BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 07:39 AM

Guardian last June.
"Ban Ki-moon leaves Israel off list of countries that kill or injure children"
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/08/ban-ki-moon-leaves-israel-off-list-of-countries-that-violate-childrens-rights

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:01 AM

2 Days Ago, not 7 months

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:04 AM

HiLo, I have long ago stopped reading Carroll's screeds, they made me physically ill. I may look at the first few words that's all I need to see. I see very little difference between his ravings and those of antisemitic white supremacists and neo-Nazis which I would not read either. A friend, who is a long time member, stopped reading the Israel threads because his, and a couple others, hateful views were adversely affecting his blood pressure. Thankfully, my blood pressure is good.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:04 AM

Yesterday, not 7 months ago.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:10 AM

"Not what I said at all."
True - what you actually said is "It is all tosh Jim."
Bit of a loss to spot the difference

Ban Ki-Moon
Missed a bit.
"but says number of dead and wounded Palestinian children is unacceptable"

Look Keith - unless you are going to provide proof that they didn't do what I say they have - you may as well just put "they didn't do it" and save yourself the trouble.
Until you do, my points remain - prove them wrong don't just deny them.
The same goes for you Lilo
If wat I have put up is "propaganda and rubbish" - prove it
I have linked every single point to masses of evidence - where's yours?
See 23 Jan 16 - 04:20 AM and following posts.
You are not even trying
Piss or get off the pot
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:23 AM

My word, Jim. Some impressive research there! Well done! Must have taken you hours!
Just one question arising:
What, precisely, was it all for?

Just asking.

Try just asking yourself.

As ever

שלום

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:26 AM

The bits you didn't draw attention to in your Ban Ki-Moon defence

Officials said the UN special envoy for children in armed conflict, Leila Zerrougui, had recommended that both Israel and Hamas, which controls the Gaza Strip, be placed on the report's list of parties that recruit, use, kill, maim or commit acts of sexual violence against children. But the officials, speaking on condition of anonymity because the recommendation was not public, said there were differences of opinion among those on the ground on whether Israel should be listed – a key reason why it wasn't and neither was Hamas.

The report, covering 2014, includes Israel and "the state of Palestine" in a 33-paragraph section on "grave violations committed against children during armed conflict". It cites escalating hostilities in Gaza and a significant increase in tensions in the West Bank, "with devastating impacts for children".
In Gaza, at least 561 children – 557 Palestinians and 4 Israelis – were killed, and 4,271 were injured, all but 22 of them Palestinians, the report said. In the West Bank, 13 Palestinian boys and three Israeli youths were killed and 1,218 children

The secretary general urged Israel "to take concrete and immediate steps, including by reviewing existing policies and practices, to protect children, to prevent the killing and maiming of children, and to respect the special protections afforded to schools and hospitals".
He also urged Israel to ensure accountability for perpetrators of alleged violations.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:29 AM

The literal meaning of

שלום

BTW

is PEACE

But then, with some of your best friends being Jews &·all·that·jazz, I daresay you knew that.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:36 AM

...and couldn't everybody please·pretty·please just note? -----

MOSLEY

AINTOS* -- Accuracy matters

≈M≈ - OLP (Official·Legendary·Pedant)


*'As I Never Tire Of Saying'

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:50 AM

"but says number of dead and wounded Palestinian children is unacceptable"

But he does not hold Israel responsible.
killing of so many children (according to Ban Ki-Moon) or women and old people. Not true Jim. Ki-Moon does not accuse Israel of killing children.
You made that up.

unless you are going to provide proof that they didn't do what I say they have

You and Israel's enemies say they did.
Israel and the democratic countries say they did not.
You have no "proof" Jim? It is just propaganda.

I have linked every single point to masses of evidence
No you have not. Just claims and accusations.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Dave
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:56 AM

We went through this Keith. Its Mr. Ban, or Ban Ki-Moon.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 08:58 AM

Says who, and why?
Is there any confusion over who is being referred to?

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 09:12 AM

Jan. 26, 2016

Dear Mr. Secretary-General

Today you spoke of Palestinian attacks on Israelis and you said "it is human nature to react to occupation".

No, It was not human nature for Palestinians, in this past week alone, to stab to death Dafna Meir, a mother of six children, outside her home; to stab Michal Froman, a pregnant woman; or to stab Shlomit Krigman, a 23-year-old university graduate, who just died today from her wounds.

It's time for you to stop making excuses and hold Palestinians responsible for their actions - those who murder, and the Fatah, Hamas and other leaders who incite them.

Sincerely,
Hillel C. Neuer
UN Watch

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 09:13 AM

Keith

Oriental names do normally render the single-syllable family name before the bisyllabic personal name:-

eg Chiang Kai-Shek was, in our terms, President Chiang; Mao Ze-Dong was Chairman Mao, &c.

I learned this while lecturing at universities in China for the British Council on English Folksong a few months before Tienanmen Square.

So Ban Ki-moon is indeed Mr Ban, as Dave says; and that is, as you ask, why.

They themselves are the ones who say so, so I think we should accept & respect it.

Regards
≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 09:18 AM

And that's the second time of telling, Keith, in words of one syllable. I'm beginning to suspect that you occasionally don't listen.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 09:25 AM

An analogue is certain Balkan countries where it is usual to put the surname first; so Eugène Ionesco would have been known in his native Romania as Ionesco Evgeny.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 10:14 AM

I asked "why" meaning "why are you making an issue of it."

I am sure you are all right about Korean names, but as the man will never read this thread what does it matter?
No Oriental Mudcatter has seen fit to complain.

There is no danger of misunderstanding who is meant so why try to pretend it is an issue?

I think that some people are desperate to make a point however trivial.
Jim makes up "facts" but Guest Dave and Steve seem not to care about that.
Why the different standard?

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 10:51 AM

" Large amounts of foreign aid to the Palestinians are spent to support terrorists and deepen hostility [against Jews]. For years the most senior figures in the Palestinian Authority have supported, condoned and glorified terror. "Every drop of blood that has been spilled in Jerusalem," President Mahmoud Abbas said last September on Palestinian television, "is holy blood as long as it was for Allah." Countless Palestinian officials and state-run television have repeatedly hailed the murder of Jews.

This support for terrorism doesn't end with hate speech. The Palestinian regime in Ramallah pays monthly stipends of between $400 and $3,500 to terrorists and their families, the latter of which is more than five times the average monthly salary of a Palestinian worker.

According to data from its budgetary reports, compiled in June 2014 by Israel's Ministry of Foreign Affairs, the PA's annual budget for supporting Palestinian terrorists was then roughly $75 million..."

Wall Street Journal, "Where Does All That Aid for Palestinians Go?," Jan. 25, 2016

Terrorism, Again (Israel)......indeed!

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jeri
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 10:58 AM

For the record, "GUEST,Brucie" was a handle used by someone who isn't involved in this thread.

The person some people think this is, beardedbruce, ALWAYS posts with his name, and is also not involved in this thread.

So please, stop calling random guests "Brucie". Thank you.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 11:13 AM

Is it OK if we call 'em "Fred"?

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 11:13 AM

I, for one, am not bothered being called Brucie - it only re-enforces my decision to post anonymously. I enjoy seeing them go apoplectic at not being able to tag a post with a name to launch personal attacks against.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 11:21 AM

It's time for you to stop making excuses and hold Palestinians responsible for their actions

Well, Fred, it's PAST time for you to stop making excuses and hold Israel responsible for its actions.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 12:15 PM

I think you are a bit late Greg, we got it already.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jeri
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 12:17 PM

Guest, I know you're "not bothered". You pretty much don't care who's affected by this shit.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Teribus
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 12:20 PM

" Example or Point 3 is very reminiscent of your WWI fable about summary executions."
And just like my WW1 claim - linmked to indisputable evidence."

Thanks for that Jim - best laugh I've had all day - haven't a clue what it was "linmked to" but indisputable "evidence" it most certainly wasn't wrt to your WWI effort - uncorroborated "hearsay" does not constitute evidence in any way, shape, or form - ask Richard Bridge about it Jim.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 12:27 PM

Are moderators now making comments with regard to the quality of the posts..what does "this shit" mean, Jims hateful posts, I presume.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 12:35 PM

I think you are a bit late Greg, we got it already.

YOU may have, Hi, but thousands ain't.

And certainly Fred doesn't get it.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 12:48 PM

We all get it Greg, especially Fred, you just missed it.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 12:52 PM

"Richard Bridges"

Oh Fuck, there's more than one? 😱

Oh, hang on, the quote was from Terribulus. Disregard his ramblings as ever..

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 01:02 PM

Jeri, what are you referring to by "this shit"? If you mean being called Brucie, how is anyone affected by that? If you mean the hate shit, I do care about whoever is affected by it, that's why I'm trying to counter it.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 01:06 PM

"But he does not hold Israel responsible."
"but says number of dead and wounded Palestinian children is unacceptable"
Who does he hold responsible - the Chinese??
Stupid boy.
"No you have not. Just claims and accusations."
Where''s your evidence apart from Israel saying "we didn't do it?"
Doesn't matter - as you ave said often enough - the opinion of one man - a good number of his colleges do (but maybe they're not "real" UN officials who sell their books in "real bookshops"
Still "Israel didn't do it" without evidence eh Keith - still game set and match then
"haven't a clue what it was "linked to"
Last five words superfluous there shipmate.
"What, precisely, was it all for?"
The fact you have to ask that Mike is indicative of just how critical of the Israeli regime you are - sadly
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 01:14 PM

Musket; you should restrict yourself to subjects you know something about, otherwise you just look foolish.
I'd give this up If I were you Jim, you are just embarrassing yourself now.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 01:19 PM

Well Jeri, this Guest almost drowned this thread at birth over two weeks ago with his unsupportable Islamophobic nonsense. Look back at the first few posts. Or did he? Was it two of 'em? Three? Team Guest? Well you clearly know who you're talking to, a privilege withheld from the rest of us. Make him log in, make him use a unique moniker. Or don't bother. Don't even bother telling us why you won't. But, if you don't bother, you have no reason to complain.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 01:25 PM

"but says number of dead and wounded Palestinian children is unacceptable"

I think it is too.
I think that the responsibility for those deaths lies with those who attack civilians with lethal missiles and bombs while hiding among their own civilians.
Mr Ban specifically excluded Israel from blame for the deaths of civilians.
Your claim,
the atrocities done during the invasion the destructuion of occupied hospitals, he unprecedented killing of so many children (according to Ban Ki-Moon)
was made up Jim!

Where''s your evidence apart from Israel saying "we didn't do it?"
Where's your evidence apart from saying Israel is guilty?

You and Israel's enemies accuse it of atrocities and massacres.
Israel denies any such, and no decent democracy holds them responsible. They have the facts and know it is just hate fuelled propaganda. Try not to be so gullible Jim.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 01:32 PM

"re-enforces my decision to post anonymously. I enjoy seeing them go apoplectic at not being able to tag a post with a name to launch personal attacks against."
.,,.

Does it not occur to you, Mr Pathetic·Guest, that the main impression the rest of us receive from this is of a cowardly, evasive, pusillanimous, contemptible nonentity [in a most literal sense!]? My opinion is that you should be thoroughly ashamed of your pathetic self, not indulge in such petty triumphalism as manifested above.

Signed, non-anonymously,

≈MGM≈

"The fact you have to ask that Mike is indicative of just how critical of the Israeli regime you are - sadly
Jim Carroll"

Have to ask WHAT, precisely, Jim? Lost me, I'm afraid; but that's nothing new. Your posts have many virtues, such as forcefulness and integrity; but I don't think your best friends could claim that consistent hyaline clarity and comprehensibility are always among them.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 01:53 PM

So, MGM, do I take it from your post that you enjoy seeing personal attacks?

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 02:08 PM

I can't see how you extrapolate that interpretation from what I posted; perhaps you could specify what I said to lead you to that conclusion.

I have, in common with most who from time to time express opinions not uniformly in accord with the sort of PC·ness which tends to obtain among many Mudcatters, received a certain number of what might be regarded as personal attacks over the years that I have been contributing to this forum; and have endeavoured to take them in my stride as far as possible. I should think little of myself if I had simply evaded them by disguising my identity as you do. I repeat, I regard such stratagem as pathetically pusillanimous, and should be ashamed to 'cover my back' by resorting to such cowardly evasions.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 02:12 PM

Hi, BBrucie!

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 02:28 PM

I can't see how you extrapolate that interpretation from what I posted; perhaps you could specify what I said to lead you to that conclusion.


I stated that my reason for posting anonymously was to thwart those who resort to personal attack against anyone who disagrees with their point of view. I took it that by being called all those names by you means you don't approve of me doing so. From that I infer that you would prefer to see the personal attacks which BTW I had been subjected to mercilessly before deciding to post anonymously, which is if I may remind you, within the rules of the forum. I have also stated the same opinions on the subject of this thread many times previously under my member name and even corresponded with you by PM on occasion so neither cowardice nor evasiveness are my motives. Believe what you will.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 02:31 PM

Poor, poor pitiful Guest. Mommie! they're picking on meeee!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 02:42 PM

"Have to ask WHAT, precisely, Jim? Lost me, I'm afraid; "
I'm sure I have Mike - none so lost as he who does not wish to be found.
I did the research to cover every point that Keith has claimed "Israel didn't do " - couldn't have hoped for a better result - he said "Israel didn't do it - or - "It is all tosh Jim." - same song, different tune.
"here's your evidence apart from saying Israel is guilty?"
You've had reams of it Keith - from Human Rights Groups (whoops - you're not into Human Rights - much prefer the silence of politicians)
Yo said toy never claimed Israel is innocent" - you lied - that hsi been your claim all along and it continues to be now.
You have not attempted to make a case - any of you.
You ones vehemently denied you supported eh killing of hostages, yet your entire defence for 2014 is based on just that.
I'm sorely tempted to ask Mike, as someone I regard as intelligent, what he thinks of your defence that Israel "didn't do it because "democratic countries" (who trade with Saudi Arabia, Russia, and numerous other dictatorships - specifically targeting the worst for arms sales) wouldn't have anything to do with them if they had - but I won't embarrass him by dong so.
Must be something more interesting on Tele than dynamiting fish in this particular barrel (still hot a @Castle to watch - oh.... that Kate Beckett....) - I'm off
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 02:53 PM

It used not to be 'within the rules of the forum', and I have several times expressed here the opinion, which I maintain, that it was a retrogressive step to permit anonymity. All sorts of complications flow from such usages: some purely administrative, such as never being sure if one is replying to the same correspondent as last time or to some interloper; others tending to a variety of emotional inhibiting factors. I fail to see why anyone with the courage of his convictions should need to resort to such evasions: even if it might mean, ah diddums & deary·weary·me, that somebody might call him by a bit of a naughty name!

As you persist in remaining The Man With No Name, [perhaps Clint Eastwood or some such will be playing you in the film?], I am unable to identify what might have been the subject of these PM exchanges which you recollect between us, so must remain frustratingly inhibited from commenting further.

Adieu, & I do sincerely hope it keeps fine for you.

≈Michael Grosvenor Myer≈

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 03:10 PM

that somebody might call him by a bit of a naughty name!

That's not the point however. In case you haven't noticed, when a thread degenerates into a litany of back and forth childish name calling it quickly gets closed down.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 03:23 PM

As maybe. But I don't see why you should have the last word. Whoever you may be, you are not my Mother-in-Law.

≈M≈

Though as a point of purely personal information, I have got on well with both my mothers-in-law & greatly regretted both their deaths. I use the designation here purely allusively & emblematically, in the old conventional stand-up·comic sense.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 03:38 PM

Well I've been called vile names by anonymous Guests as it happens, including "Jew hater" by someone I strongly suspect to be you, going from your own Islamophobia and bigotry and thread contexts. Prove that it wasn't. And if you're going to claim that it wasn't you, tell us why you didn't immediately protest when you saw it, as you're so against name-calling. Unless you didn't see it, of course. Ha bloody ha. Here's a name for you. You're a self-important coward. Tell us: when you decide to post again under your logged-in name, are you also going to be dishonest enough to continue with these Guest posts as well "whenever you feel threatened"? You're a bloody laugh a minute, mate. You've achieved the very opposite of what you disingenuously claim to be your goal. You've made it all about you. Congratulations.

Mods: no posting unless logged in. Everyone with a unique moniker. Just an original suggestion. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 03:41 PM

Problem is Lilo, I probably know too much about it. You claim, conveniently, to have lived in Israel. Either you are "romancing" as we used to call fantasy merchants when I was a kid, have signed up to the fascist dream or you walk round with your shutters over your eyes.

I reckon the former, and my experience includes what civilised people call Palestine too. Business is business. I'll tell you what though. The combination of aggression and terrorism combined with screaming that retaliation is aggression, and only those bankrolled by idealists in New York needing to listen in order to attempt to shame the world into looking the other way whilst Israeli militants try repeating what was done to European Jews but on Arabs, it's sickening. I'm with The UN on this one, not ignorant fools.

It's not a problem reading nonsense from the likes of Keith or Terribulus, who, lets face it, pore over Internet quotes that coincide with their xenophobic armchairs but by claiming knowledge, you, Lilo, are a fucking disgrace.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 03:41 PM

And one last point. Another reason for posting simply as Guest is to help keep respondents focused on the content of the post rather than being distracted by the identity of the poster as they are wont to do, to wit anytime Bearded Bruce posts, actually even when he doesn't post. That's all for now.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 03:43 PM

"Says who, and why? Is there any confusion over who is being referred to?"

I know I am perhaps not the best person to bring this up given my recent record but, Mr Hertford of Acheson Keith, the man's name is probably important to him.

As a senior political figure common courtesy would normally allow him his given name to most discerning people. (present company accepted)

Unlike you professor he does have considerable kudos.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 04:14 PM

Musket, I would never accuse you of knowing too much about anything. Your posts lead me to believe the opposite. I repeat, stick to what you know, you will not look so foolish.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 16 - 04:58 PM

A thoughtful and thought provoking piece from Fred Maroun in The Times of Israel: Israel may not survive