01:36 PM

Not fear and not bravado. Panic is what you are probably picking up on. Time is short. 3 one-million bed concentration camps have just been finished...just in time for the invasion of Iraq and the consequential release of bioweapons in the U.S. And meanwhile, public schools are securing entryways so, in the event of another Columbine, the panic button will lock every door. The next time there is a Columbine, hundreds will probably die, and people will be told by the media there is no answer except to give up our guns. In violation of the Second Amendment. And Americans have become so ignorant and corrupt and comfortable, no one will squawk much about giving up their neighbor's guns.

So yeah, there's a bit of panic involved. See, since Sept. 11 I've studied enough to learn that my Democratic Party affiliation was leading to my own destruction. Watch one of the wildlife shows...the Crock guy, one of those. Everything is 'endangered' and 'protected'. Kids are being taught that humans are bad and need to be herded up and placed in compact cities. Meanwhile, the Sierra Club becomes the largest non-governmental land owner in the U.S. And in Austin (my area), the city council grabs land for 'protection', then some new 'findings' come out and the protected land suddenly has a shopping mall on it. My point is, the Democratic Party has been co-opted by the land-grabbers. And Democrats aren't even aware of it. Just like gun-rights people aren't aware the NRA and GWBush are working to deprive us of our right to bear arms.

So when everyone at the national level is violating his or her oath to protect, serve and defend the Constitution, what are you going to do?

You speak out.

And I seem to have the advantage over a lot of you, because once you realize the truth about how you have been manipulated by your leaders...realize it and ADMIT you've been had...then you never have to feel that shame again. You can begin working to change things. Whereas those of you who KNOW something is wrong (why are the Bushes trying to overthrow the democratically-elected President of Venezuela? Why are the Bushes pushing us into an Iraqi war 75% of Americans are against? Why won't the Bushes allow an investigation of Sept. 11? How did they 'find' 90 million half-century-old doses of Smallpox vaccine in France? If we are at war, why are the borders wide open? Why did 'smaller government' GWBush Federalize schools with national testing, Federalize churches with 'faith based initiatives', Federalize local police with Homeland Security?), once you admit both sides of the political spectrum are working to enslave and eradicate you through mis-direction and illegal activities, you never have to look for explanations again. Everything becomes clear when you bite the bullet and acknowledge the fact that our puppet government is serving non-American interests intent of destroying America.

While on the other hand, those of you who refuse to accept the obvious, you have to rationalize a hundred times a day. And the media has to keep lying to you to keep those rationalizations in place. Why were the NORAD jets held on the ground 75 minutes Sept. 11? You won't hear discussion of that on the news...they'll feed you to the gills on the 'sniper' attacks. They'll tell you how to stuff a turkey at Thanksgiving. And if they DO mention the NORAD smoking gun, they'll only tell you the general in charge that day was promoted so he can have more control to prevent another Sept. 11, and you'll go back to sleep.

And it seems to be working, by and large, so yeah, there's a bit of panic. You need to wake up.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Jan 03 - 01:39 PM

www.infowars.com

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Jan 03 - 03:22 PM

Interesting stuff, GUEST. I found the Opium connections in Afghanistan and N.Korea particularly so. I've also been wondering about the Venezuela thing...Venezuela is one of the biggest oil-producing countries in the World, and I find it odd that it is the middle and upper class people (those who have the most already) who are protesting against Chavez...instead of the poor people (whom one would think would have the most reason to protest an oppressive system, wouldn't one?). Very mysterious. Sounds like someone from outside pulling the strings to me.

I have never seen a modern country with a supposedly democratic system that was more perfectly inclined by its nature and psychology to be taken over from within by a fascist (or, if you prefer, "communist") dictatorship...than is the USA. The USA is, and for a long time has been, a scary place...where "freedom" is talked about endlessly, while being subverted and taken away at the same time by the most extraordinary forms of hypocrisy and media manipulation from the top.

I suspect that there will be one more LARGE and very nasty "terrorist" attack on American soil (only it won't truly be put in motion by the foreign terrorists it will be blamed on, but by someone on the inside), and that will serve as the pretext to allow Mr. Bush and his power structure to do, basically, pretty much what Hitler did in Germany after the burning of the Reichstag. One problem...the destructive capability of corporate America far outreaches that of Nazi Germany in the 30's and 40's...they didn't have nuclear weapons, smart bombs, and the logistical ability to strike globally and massively at any nation on Earth...and they were not the only Superpower of their day, but just one of several.

About my prediction for that next attack...I hope I am wrong.

If it happens, I will avoid the USA just as scrupulously as I would have avoided Nazi Germany after 1933, but I wonder...will any corner of the World be safe any more? I live in Canada, and as I've said before, Canada is much too close to the USA. Matter of fact, we're just seen as a branch plant of corporate America, and we will be tolerated as long as we serve the big red, white, and blue machine and do exactly what we are told to do. If not, we will be taken over by quite unsubtle means...whatever it takes to cement total control.

By the way, I will say to you what I would say to anyone who expects to find himself on a battlefield soon...

God be with you. And I would say that to anyone. I value people fully for what they are. Their intrinsic worth is far greater than most of them realize.

- LH

Subject: What if Abe could see us now???
From: Donuel
Date: 04 Jan 03 - 08:39 PM

Ahh the ol gang is back lilhawk Amos and the uninvited guest among others...

I was wondering what good ol Abe would think of the Bush dynasty.
How would Lincoln feel about the now GOP now if he were still alive?
I am not as eloquent or educated as Mr. Lincoln but when has that ever stopped me .....

..................................................................

Lately we have been fooled most of the time but I still believe It can't be done all the time.

I see that 60 acres and a mule was never delivered.
I am sorry for those who are still waiting,
but it is time to move on.
You have earned more than this country has returned you, and for your perseverance, I thank you,
history thanks you.

For all those descendents of the great civil war, this great nation may call upon you to serve in its next great mission.
I ask you to first ask yourselves
"whose God and country is the current president talking about??".
Being duped by those that are already duped is for sheeple and not a free people.

What do I really think of our leaders and GOP today?
They have become the tyrants we once defeated.

Like seafoam these arguments flow in and out but the beach remains. But now a storm is coming and even this beach will be in peril with weapons unimagined in our great civil war.

I am secure in the fact we know who we are. Looking at the results of a plan to dominate the US by any means possible I am saddened. Its not like we really don't know who committed all the desperate assassinations of the 60's. I did not know mine however. Victims seldom do.

I hear the former George Bush didn't fool the most underprivileged either. His greatest achievement was not Operation Desert Storm but the LA riots. Washington DC is ripe for such riots today. The average reading ability is only 3rd grade in DC. The unemployment is high, more people have less to lose and no right to vote for a Senator or Congressman.

These are nervous times.

Vice President Cheney is dancing around like a spider on a hot plate and is digging a bunker under his home in DC.
He has advised FEMA that it may quarantine city populations with the use of the Army to counter "small pox" like outbreaks.
The current presidential dynasty has a free "do over" granted by Rhenquist to "get it right" this time. You can bet they have contingency plans they missed the first time around.

After all... multi billionaire fortunes and multi trillion dollars are at stake. All the mergers that can happen have now happened in industry, oil and of course every branch of the media.
These monopolies do not benefit the average man.
The main job of the media now is getting the average man to support the corporate and government crimes committed against him.

In this country, exactly who are the dupes?:
some are the white nazis like the KKK, some are arrested at adolescence for all their life. and some claim their love is a divine wisdom ,yet lust for executions and war, and the rest are the good people who have chosen to remain silent.

They are led by one issue at a time under the banner of God and country. They are told they are the elite. The right is mobilized by one issue politics like guns or abortion. They are told they are morally higher than everyone else, they are told they will get a tax break and they fall for it every time.
With the mandate of a court determined election the talk radio right struts about stammering that their majority rules, their morality is sacrosanct and only their patriotism counts - others may simply be traitors or at least suspect.

The right really is more than the sum of its duped parts.
It is for God and country in the name of nameless corporations.

The so called left wing opposition to these corporations*
(*businesses that owe no allegiance or taxes to this nation)
can be fooled as well.
There are bigots for the left and those that embrace a fictitious political correctness as to not offend, and in the end become offensive in that effort.
The left is everyone that is sick of the rip off,
not just a segment of socialists or any group with a name or banner,
but the entire Spectrum of the people.

Just imagine a government by the people
for the people

and not just corporations.

Including republicans that understand the moral bankruptcy of CEO white house connections.

Including single parents who gladly take education vouchers not because they hate public education but because there are too many guns in the urban schools.

Including the elderly that see all the breaks given to drug companies but none for them as hmos and monopoly pricing leaves them choosing between food or medication.

Including veterans who have now witnessed the republican president and Supreme Court deny them all the health benefits they were promised prior to going to war.

Including anyone who believes the USA has the might to defend itself without selling its entire economy to Lockheed, star wars 2, and GE while erecting the largest police state to ever infest this country.

Fair minded people have been called the opposition, whackos and much worse. But no matter what we are called...
We are more than the sum of our parts.

We are about to witness another war very similar to our last war that in no small way helped kindle the hatred leading to 9-11 although 9-11 is already so convoluted with unanswered questions, that some say it makes the Warren Commission pale in comparison.


My dear Americans:
Guard against any feeling of powerlessness, brace yourself against CNN claims of victory with the aid of animations, maps and retired generals while the stars and stripes play.

The world is watching. They may see more than we will be allowed to see.
A well informed pulic is the foundation of democracy.
A well informed public is our national security.
An ill informed public is an intentional criminal act.
But ignorance is no excuse for you or anyone.
Some of the world believes all Americans have blood on their hands.
The rational know better and see how easy people have been duped for thousands of years.

Yes during the civil war I suspended Haebeus Corpus for a time.
But I did not ask for an ongoing war for all time,
I did not suspend the bill of rights indefinitely.

I only ask that fellow Americans give no aid to the enemy, foreign or domestic. I ask that you consider that some of the domestic enemies may be oily politicians with a grand design who no longer ask you for sacrifice but demand it.

We are now on the march across the sea.

The countdown to war drones on.

The might and fight of the right may have bitten off more than they can chew.

So I encourage you to remove the princely and mentally impoverished presidential imposter.
Remove this vestige of his CIA father from the White House.

George says "I get to decide, not you"

Do not be duped.

YOU GET TO DECIDE
NOT HIM.

They have stolen the name of my grand old party

Do not let them steal the nation.




.....................................................

The Homeland Address:

The concept of a faith based fundamentalist government will attract many devout and religious people.
God bless you all, but it is the oldest and most insidious con game.
America was an experiment to rest authority on the unalienable rights of man and not a religion or king.

This faith based con game demeans religion by elevating it for the manipulation by war lords
and not the lord.

Even in the face of facts there are those that will virtually worship a warlord President and do not know they are duped.

When the duped are proven wrong they retreat to their faith and defend their position.

They retreat to their guns.

When the polite barriers are broken down
when even the law does not deliver justice
all that is left is might makes right.

and that my friends is war.

On our own or foreign shores
The shore where truth and freedom
are dashed by the storm of intolerence.

preserve the truth.

Preserve our nation.




Abrahakman Lincoln

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jan 03 - 03:35 PM

I enjoyed both the above entries. As far as the Venezuela connection...

A year ago the Bush junta recognized an illegal government in Venezuela. The duly-elected president (a Marxist) was out of the country and the military staged an 'overthrow'. But then the president came back, asked what was going on and returned to the job.

The problem was, the White House recognized the new government IMMEDIATELY. Within a couple of hours. They recognized the leaders of the coup as the official government of Venezuela. They actually tried to deny it later, but it's so ON THE RECORD that it was one of the first big indicators of the lengths to which Bush / Cheney would go to for oil manipulation.

Venezuela is one of the OPEC nations, and 15% of U.S. oil imported comes from there. AND, the president of Venezuela is currently the head of OPEC (rotating post). So the Bushes, while BS'ing the world about 'democracy', assisted the military in their overthrow of the president with money and intelligence and then rewarded the efforts of the coup leaders with official 'recognition'.

Technically, the Bush actions were 'in the interest' of the U.S. Bush was already planning to go to war with Iraq and needed a secure Western Hemisphere oil supply, but you DON'T behave like that and then lie about it when it is SO PUBLIC. Our leaders need to treat us like adults and ASK us if our oil is worth overthrowing democracies to us.

So now, currently, the Bush Company is pouring money into Venezuela again to foment dissatisfaction. The harbors have been blocked so no oil can be exported, and Bush and Cheney are responsible. They want Americans willing to back ANY atrocity in order to get the price of gas at the pump back down.

By the way, the interview here:

http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=78&row=1

may be the biggest story of the past century. This guy defected from the World Bank (after winning the Nobel Prize for Economics), and he explains how the world works. The World Bank puts pressure on countries like Argentina and Venezuela, plans depressions and riots...and the Bushes work for this plan. GW made phone calls from the White House while his Daddy was President...helped set up the destruction of Argentina...and now they're doing this to the U.S.

And did you know Bush (who is trying now to come up with a 'reason' for war with Iraq) had plans even before going into the White House for this war? It's not about Weapons of Mass Destruction, etc.:

http://www.sundayherald.com/27735

As far as Lincoln....I think he and the Founding Fathers would weep. World War 2 and Korean War veterans have just had their medical benefits cut off. They agreed to a contract to serve, in exchange for medical treatment afterwards, and that has just been deleted. Our forefathers would puke. And rightly so. The proof that THIS IS NO GOVERNMENT OF AMERICANS is everywhere, but that particular bit of proof...the withdrawal of benefits to veterans...what more proof do you need?

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Little Hawk
Date: 05 Jan 03 - 04:21 PM

Well said, brother. The North American public has been robbed blind over the last 3 or 4 decades, their jobs have been exported overseas, their elections and political parties have been stolen or rendered meaningless, their governments' covert agencies have become drug lords and assassins, and the rest of the World has had even worse things done to it (such as invasion and mass murder in some places and virtual economic slavery in many more), just so a few very rich men could become even richer and increase their stranglehold over all the material gains they seek in this world. These are men who have allegiance to no nation and to no people, and certainly not to your United States Constitution.

Unbelievable. Even Stalin didn't think this big, although he certainly had the general inclination to. And even King George IIIrd of England was not this mad.

- LH

Subject: BS: Bush's Satanic Motivations
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 03 - 08:00 PM

An April 10 Reuters press release (www.reuters.com) indicates that a biotechnology company, ProdiGene®, College Station, TX (www.prodigene.com), through a grant from the National Institutes of Health (NIH), has produced a transgenic corn variety that contains a protein found on the surface of HIV, the virus that causes AIDS....

http://www.agcom.purdue.edu/AgCom/Pubs/GQ/GQ_47/gqtf47.html

------

I personally don't believe in the Biblical view of the world, but some people claim the folks running the world DO have a Biblical view. And this leads to one of the more interesting explanations as to why the U.S. government and the governments of some other countries have been behaving the way they have lately.

We are on the brink of an engineered world economic collapse, plague and Armageddon, and it has been contrived in large part by the Executive Branch of the United States government. But why? Some say stupidity, some say greed, and some say insanity.

But if you acknowledge the FACT that the people in control of the Executive Branch right now are DOCUMENTED Skull and Bones members, another explanation makes more sense than any of the above.

The Skull and Bones society is an elite group of former Yale University graduates. They have sworn allegiance to Satan and committed their lives to serving him. The Skull and Bones compound on the Yale University grounds is used for many rituals, one of which is the dedication of the members' children to Satan. George Bush I dedicated his infant son GW Bush to Satan on the grounds of Yale University.

The Skull and Bones crowd believes in the Biblical view of the world, only, they pray to Satan. And they believe they are Satan's soldiers in a war with God. So this group of Satanistic soldiers is doing everything it can right now to destroy 'God's Creation'. I mean, this genetic manipulation CANNOT be controlled. It WILL destroy Creation as we know it...some say as God made it.

I personally don't think this will lead to a showdown between God and Satan and a return of Jesus and all that, but the people in the White House DO believe such a confrontation is coming. So they allow mutated genes to be released into our environment while they pray to Satan. They think they can anger God and force him into a battle by tinkering with his handiwork, and all the while they are praying to Satan because they believe he will win that battle and reward them.

So the newly-arisen chaos in the world now makes sense if you take all this into consideration. The CIA -- an extension of occult German Nazism -- is INTENTIONALLY trying to destroy God's handiwork in order to force a final spiritual battle.

------

...Nexia scientists put spider genes in mammal cells to make their version of the silk. The company now has genetically modified goats that will produce the protein in their milk...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/1760059.stm


Companies have created animals that make human drugs in their milk... Thousands of other research projects along similar lines are under way...

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/08/21/1029114137169.html

...First of all the crops will have to be harvested and destroyed. The rogue seeds contain an antibiotic gene - controversial because of the danger of a gene transfer to bacteria in the guts of animals and humans - who could then develop immunity to antibiotics used to treat diseases such as meningitis, gonorrhoea and tuberculosis...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/gmdebate/Story/0,2763,775891,00.html

(Do a websearch...www.google.com...for things like 'ProdiGene contamination', 'Monsanto Rumsfeld genetics', etc., and you'll be shocked at how out-of-hand things are. Tens of thousands of uncontrolled splicing experiments going on. Makes you wonder.)

---

Multiple Bush threads combined.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Satanic Motivations
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 03 - 08:07 PM

GO AWAY YOU STUPID TROLL! THIS IS A MUSIC SITE!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Satanic Motivations
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Jan 03 - 08:16 PM

"Heave Ho! Devil in the garden
Devil in the garden a'roving"

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Satanic Motivations
From: Amos
Date: 07 Jan 03 - 08:23 PM

Jeeze, guest, for such a vocabulary you certainly act like a slow learner. Does the phrase "get a life" mean anyting to you?

A

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 03 - 09:13 PM

Sorry to be too complex. Let me boil it down...THEY ARE GENE SPLICING HIV INTO YOUR CORN! You are being prepared as a huge blood sacrifice to Satan by the people running the world, whether YOU believe it or not. THEY believe it, and they WANT you to strum that gitar and watch those sit-coms while they distribute nuclear arms and bioweapons. And a big part of that sacrifice apparently has to do with you KNOWING that you are to be slaughtered (must be more pleasing to the nostrils of Satan, or something), so that's why all the preparations for the upcoming sacrifice are being carried out in plain view. Tens of thousands of unregulated gene-tampering experiments going on in the world now...unregulated, yet they regulate your freaking car and dog. Why? They WANT things to go haywire. The ruling elite have their bunkers with underground water supplies and food stocks and could not care less what happens to you. You are just sacrificial meat to them.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: Donuel
Date: 07 Jan 03 - 09:37 PM

So thats what all that corn in the X file movie was about

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 03 - 09:56 PM

Don't know. Didn't see it. The X-files, in some people's opinion, was a major distraction. The word 'Conspiracy' is now linked to 'theory' permanently in large part due to the X-files. The FBI is on the case, but nothing is ever really proven. And Muldar is a little bit...off, isn't he?

I play the guitar and I like sci-fi, so I'm not trashing anyone on this forum, but we've been duped, people. American science went underground 50 years ago, and the things already developed are beyond what we can even have nightmares about. Look up H.R.2277 on the thomas.gov website. The bill to outlaw space-based weapons. Psychotronic, tectonic, climatic weapons. They feed us just enough to dazzle us...a little faster computer each year, new surgical techniques...but the Bushes travel around in space planes. Look it up. The Aurora. We never abandoned space planes in favor of vertical take-off rocketry. We developed both. And now the Aurora can fly around the world in 3 hours and leave the atmosphere. So what's real and what's not? You tell me.

As far as the people CONTROLLING this technology, I know for a FACT they are evil. They have the life-extending technologies, and they want it all for themselves. The U.N. goal is 500,000,000 people worldwide. Half a billion. Just enough to tend the global plantation.

They don't need our creativity anymore...they have their cloning and wonder drugs, and the computers can now create the rest. So, while they're getting us out of the way, I believe they're going to try to rack up a few points with the guy that made it all possible for them (in their belief system). Just sacrifice us all to Satan and they'll live happily ever after. It is the only explanation of the current contrived apocalyptic scenario which makes sense.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Jan 03 - 12:29 AM

Oh, and have a nice day.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush's Opium War
From: GUEST,Forum Lurker
Date: 08 Jan 03 - 01:06 AM

Just one small objection to this whole "HIV corn" thing you've been ranting about for the last week. You DO realize that a substantial part of the HIV genome is present in all multi-cellular organisms, don't you? Any protein found on the surface of an HIV viral coat is more than likely also found on half of the cells in the human body, and probably serves a simialr purpose. A virus is just too simple to have any particularly unique proteins. Besides, if Dubya really wants to destroy the world, a nuclear launch is easier, faster, more complete, and just as survivable as uncontrolled bio-warfare.

As to Satanism being the cause of this supposed armageddon: why wouldn't a Christian want to force the final conflict? I mean, once Satan is defeated (as Christian theology asserts will be the case) all of the good Christians get to live in eternal paradise. Who wouldn't want that?