Terry Wogan plays folk!

Subject: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Lurking guest
Date: 18 Sep 09 - 12:45 PM

I was listening to Terry Wogan on radio two on my way to work yesterday (Thursday)(no cd player...) and heard someone called Camilla something sing 'She Moved Through the Fair'. Terry was in raptures. You can still catch it on the playbacks - about 1hour 47 minutes into the programme. Apparently they played it on Tuesday as well.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00mngbd/Wake_Up_to_Wogan_17_09_2009/

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 18 Sep 09 - 01:53 PM

oh dear. what next? will wogan join our happy mudcat bunch?

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: doc.tom
Date: 18 Sep 09 - 03:11 PM

Well he'll have to do something when he retires!

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 18 Sep 09 - 03:13 PM

He's got a track record for playing folk records... he's even played Show of Hands!

LTS

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 09 - 04:05 PM

Camilla Kerslake.

Website here http://www.camillakerslake.com/

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Jim McLean
Date: 18 Sep 09 - 07:36 PM

In 1966 when I was the road manager for the Dubliners, Terry Wogan often came around the pub to drink with the lads.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Leadfingers
Date: 18 Sep 09 - 07:42 PM

There is a lot of decent music on radio 2 - Even Mike Harding plays the occasional folk track

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 18 Sep 09 - 07:50 PM

Didn't Mr W once have a hit with the Helston Fuury Dance?

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 18 Sep 09 - 11:32 PM

He did I reckon I thought I could hear the peculiar tone of cornet ,clarinet and big trombone !
He has also played a lot of music that wouldn't have gotten any air time
otherwise,not just folk.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 04:28 AM

Wogan, like the late lamented John Peel, always insisted that he had control of his playlist, and thus, like Peel, could play what took his fancy.

We need more like them, and I can't think of any current DJs who do that, other than Gerry anderson on Northern Irish (Belfast?) Radio.

Don T.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 04:39 AM

Eeek! I find that record nauseatingly syrupy and over produced - in fact it destroys the *song* for me.
Be perfect soundtrack to some schmaltzy Disney production though.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: melodeonboy
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 06:02 AM

Hmmm. So in the midst of oceans of musical dross, Mr. Wogan has found time to play a song by (radio-friendly) Show of Hands and a rather uninspiring version of She Moved Through The Fair.

Not impressed. Nul points!

"Even Mike Harding plays the occasional folk track"

Good one, Leadfingers !

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 10:46 AM

I didn't like the Baby Cam rendition either.

I have heard She Moved Through The Fair by a number of different performers. With the exception of Growler's parody, I had become sick to death of it.

Though I believe Crow Sister's version could rejuvenate my early love for that song.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Stower
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 11:06 AM

This is interesting as, on Desert Island Discs, Terry was asked if he would take any traditional Irish music and he said the thought horrified him!

Perhaps this was hyperbole on Terry's part? Or maybe he just likes the odd rare track, despite himself?

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 11:15 AM

"Baby Cam" Wot's that mean?

Maybe SMTtF is possibly a tricky song for singers to treat with freshness, simply because it's been done and done over and again. Knowing nowt about folk song myself, I'd never even heard of it till I learned it off 'Pretty Woman' Julia Roberts singing it in that scene in the 'Michael Collins' flick!

I probably wouldn't bother with it now if it weren't for sentimental reasons relating to my Mother, as it is a tad too gooey for my tastes - even without the violins.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Leadfingers
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 12:05 PM

I wonder what will happen to Radio 2's listener figures when Mr Wogan retires and the Ginger Whinger takes over the slot !

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 12:05 PM

Baby Cam = the Camilla (Disney) version for children.

I think your voice would bring it back to the way it should be performed. Raw!

I was considering trying to put a bluesy slant on it. Nah!



Re loose comparison of Wogan to John Peel!?!?

Sacrilege to put those two names in the same thread much less sentence.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Les from Hull
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 12:17 PM

Not exactly performed in a folk style, though. Sounds like another opera singer ruins a folk song.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 01:26 PM

Not only SMTtF was not anyhow learned from tradition [Margaret Barry, the Irish traveller who energetically intro'd it to the London scene in the 1950s, asked in an interview if she had learned it traditional-style on her travels, cheerfully admitted "Oh no; I got it off a gramophone record by Count John McCormack"]; but the 'cornet, clarinet, big trombone' 1930s-pop-rewrite *'Floral Dance'* bears scant resemblance to the genuine ('John the Bon went marching on') 'FURRY Dance' song as traditionally sung at Helston. So just how 'folk' anything Wogan ever actually played on his show seems to me highly debatable.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 01:42 PM

Wogan once featured a live interview with a mudcatting person during which Jour d'Eté was played on concertina (very nice but not exactly f*lk whatever that is). He did remark when the tune was over that he thought it would never finish though.

FWIW, Mark Radcliffe often plays tracks from the Smoothops end of the genre. But if you're looking seriously for English trad on the BBC, R2 is scarcely the place to look. R3 & 4 are considerably more fruitful.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Irene M
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 02:34 PM

I thought it was a rather odd version. Not only did it miss out the fourth verse, but it had managed to completely remove the ghost element of the story.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,AndyC
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 02:45 PM

Actually if you want more traditional folk music via the radio it's far more fruitful to try BBC Radios Scotland, Wales or Ulster, or RTE's Irish stations - all available online or through Sky Digital - than any of Radios 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 or 7.

Unfortunately the BBC seems to think that things ENGLISH and traditional just means 'Last Night of the Proms' stuff.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Dennis the Elder
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 03:36 PM

Many will disagree, but the best version of She Moves Through the Fair is by Sam and Joe Brown on one of Joes Cds.
It puts all other versions in the shade. Unfortunatly I believe not too many Folk enthusiasts have listened to it.
I would be interested to know how many Mudcatters have!

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 03:48 PM

I haven't heard it, nor of it.`But I find it difficult to credit that anything could ever surpass the way Davy Graham did SMTtF.
I return to this thread only to note that it may not have been Wogan but his holiday relief who made the remark about Jour d'Eté. However, English trad remains scattered throughout BBC schedules (R3 & 4 in particular), sometimes even correctly attributed, as it ought to be as an integral part of English cultural representation.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Phil Edwards
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 03:52 PM

Maybe SMTtF is possibly a tricky song for singers to treat with freshness, simply because it's been done and done over and again.

I dunno. Not really knowing whose records to buy (and being a cheapskate) for quite a while I learned songs from lyrics in the public domain, supplemented by 30-second snippets from record company sites. In this case I only heard the first verse and half of the second. And so it was that I sang SMTTF in a form which I think nobody else has ever sung it in, viz. with repeats:

My young love...

She stepped away from me...

The people were saying...

She stepped away from me...

Last night in my bedroom...

She stepped away from me...

Worked pretty damn well, if I say so myself. But I stopped doing it after realising that everyone else sang it straight through - I genuinely hadn't realised.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Edthefolkie
Date: 19 Sep 09 - 06:56 PM

Not only did Margaret Barry get that song off a John McCormack record but the words were written by Padraig Colum. Bit difficult nailing down folk songs innit?

My vote for best version goes to Sandy Denny and the Fairports, Davy Graham coming up on the rails, but I must investigate Sam and Joe Brown.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: breezy
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 04:32 AM

Was it not T W that promoted Eva Cassidy

Terry will be missed

There will be much floundering when he goes

he is irreplaceable.

There's usually a 'folk' element in most of his progs. By that . a song worth listening to.

Worth setting the alarm a clock for 7.30

and as for Janet and John !!!

Tog on everyone

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 04:42 AM

sung it in, viz. with repeats:

Pip, now that sounds interesting and definitely more engaging for the audience or sing around members who have heard it done to death.

Gimme that good old "folk process."

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: scouse
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 04:42 AM

One also has to remember Terry W. played the Furies way back when and gave them their first big hit in England with "When You Where Sweet Sixteen."
As Aye,
Phil.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Chris Murray
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 05:18 AM

Beth Nielsen Chapman thanked Wogan from the Cambridge stage for playing her stuff and helping her to become popular in the UK. It may not be folk - but it's a step in the right direction.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: melodeonboy
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 07:12 AM

That wouldn't have been the Radio 2 stage at Cambridge by any chance, would it????

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Ray
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 07:32 AM

Nothing new - he played our version of "Planxty Irwin" several times in the 80's
Ray

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 08:07 AM

""Re loose comparison of Wogan to John Peel!?!?

Sacrilege to put those two names in the same thread much less sentence.""

I think you misunderstood my point Tam.

Since the sixties, almost all mainstream radio DJs have walked into the studio, and been handed a playlist by the producer, comprising almost entirely what the music industry wanted to plug.

That is the main reason why we've been subjected to years of "pop" music which owed its success to massive airtime obtained through the death grip of the record companies on radio and TV exposure, rather than to any intrinsic musical value.

Wogan and Peel had one thing (and only one thing) in common.

Both of them steadfastly refused to accept ANY outside control over their choice of playlist.

Peel regularly inserted folk performances into his programming. Wogan, less so, but they are there if you choose to look. Both were popular enough to make it stick

I mentioned Gerry Anderson in Northern Ireland, and forgot the one other that I know of, who is cut from the same cloth, and that is Frank Hennesy on Welsh radio.

I have to agree with Andy C above, that regional radio does turn up more folk, though perhaps not more English music.

The problem is that Auntie Beeb is tending to ditch local services, and with them, much which relates to folk.

Don T.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Betsy
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 09:03 AM

Christy Moore was on Wogan's TV shows at time or two - I believe they both came through the ranks of Irish banking (would you believe?) , but whether the same bank I know not.
Wogan knew his place in the BBC and his listener-base and didn't seem take unreasonable risks to allienate the majority of his listeners, who basically just wanted easy listening popular music, but I can imagine that he was asked on occasions by his closer friends , why don't you put a bit of the ould Irish in your programme . I can't think where I was working, but it was one of those places where lots of people had portable radios,and Wogan was the preferred listening. He insisted on playing (it seemed on a daily basis for months), a song something of the like "Do you want your ould lobby washing down" , which drove me fucking nuts.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Guest John Hartford
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 02:11 PM

hi breezy

You are right that TW "found" Eva Cassidy ( although she had died before he did so).And if the true was known it was "Paully" Walters who brought Eva to TW's attention.

He also brought a lot of "folksy" and Countryish music to the BBC.

I can think of Mary Chapin Carpenter, Nanci Griffith, Mary Black and even "Little Wizened Willy Nelson" as only a few of the many that he brought to main-stream listeners.

For me at any rate he introduced Katie Meluha when I would not have heard her anywhere else.

As for the main thrust of this thread I think that Camilla Kerslake makes a very good fist of Slowly She Moves Through the Fair.

Many traditional folk songs have been "resurrected" and up-dated and many died-in-the-wool folkies don't appreciate it, could it be that what they don't like is the word COMMERCIALISM ??

However songs like these do help people to find folk music and look for more.

Camilla is IMHO being groomed as a clear competition for Katherine Jenkins, and that can't be a bad thing.

Cheers

John

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: melodeonboy
Date: 20 Sep 09 - 03:28 PM

'Many traditional folk songs have been "resurrected"'

Oh, I wasn't aware that they'd died!

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Chris Murray
Date: 21 Sep 09 - 04:50 AM

No, Melodeon Boy, it was the main stage.

Anyway - there is no longer a Radio 2 stage at Cambridge.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Mr Red
Date: 21 Sep 09 - 05:40 AM

When our Tel was a DJ on RTE he had a diddly dee quotient to fill and I have heard an example.
When they were plugging Oshokan Farewell and George Butterworth, Classic FM had an arguably higher folk content than R2. If you counted all the tunes I bet R4 has a higher content by using mood music to drama etc.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Guest John Hartford
Date: 21 Sep 09 - 07:06 AM

hi Melodeonboy

< Many traditional folk songs have been "resurrected"'

Oh, I wasn't aware that they'd died! >

Perhaps I should have said resuscitated ??

Some songs are better for a little dusting off now and again...lol

cheers

John

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 21 Sep 09 - 07:41 AM

Surely any music programming of any sort on Wogan's show comes a poor second to the show being about Wogan the personality rather than Wogan the DJ?

FWIW, my favourite SMTTF is Alan Stivell's...

Now that Stuart Maconie: He plays a fair bit of folk, especially on his Freak Zone show on BBC Radio 6.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: melodeonboy
Date: 21 Sep 09 - 08:47 AM

"FWIW, my favourite SMTTF is Alan Stivell's..."

Blimey! I didn't think many people knew about that one. That's my favourite as well.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 21 Sep 09 - 04:36 PM

Ah, Melodeonboy! Clearly a man of great taste...

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 22 Sep 09 - 01:16 AM

As someone who worked on Terrys show from 1973 to 2006. Here is what really happens.
Until his untimely death a few years ago, It was Paul Walters (TWs producer) who selected the music for the show. Paul (A pretty damn fine guitarist in his own right C/W stylee) had to go by the strictures of daytime playlists. but occasionally he would sneak one in under the Radar. Eva Cassidy is the obvious famous artist here). Terry would have never have heard of Eva without Paul. But having said that, his playing her records certainly contributed to her (postumous) fame.

Paul and I would have long conversations about music of all types during the show, and he was always enquiring about my work.
So it was Mr Walters who guided Terrys opinions. Terrys job was to make it sound like they were his idea!

And yes, It was me who played Jour D'Ete on the show, just before I retired.

As for other Folk Friendly DJs. The already mentioned Stuart Maconie (who was slightly stunned when I played Candee-i-o once, him being a huge Nic Jones fan!
Mark Radcliffe, Johnnie Walker, Bob Harris, Aled Jones (Yes Really!) Simon Mayo. Jeremy Vine.

Have had conversations about music with all of them over the years.
The problem is that their musical tastes are strangled by the dreaded playlist.

Peel was the obvious maverick, with Kershaw a close second. Then there is Late Junction...Mike Harding for entry level stuff. (You're hardly likely to follow the Chris Evans show with Sam Larner are you?!)

So, to end. It's not that bad at the Beeb. It's just that daytime presenters are forced to stick to the guidelines. Hope that clarifys the situation.

Ralph

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Peterr
Date: 22 Sep 09 - 05:37 AM

We have asked why Harding hasn't played Noel Murphy's compilation double CD album, released in 2008. The answer seems to be that he has no control over his playlist and the powers that be are not interested the old hairies. Which I think is a pity.

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 22 Sep 09 - 11:24 AM

And you're surprised?

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Abdul the bul bul on laptop
Date: 22 Sep 09 - 11:45 AM

"Ah, Melodeonboy! Clearly a man of great taste... "

Blimey, you obviously havn't seen his shirts!!.

Al

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: longboat (inactive)
Date: 22 Sep 09 - 11:59 AM

Mr Red,
BBC Radio 3, the Flemish classical radion station Radio Klara, Classic FM have all played Coope Boyes and Simpson

"...tunes sung with natural, unfettered energy - isn't it fabulous, that sound."
- Natalie Wheen, Classic FM

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Spleen Cringe
Date: 22 Sep 09 - 01:08 PM

"Blimey, you obviously havn't seen his shirts!!"

True. But I bet you haven't seen mine!

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Abdul the bul bul on his laptop
Date: 22 Sep 09 - 02:18 PM

Indeed tis true, I havn't seen yours SC, but it is hard to imagine that shirts could be found to rival the impact of those that adorn the fine physique of Melodeonboy. "Shirt Murderer" is not a name awarded lightly.
Excuse the thread drift folks but who cares what TW plays? If I want to hear folk music I wouldn't go for the TW prog.
Al

Subject: RE: Terry Wogan plays folk!
From: GUEST,Abdul the bul bul on his loptap
Date: 22 Sep 09 - 02:19 PM

Oh yes, ...........50

Al