BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 16 Apr 07 - 02:03 PM

Come on Peace, you know what I meant. This is a discussion, not an arguement.

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: Greg B
Date: 16 Apr 07 - 03:05 PM

Oh, but some of those camera angles in Borat--- there were
definitely some views in there which put me right off my
popcorn.

That said, my favorite parts of it were the truly crude
humor. In that respect, Borat seems a bit like the 'Jackass'
movies, or even 'The Three Stooges.' Someone always says to
me--- 'It's a guy thing.'

Maybe the same is true of Howard Stern and Imus, as well.

Or 'The Man Show.'

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: TIA
Date: 16 Apr 07 - 10:06 PM

Nope, I'll say it again. Borat and Imus are different. Borat is lampooning racist pigs like Imus (and the pigs usually don't even know it).

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: mg
Date: 16 Apr 07 - 11:17 PM

Then he should go right after Imus and his ilk,,,he should not use the Gypsies of Romania, living in dirt-poor conditions, or the people of Khad..sstan..I am not going to even try to spell it... to make his point. He at the very least could have made up a mythical country. Once again, I have not seen the movie, although I was watching for it to come through town. Maybe it did and I missed it. But I am not talking about the contents of the movie itself. I saw him plenty of times on TV and he said plenty on which I base my judgement. I am actually talking about the dirty tricks he used on the Gypsies in the Romanian village, who were deeply mortified by what was done to them. Have you seen the documentaries about the Romanian orphanages some years ago? Well, that is where people would have had to place their children to give them an improved chance in life, if you can imagine. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: mg
Date: 17 Apr 07 - 12:21 AM

OK. I rented it and I am watching it..it is more disgusting than I was prepared for....."the ass-hole of a seven-year old girl" "fucking my mother", the "running of the Jew." Creating what look like, unless done with professional stunt drivers etc., traffic hazards with cars, busses. Chasing people down the street. Essentially doing what we would consider assaulting them. Letting a chicken loose on a subway..was that acting or for real? That is a hazard for various reasons...I shall force myself to watch more of it but so far I think I had one chuckle and huge amount of disgust. I am repulsed by the thought of going back to it but consider it my social duty. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: mg
Date: 17 Apr 07 - 12:35 AM

OK..Now he is a guest on a Georgia TV show...he says you come to my country, stay in my house and sleep with my sister. He is representing himself as a person from a real country. How is this respectful to them and for heavens sake, how does it show us our prejudices etc.? What blather. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: dianavan
Date: 17 Apr 07 - 01:06 AM

I never once thought Borat was a real person from a real country.

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: mg
Date: 17 Apr 07 - 01:12 AM

Well, the nice people in the bed and breakfast he made fun of did.

What was the deal with him assaulting Pamela Anderson? Was she in on it? Was she acting? Even so....mg

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: mg
Date: 17 Apr 07 - 01:16 AM

And Kazaghstan is a real country and he said several times on the movie that that is where he is from. Sorry, I have known people from thyat part of the world, Ubzekistan mostly,and I don't like to see them ridiculed..no..beyond that..with talks about 7 year olds in pedophilic ways...worse than ridiculed for being perhaps unsophisticated. Presented as degenerate. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: EBarnacle
Date: 17 Apr 07 - 09:36 AM

Many years ago, there was a passage in Heinlein's Stranger in a Strange Land. In it he refers to humor, using the analogy of monkeys in a zoo. He pointed out that humor is about pain [even puns].

Both Borat and Imus are about pain. Imus is/was a so-called insult comedian and Borat is about putting people up in public and making them twist and turn in a sort of auto de fe.

It is hard to say which is worse. Imus brings out the worst in himself and if you challenge him you are poor sport. Borat holds people up to ridicule for their own behavior--which he goads them into. Either one is a death of a thousand cuts and ultimately makes people feels worse about themselves.

Kaufman fell somewhere between them but the results were similar. After being 'on' with him, people often felt embarassed and foolish if they had any sense.

All three are very effective styles. When they lead to people learning about themselves, they provide a useful act. When they are simply there to pander and make people laugh at the goat while thinking "Am I glad I'm not that idiot" they are simply nasty.

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: Greg B
Date: 17 Apr 07 - 12:13 PM

QED, mg.

Some folks just don't 'get' Borat, like they didn't 'get'
Andy Kaufman.

Appears you're either one of them--- or playing the role
of one of 'em. (You never know, when talking about either
'Borat' or Kaufman.)

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 17 Apr 07 - 05:56 PM

One must hope that the Borat garbage will rapidly disappear from view.

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 17 Apr 07 - 09:36 PM

I hope he makes more. He is clever and perceptive, and funny. His various characters all serve a purpose.

I'd love to see him work with Kevin Smith.

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Apr 07 - 11:28 AM

I have been banned on over 30 websites for my visual and verbal parody and satire.

People who do not care for parody and satire when their ox is gored are often adamant in their protest.

Furthermore my entire website was removed without permission for reasons unstated and unknown to me.

If I had to guess it was by religious or anti parody zealots who can pull stings.

Pentacostals, evangelicals and fundamentalists have a mission, and it doesn't include the free speech or science of select individuals.

Subject: RE: BS: Revisit Borat in relation to Imus fiasco
From: GUEST,carl
Date: 18 Apr 07 - 10:01 PM

This type of humour is always available to those who seek it out and like it. I suspect few would change this.

But, what has changed is the Ali G (and Borat) type humour is now considered main stream, right there in the face of everyone, including those who consider it offensive and the young.

It certainly tells us that there is a big change in the direction of what is interpreted as community values and what is broadly acceptable. I suspect there will be a backlash at some point. Imus may be a sign of a correction of this interpretation in the near future..