BS: smoking in uk pubs

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Hand-Pulled Boy
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 06:34 AM

Yes indeed. Some years ago I was offered a cigarette. I took it, said thank you, screwed it up and threw it away. Obviously the person was offended but I said that I would have only destroyed it by setting fire to it so what's the problem? Personally I think they should bring back breast feeding in public. I certainly am not offended by it.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Scrump
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 06:48 AM

I always find that during a gig in a pub with smokers present (even if the atmosphere doesn't seem particularly smoky at the time), my voice gets 'croaky' towards the end of the evening. I never get this effect in a totally smoke-free environment (like the folk clubs I go to regularly). I can only conclude that smoke in the atmosphere adversely affects my voice or throat somehow. (I am a non-smoker myself of course, or it probably wouldn't make any difference.)

So I will benefit from the smoking ban in pubs and have to say I'm in favour, although I sympathise with those who say it's another personal freedom being taken away by this government (but against this is the freedom of people like me to not have to breathe in smoke emitted by other people :-))

Interestingly, a few smokers I know personally are actually in favour of the ban, because they say it will give them the kick up the backside they need, to give it up - they say it'll be the one thing that will help them stop! But I guess they are in the minority, judging by the comments from smokers in this thread and others I've seen elsewhere.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Teribus
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 11:45 AM

I have exprienced this transition in Ireland, Norway and in Scotland, and found such bans to be beneficial overall. The sooner England follows suit the better. The thing that amazed me was that in Edinburgh at Murrayfield you are not allowed to smoke ANYWHERE in the grounds, at railway stations you are not allowed to smoke on the platforms. Sooner smoking becomes a distant memory, no matter how fond a memory, the better.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Scrump
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 11:58 AM

at railway stations you are not allowed to smoke on the platforms

As a regular rail traveller, I would be happy if that rule were introduced on the railways. If it's raining, the smokers all congregate under the covered part of the platform, filling the air with smoke, and forcing the rest of us to choose between getting 'smoked' or getting soaked.

Even if it's fine, and I'm standing in the open air waiting for a train, and some b*gg*r comes up and starts puffing away in my direction (if the wind blows the smoke towards me), it's me that has to move away, as there's nothing to say otherwise.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Grab
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 12:26 PM

Why should smokers expect to be able to smoke in a pub? Just because they always have done? Doesn't make it right, or pleasant. At our club's previous home, there was one couple who both smoked who turned up infrequently. There were three people (three halves of three couples) who had lung or allergy problems and couldn't stand being in a smokey room, and who came most club nights. We asked the smokers to stop - they said no. Not our pub, so we couldn't force them. End result - six people who never came to the club again, because they wouldn't take the risk of travelling over and finding that the smokers were there so they'd have to go home again.

That's what I think of when I hear smokers complaining about this. That and the fact that anything we wear to a smokey pub can't be worn the following day, and that we need showers because we stink of smoke. Oh, and that Ireland is apparently seeing more people than ever in pubs now.

Graham.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Captain Ginger
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 12:26 PM

Sooner smoking becomes a distant memory, no matter how fond a memory, the better. Agree wholeheartedly and absolutely!

Thanks to the smoking ban, the pubs and bars in Ireland are far more tolerable now. And as a bonus, the hangovers seem less severe - which must have something to do with not ingesting second-hand smoke, which is a vaso-constrictor. For some time I've avoided pubs - and therefore sessions and singarounds - in the UK because of the filthy stink that lingers in my clothes and hair from smokers, so the bans in England and Wales can't come in a day too soon. I haven't had the pleasure of a smoke-free Scottish pub yet, but hopefully at Easter...

If people want to kill themselves at home, that's fine by me, but I don't want to be collateral damage. Hopefully the day will come when a smoker's 'fix' is regarded in polite society as something akin to having a shit - necessary perhaps, but most definitely not to be shared.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Bagpuss
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 12:30 PM

"Personally I think they should bring back breast feeding in public."

As far as I am aware, it never went away. And in Scotland it is an offence to try to prevent someone breastfeeding in a public place.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 01:02 PM

I must admit that some of the more belligerent of the anti-smoker posts would be almost enough to tempt me to take up smoking. More important, if I were a smoker that kind of thing would be the very thing to help keep me smoking. I think that is something people ought to take into account when tempted to indulge in diatribes on the subject.

The ban on smoking in pubs is a human rights thing as well as a matter of public health. People have a right to socialise in a non smoky atmosphere. People who do smoke have a duty in common courtesy to confine their habit to places where it doesn't cause physical discomfort to others - which normally means outdoors. This would even apply if smokers were in a majority - but in fact they are in a relatively small and dwindling minority.

Here's an article from Wetherpoons about plans for the ban - "When smoking was banned in pubs in Scotland, last March, most Wetherspoon pubs erected awnings and added patio heaters, so that smokers would not feel left out in the cold.

Shelves, tables, chairs and even fireplaces were made available in new outdoor facilities, so that smokers could enjoy the same pub atmosphere as those indoors.

Artwork outside the pubs is designed to reflect pub interiors."

All sounds very civilised. Maybe this kind of thing might offer a setting for music sessions...

I'm still puzzled why the ban is coming in for Wales and Northern Ireland in April, but England has to wait till July.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Stu
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 02:06 PM

I do smoke the occasional cigar, and go outside the pub to do it whatever the weather. Why should other people have to put up with my filthy habit? I am not interested in making my friends clothes stink and wafting smoke across them.

As for restaurants, the ban can't come soon enough - it's horrible eating whilst some smaggo tries to give you lung cancer.

I'll make a deal with smokers - you can smoke next to me as long as I can fart directly in your face from about 1cm for the combined duration of each ciggy you puff.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: dagenham doc
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 02:32 PM

Here in New Zealand smoking in ANY public place has been banned for ages. There was a huge cry with all the protests echoed here…………… heard it all before. Now it has settled down and all is back to normal. In the pub sessions when smokers want to smoke they just step outside. The remarkable thing is the amount of people who talk to one another now whilst they have their ciggy and who used to be strangers. A new culture of "smirting" (smoking and flirting) has emerged. Oddly enough prostitution has been legalised but if they want to smoke they have to go back down on the street.!!

Doc

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Rasener
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 03:03 PM

An example of selfishness and stupidty

The other day, I saw a neighbour leave in his people car smoking. His three young children were in the car.

Another

Talking to receptionist at the bowling alley in Lincoln about when they would be changing. She said it couldn't be soon enough. She gave me a flyer showing how they would deal with it by July in stages.
We got to talking further about smoking. She said she was out with her 10 mates the night before and they all smoked. They were at a pub where one room was smoking and the other was no smoking. They weren't bothered about her, so she had no choice but join them in the smoking room, otherwise she would have been sitiing on her own.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: *Laura*
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 04:17 PM

Well I work in a pub... and I hate it when I'm working and it's really smoky cos I can't get away.... but I don't mind smoking in pubs and clubs when I'm out....

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 04:24 PM

I stopped going to pubs over ten years ago because I developed an allergy to 'raw' cigarette smoke...that is direct from the cigarette not after inhalation. I smoked from the age of eight until I was 43 yrs old but developed the allergy some 5 yrs after giving up. If I go to a pub/club where people are smoking...even if I don't have a drink...I wake in the morning with what feels like a hangover. So....banning smoking in pubs...for me...is great as I love dancing in those local pubs that allow it and I can go to all the Folk Clubs without fear of hangovers unless I drink too much...which I never do!.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 07:06 PM

Outdoors I don't see smoking as a "filthy habit". Liable to be unhealthy, but that's a different matter. Keeps the flies off.

Pipes are a more civilised way of smoking - cigarettes are a convenience smoke, analogous to convenience foods, and in both cases these have tended to displace older and better ways of satisfying the same appetite.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 07:32 AM

McG, come and sit at one of the outside tables at Starbuck's in Lincoln High Street - you'll soon revise your opinion on whether outdoor smoking's a filthy habit. Dozens of cigarette stubs littering the floor around the tables (despite the ash-trays ON the tables), burn-marks on tables and chairs, those butts which are stubbed out and left in the ash-trays to mingle with spilt coffee and wet napkins stink beyond words, ash all over the chairs, and a foul stench of stale tobacco about the area.

Smoking is disgusting. As are its proponents.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: fair maiden of nottingham
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 08:10 AM

i agree with the segregation, but to be dominated pisses me off.
if a publican employs smokers behind the bar, it should be his choice to allow....as a none smoker you have the right not to enter the pub,
now us smokers have no rights...i see even train stations are band.

hell St.Pancras is in the open air. so where next.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Rasener
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 08:15 AM

>>i see even train stations are band<<

Never heard of that Band - are they good?

I don't think you are dominated Fisheye. Lets just say that the majority (non smokers) have actually won against the minority.

Even I will start going back to the pubs when the smoking stops with my children.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Rasener
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 08:17 AM

>>
Even I will start going back to the pubs when the smoking stops with my children<<

LOL I will rephase that.


Even I will start going back with my children, to the pubs when the smoking stops.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 08:45 AM

Hehe...

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Stu
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 08:52 AM

"but to be dominated pisses me off"

Hmmm - so it's OK for a smoker to dominate everyone in a pub by physically assaulting them with your carcinogens? Perhaps you would prefer just being able to twat them in the mouth when you go in for a pint?

Truth is, this isn't domination of smokers by non-smokers - it's a health issue. The sooner poor hard-done to smokers get that into their heads, the better for them and everyone else.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: GUEST,concearned
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 09:02 AM

Is not a "twat" in the mouth also a health issue especially in a strange pub??

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 09:12 AM

Certainly is for the dirty-bastard smoker who gets twatted. LOL!

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Rasener
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 09:18 AM

I thought getting a twat in the mouth was called muff diving?

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 10:43 AM

ROFLMAO!

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 10:57 AM

Why the comtinuing insinuation that smoker's parents never married?
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 12:14 PM

Just a turn of phrase to express disgust Skipy!
I'd refer to them as 'buggers' - but it might be taken by some as even more offensive! LOL!

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 12:27 PM

LOL
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: GUEST,concearned
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 04:07 PM

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL

I'd rather stand next to a bar full of smokers than Strollin'Johnny or skipy. What a pair of bastard twats. LOL

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 04:10 PM

What a very sad person you are, seek some help.
Best Regards for a speedy recovery.
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Captain Ginger
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 04:20 PM

Nah, we'll just put a kink in his oxygen tube when he's got terminal emphysema. Watch him drown in his own phlegm - that'd be a larf!

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: GUEST,concearned
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 04:25 PM

Then there were three!............Bastard twats, that is!

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Captain Ginger
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 04:35 PM

Aye, and one of them was an oncologist. A smug one, at that.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Rasener
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 04:42 PM

And when you get Cancer of the bladder like I did through smoking.

You will love them going up your willy with a camera etc and cutting the growth out and the Chemo in the bladder delivered in the same way many times, and the years of going back to be checked to make sure it hasn't come back and again the camera stuck up your Penis. Also the pain and anguish that it brings to your family and the pain and anguish that you feel wondering if you life has come to an end.

Think on GUEST Concearned - don't think that you won't get it.

I think you are the stupid bastard twat that thinks you are invincible.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: GUEST,concearned
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 05:00 PM

Sorry for your trouble Villan. I don't smoke and I am for the ban.
The sanctamonious attitudes of "The Three Twats" does, however, give me cause for concearn.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 05:03 PM

Reveal yourself, coward!
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Rasener
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 05:13 PM

Sorry to you as well, I thought you were a smoker, and if anything I was trying to make you see sense. :-)

No need to be sorry about my troubles. I am 8/9 years down the road from that horrible discovery. However, I wouldn't like anybody else to have to suffer.

Well I know one of the three and he is a very nice guy, but like me is anti smoking.

One of the problems is that a forum like this can often in text give the wrong impression.

One of the other problems, is that gueats come on this forum so often and incite and most of us do not take kindly to that. Basically they are wind up merchants. Us members stand up for what we beleive.

However based on your last post, you don't seem like one of those Guests.

Why don't you join Mudcat. Are you a performer or part of the folk scene?

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 05:22 PM

Villan, for goodness sake, he bowls into here calls all & sundry "Bastard twats" & you want to embrace him.
I to am really saddened to hear / read what you have been through and hope that it is all behind you now.
Regards Skipy.
Oh & by the way even though you have been quite vitriolic in this thread, I DO respect your point of view, it is just that my life will alter totally in a few months & I will no longer be able to be involved in a lot of local associations & others will lose out too.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 05:30 PM

Smokers don't notice that their clothes are impregnated with the smell of stale cigarettes, or that they reek of smoke.

I've come home from folk clubs and sessions in smoky pubs, and my clothes, skin and hair smell of stale cigarette smoke. I lost my voice at Whitby festival on the first day one year because I was singing in a smoky pub.

I'm looking forward to 1 July.

The bad news, though, is that patio heaters aren't energy efficient, and contribute to global warming.....

Kitty

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: jacqui.c
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 05:37 PM

Skipy - you could always stop smoking. You have time between now and July. Just think of the money you would save!

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 05:45 PM

Jacqui, I was hoping to stop but this crap has given me the resolve to carry on, I am actively increasing my smoking!
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: GUEST,concearned
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 05:46 PM

Villan, I thank you. I will and I am.
Good night and God bless.

Skipy...........Same to you.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 05:53 PM

Take care.
Regards Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 06:02 PM

Skipy

You don't need resolve to carry on, because it's what you do anyway. It would take resolve to stop (as would, one day, I'll stop drinking beer...).

Kitty (who doesn't smoke, but does drink beer)

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 06:03 PM

I gave up once for 11 years!
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 06:15 PM

11 years impressive - what started you off again?

Kitty

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 06:18 PM

Divorce! way back in 1981.
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 09:25 PM

The difference is, beer is good for you.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Jan 07 - 03:58 AM

I live in the West of Ireland in a town where all the pubs are small, one roomed affairs. In general they are run on small profit margins.
The smoking ban has been in place now for a couple of years, has worked like a charm and is here to stay. The effect it has had on custom is very much swings and roundabouts; some people have stopped coming in, but others have increased their visits because of the additional comfort. Overall, it has had no adverse effect whatsoever.
It has been accepted wholeheartedly by smokers and non-smokers alike (with a few, begrudging exceptions - but you salways get them).
As a non-smoker I no longer get sore eyes and shortage of breath while enjoying a pint; my clothes don't smell like somebody else's old ash-tray the following morning and, best of all, the risk of my lungs being turned into lace curtains has lessened considerably.
I could, of course, give up the pint, the company and the music that my local offers so that people can continue their anti-social, unhealthy and eventually fatal habit, but somehow that seems a little unfair.
To those who suggest smoke-free areas in pubs, a letter to a newspaper summed it up beautifully:
'Having a smoke-free area in an enclosed building is like having a pee-free area in a swimming pool'.
Good health,
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: Rasener
Date: 17 Jan 07 - 04:20 AM

Skipy
>>Villan, for goodness sake, he bowls into here calls all & sundry "Bastard twats" & you want to embrace him.
<<

We all say and do things that later when we reflect on it, maybe wished we haden't or maybe have toned it down.

Guest Concearned did apologise, and it seems will join and is on the folkie scene.

I am all for forgive and forget.

Anyway Skipy if you went 11 years without smoking, you can do it again. It just requires a determination to stop. You will also feel all the better for it. So give it a go again.

Subject: RE: BS: smoking in uk pubs
From: skipy
Date: 17 Jan 07 - 04:38 AM

100 (a day!)
Skipy