Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8

Subject: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 04:40 PM

I don't know if this will be allowed to stay on Mudcat...I sincerely hope it will.

I've just finished watching the videos on the Live 8 site and I felt that the link should be on Mudcat....and hopefully it will be passed on by loads of people TO loads of people.

It was the little baby girl who sleeps on the streets in the 'Toddlers' film that broke my heart....she's not yet two, but she can't walk as rats have bitten her toes. And Lenny Henry saying that "People are dying because they're too poor to live!" and Nelson Mandela telling people "Do not look the other way" And the two little boys who broke down in tears when they were talking of their Mum who had just died of Aids, how they didn't know what to do without her, and their Dad was sick too....he died a few weeks later.

So...please..if you've got a few minutes to spare, take a look at the site. Remember that 8 people in this world can make a vast difference to the people in those films and for hundreds of thousands of others. But those 8 people, the most 'important' leaders in the world, WON'T change things unless we DEMAND that they do!!

You can e mail Tony Blair from that site, the message is already written out for you, just put your e mail address in and 'send'. That's all you have to do, to add your name to the vast waterfall of people around the world who are trying to stop all this madness.

As Lenny said "If enough people make themselves heard, then the world can change forever!" Help them do it! They can't do it without us and we all need to change the way this world is.

I say this at the beginning of the Wimbledon Tennis tournament tomorrow, when one of the top young girl players will be appearing in a pair of trainers that Nike have spent £500,000.00 making. They are made with pure gold you see, with Maria's name picked out in pure gold on her heels.

Meanwhile, in Africa, another young girl, who has her bed on the pavement, has rats at her toes....not gold on her heels.

We need to change things!....Oh we SO need to change things!

Here's the site, the first is direct into the videos, the second is the main site:

http://www.makepovertyhistory.org/video/

http://www.live8live.com/

"Every 3 seconds......a child dies."

But for the Grace of God, that child could be mine...it could be yours....but we are the lucky ones, aren't we.

"Do not look the other way"

Lizzie x

Subject: Lyr Add: HOW LONG (Jackson Browne)
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 04:47 PM

I also wanted to say that today I watched Christy Moore singing Jackson Browne's song "How Long?" and how much I wished that Bob Geldorf had included people from the Folk World in his list of artists. The way that Christy interprets that song is wonderful.

That song, for me, encompasses what Live 8 is about. If those 8 Leaders were sat down and made to hear Christy singing it whilst watching those videos....well...who knows what might happen!!

Here are the lyrics:

"How Long?"
by Jackson Browne

When you look into a child's face
And you're seeing the human race
And the endless possibilities there
Where so much can come true
And you think of the beautiful things
A child can do
How long -- would the child survive
How long -- if it was up to you

When you think about the money spent
On defense by a government
And the weapons of destruction we've built
We're so sure that we need
And you think of the millions and millions
That money could feed
How long -- can you hear someone crying
How long -- can you hear someone dying
Before you ask yourself why?

And how long will we hear people speaking
About missiles for peace
And just let it go by
How long will they tell us these weapons
Are keeping us free
That's a lie
If you saw it from a satellite
With its green and its blue and white
The beauty of the curve of the earth
And its oceans below
You might think it was paradise
If you didn't know
You might think that it's turning
But it's turning so slow

How long -- can you hear someone crying
How long -- can you hear someone dying
Before you ask yourself why?
And how long will it be 'till we've turned
To the tasks and the skills
That we'll have to have learned
If we're going to find our place in the future
And have something to offer
Where this planet's concerned
How long?

Lizzie x

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: s6k
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 04:49 PM

Videos

Main Site

make poverty history

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: s6k
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 04:50 PM

i love that song too.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 04:57 PM

how much I wished that Bob Geldorf (sic) had included people from the Folk World

What is at issue is that no African musicans were included in the original line-up. Now they have been thrown the sop of their own concert, safely out of the way in some greenhouse in Cornwall. How fucking patronising. The aim of Live 8 (unlike Live Aid) is to raise consciousness, not money. There is not even the 'excuse' of needing to book so-called 'high profile' acts.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 04:58 PM

Thanks heaps for doing that ((((s6k))))

You can always rely on Mudcatters!

Lizzie x

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 05:56 PM

Dear 'Guest' above,

I've been to Eden...it is, quite simply Beautiful! An extraordinary place. Yet, just a few years ago it was just a hole in the ground, a gravel pit. Tim Smit had the vision and the courage to go ahead and do something when everyone around him told him it would never work. Bob Geldof tends to do the same.

Lets leave any form of anger or hatred out of this thread, please....keep that for the politicians who have had the power to do so much for so long and have turned away, back to their fine houses and their fine troublefree lives.

I can think of no better place for Peter Gabriel's WOMAD acts to take place. Eden shows what can be done in the face of insurmountable odds. And at night, the three huge domes are lit with floodlights of many beautiful colours against the velvet black backdrop of the vast bowl of hills all around them. Those lights shine up through The Domes to the stars, illuminating plants and trees from all around the world, shining on the waterfalls, the rainforest and the desert.

It is simply magical....it will be the most wondrous venue of any of the Live 8 concerts anywhere in the world and to see people like Tinariwen playing there will be incredibly special. It will put Hyde Park in the shade...as will many of the acts that will be appearing at Eden.

But I agree with you, the big acts should not be what Live 8 is about.
And the African artists should be as much in Hyde Park as they are all around the world. We are all one people. The sooner we all get to realise that the better the world will be. However, I think that Eden is by far the best venue of them all and just for one night it will belong to all those great artists appearing there and the people who go to watch it. And somehow, to have them all in one place brings a very much more powerful message than if all those acts were in different places. It will have far more impact.

Live 8 is really about all of the people who have too much helping all of those who don't have anything.....ordinary people, like us, taking control. It should also be about powerful songs that have the where-with-all to make people think.....and a lot of those songs are to be found in the folk world amongst our poets and our protest singers...because my word....do we need to protest about what is going on in this world right now!!!

So why not re-direct your anger to the Live 8 site and get your e mail on the way. Make a difference where it will actually help.

By the way, here is the Eden Project site and the list of great artists appearing there. I wish I was going.....it will be fantastic!

http://www.edenproject.com/245.htm

http://www.live8live.com/theconcerts/index.shtml

I need my Blue Clicky Angel again! :0)

And I'll leave you with some words I heard yesterday from someone's site who is also a Mudcatter...'El Greko'...otherwise known as George Papavgeris...

"In countryside like this, your God comes out to greet you. In hills and trees and stones and streams and waterfalls he's there. If you just take a look around you cannot help but wonder. For countryside like this is proof that somebody does care."

And THAT is what The Eden Project is all about. George's words ARE Eden!

It is not a 'greenhouse'....Eden is a way of life. It is about changing things for the better, proving you can make a difference, taking up the challenge, helping all the local people in a very poor community...and THAT is why, imo, it so fitting for Peter Gabriel, Angelique Kidjo, Maryam Mursal, Salif Keita, Thomas Mapfumo, Tinariwen, Daara J, Shikisha, Ayub Ogada, Modou Diouf and O Fogum to be in exactly that place, for Eden is a very special place and coupled with the artists appearing there, that concert will be the most special of them all....Eden is the concert I shall be looking out for most on Live 8 Day.

"Your God comes out to greet you....." No more so than at Eden on July 6th.


Lizzie :0)

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Sorcha
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 06:00 PM

Thank you Lizzie....this is just another atrocity....I shall click and send.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Peace
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 07:16 PM

Thanks for the link, Lizzie. All I can do is send a picture, but I'll do that for sure. Funny, because it'll be a picture back to the land of my ancestors. No one deserves to die from malnutrition; no one deserves to die from poverty. Not with the vast riches of this world. I am happy you saw fit to post this thread.

Bruce Murdoch

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Peace
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 07:25 PM

PS This may end up in BS, but I am sure it'll 'stay on Mudcat'.

BM

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Azizi
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 07:37 PM

Lizzie, thanks for starting this thread.

I'm not the 'blue' click angel, since for some reason my clickies are always red.

But, here are the hyperlinks to the websites you mentioned:

The Eden Project

Live 8 Concert

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Azizi
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 07:51 PM

Lizzie, here is the way that I make a hyperlink:

1. I copy the URL {website address}
2. I past the URL into an address field on the top of a page or
   search engine such as google and then pressed "Go"
3. When I get to that website, I right click on "Properties"
4. When a box appears, I click on "Okay"
5. With my mouse I then "highlight" the URL address for that website
6. I press "Cut"
7. I return to the comment box in the Mudcat thread and click on
   the "Make a blue clicky" feature on the bottom of this box
8. I paste the URL that I had highlighted into that box.
9. I follow the rest of the instructions in that box {decide
   what name, if any, I want to use for the hyperlink, type
   in that name, and then highlight the hyperlink that appears}
10.I copy this hyperlink into my comment

This usually works, but as I said it results in a red clicky.

Maybe your blue clicky angel will correct any errors I have made so that both of us will become members of the blue clicky crew.

Best wishes,

Azizi

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: michaelr
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 09:24 PM

Lizzie -- where did you see Christy sing that Jackson Browne song?

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 11:14 PM

Post quick Lizzie -- so we can start our lawyers on it Monday morning, crisp and bright (Browne people get no respect)

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 01:14 AM

Lets leave any form of anger or hatred out of this thread

. . . and leave you to enjoy your nice, white, worthy, middle-class, boring performers (like Coldplay for chrissake) sporting their trendy white armbands while the African musicians with their hastily-issued, afterthought sop invitations are belatedly and patronisingly shunted off to a greenhouse backwater, well out of sight and vision? Africa Calling actually happens on 2 July (not 6) and the line-up contains one of the finest musicians on the planet, Youssou N'Dour. Shows the extent to which it's penetrated your consciousness. Live 8 fails completely to respect the people of Africa, musicians and ordinary citizens alike. It's one day of token pity which impinges not at all upon the necessity for fundamental changes in economic, political and social attitudes towards people stereotyped as inferior because they have less money and different skins. A Live 8 discussion should be in the music section of the board, not BS, to promote serious reconsideration of the work of these musicians, not to pose for a day pretending to care about the plight of millions of people while watching mainstream rubbish on the television.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 01:22 AM

"and leave you to enjoy your nice, white, worthy, middle-class, boring performers"

The word is White.

I'm White. I ain't all that nice, I ain't all that worthy, I ain't middle-class, and not all the performers are boring.

That African performers were not given the respect or main-stage attention they deserve is bad. However, the cause is a good one, and I don't doubt that the screw-up will be rectified for the next concert. It may be one day of token pity, but if it raises millions, then so be it.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 01:42 AM

The stated motivation of Live 8 is NOT to raise money but to raise consciousness. It's hard to fathom which bit of that you don't understand but one thing is certain; it's failed before it starts.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Peace
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 02:05 AM

The eventual goal is to change the thinking of G8 members who are meeting soon. That will--maybe--raise some cash and help people.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Kaleea
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 02:24 AM

I was in the Orient many years ago, and through friends, met a fellow who ran an "orphanage" for the orphans/street kids he found in the city of Taegu, S. Korea. Many of the children had living parents who could not care for them for whatever reason. Mr Yee, his wife and children lived in & slept on straw mats in the same large room, ate the same food, and considered the children as his own. He worked a full time job, and had few donations and managed to take in all the children he found or who came to him or were brought to him. It was such an amazing thing, that I decided to "adopt" one youngster--but from afar back in the states. Mr. Yee held the belief that the young people are valuable resources of the country, & that their country needed them to grow up & become respected members of society-that they deserved this. I sent Mr. Yee $10-15 a month (inflation over the years) until the young man had finished high school. After I became disabled & on a measly monthly amount, I was unable to send funds anymore.
   I realize that my situation was unusual, since I knew the people & saw the situation for myself. Perhaps there are some of you who travel and know of orphanages or agencies which are dedicated to the welfare of street kids &/or the many children in poverty of this world.
As I recall, Audrey Hepburn spent a great deal of time with "street children" and devoting much energy to this cause. Was UNICEF the agency? I would certainly suggest that one should thoroughly investigate the agency & how much of the $$ actually goes to the actual needs of the children. I knew that every won (penny) of the $ I sent to Mr. Yee went for the real needs of the boy-food, shelter, clothing. Somewhat an unusual situation, I'm sure.         
   Here's to people who care enough to try to make this world a better place.    Cheers!

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 07:36 AM

Azizi...thanks heaps! Listen...I've sat and read your instructions and tried to follow them as best as I can....so fingers crossed...here goes:

For Christy Moore


Michael the video is on the Radio 2 F&A homepage, just press 'video'. If the link above doesn't work, then their address is:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/r2music/folk/playback/

That should take you straight into the video page, but...with me doing it...that may not necessarily be the case of course! ;0)

Hope it works.

Lizzie :0)

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: s6k
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 07:44 AM

VIDEO PAGE

thanks for this! i will watch these eagerly later - christy, martin carthy, kate rusby!

PS - for the person that said they have red clickies instead of blue - they are still blue clickies, its just that you have already previously visited that link recently, and so links youve clicked on appear red.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 07:52 AM

Doh!! Sorry Azizi....let you down there. :0( ....I'm such a dingbat!

'Guest' above....the only reason that I didn't mention Youssou N'Dour is that you were talking about Eden and Youssou is, according to the details, appearing in Paris at the Palace de Versailles. Personally I'd have rather seen him in Eden as it means so much more in a spiritual sense than Versailles. And as to 'White' and 'Black'.....well there's only one 'colour' for people...'Human'...and the sooner we realise that, the better this world will be. So let's stop flinging words at each other. And yes you're right...the date I quoted was wrong for the concerts. It IS July 2nd.....July 6th is the date for Edinburgh. Apologies for that mistake. It was not intentional.


Kaleea...you sound a lovely person. What a wonderful thing to do. Good to read your story.

Brucie....thank you and it's great to think of your picture being among so many, many others. Well done you.

I'm off to study Azizi's instructions again and try to get it right this time!


Lizzie :0)

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 07:54 AM

Yay!...(((s6k)))
Lizzie x

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 07:59 AM

One last thing I forgot to mention, with regard to the Radio 2 link and Christy Moore...the first 9 minutes are the presentation of the Award to Christy...How Long starts right after that.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 08:02 AM

Africa Calling

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: s6k
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 10:39 AM

yossou n'dour is presenting the Eden concert.

but the official live 8 site says he is at paris too, so i dont really know whats going on there.

NEWS JUST IN - the sex pistols are reuniting for the London concert with the original lineup

CLICK HERE TO READ ABOUT IT

i disagree that it will be the highlight of the entire event, seeing as Pink Floyd will be there - but thats going to be interesting - considering Lydon once wore a "I hate pink floyd" shirt!

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Azizi
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 09:13 AM

Lizzie, it's probably my instructions and not you.

I notice my hyperlinks on this thread are showing up blue..I'm simply shocked since they usually show up red.

So this is a shout out to sk6, Guest, and others like Brucie who know how to make those blue hyperlinks.

Would you please read the instructions that I posted for hyperlinks for accuracy & clarity, and re-writing them as needed?

Thanks & Best wishes!

Azizi

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 09:34 AM

I see that life is going along as usual here. Only four posts posted until "GUEST" tries to switch the topic from the needs of children to the egos of adult males.
---------
A few months ago, my and the DH went to a performance by the African Children's Choir. The children were so delightful and the information given about their plight was so moving that we dipped into our pockets and put whatever we had in the basket.

I recommend going to hear them (and taking your kids and grandkids) if they come to your part of the world.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 10:30 AM

"GUEST" tries to switch the topic from the needs of children to the egos of adult males

The topic is Live 8, the purpose of which is to raise consciousness about and inspire respect for Africa and Africans. This is a music forum and thus a highly appropriate place to highlight the marginalisation of African musicians at an event which is supposed to draw attention to economic disparity. Unlike Live Aid 20 years ago, it is NOT a fundraising event and NOT about handing out short-term aid to children or anyone else. Emotive claptrap about "children's needs" is as patronising and imperialistic as the thankfully abandoned, post-colonial, church missionary approach of selling photographs of "cute piccaninnies" to "help" them. Do have a reality check; what the people of Africa need and deserve is the economic equality to engage with the rest of the world on an equal footing.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Peace
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 10:33 AM

And maybe the pressure put to the G8 members is a way to do just that, GUEST.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: s6k
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 10:40 AM

i will paste a simpler way to make the blue clicky.


go to the website you wish to include as a blue clicky.

in the address bar, click once and the entire address should highlight blue

right click it while it is highlighted blue, click copy

come to the mudcat window where you are typing your message. underneath the text, click "Make a Link (blue clicky)"

a new window will pop up. where it says LINK URL - right click in the text bit and click paste. it will paste the address you copied earlier.
now click in LINK TEXT and type in what you want - for example, if you type in VIDEO PAGE, then the words video page will appear in the message, but you will be able to click it and go to that link.

IGNORE the bottom 2 fields (mailto and link text) and click create link under where you just made it.
the page reloads and a mass of text appears. click and DRAG (hold down mouse and pull across the text) across the text underneath where it says "cut and paste this into post"
they will all start with a < and end with > so make sure you get these in.now right click it, as it will be highlighted blue. and right click... copy... then come back to your mudcat message and right click paste into this text box. then submit message as usual
done

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 11:23 AM

Good grief, what a palaver! All you need to is copy and paste the URL into your post and mark up the html, thus:

URL AGAIN

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 01:59 PM

Thanks Azizi and s6k. I'll try again in a minute!

Right then...yesterday something quite extraordinary happened. We went to Honiton in Devon, just down the road from where we live, in Sidmouth. Amongst other things we went into Oxfam to leave a few bits and pieces with them and I bought some more of the 'Make Poverty History' bands that they're selling and picked up a few of their new leaflets.

Then, I went into the health shop to buy a few things. It was an incredibly hot day yesterday and there was an elderly lady in there who was obviously 'feeling the heat' somewhat. I joked about the weather and she grinned and told me that her friend who was staying with her found the heatwave very cool! Then her friend came round the corner of the stand, a beautiful lady who apparently was from Tanzania. We laughed and that's when she noticed my Oxfam bracelet. Well....she took hold of my hand and squeezed it so tight, looked right at me....and then her eyes filled with tears!

Well....that was it! That sweet woman said more to me with her eyes than a thousand words could ever speak. We just stood there holding hands and then we wished each other well and said goodbye.

So...here for everyone to pass on is a new idea and a new website.

Oxfam is now doing its own 'Gift Catalogue' but this is unlike any other that you've seen before. These are the 'gifts' that you can buy, except you buy them for the people who really need them on behalf of your friends, (for birthdays), yourselves, the new bride and groom who already have everything, maybe instead of funeral flowers that just waste away:

Here is what your money can do:

.£6...School dinners for a child. Often their only meal.

.£6...2 textbooks for children

£10...Essentials for a child

£16...50 trees

£16...Fills a school satchel

£19...Health and hygiene kit

£24...A goat "You start with one and end up with a herd"

£24...Plants an allotment

£30...Building materials

£30...Textbooks for an entire class

£36...Training a teacher

£50...Starts a business for someone

£50...Services a truck

£64...Teach and support a farmer

£70...A cow for a family, the resulting calves go to the village

£95...A camel..."the most valued livestock in Somalia.."

£100..Basic medicines for an entire village

It goes on all the way up to thousands of pounds, buying an entire farmyard stock for villages, training and supporting carers, instilling water supplies etc. Everything is designed to educate people, make them self-sufficient, give them dignity and pride, all the things we take so much for granted.

Here's the site:

Oxfam Unwrapped.com

Fingers crossed that it works Azizi and s6k!!

So tonight we're all sitting round and deciding what we're going to get. My children are really excited about it and from now on I'm going to include this idea in people's presents too. Let's face it, how many toys..for big people or little people...do we actually need anymore? ENOUGH!

I'll let you know what we've decided upon shortly. Take a look at the site it's brilliant! If you had told me a few days back that I'd be on Mudcat urging people to go out and buy a cow....I'd have looked at you as if you were mad! But here I am!!

The words above all stem from that sweet lady from Tanzania who literally 'reached out and touched me' yesterday in a small Devon town.

I hope that through me she reaches out to you too.

Lizzie :0)

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 02:00 PM

Yes!!! I did it! Thanks Guys for all your help on that!

Lizzie x

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: akenaton
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 04:09 PM

Lizzie Cornish....Why are the organisers of "Make poverty history" actively discouraging people from protesting at Gleneagles Hotel, where their protests should at least embarrass the the G8 leaders.

Instead we are invited to leave our brains at home and join the politicians at a "feel good " junket in Edinburgh.

Well I for one wont be listening to the ageing hypocrits singing of poverty and environmental disaster, while they gorge on cocaine and travel by private jet.

Like the anti Iraq war demo, this is an occasion when all we need to do is stand and be counted, and make the politicians understand that these issues can't be treated as a PR exercise, all bleeding hearts and rhetoric for a while, but then its back to business as usual.

It's the oldest trick in their book, rub the spiky corners off the protest, emmoliate the protesters with some meaningless figures, then when all the fuss has died down, let the African continue to die in peace.
I hope some of the party goers make the effort to get to Gleneagles and make a show of unity where it really counts...Ake

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Azizi
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 04:17 PM

Congratulations, Lizzie!

You're doing good {and I don't just mean joining the blue clicky crew}.

Yes, there are significant things that should have been done differently, but still IMHO this is a beginning step that will help some people who really need our help so that they can help themselves and their loved ones.


Peace,
Ms. Azizi

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Bloke in the Corner
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 07:07 PM

Of course help, of course end poverty.
It won't end while the EU subsidises their agricultural products to the extent that they are sent to Africa cheaper than they can be produced there.
But above all--- all the money in the world won't save a single life while it continues to pour into the pockets of the kleptocratic rulers of these countries and their foul minions, who watch their own people starve to death form their palaces, or start genocidal wars against their own countrymen because they come from another tribe.
Africa can save itself, we in the rich countries have succeeded in doing so little since live aid because so much of the money has been...stolen.
And Gordon Brown's writing off the billions of debt was really little more than a gesture. Almost all the poorest countries are already in default, being unable to pay because they are being robbed from within.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: akenaton
Date: 22 Jun 05 - 04:20 PM

Rumours abound in todays UK press, that performers at Live 8 have been warned not to criticise Bush or Blair......"Surprise...Surprise".

Apparently the debt which is to be "written off" by the benificent West would never have been paid,as most of the economies are bankrupt.

The real crime being committed by the G8 leaders is failure to address climate change....They know what is required, they just dont care . Short term political survival is what's important to politicians, not protecting our environment or making this world a happier and healthier place to live..Ake

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: SharonA
Date: 22 Jun 05 - 07:54 PM

There's more political nonsense going on in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA (another site of the Live 8 simul-concert). Seems that some African-Americans there feel that it's not enough to raise awareness of Africa's dire situation; they want to use the concert as a means of making money for themselves (through selling food, such as soft pretzels, at vending stands) and are complaining because the city isn't making arrangements to suit them. Get this: they are saying that the fact that the city isn't allowing them to set up their food stands where they want IS EQUIVALENT TO the suffering of all the people in all the sub-Saharan African nations. Makes my blood boil!!! Here's a typical article about it (this one from Yahoo News):


Philadelphia Black Leaders Call on Geldof and Live 8 Talent for Support in Their Economic Struggle
Monday June 20, 2:09 pm ET


PHILADELPHIA, June 20 /PRNewswire/ -- A coalition of predominantly African-American business, civic and community leaders, working with Philadelphia's African-American Chamber of Commerce (AACC), today likened the economic exclusion of blacks in the City of Brotherly Love to the economic hardship suffered by sub-Saharan African nations and have called on the event organizer, Bob Geldof, and the entertainers scheduled to participate in Philadelphia's Live 8 Concert, to intervene on their behalf or to cancel Philadelphia as a concert venue.
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According to the members of the Philadelphia Coalition to Eliminate Economic Injustice from Live 8, the city of Philadelphia has made no public commitment to ensure that black vendors and businesses will fairly participate in the anticipated $40 million in expenditures that are expected to result from the concert.

In fact, the AACC sent a hand-delivered letter on June 14, to the City's Commerce Director, to Mayor John F. Street, to members of Philadelphia City Council and to Pennsylvania Governor Edward G. Rendell, requesting black vendor, business and workforce participation at Live 8 and at a center city vendor's mall, before, during and after Live 8. In response to that letter, the Commerce Director has replied that black vendors can begin doing business at the vendor's mall only "after July 4," and the city has made no public commitment that there will be appropriate levels of black business involvement in the concert planning and related business opportunities.

The Coalition points out that Philadelphia has a long history of excluding black businesses from full economic participation and that it is hypocritical of the city to participate in an event whose purpose is to bring economic equity to Africans while Philadelphia continues to actively discriminate against black businesses locally.

The Coalition further stresses that, while blacks constitute the city's largest population segment, at 43.2%, the city of Philadelphia has involved black businesses in just .7% (less than one percent) of annual government contract revenues. U.S. Census data also indicate that black businesses participate in just .9% (less than one percent) of the city's private sector gross receipts.

Commenting on the situation, A. Bruce Crawley, chairman of the African- American Chamber said: "Apparently, Mr. Geldof and his colleagues have some awareness of the economic challenges faced by blacks in Philadelphia. In fact, the Philadelphia Inquirer, in exploring the reasons why Philadelphia was selected as a concert venue over other U.S. cities, quoted event producer Tim Sexton as saying: 'You can't think about poverty without looking at the streets of Philadelphia, where that's an issue.'"

"With that understanding," added Crawley, "we call on Mr. Geldof, on Dikembe Mutombo, on Jay-Z, on Stevie Wonder, Bon Jovi, P. Diddy, Destiny's Child, the Dave Matthews Band and other talent related to the Philadelphia venue to speak to city government on our behalf and to demand that blacks right here in Philadelphia also benefit by the good work they intend to do for Africa.

"And, if for some reason, this city turns a deaf ear, on this critical issue, to the event organizers and to its entertainers in the same way that it has to the local black community, then we encourage the Live 8 concert planners to withdraw from the Philadelphia venue. The fact is that their participation will simply serve to perpetuate the economic exclusion that the Philadelphia black community has suffered under this and previous mayors."

"To come to Philadelphia and have an event to assist blacks in Africa, while ignoring and actively discriminating against blacks who are facing economic hardship right here is, at the very least, hypocritical," said Coalition member Debra Moore of It's a Family Affair, a local community-based organization.

The Coalition members say they will continue to work diligently to bring economic equity to their community, both for the Live 8 concert and beyond. They have committed themselves to have direct dialogue with the concert organizers and talent and to having continuous sporadic demonstrations throughout the city, leading up to the scheduled concert. They are also encouraging blacks and all Philadelphians who believe in fairness and equity, to contact the mayor and other elected officials to bring about fair levels of inclusion by blacks and other minorities in the city's business opportunities.

"In the same way that the Live 8 concerts have been designed to influence the G-8 nations, this ongoing local economic exclusion of blacks is an issue that must be addressed by government. It can no longer be swept under the rug, or hidden when polite company comes to visit," said Robert Gray, a Coalition member who heads the African-American Freedom and Reconstruction League.

"Black families and black neighborhoods in Philadelphia are suffering every day because of this issue. Now is the time to do something about it," said Stanley Crawford, a long-time vendor and Coalition member.

Founded as the African-American Chamber of Commerce of Philadelphia in 1994, the African-American Chamber of Commerce of Pennsylvania, New Jersey and Delaware is the leading private sector advocate for black-owned businesses and African-American economic development in the tri-state area. Headquartered at 1735 Market Street in Center City Philadelphia, the Chamber represents the interests of such businesses in both public and private sector forums. The organization also offers management and technical assistance programs to improve the effectiveness of black-owned businesses in the region. According to the Census Bureau, there are 16,010 African-American-owned businesses in southeast Pennsylvania, southern New Jersey and northern Delaware.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Burke
Date: 22 Jun 05 - 09:12 PM

So ignore Live 8 & get involved in your local Make Poverty History campaign to hold world leaders to their pledges to reach the Millennium Development Goals by 2015. Join with the rest of the world & wear your white band on July 1. Global Call to Action Against Poverty.

If you are in the US sign the
One pledge and send a message to President Bush endorsing the goals of more and better international assistance, debt cancellation and trade reform for the world's poorest countries.

Bob Geldorf did not start this campaign, he's just helping to publicize it.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Jun 05 - 09:34 PM

Thanks, Lizzie Cornish. Getting politicians' eyes turned the right direction may make the world's inequities harder to ignore.

Someone once said: You can share without caring but you cannot care without sharing.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: akenaton
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 05:35 AM

I repeat my question to Lizzie Cornish, and address it to Burke.
Why are the "Make poverty history" spokespeople discouraging protesters from going to Gleneagles?....Ake

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Stu
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 06:00 AM

I've posted this on another forum, but thought it was relevant here too in support of Lizzie's original post.

The idea of the concerts and march is not to raise money from the public to send to corrupt Africa governments, but to pressure the leaders of the world's richest industrialised nations, meeting near Edinburgh on July 8th, to write off the debt that cripples so many African countries. These events have already opened up this debate though - here we all are talking about it now. I agree it is flawed to some degree - not enough African music etc, but even that does not detract from the fact this is a publicity-generating exercise whose fundamental aim is to get this debate on the agenda of those who can influence events at the highest level.

Since the idea was proposed, 18 countries, mainly in sub-saharan Africa have been freed from this debt burden - that's 280 million people. This burden of debt was a useful tool for rich companies to gain commercial footholds in Africa through morally dubious relief schemes. Debt relief was (and still will be, if the G8 countries have their way) often tied to the privatisation of a countries nationalised healthcare and education systems. Instiutions run by African Governments for their people and in their interest was turned into a moneymaking machine that serves the interest of shareholders in rich G8 nations.

Many African governments are run on an undemocratic basis by corrupt individuals, but this is not unique to Africa. British firms now export arms worth nearly £1 billion to African countries, including £53 million to Nigeria, plus £30 million to Angola and the granting of a military export licences to Uganda, the latter two were singled out by Vic for criticism in his article. If they are so corrupt, why are our government so happy to sell them weapons? Doesn't that make us, a the very least, complicit in the misery heaped upon the innocent citizens of these nations by their leaders?

Live 8 represents the chance for ordinary people to influence decision-makers that act more often in the interests of unelected commercial organisations rather than their own citizens. This is democracy in it's purest form - the people seeking to impose their will on their leaders.

stigWeard

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 07:09 AM

Akenaton....please could you tell me where you got your information from, as I've just phoned Oxfam and told them what has been written here. They said that they are not discouraging people from going to Gleneagles at all. So...I'm a little mystified.

I don't want to go back to them again until I know your source. This will make it easier to sort out and hopefully I can come up with an answer for you. Meanwhile here is the part of their site that deals with the G8 Campaign.

http://www.oxfam.org.uk/what_you_can_do/campaign/mph/g8/index.htm

Thanks

Lizzie :0)

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 07:37 AM

OK....Bob Geldof was on BBC Radio 2 yesterday afternoon on The Steve Wright Show. You can 'listen again' to what he had to say by clicking on Wednesday's show here:

BBC Steve Wright

The show is 3 hours long, but don't panic! There is a fast forward button that comes up once you have pressed the 'listen again' title.

The show started at 2pm and Bob was on just before 4.30pm. So...click the '15 mins' button 9 times to take you to around 4.15pm,(at this point you should get Abba, almost finished singing 'The Day before you came') then click the '5 mins' just once which will take you to halfway through Rufus Wainwright singing 'Crumb by Crumb'...continue to listen to this and right after Rufus finishes...Bob comes on.

Obvioiusly this link will only work for the remainder of this week as Steve's shows start all over again next week.

Good luck. It's worth hearing...honestly!

Lizzie :0)

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: akenaton
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 01:47 PM

Lizzie ...I've heard two spokespeople for "Make poverty history", when asked point blank if they would like to see protesters going to Gleneagles, reply that they were not encouraging this action.

One was on Channel 4 news , and as far as I remember the other was on Newsnight Scotland...

I'm sure your a good person and don't want to diminish what you are doing, but I think these issues, especially environmental degradation, needs more of a hard edged protest than a bunch of has-been pop singers entertaining politicians and the reality TV generation....Ake

PS just read Oxfam website.....not a word about protest at Gleneagles

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 03:47 PM

For 'has been' popstars they sure sell out alot of venues.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Burke
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 08:29 PM

I'm in the US & so have not paid any attention to what or what is not planned for Gleneagles.

My impression is that the UK organizers want to concentrate efforts on the July 2 rally in Edinburgh.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: *daylia*
Date: 24 Jun 05 - 08:10 AM

Hey, my home town of Barrie Ontario is so proud ... and shocked! ... to have been chosen for Canada's Live 8! We were chosen even over Toronto ... and now we'll be famous for more than our world-class pot plants!

Here's the lineup for the Barrie concert:

African Guitar Summit
Barenaked Ladies
Blue Rodeo
Bruce Cockburn
Bryan Adams
The Bachman Cummings Band
Deep Purple
DobaCaracol featuring Kna'an
Gordon Lightfoot
Great Big Sea
Jann Arden
Les Trois Accords
Motley Crue
Our Lady Peace
Sam Roberts
Simple Plan
Tegan & Sara
The Tragically Hip
Tom Cochrane


The African Guitar Summit? and Deep Purple?!? Wow, I'm almost tempted to go, but the 35,000 tickets they were giving away were gone in 21 minutes the other day. To me, that's scary! I do know what Molson Park is like in the sweltering heat, with 50,000+ half-baked partiers milling about. Been there, done that, got insulted, got assaulted, got away, bought the t-shirt, moved on ... but I'll be there in spirit. And make a donation, if there's someplace to do that.

Subject: RE: Every 3 seconds...a child dies...Live 8
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 25 Jun 05 - 05:38 AM

Akenaton, thanks for your reply.

Well....I didn't phone Oxfam back. Not because I don't believe what they told me or what you say, because I do, but the long and the short of it is that it really doesn't matter who said what...where. Gleneagles or Edinburgh, it WILL get through to the G8 leaders because they will not be able to ignore it!

What really matters is how many seconds have passed since this thread began and how many children have died. Short and simple to me what Live 8 is about.....Changing things! Ordinary people changing things, putting pressure on our so called Leaders who should be hanging their heads in shame.

Wouldn't it have been a great idea if EVERY city across the Live 8 countries were filled with people, just marching in silent protest, not just Edinburgh?

I remember over here in England, when Mrs.Thatcher was in power, a lady in the West Country rang up BBC Radio Devon and complained about the Poll Tax, saying how wrong and unfair it was and that we should all protest about it. That story was taken up by every BBC radio station across the land and within days The Poll Tax Protests were taking part in almost every city. We went into Plymouth to join everyone and I'd never seen anything like it. Thousands of people, just marching in silent protest, no damage, no riots, although I think Rent-a-Mob was out in other places. It changed everything. The Poll Tax was done away with very hastily....and the Politicians realised that you can only push people so far, although just lately we all become so apathetic again that we need a huge kick up the backside!!

It needs all of us right across the rich nations to take Live 8 up and say we've had enough of all this madness! It's not right that we live in countries where food is piled up to the ceilings in supermarkets whilst others have nothing. We're destroying food because we have too much and others are dying because they have nothing. Imagine being a parent and just holding your child in your arms while it dies, for no other reason than it has no food. How must that feel??? We can only imagine.......we are very blessed over here.

I understand about the corrupt, evil Governments in some of these countries. It makes me as mad as it makes everyone else!! Just last night we saw on our news the graves of two children killed by Mugabe's men, when they decimated their homes. And yes, something HAS to be done about that too! My Dad fought in World War II, he was a kind, gentle, peaceful man, he spoke very little about his experiences, but I remember that he did say that sometimes things are just so evil that you have to stand up and do something. Something needs to be done about Mugabe and all the others like him.

Already, as someone mentioned above and Bob mentioned on BBC Radio 2, the Anti-Poverty Coalitions are growing ever bigger, 18 nations have had their debts wiped out, 280 million people freed of that, 9 more countries to follow...possibly more. Bob talked of how the papers are suddenly becoming filled with pages containing information on trade justice, tariffs, cashflow subsidies, debt relationships, aid-flow packages. This is despite them all saying it was madness to even think about it, five years ago.

He spoke about not wanting to be an old man and look back on his life and know that he could have changed things, he could have done this, but turned away. And he hasn't turned away...he knows how people criticise him, but he just keeps on keeping on, despite it all. I admire him hugely for that. As Bruce above said in another thread "You don't just talk the talk, you've got to walk the walk." Hope it's OK to quote you Bruce, but they were good words!

So...Akenaton...if nothing else, why not visit that Oxfam Gift page and take a look. We, as a family, decided on 50 trees, some clothes and shoes, a goat and a cow!! It's all ordered and done now. And no....we're not rolling in money, my husband has recently lost his job through redundancy....and no...I'm not putting it on here to make you think good of me...let's face it I should have been doing it years ago! Many people have been for years and years quietly, just getting on with it. But this is about changing how the rich world has been behaving for years. It's so easy to turn away and just carry on with your life….Live 8 are trying hard to make us think differently.

But just think if you decided to go for even the smallest item at £6 and told 10 friends, then those 10 friends told 10 more each, making 100, then those 100 told 10 each, turning it into a 1,000 people and then 10,000 and then 100,000 and then.......suddenly you have the Pyramid Effect and a Waterfall Of People all wanting to help. And that waterfall can turn into an entire Sea Of People, made up of the likes of you and me.

To quote Bob again from the radio interview above:

"It's about changing the dynamics between the rich and the poor world."

"It is maybe likely that with having all of us embarked on this adventure to change the world within the next two weeks that we might just get there."

"It's individual humans helping other people"

And THAT'S what July 2nd and July 6th is about to me. Not just about the politicians and wiping out the debts, but about all of us deciding to do things differently.

Daylia....your concert sounds great! Hope you enjoy it and that it achieves more than anyone ever thought.

And here's one more site to visit....well two actually. The first is Martyn Joseph, an incredible, committed, passionate man whose songs are making a difference everywhere he sings them. He's in Canada a huge amount of the time so check him out, because this man has the power to change how you view things in life.

http://www.piperecords.co.uk/martynj/community2.htm

The second is Harry Chapin's site. A man whose songs and attitudes I loved deeply when I was younger. Harry was incensed about world hunger and was determined to change all that in his lifetime. He started up the 'WHY' foundation 'World Hunger Year'..which is still going today, with Bruce Springsteen and others still taking up that challenge. Had Harry not died so tragically, so early in his life, who knows what he might have achieved. I've put the link through directly from Harry's site to the World Hunger Year site. Hope it works.

http://www.worldhungeryear.org/

And finally wouldn't it be great to hear Steve Earle singing 'The Revolution Starts Now' somewhere during the Live 8 concerts.

Apologies for the length of this post.

Lizzie :0)