BS: Our Grandpas

Subject: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Apr 07 - 10:54 PM

My maternal Grandpa was in the second to last Oklahoma land rush.
Gambling and prohibition made for a lucrative income when farming was tough but then came oil. His oil estate was distributed over 100 relatives.

My paternal Grandpa was killed by the Nazis.

Great Grandpa was in the civil war.

The other one, I don't know.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: fumblefingers
Date: 22 Apr 07 - 11:06 PM

Great Great Grandpa was a Texas Ranger in 1837 and an Indian Agent for the Republic of Texas in the 1840s. He was also a Cherokee Indian.

Great Grandpa was an Irishman (born in Derry) who became a medical doctor. He practiced on the North side of the Red River in Indian Territory, which became Oklahoma in 1907.

Grandpa was a small time farmer/rancher in the Chickasaw Nation, which became Carter County Oklahoma.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Apr 07 - 11:13 PM

One of my grandfathers, I believe, is one of my guardians.

Well, you asked.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: jacqui.c
Date: 22 Apr 07 - 11:28 PM

My paternal grandfather was a brigadier in the Salvation Army and officiated at my christening. We called him Grandad Chocolate, because he always had treats for us when we visited. I lost him too early, before I reached my teens.

My maternal Grandfather had been a teacher but, when I knew him was retired and I think was senile. He also died when I was a child.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Mrrzy
Date: 22 Apr 07 - 11:37 PM

My paternal grandpa was a wonderful Quaker dude; my maternal grandfather survived WWII just long enough to see who else did, because he both had a heart condition and ran the local newspaper: When the Nazis came into Szabatka/Subotica and got rid of influential jews, he was sent to some hospital and after the war, was sent home in an ambulance.

Paternal grandma was a White Russian who was sent to the States just before the Revolution, she thought to visit her dad but then she could never go back. Said dad sold her to conver his gambling debts and then committed suicide.
Maternal grandma died in Auschwitz, suicide by Nazi, kind of. She said she was sick and needed to go to the hospital, and everbody said no, they'll just kill you, but she went anyway. She was an amazing artist before she got married.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Janie
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 12:15 AM

My maternal grandpa died in a coal mine accident when my mother was but 9 years old. I don't know much about him or his family. His family didn't have much to do with Mom's family after he died.

My paternal great grandfather was apparently as mean as a snake.

My paternal grandfather was 'the salt of the earth.'

Janie

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Metchosin
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 12:15 AM

My paternal Great Grandpa was sentenced to 2 years in the BC Penitentiary for operating an illegal still. If he hadn't drank so much of his profits and had known the right people to pay off, he might have given the Bronfmans a run for their money.LOL

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: mg
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 12:25 AM

My father's father, John Garvey, was a railroad section boss. Somehow we got the idea recetnly he was station master but I don't think so. He died in the Spanish Flu. His wife, Ella Devery (relation to big bill???) made chairs and had been a milliner..we think she made lace. My grandfather on my mother's side was a Baptist preacher/plumber/sharecropper. I don't know if my grandmother had an outside job but was undoubtedly a sharecropper too. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 01:13 AM

Well, my paternal grandfather died before I was born, but as some of you know, through my dad's and sibling's stories, I felt as though I'd known him. He was a larger-than-life rancher and a hell of a shot. His father, who had been a lawman in the Cherokee Strip,was a pioneer rancher on the western slope of Colorado and is the one who had a shoot-out with a neighbour. Said neighbour's widow reputedly said it was the best thing anyone had ever done for her. My dad's maternal grandfather was from Nova Scotia and looked like a tall, not too heavy Santa, with a long, beautiful white beard. It's that side I got my red hair from.

My maternal grandpa died when I was five, so I knew him a little bit. I have his chair and a picture of him sitting in it, with his pipe. He made wooden toys as a hobby, giving 100 away to needy children in Denver each Christmas. I have a few, precious ones he gave me as a child. Fortunately, his wife, my grandma, wrote her memoirs when she was in her 70's and I have those, including some about him courting her and their early days as a married couple. He was originally from Pennsylvania.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Ebbie
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 01:41 AM

Fascinating. I want to hear more!

My grandparents on both sides were Amish. My paternal grandmother died when Dad was 25, about 10 years before I was born. They said that the doctor didn't know what was wrong with her, she just kind of wasted away. In recent years I have suspected from how they described it that she had lupus, as I have had also.

Grandpa never married again but I learned a few years ago of a child of his. I never met her; she died in her middle 70s, I think. It infuriates me that my Amish relatives never took her into our family. It was one of those archaic hushed-voice situations. One of my sisters did meet her- and that sister was as bad as the rest of them.

Most of my grandparents lived to be a good age My paternal grandfather was almost 96 when he died and the other two lived to be 78 and 76.

My father always said he didn't want to live as long as his father did, and he didn't. He was just past 93.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: MBSLynne
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 03:03 AM

This is really interesting!

My paternal grandfather died when I was only a few months old. He was a slater and tiler in Middlesex but a bit of a layabout so if it rained he wouldn't bother to work. My Dad worked with him for his first job but got so frustrated by his slap-dash attitude to the business he 'ran away to sea' and joined the navy.

My maternal grandfather was the son and descendant of Leicestershire farm labourers. He was one of these people who could get horses to do anything he wanted. He lied about his age when he was about 16 or 17 and he and his brother joined the army. That was in 1911. In 1914 he was one of the British Expeditionary Force and sent over to Europe at the very beginning of the War. He fought in Ypres among other places and was there to the very end. He was gassed when the Germans first started using gas and had no sense of smell and very little sense of taste. He also had barely a whole digit on either hand because ends had been blown off by shrapnel.

His father was another layabout and heavy drinker. The army didn't pay the soldiers direct but sent their money home. When my Grandad got back his father had drunk all his pay. He died a drunk in the almshouses in Melton Mowbray with the family having little or nothing to do with him.

My maternal grandmother's father was a groom then coachman for Lady Otteline Neutrick, sister of the Duke of Portland. When cars became popular he learned to drive and became her chauffeur.

My paternal grandmother's father was also a coachman and ostler.

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Cats
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 03:26 AM

My Grandfather was a Quaker. He refused to fight when he got his call up papers for the war and was sent to prison. He was released at half past six in the morning and re arrested at 29 minutes to 7 for being awol!! He was a member of the Society of Friends Ambulance Service that went into no mans land and brought back the dead and injured. He was branded a 'coward'.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: bubblyrat
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 04:03 AM

My paternal grandfather managed to survive the First World War, but like so many others, his experiences affected him for the rest of his life. He served as a driver in the Royal Army Service Corps, and drove trucks loaded with shells up to the front.When the trucks arrived, they would park up some distance from each other, in case one was hit.On one occasion, he pulled up, leaned out of the window to shout something to his friend in the next truck,and saw him blown to pieces as the truck took a direct hit. He was also gassed, and suffered from "Shell-shock " . He was, oddly, transferred to the Navy,and ended up as a Petty Officer in the Royal Naval Armoured Car Division !!! I was lucky to have him for the first 22 years of my life-----He was great company, and taught me a lot.Sadly, he suffered from deafness , and shook uncontrollably all the time,( Parkinsons Disease , but we blamed the shelling ) and ,in later life, spent long periods in hospital. He died in hospital, in Henley-on -Thames, in 1969----I really loved him, and still miss him today !!
   My maternal grandfather, on the other hand,was run over and killed in Fulham ,in 1926, when my mother was only 1 year old, so I never knew him ,and nor did my mother !! He came from a long line of Ekes from Norfolk, and that"s all we know !!

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 05:12 AM

My maternal granfer was a dairy farmer, my paternal grandfather was unknown. My paternal grandmothers' husband was Granpop... looked like Fraser from 'Dad's Army' - long face, sunken eyes, crazy wild eyebrows! He was a builder/agricultural labourer for most of his life. I have no knowledge of him other than he served in the village Home Guard with my father - if he was Fraser, dad was Pike - youngest in the platoon, ears like the F A Cup, wore a scarf....

I've traced back 7 generations in my maternal granfers family - his father was originally a thatcher, the family trade that goes all the way back to the 1720s and beyond. My paternal side, it's mostly agricultural labourers, carters, sawyers and woodsmen.

My granfer, born in 1905, avoided active service in WWII as he had a proteced occupation, but he did billet several soldiers, was a member of the Royal Observer Corps and fed half the village with his rabbit snares. Granfer the Spiv... as he was in his younger days... quite the catch!

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 05:27 AM

Granfer (maternal) had a mortar land close behind him in World War 1 and had bits of metal in his body and legs at the back....hundreds of bits...had trouble walking when he got older but would never talk about how many he had killed........Grannie, a lovely woman who like her odd drink or six of Sanatogen tonic wine and always for some reason had to go to bed after lunch as 'she could not carry on'
Grandad (Paternal) contracted sleeping sickness during WW1 and had a distended tongue. He could only stomach milky cereal products such as rice, semolina, tapioca and he too had the shakes as described by Bubblyrat..diagnosed as Parkinsons but attributed to shell shock by family. Gran was a very dainty woman who had love for all and whose skillet...a huge frying pan...used to come out over the victorian open range, when we visited, to make round sliced potato chips which were fried in dripping and salted in the pan.....mmmmmmmmm delicious! They had a hand worked pump to a well outside from which the most pure water came...in spite of this it was condemned by the Council eventually when mains water came through.....

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Bee
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 06:21 AM

Both my grandfathers were dairy farmers, but one was less successful because of poor farmland. Mom's dad had good land, and he was a great reader of 'how-to' books. He acted as local farm vet when there was no professional vet in the area, and reportedly was pretty successful.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Metchosin
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 06:55 AM

My paternal great Grandfather was known, by the more religious and upright of the family, as "The Black 'n". He was considered a nasty piece of work, whose only contribution was his ability to produce a lot of children. As a young man in the late 1800's, he managed to escape an explosion at the Wellington coal mine, outside Nanaimo BC, by climbing up a cable, loosing most of the flesh on his hands in the process. Unfortunately, his younger brother, age 14, along with 77 others, did not survive the disaster. Perhaps this experience had some bearing on his demeanor, but I believe liquor probably had more.

His son, my paternal Grandfather, left home at a very early age, after beating him for throwing a coal oil lamp at his long suffering wife. The family tale of my grandfather's outburst always seemed odd to me as a child, because my grandfather was the gentlest of souls, much loved by his grandchildren. A tiny man, made even smaller by scoliosis, he spent a great deal of his retirement with us, taking us for walks and building garden swings and whirligigs in his basement workshop. My favourite whirligig was "Dudley" the little wooden man who furiously cranked away whenever the wind blew. Sort of reminded me of Grandpa.

Because of his diminutive size, when we were young, we grandchildren delighted in playing dress up in Grampa's clothes, particularly his salt and pepper cap and long tweed overcoat and shoes. He died in his late 80's, when we were teenagers and my brother wrote the following regarding him during his last days:

Grampa Jack

I watched as you daily unremembered things
sort of like baking a cake in reverse
a little less of this, a little less of that
take away one teaspoon of the past.....
But suddenly fold in one lucid moment!
a sprig of over sweet lilac
one milk cart which left you a hunchback...one donkey engine
a kerosene lantern lantern sent in a drunken rage across the head of
your beloved mother, by your father who you beat unconscious
and left forever....
three lost brothers, or,
were they lost family photographs....?
And then there was the time when that locomotive derailed
and you were there to pull the engineer from the wreck but the stream
had done its damage, like your years, and when you took his arm
to pull him to safety, his skin slid off his arm as smoothly
as Garbo's evening glove, only....
gone
blank
Eyes like wet, grey sand and a rattle of a voice
through lips as thin as tin...no teeth, you see
saying "who are you"
and you crushed who you loved but no longer knew.....
And I watched quiet....hurt...angry...ashamed, as you slipped
behind that veil of ether to unremember me
for the last time

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 07:01 AM

My maternal grandfather joined the Navy in 1912, and shipped with Scott but not on his Antarctic voyage.
He served on destroyers right through WW1 and became a wireless telegraphist, a weird new science.
When he retired from the navy he became a coastguard.
My paternal gf died before my birth. He was the youngest of a large family on an Irish farm. He drove horse and electric trams in Scotland, Newcastle and New York.
He bcame a nurse and worked in the prison service. They would not release him to fight. He applied twice.
He assisted the famous pathologist Spillsbury on post mortems after hangings, including that of Dr. Crippen.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 07:05 AM

"Grandpa was a tinsmith, he started was a tinsmith
The forman of the shop"

From Grandpa Was A Tinsmith.

My Fathers father was Lars Peter Rasmussen, and was born and raised in Denmark. He was a tinsmith, as the song says, and took pride in having worked on a cathedral there. A tin cathedral? Nawwww... I'm sure they had drain pipes and flashing.. He came to this country as a young man and settled in a Danish community in Northern Wisconsin.
He met my Grandmother there, who was also Danish and had come here as a young woman. She came over here as a maid for the Diamond Family of Diamond Match... the largest manufacturere of matches in this country.

"Grandma worked for Diamonds
She started at the top"

My Mother's father had a dairy farm, Cedar Acres, in southern Wisconsin.

Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Grimmy
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 07:39 AM

Paternal great great grandfather joined the Police in 1860 to escape the ravages of the cotton famine in Lancashire. He made Inspector.

His son, my great grandfather, also joined the police but was fired for drinking on duty. He somehow managed to re-enlist, but was again sacked for drunkenness. So THAT's where it came from!

His son, my grandfather (a teetotaller) also joined the police. His career was interrupted by WWI during which he was gassed by the Germans. He survived but was rendered almost totally deaf.

His son, my uncle, also joined the police before emigrating to Oz. Four generations of policemen - is that some kind of record?

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Micca
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 07:46 AM

My Maternal Grandad I never knew, he died before I was born, but my mother told me his love of Opera was passed on through her and to me, unlike my mother though I like the Operas he liked, Mozart and Wagner etc but she preferred Verdi and Puccini.
My Paternal GF was the one that is the subject of this song HERE he really did survive the First World War, mostly by the methods outlined in the song, the details whch were gleaned from family stories, many of which were ended abruptly when us kids were noticed listening!! He really was nearly drowned in a latrine during the German advance on Amiens in the spring of 1918, he died in the early 1950s from (according to the Post Mortem) the effects of a substantial piece of shrapnel lodged in his pericardium for 40 years.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: MBSLynne
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 07:51 AM

Interestingly, though so many men who survived WWI would talk about it only reluctantly and had it's mark left on them mentally as well as physically, my Grandpa seemed to have had a whale of a time. Despite the horror of it he sounded as though he enjoyed himself and would tell you stories about it for hours. He suffered no lasting psychological effects and I've often thought it was because he did talk about it so freely rather than bottle it up. He died at the age of 82. Funny...it was his wife who suffered the shakes from Parkinsons disease.

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: ranger1
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 08:13 AM

My paternal grandfather "Grampa Moses" was a little, twinkly-eyed French-Canadian who was always singing and telling me stories. He uses to let me "help" in the basement workshop when I was a little kid and I learned fractions by sorting the sockets in the socket set into their proper places. He died when I was 13 at the age of 84 and I still miss him 25 years later. But, I have a copy of a field recording of him done by Margaret MacArthur, so he will always be with me, in a sense.

My paternal grandfather and I were also very close. He was a WW2 vet who was on the Italian front and received a bronze star and cluster and at least one purple heart. He never talked about any of it. He worked in several woolen mills after the war as a "fixer" until he retired at 65. We used to watch old westerns and the World Series on TV together and we did a lot of camping in the White Mountains. This is all good stuff, but he could be a real mean SOB, too. He used to gamble and drink his entire paycheck on payday. leaving my grandmother scrambling to find food to feed a family of six for the next week. He could say some god-awful nasty things and a bit of a bully sometimes, too, but he was better with me than he was with his own kids. I like to think I was his second chance to get being a parent right, as he and my grandmother raised me until I was about six. He died 14 years ago at the age of 69, terminally ill with some lung problem that he probably picked up in the mills, by his own hand. I was living with he and my grandmother at the time and I was the last person he spoke to: "good night, little one" as I headed to bed.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: artbrooks
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 08:24 AM

My paternal grandfather (the first Art Brooks) ran away from home at age 17 or so to join the Navy. The family had mostly been farmers in Greene County, New York since the 1740s. He was aboard ship for the end of WW1, but the US Navy didn't see much of the war. After he retired, he was an apartment house fireman in Providence, Rhode Island - that means he shoveled coal for building furnaces. He was recalled as a Chief Bosun during WW2 but never left the US. My maternal grandfather was a press operator for the Bureau of Printing and Engraving; I have a memory of him taking me down to their building in Washington and showing we all of the stamp and currency bloopers that were caught in inspections. He was the first of his line born in the US; his father was originally French (and mostly absent) and his mother came over from Ireland at the age of sixteen.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Crystal
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 08:33 AM

My Paternal grandfather was a London stockbroker who served in the RAF towards the end of WWII.
My Maternal grandfather was a teacher with a double masters (French and English) and a running blue from Cambridge.
His father was about 60 when he was born and a retired major.
Both were interested in the sciences, history and the arts and both wrote a little. I got the science and arts, my sister got the history and arts!

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Rapparee
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 08:44 AM

My paternal grandpa, Ed, was a carpenter. During Prohibition he decided to get rich, as the man across the street was doing -- only instead he got 180 days in the Workhouse and the Sheriff got his still. We still have his personal still though; my Grandmother was throwing it out after the old man died in 1968 and my brother rescued it. He made houses and was pretty good at it, but he didn't believe that education beyond grade 8 was necessary. He and my father had some serious rows, I understand, because Dad wanted a life outside of carpentry -- one that included acting in the local theater company and reading, for example.

Ed, my maternal grandpa, was a machinist and draftsman. He and his twin brother, Ted, bought a ranch outside Lewiston, Montana. Ed went Back East to court and marry Clara -- which he did, and thereby provided my mother and uncles -- but who, when they were newly engaged and Ed announced that after they were married they'd be living on the ranch, announced in a shocked voice, "You want me to move WHERE?!??!?" And so he spent the rest of his life in Illinois. Insulin-dependent because of his diabetes, he died of a stroke in 1953. We kids inherited his test tubes (he had to do the old Benedict Blue test every day) and his auto-injector and hypodermics. We found that you could use the auto-injector and a hypo needle as a wonderful water gun that would shoot a stream clear across the living room. Grandpa was an inventive soul and would have loved that!

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 09:07 AM

Metchosin - That poem of your brother's is a fine piece of work, well-craft and moving.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 09:20 AM

My paternal grandfather was a metal machinist & died when I was 2 months old. He was a widower, who lived with his only son, & Mum moved into the house when she married.

The house had been built in 1916 by his father who was a stonemason. The basement/foundations of the house apparently contained blocks from Sydney's old General Post Office (built c.1850) & removed in renovations in the later part of the 19th century or earlier 20th.

Dad's Grandfather had worked on a lot of Government buildings in his career with his father who was also a stonemason who arrived on Oz in 1870s from Liverpool. Dad's grandfather married the grandaughter of a convict who came from York in 1812. The convict & most of his sons beame landowners with large properties, except for my direct ancestor who was a blacksmith.   

My maternal grandfather died when I was around 7 & I have no memories of him, tho in much later years I always agreed with Nana when she spoke about him & agreed with her when said I remembered him. I was his first grandchild & apparently I loved sitting on his lap, buttoning & unbuttoning his cardigans. He was a house painter & lost his business during the depression.

His father was a cabinetmaker/French polisher & arrived in Oz before 1869 from Sussex.

Mum's maternal grandfather was an cordial manufacturer, and his father-in-law was an inkeeper who was born in London in 1825 & arrived in Oz before 1855.

My cabinetmaker GGF made some beautiful miniatures which I had custody of in the mid 70's after I moved into my own place. One day my younger sister visited & said Mum wanted them back. Years later Mum asked where they were & I said I gave them to her cos you wanted them. Sister denied knowing anything about them.

They were very small & beautifully made - one cabinet of 6 or 8 drawer, all with mortise and tenon joints, was only about a finger long, 2 fingers wide & several fingers deep. The drawers were too small to fit a fingertip into! I hope they went to a good home, not landfill.

sandra

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: MBSLynne
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 10:27 AM

Someone mentioned the Home Guard. My Grandpa was horrified to find that he couldn't re-join the army at the beginning of WWII because, having put his age up to join the army before WWI, he appeared to be too old! My Mum says the Home Guard saved his sanity. And other people have likened their grnadfathers to members of Dad's Army. Mine was most definitely Captain Mainwaring!

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: mack/misophist
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 10:58 AM

The paternal grandfather was a Polish emigrant and worked as a jewelry fabricator and sometimes designer for Tiffany's of New York. In those days the job didn't pay bupkis. The maternal grandfather was murdered - almost certainly - in prison; a nasty and complex storey.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Grimmy
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 11:26 AM

My maternal grandfather (illegitimate son of a Glasgow docker) fought in both wars. He lied about his age in WWI because he was too young, then again in WWII because he was too old. Barmy!

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Ebbie
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 12:38 PM

My paternal grandfather was a farmer in North Dakota, farming entirely with horses. I've seen pictures of the draft horse herd- more than 40 of them.

Grandfather had taken his family to Wisconsin, where my mother and father met and married. Along about 1925, Grandpa and Dad along with two other sons plus one son in law moved back to North Dakota where they bought a number of sections of land and began farming in a big way.

Then came the drought and the Great Depression, and one by one they lost the farms. Everyone, in theory, was equal but in practice they discovered that Grandpa was more equal than the others.

My maternal grandfather was a carpenter by trade and a preacher and bishop by vocation. He was skilled in counselling and mediation so he was sent to Amish "colony" after colony to settle disputes among the parishioners which meant that my mother lived in many different states and communities. One of her favorite memories of when she was a little girl was the whole year they spent in Salinas, California. She loved the school and the teacher and she had a special friend. It always made me feel sad that she had so little continuity in her early life.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: open mike
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 02:02 PM

interesting to hear these stories..I will add mine.

I never met either of my grand fathers.

My father's father died when he was a young man.
His family was from Denmark. They lived in an
area of Nebraska that had many other Danes. One
town there is called Copenhagen. He had been in
banking and I recently learned he may have had
some dealings with the oil industry in Wyoming
in the 1930's. My aunt spoke to me on her death bed
(earlier this month)of an oil scandal in the Casper
area..Tea Pot Dome. unsure of his involvement in this,
but there were numerous land dealings in the area
surrounding Casper.

My paternal grandmother sold insurance to support
herself. I have a calendar from her business in
1949 on my wall. Her family was from an area which
was between Germany and Denmark...Schleswig-Holstein.

On my mother's side, her father is a mystery to us.
He disappeared when she was 4 (1921 or so) and my
interest in genealogy is mainly inspired by searching
for evidence of his whereabouts after that. One story
says that he went to a neighboring state to acquire land
to which he hoped to move his wife and family. I have no
idea if he lived or died...i hope some day to find a clue
about his life. He was born in 1885. I have found info
about his parents, grandparents, great-grandparents and
more, so my searching has turned up lots of data and I
have contacted many of the relatives on this branch of
the family tree. They lived in Pennsylvania and in Dutchess
county in New York. They were "Palatines" from Germany and
travelled thru Holland and England perhaps before coming
to America. Many of the family settled in Iowa, Minnesota
and Nebraska.

My grandmother spent many years on the family homestead.
Her parents were Swedish and I think she may have been
named after her aunt in Sweden. i saw their church in
Skåne province in Sweden a couple of years ago. I have
an interest and an affinity in Swedish culture and music
and have named my Nyckelharpa after her.
She took care of several of her batchelor brothers and
some of the main products from this farm were hogs and
watermelons. Later she moved to town and re-married...
much later...my step-grandpa worked at the Greyhound Bus
station--selling tickets.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Alice
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 03:18 PM

My granpa, Earl McConnell, was a philosopher, prospector and proud to be the first to run on the Socialist "ticket" in Yellowstone county Montana. He died on his gold claim on the banks of the Yellowstone river, near Gardiner, MT, in 1977. He was interviewed by Charles Kuralt in the tv series "On the Road". Years later, when Kuralt was asked who he remembered most from the series, he named two old men, one my grandpa McConnell. When I did a google search to find something about him, the first page that came up was a "Political Graveyard" index to politicians.
McConnell, Earl — of Montana. Socialist. Candidate for U.S. Representative from Montana 2nd District, 1942.
Google also came up with a link to ordering the Charles Kuralt video of my grandpa.
http://openweb.tvnews.vanderbilt.edu/1973-8/1973-08-09-CBS-20.html
When asked what would happen if he died on his claim, he said he would just go up to the meeting of the positive and the negative in the sky.

I remember visiting him with my parents when I was a kid. We would drive down and camp on the claim, fish for the big trout in the Yellowstone. I would find flint and obsidian flakes in the sand and garnets among the "concentrate" he would pan from the river. The last time I saw him, I was in college and went to visit with a friend who was from Gardiner. We found him trying to keep some kittens warm that had been born that night. They died from the cold. He had an old cookstove in his shack that he used for heat, my uncles taking coal to him. He would not move from his place. It was crude living, but he felt free there.

After he died, my parents had to remove all the implements, his shack, outhouse, the garden fenced by old bed springs, the very old Ford truck. It was Forest Service land that he had filed a claim on and lived on. When everything was removed, they named the location "McConnell River Access". They put up a highway sign by his dirt track that wound down to the river and people use the spot for putting in boats for rafting.

When I saw him last, he told me he would sing an old Lake Michigan song to the rafters who would come there to put boats in. He was a folk singer and musician. He played fiddle.... I still own his violin. My grandmother would play guitar and he would play fiddle and they would sing and call dances in their younger days. My grandmother's name was Maggie. He was fond of singing When You and I were Young Maggie. His claim was called the Maggie and Me. I didn't know that until after he died. I was walking down along the river among the cedar trees and found an old tin can that he had flattened, nailed to a tree and punched with a nail to spell Maggie and Me claim.

Alice

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Big Mick
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 03:25 PM

Alice, my friend never met, that post is bound to be a Mudcat classic. There is a song hiding in there somewhere. Why don't you stake a claim and pan for it a bit?

All the best,

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Bill D
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 03:56 PM

fascinating stories! Quite a history we have.

My maternal grandfather, Albert Walker Martin, was a barber in Missouri, where my mother was born. He moved to San Diego, California in the late 30s and worked part-time as a painter. I barely remember him, as my mother & I only went to visit once, in the summer of 1942, (on the train from Oklahoma...full of service men)..my grandfather took me to the San Diego zoo (we threw peanuts to the bears) and to the beach...and swung me between his legs...*smile*. The next year, he died in a fall from a ladder while painting a theater lobby.

My paternal grandfather, William Lindsey Day, was a farmer in western Pennsylvania in 1900-1912 or so, when he moved the family first to the Oklahoma territory to try his hand in the oil boom....I guess it didn't work out, because in a couple of years they moved again...to central Kansas, where they operated the hotel in Lost Springs.

here are 2 pics....at their "mansion" in Oklahoma (my father is on the right), and in front of their hotel in Kansas (at the far right, Grandpa is not there)

I never met William Lindsey, as he died in an auto accident when his 'touring car' driven by my older uncle "turned turtle", as the newspaper article says. I do have his pocket watch, though, and a medal for sharpshooting he earned in some sort of military training in the 1890s.

Almost all of the male members of my family were the wrong ages for recent wars....so maybe that's why I'm here.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Shaneo
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 04:17 PM

I don't know much about him , except he was interned during the Irish war of independence in Kilmainham jail , there is a plaque in the jail with his name carved on it. [John 'The Brown' Dardis]
He died in the fields behind our house while looking after cows.
His son also died in the fields not too far away , he was blown up by an unexploded bomb he found.

How sad ,,as a family we never talked about these things , if the subject was brought up ,we were quickly told to s,,,,

enough said

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: RangerSteve
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 04:30 PM

I never knew either of my Grandfathers. On my mother's side, my GF was mostly a farmer, moving from Arkansas to Idaho to Colorado before settling down. He worked as a cowboy in Idaho for a while. His father was born in Illinois, moved to Arkansas and then to Idaho and farmed all his life. His father was a stone mason in Ohio and Illinois. I think it's safe to assume that I came from a pioneering family.

On my father side, my grandparents were born in Yucatan Province, Mexico. They came to the U.S. (The Bronx) in 1920, and my grandfather eventually started up his own manufacturing bueiness, mostly making things that other people invented, but didn't have the means to manufacture themselves. Apparantly, he was pretty successful, and was able to move his family to one of the more affluent sections of Brooklyn. My dad didn't talk about him much, as they apparently didn't get along.

Both my GF's died before I was born.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: mg
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 09:06 PM

I just today found out the names of my great great grandparents..Michael Devery and Bridget Whalen..might be a Kentucky connection but I am not sure..they were born in Ireland and he was fairly old to start with...Deverys were flax farmers in County Offaly Ireland..some came to Ireland from France..named Deveraux..in French Revolution I believe...a number of them..they say those in US are all related...don't know. Might be related to Lost Jimmy Whalen as well..mg

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 11:08 PM

I think there is a good book in this thread. What say you, Mudcatters? Stories about grandpas? I'm looking for a new editing project and I have nine ISBN numbers going to waste.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: mg
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 11:16 PM

good idea...but what about the book you were going to do about grandmothers.??? One of each? mg

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 11:45 PM

Sure, mg! I don't remember one I was going to do on grandmas, unless it was the memoir by my grandma which I was working on and the memoirs of my dad on the other side of the family. The family history book I was calling "Touchstones of our past." Is that the one you meant? I was in a fog for a year or so before my surgery and until about 6 months ago post-surgery, so my memory needs to be refreshed once in awhile.:-)

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Sorcha
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 12:03 AM

I have no info on my paternal granfer except he was a farmer in Elk County Kansas and died when my dad was 15.

My maternal granfer was a switchman/telegrapher for Santa Fe back in the days when tracks were switched by pulling levers by hand in 'the tower'. He was so good with Morse code that he could speak out loud what was coming over the wire as it came in. He was also a very fine finish cabinet maker/woodworker. Sadly, I have none of his work. My evil sister absconded with all of it except one library table which my brother has.

He also 'carved' things by hand. He made a model of a 3 masted schooner (I think that is what it was....)that was about 3' long. My cousin has that. He took it to a refurbisher to have the sails and lines re-done. He was asked, did your grandfather make this from a painting?

Well, yes, but HOW did you know that? (We are all land lubbers in Kansas). Turns out (as all you ship folk know) that a ship is NOT exact on the port and starboard sides, but gramps didn't know that, so made them exactly the same. Both sides of his sailing ship are port. I guess it's sorta 'priceless'.

He also made my grandmother an English style 'tea cart'. All hand carved and hand turned. A drawer, shelf on the bottom, rubber mounted 'tyres' on the hand carved wheels, etc. of American Walnut. I think that ended up in the cousins on the East coast of the US. MD, PA, etc.

When I was little I was allowed to visit him at 'the tower' once in a while and he'd let me try to switch the tracks by hanging by my hands from the levers. Never did manage it. Never learnt Morse Code either.

He was also heavily involved in Boy Scouting as a Toop Master for years. Got my dad involved in that too.

He was not a WWI vet because he was the sole support of many people and in the transportation industry. He sent his sons to WW2 tho. I have his and grandmas wedding photo and a 2 of his early (learning period) furniture pieces.

I miss him. He died when I was about 16.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Flash Company
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 05:00 AM

Both my Grandfathers died before I was born.
Paternal grandfather was Joe Quinn, An Irish protestant from Cork. He married a Belfast catholic! Dad used to say, 'Don't talk to me about the Irish troubles. they were fought out in our kitchen every Saturday night!'
He died a very nasty death of throat cancer when Dad was about 16 years old. Dad's great fear was that he would go the same way.
Maternal Grandfather was Thomas Percy Gwilliam, Farm labourer, Morris Dancer, Musician, Woodworker, Maker of early radio sets.
He was killed by a drunken driver in 1937 just four months before I was born in an era when there were very few cars on the road.
I know that I inherited a lot of Grandad Gwilliam's characteristics, although not the dancing ability, much to Sheila's disgust. I have an old photograph of him which I found in Mum's collection after she died, he is sitting in his old fireside chair in earnest conversation with someone, leaning forward with his hands on his knees. When Sheila first saw it she said 'My God, I have seen you sit like that so often in the last 25 years. If you had a moustache that could be you!'
I can honestly say that, until I found it when I was scanning old photos onto the computer, I had never seen it before.

FC

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: fat B****rd
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 06:31 AM

Usually when I read these "Family threads" I ignore them because My Family doesn't seem interesting. However...my paternal grandad Charles Victor Eugene Stenger was the grandson of French glass makers who came to Sunderland in the 1850s to work at Hartley's glassworks where his uncle was killed falling in a pit in 1974 Grandad Stenger had three children my Father being the eldest. As far as I know he worked as a glassmaker all his working life and must have done quite well because he had a largish house in Sunderland where he died in the 1960s.
My Mother's dad Edward Selby was born in 1875 and joined the Durham Light Infantry in 1894 seing service in Afghanistan, India and eventually South Africa where "A bloody Boer shot his horse from under him"He worked for the Sunderland And South Shields Water Board after being demobbed 1n 1902 until October 1914 when he went to war again as a reserve and ended up back in India until 1919 he went back tothe Water Board until retiring and died in the 1950s.
I wish I'd known them both better.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: bubblyrat
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 08:10 AM

What a lovely story from Alice !! Earl McConnell sounds like he lived the kind of life many of us can only dream about !! Thankyou for sharing, Alice.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Rapparee
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 09:02 AM

I wish I'd known ALL of my grandparents -- and my parents -- better. Not to mention all of those who came before my grandparents...gonna have a heckuva family reunion one of these days in, I hope, the far, far distant future.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Donuel
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 10:53 AM

Grandpas DNA can't be tracked the way grandma's can.
A portion of the mothers DNA gets passed down unchanged.

Since momma grandma married 3 times I Guess I have 7 grandpas.
I wish I had stories about grandpas but I only met 2 which were of no relation. All I have are vague outlines consisting of jobs they had.

I have no knowledge at all of my biological dad's dad. But I bet I could find out. All I know is my dad's aunt was Gene Hackman's mom which must mean that I share one of Gene's grandpas.

One managed the VFW that was so thick with cigarette smoke you could not see the far wall. He got emphasema.
One got to fly WWI airplanes but froze his lungs and was grounded. Later he went to Chicago and worked for Sears as a graphic artist for their catalog.
On my step father's side grandpa was a tinsmith in Boston and made pots, chests and anything else made of metal. He liked to tell of fixing Babe Ruth's fenders, which were frequently dented. He learned to read English, unlike gramdma who read only Yiddish papers or a little bit of German, Polish or Russian.

The Mormon church is supposed to have one of the most extensive geneology libraries in the country. Its reason e'etre may be founded on racism but I hear it is accurate.
Then there are all sorts of pay as you go geneology websites that I don;t trust as far as I can throw them.

Who do you trust for geneology data?

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: katlaughing
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 11:10 AM

The LDS one is very extensive, but can also be expensive and not as accurate as some might think. I have fought with a guy who posted a family tree on their site for years and they will not make him either take it down or correct it. I have sent him and them proof that he has my grandma married to her sister's husband and her sister married to her husband (my granddad.) They do have vast amounts of data, but each time they add a new one, they also find a way to charge more money for it.

I really like genforum for person-to-person queries and it's free. Also, there's Family Search, which is free and, if I remember correctly, is an LDS site.

A good place to start is Cyndi's List which is the most extensive listing of genealogical sites on the internet.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 11:21 AM

Hey Fat B... My great great uncle was in the Durham Light Infantry, during WWI. He too, served in India (photograph of him in Coonor, Christmas 1917) and was finally killed in Arras.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Beer
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 04:32 PM

Mum's side. my grandpa served in WW1. Got home stayed about a month then split. Mum was 3 or 4 at the time. I guess he just saw to much and couldn't cope when he got back.
Dad's side, my Grandpa was a fisherman and at some point started to can lobster. I'm told he was the first person to do so. "First meaning what" On P.E.I. or whatever.
Beer (adrien)

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: bobad
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 05:20 PM

I was just looking at the Canada immigration site and found the records for the arrival of my maternal grandparents. They landed at Quebec city exactly 80 years ago yesterday.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Becca72
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 06:42 PM

Sadly, I know next to nothing about either of my grandfathers.
My mother's father died 9 years before I was born. He worked for the local power company for his entire adult life.

My father's father died when I was around 1 1/2 and I know nothing about him.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Alice
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 06:55 PM

Although I knew my grandpa Earl McConnell, I didn't ever meet my grandpa Lawrence Flynn. He died when I was about a year old.
He came to the US with his parents and siblings from Glenfarne, Leitrim, Ireland. He was 17 when they immigrated in about 1882.
He married a woman from Guissborough, Yorkshire, and they left the family homestead area of Tintah, Minnesota and settled at Old Forge,
near Scranton, PA. I don't know why he moved so far away from the rest of the family. I heard that they did not like the idea of his marriage to an English girl. He was a fireman in Old Forge or Scranton, Pennsylvania.
When my dad was a year old, his mother died along with the last baby she had. Apparently, my grandpa Flynn was not able to cope with this.
My aunt Anne was about 16 years old, and she raised my dad and kept all the 8 kids together. My grandpa was going to split them up
and send them off to different relatives to live. Anne would not allow it and was like a mother to my dad and the other kids after their
mother died.
I have an old photo of my grandfather Lawrence Flynn taken probably in Scranton. He is wearing a dapper suit and fedora and has
a handlebar mustache.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Donuel
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 07:02 PM

Lots of Irish folk back then got into the US through Canada.
Now its Boston that is most friendly.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Ebbie
Date: 24 Apr 07 - 07:06 PM

Gracious, Becca. Ask your dad.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 25 Apr 07 - 03:23 PM

My paternal grandfather died in 1916 at the Somme six months after his wife (my grandmother) died of TB and he started volunteering for anything and everything earning himself the military medal and enough bars and oak leaves to sink a battleship. My father collected them at the age of six from Buckingham palace after my grandfather died. My maternal grandfather worked on the docks in East London. He was from Waterford but fell out with the family due to his rejectio of Catholicism. I never met him either as he died about ten years before I came along.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: GUEST,Mickey191
Date: 25 Apr 07 - 07:09 PM

Took my Mom back to Cork in "61. Her Dad was about 85 & wee bit shrunken from arthritis I guess. Handlebar mustache and easily offended. I refused a cup of tea saying"No thankyou." Never heard the end of it for a week. So I learned to fake it.

Took my Mom, Aunt and himself for ride and lunch in Dunmanway. The waitress was stunning-with beautiful red hair down to her backside. She was about 18. At one point she had her back turned to Grandpa & he ran his hand down the flowing hair-resting for a beat or two on her derriere. (Or Derry Air since we're in Ireland!) She turned and gave him a huge smile as he crooned "Lovely-just lovely."
The 3 females apologized. The maiden said:"happens all the time--but he's the oldest."

If that happened today the man would be in the slammer. He sang all the way home. That's my John Triggs story.

My Dad's Father was a stern fellow from the North of Ireland. I know only that he stopped bidding Good Day to a former friend when the friend married a Protestant! I was shocked when my Dad told me that story-Dad said,"Mick, I guess he was a bigot." Got that right.

Love the song "Emmigrant Eyes" especially by Danny Doyle.
"When I look in my Grandfather's Emmigrant Eyes-I see starting with nothing And working hard all of his life."

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Gulliver
Date: 25 Apr 07 - 09:27 PM

Maternal grandfather joined the Dublin Fusiliers and ended up in the Boer War--Colenso, Ladysmith, etc. When demobbed he became a telephone technician and at the end of WW1 was awarded a medal for some mysterious "services in connection with the war". He sold the medal for a plug of tobacco.

Paternal grandfather was also in the Dublin Fusiliers (his father had also been in the army) and served in India and Egypt before being sent to France during WW1. He was involved on the medical side of things. After the war he was part of the Expeditionary Force sent to Archangel in Russia to fight the Red Army. He was into music, played piano, fiddle, whistle, mouth-organ, etc. so I know where my musical interests come from!

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: GUEST,IB48
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 12:03 PM

Both grandfathers were killed in second world war.Wish i could have spent some time with them,they were both such great characters.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Mickey191
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 12:15 PM

This great thread brings to mind Kevin McGrath's "Before you slipped away." When I read that - I always think of my Dad-(also a Grandfather of one.)

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Grimmy
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 12:39 PM

It's great to read about all these folks and what they got up to. There seem to be quite a few 'characters' amongst our forebears. And no, fat B****rd, all families are interesting - even the 'uninteresting' ones.

Here in the UK, it's been estimated that 75% of surnames have become extinct since 1250 - wars, disease, famine, disasters (natural and man-made) have taken their toll over the centuries. We are all special.

For those of English ancestry, there are some free genealogy resources out there:

eg Free BMD Search (incomplete but growing)

Birth, marriage and death indexes are also being added per county:

eg Lancashire, Cheshire to name but two.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 05:38 PM

Grimmy, thanks for the links. What, may I ask, does "BMD" stand for?
Thanks,

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 05:49 PM

Something else folks might be interested in, along the genealogy lines: Free DNA testing for a genealogical database. Apparently, if they match yours with someone else's they will put you in touch with them. If you want a full report, you have to buy it from a professional company for which the original company offers discount coupons. Interesting to say the least.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Mickey191
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 06:24 PM

HI Kat, I was puzzled myself about BMD-till I reread Grimmy's post. Birth, Marriage, & Death. I couldn't get the site to link. Probably a webtv thing.

I can see the DNA thing will cause some people some nightmares. Will make the lawyers rich.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 08:12 PM

BMD - I thought it was Billions of Moms and Dads.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 10:46 PM

LOL, meself.

Thansk, Mickey, duh, I shoulda figured that one out!

Subject: RE: BS: Our Grandpas
From: Grimmy
Date: 27 Apr 07 - 05:38 AM

Births, Marriages and Deaths - or as it's known in the trade: 'Hatchings, Matchings and Despatchings'.