BS: Canucks... Trudeau?

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 30 Sep 12 - 09:34 PM

But, Pierre and Joe "lost" those fights long ago, no? Justin can't go back and fight those battles again, can he? Of course, he could kick Harper's ass... it would be as absurd as that freak show that went on but FAR more enjoyable. I can picture Harper on the mat... unconcious and bleeding without one hair out of place.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Sandy Mc Lean
Date: 30 Sep 12 - 09:51 PM

But Pierre didn't lose the oil battle. It was Alberta's influence on later governments like Mulroony's that sunk our national energy strategy. Every damn time I cough up at the pumps I wonder if there were more envelopes than what we know of? Not saying; just wondering {;-}

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 30 Sep 12 - 11:43 PM

Mulwhoooooney? Wash yer mouth out with soap!

Must be something about the hair, eh? And that wry smile that just says, "Fuck you." in such a demure manner. Innocent lambs them two.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 01 Oct 12 - 07:21 AM

Just to be clear, (for those falling outside the Canadian sphere of influence) I was talking about "Justin Trudeau", not the much more famous Canadian "Justin Bieber" - who is not considering coming to the rescue of a political party, will likely never be the Prime Minister, and was not (as far as I recall) "somewhat" overlooked by previous Liberal party leaders. Remember that.

And, I do not covet my neighbour's hair (nifty or not) - nor rate any life success, or lack of it, on hair - or, lack of hair.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: bobad
Date: 02 Oct 12 - 10:11 PM

Justin Trudeau's speech announcing his cadidacy and his vision:http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2012/10/02/pol-justin-trudeau-liberal-party.html?cmp=rss

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 03:17 PM

Thanks, Bobad. As for a federal election, it's clear he is toast and as for the leadership race, this is just practice for the future. Or it could be the inuring process of leading an opposition as mentioned above, but I just can't see that. Anyway, I digress.

So... now that my initial question has been answered, who else will run besides Trudeau, Coyne (not a hope of election, sooo...? a carbon tax??? - what was she thinking??? doesn't she read newspapers?), and Mousley?

I think Garneau would mop the floor given what we know now but will he run?

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 03:45 PM

Coughlin's Law: anything else is always something better.
quote: Coctail(Doug)

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: bobad
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 04:20 PM

Deborah Coyne, being the mother of Justin's half sister, adds an interesting element to the leadership contest.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 04:32 PM

Coughlin's Law: anything else is always something better.
quote Doug: Coctail (the movie, not the drink)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 04:39 PM

OOps, twice is better than once ;(

OK another "drifty and nifty" one from the same movie:

Doug: You see, there are two kinds of people in this world: the workers and the hustlers. The hustlers never work and the workers never hustle...

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 04:42 PM

She is certainly well qualified to be PM but the carbon tax? Fine if she believes in it but sell it afterwards... we know what it did for Dionne (she would too if she read a newspaper, no???). I think she shot herself in the foot on day one on that alone. Of course, she could be another sacrifice choice in the opposition IF that is the case. Hey, somebody has to do the job.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 05:04 PM

""Deborah Coyne, being the mother of Justin's half sister, adds an interesting element to the leadership contest.""

How so?

Are there any more relatives Liberals-of-the-past in the shadows?

With this in mind, what shot does Monica Lewinsky have is running in the next US 'lection? She can claim a close relationship with Bill;)

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 06:21 PM

For one thing, she doesn't need the money. Apparently, the going rate for a blowjob in The States is a LOT more than in Canada. Of course, if it's leadership of the Liberal party for a lay?

Yes, yes, yes... that was an extremely crass joke but not beyond crass in my books. And, yessss... I do go beyond sometimes.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Beer
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 06:26 PM

Your buddy D.Leblanc is not running. The official announcement will be made when Justin visits New Brunswick next week.
Ad.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: meself
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 08:19 PM

Okay, went to see young Trudeau make his speech today. Very impressive - an effective, engaging speaker, saying all the right things. Seems approachable, personable. Could be the guy to save the Liberals ....

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Beer
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 11:15 PM

meself, you mean yesterday right? The speach he gave in Montreal?
ad.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 03 Oct 12 - 11:32 PM

Beer...told yas. >;-)

Just too smart... like all the LeBlanc. That's where I get my calm, calculated and reasoned demeanour from. It's my Irish I have a problem with at times. >;-)

Mark my words... if LeBlanc becomes PM some day, I'll be surpised( for many reasons) but I will also be pleased. On accounta he's the real deal.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: meself
Date: 04 Oct 12 - 12:06 AM

No, today in Calgary. Wish I was in Montreal!

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: GUEST,999
Date: 04 Oct 12 - 03:31 AM

meself, based on what you heard, how's he look in terms of policy? He spoke against a zinc mine development on the Nahanni River in the NWT about a half dozen years back. But unless the Libs and NDP get it together, we may be stuck with The Hair once again, and I don't think our democracy can afford that.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 04 Oct 12 - 06:51 AM

OK, I'll bite on that one, why is LeBlanc "the real deal"?- outside of him "kinda" being from the Maritimes (mostly lived in Ottawa as a lad, studied in USA, vacationed, at the beach, in NB, now 'kinda " lives in Shediac -because he ran there- and in Ottawa), and had a famous father, and has, I suspect, very little, if any, Irish Blood ;).

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Beer
Date: 04 Oct 12 - 08:16 AM

Reason why I asked "meself", was if you had been in Montreal and hadn't got in touch with Bruce or meself, we wouldn't speak to you again.
Even if you are downtown Montreal on business, give us a call and will come and have a coffee with you.
Adrien

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: meself
Date: 04 Oct 12 - 11:46 AM

Unfortunately, I rarely get to la Belle Province these days - thanks for the thought, though - and if I ever do get there, I'll hold you to it. (Business? Well, we'll see how this whole Mafia thing shakes out ... )

__________

Re: policy. Justin spoke pretty much in platitudes, no specific policy statements - but they were the kind of platitudes I for one wanted to hear (uniting the country, economic development in concert with environmental protection, politics of hope rather than fear, trust rather than suspicion, etc., etc.). I'm not ready to pronounce on how satisfactory a PM he would be, but I think he may have what it takes to rally some real opposition to the corporatist zealots, which is job #1 at the moment.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: GUEST,999
Date: 04 Oct 12 - 05:29 PM

Thanks, meself. I am actually quite happy to hear that and I trust your opinion. (I'm kinda NDP and have been for years, but I change that in certain elections if the NDP candidate is in a close race.)

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 04 Oct 12 - 06:48 PM

"real deal"? I know the family. I could say Trudeau can be trusted because his old man did the right things by standing uo for Canada against any and all opponents but I have added trust in LeBlanc. As much trust as anyone can have these days. Trust the system? No. Trust the wo/man? Yes. It's all we have.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 04 Oct 12 - 07:00 PM

Well, gnu, I knew Romeo also, maybe not as well as you??? I did not know him when he taught school or lived in Cormiers' Cove, near Taylor's villiage....but it was later when he matured and was Fisheries minister. I can say first hand that he was "the real deal".

But, I know too many case where the offsprings are nowhere near their parents scale (and sometimes on the opposite pole) to base a judgement on. Basing a persons character on the parents, or the family's overall character alone does not make it with me. In my books, they have to earn my respect and show it for themselves for me to take notice.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 04 Oct 12 - 07:09 PM

Ed... ya got me there. Point blank. I can't prove a word of it. My apologies to all.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: ollaimh
Date: 05 Oct 12 - 01:38 PM

gnu, martin and his followers got control of the riding associations step by step for a decade and that is how he forced chretien to retire two years before planned. chretien should have ridden out the scandals. martin had what ot took to govern but little political sense. ans he had no answer to harpsers dirty tricks.(like getting ther head of the rcmp zacherdelli to put out a letter in mid electio , that the liberals were ubder criminal investigation for budget leaks--then after the election zacherdelli says--opps no investigation after all)

chretien knew how to ride out scandals and dirty tricks.

remember the libertals brought us eleven surpluss budgets without cutting core social programs, and regulated out banks so we had no collapse. we will now have a debt crisis like under mulroney and the next government will have to clean it up.

if justin wins the pm office he will not abandon the liberal fiscal conservatives. he will go with mnore social programs but so did martin at the end.

however it may all be moot--mulcair may have quebec locked up and that would kill trudeaus hopes of governing.

granted justin does not have his fathers history of a phd in economic, studying at harvard, the sorbonne and the london school of economics. and especuially pierre's history of fighting for social justic in qhebec against duplessis, especially with cite libre. but who does? p trudeau was almost uniqie as a politician , having come from a totally inependant background with high education and a history of social activism. kinda like obama. these guys don't come along often. most politicians never have a job out side politics.at least justin taought school and made movies--with his brother.

and he could out box harper or mulcair!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 05 Oct 12 - 04:14 PM

Gez gnu, no need to appoligize to anyone. You did nothing more than give your opinion, as we all do.

When someone makes a statement, I often ask questions for information - not to call them out, or challenge them beyond that. I do this to learn and possibly adjust my way of thinking and to see if I missed something.


Here is Dominics bio- not everyone can obtain a Masters of Law degree from the Harvard Law School>

Dominic LeBlanc

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 08:03 AM

Yes, I did need to apologize because I was absolutely wrong... point blank. I said something I feel but cannot PROVE. Even if he was a saint, it doesn't say what he would do in future.

ollaimh... I agree with your take on Martin and The Little Guy. If Martin had Chrétien's skills and stayed in power (still doubtful, I think) we would be in far better shape. Of course, I can't prove that either... maybe it's just that I loathe The Hair.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: bobad
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 02:02 PM

Trudeau's Turks

The people behind Justin Trudeau's bid to become Liberal leader

By Michael den Tandt, Postmedia News October 6, 2012 10:48 AM

"Without question, Trudeau's rebels embody a generational shift: generation X is finally at the head table. Whether what the campaign is already calling a "movement" also represents a philosophical and ideological shift remains to be seen.

Certainly, there are early signs Trudeau intends to try something unusual: His stump speech is explicitly anti-ideological. His senior people speak about crafting "post-partisan" policy. Behind the scenes they are quietly but deliberately reaching across party lines in a search for ideas.

"I'm not sure I would characterize us a left-leaning," says Telford. "If there's a good idea that's traditionally seen as right … we're all pretty open-minded people. (Solutions) need to be results-driven, and evidence-driven."

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"What we see is old-school rules," says Chin. "Regional divides, regional mistrust … I don't think Canadians are ideological. I don't think Canadians are polarized. I think Canadians want pragmatic solutions that work, and policy based on facts as opposed to making up the facts to justify the policy. That's what we need to get back to."

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"We want to have a relatively flat organization, says Telford. "There are certain accountabilities, but we want to stay as flat as possible and as merit-based as possible. It's about who's willing to put in the work, no matter their background, no matter what party they've been in before, or (whether they've) been involved in past battles."


Read more:

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 02:50 PM

A July column by Lawrence Martin.



Trudeau's inside players

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 02:57 PM

I've got three things to say to Canada about electing the son of a former leader.   George W. Bush

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: bobad
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 03:02 PM

Therefore it must follow that......

Can you say logical fallacy?

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 03:16 PM

GWB was "elected" to do a job, ONE job, that being "leading" a team that would exact retribution with one big ass-kickin at ANY cost. Apples and oranges.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: GUEST,999
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 03:29 PM

IMO, Bush was elected to be the front man for the biggest bank robbery in history. It worked.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 05:48 PM

So... that shit about killing Saddam and destabilizing the region and getting at the oil and gaining contol of the WMDs and... that was all secondary to robbing the western taxpayers of their life savings and they were just extra bonuses, 9?

Nice work if ya can get it, eh?

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: GUEST,999
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 06:38 PM

Pretty much, Gnu.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 06:59 PM

So, does that mean that it don't matter squat who we elect or even who runs ta offer ta lead the True North Strong and gettin fucked up the ass?

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: GUEST,999
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 07:09 PM

Not at all. Who WE elect in Canada is important. The Hair has got to go. Although NDP is my party of choice, were it to look like a close contest between Libs and Cons, I would vote for the Libs in a trice. In the best of worlds, I'd like to see the NDP and Liberals merge, but I don't think that will happen.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: bobad
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 07:17 PM

I'd like to see that merger as well - the Cons would be toast.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 08:33 PM

There are those wo believe that the majority of Canadians are not at the left or right, but in the middle.

Let's say the librals merged with the NDP. Would the NDP ever be able to capture those in the middle. Or, would the Conservatives be the party that would capture that position?

There was a time that the Liberals were the middle party, and benefitted by frequent support from the NDP. I seem to recall that PET's ass was saved by the NDP support quite often, with a benefit to the NDP by the adoption of some left-leaning programs.

In an era of where economic concerns are a priority, the NDP may show poorly. If the priority were environmental issuues, possibly they would do better? A major shift in the past few elections was the so called "new Canadian" vote. The libreals seemed to loose this vote to the Conservatives in the last election?

Another good question is where will the Quebec votes go in the next election? Could there be a resurged Bloc type vote? Can Justin Trudeau (or another candidate) "shake off" the federal poor showing for the liberals? Was the NDP vote just an anomoly? There are far too many confounding factors in Quebec to figure that one out now?

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 08:45 PM

"There are far too many confounding factors in Quebec to figure that one out now?"... no need for a question mark at the end of that sentence!!

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 09:24 PM

:)

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 06 Oct 12 - 11:40 PM

What I am saying about W. is that he came to the job without a lot of experience. We gave him a lot of credit because of his father.

TAKE A GOOD LOOK AT JUSTIN!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: GUEST,ollaimh
Date: 07 Oct 12 - 05:18 PM

i used to be ndp, but my wing kept getting kicked out of the party. in nova scotia in the seventies and bc and federally soon after. ya get the message eventually.   i've been voting green mostly recently. but i have voted liberal when i thought there was a tight race. when i lived in toronto i was in gerrard kennedy's riding so i voted for him. i even voted for him in an advance poll one year. then the next day i met him on the street campaigning. he asked me to vote for him, i said "i already did,you could punch me in the nose now and i couldn't change my vote if i wanted to"

luckily he refrained from rearranging my face.

but justin trudeau needs to win serious seats in qhebec to revive the liberals. it might happen but mulcair is a formidable oponent in quebec. however oif trudeau pulled it off, and captured the moderate vote in ontario, he's on his way to power. his father did it, and chretien did it in ontario in spades.

to compare him the george w bush is silly. george w never had a job except with family money. justin taught school. its a world of difference to actually be in the regular workplace compared with being bailed out repeatedly with family money in losing businesses.i wish justin had more of his fathers history of the fight for civil liberties and advanced education, but pierre was very old world. who has that kind of education and bacjground now?

however i will keep voting green as long qs there is a good candidate in my riding.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 07 Oct 12 - 05:31 PM

High school teacher for a couple of years and then a pro student. Wow!

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 07 Oct 12 - 07:02 PM

On profession alone: Should one prefer a lawyer (many politicians are), a professional politician (quite a few are), or a lobbyist to a teacher?

Just wondering?

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 07 Oct 12 - 07:42 PM

ABSOLUTELY "alone"? Pro politician.

Yes, I caught that. I think... maybe... I don't know fer sure.

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: Ed T
Date: 07 Oct 12 - 07:57 PM

My last post should have read:


On profession alone: Should one prefer a lawyer (many politicians are), a professional politician (quite a few are), a lobbyist, or a teacher?

Just wondering?

Subject: RE: BS: Canucks... Trudeau?
From: gnu
Date: 07 Oct 12 - 09:02 PM

Dominic has officially supported Trudeau. Smart move.