Morris segregation

Subject: Morris segregation
From: The Sandman
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 08:48 AM

In my opinion,Morris dancings image needs to be improved with the general public.
Dancing standards need to be improved to do this.
the desegregation of Male Morris sides,is one way to acheive this,by utilising the best women and men morris dancers in the same side [where geographically possible]you are increasing your statistical chance[by using a greater pool] of providing a better display.
The morris federation,has as one of their aims,theimprovement of standards,The Morris Ring[As far as Ican see from their site]has as their aim to encourage the performance of morris and to maintain its history and traditions.
Open Morris have as their aim, like the Morris federation,the allowing of alldancers male or female and or mixed ,they also believe Morris dancing should be fun.
can we discuss amicably.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: manitas_at_work
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 09:03 AM

We could if you wouldn't make such sweeping generalisations in one thread and then retreat to another when you're told that you are just plain wrong.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Dick The Box
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 09:10 AM

Before we get into discussing the composition of morris sides as a means of improving public perception maybe we should be considering the show itself. It has to be said that morris dancing is not exactly the most riveting of spectacles and most people, myself included, get quickly bored. The way round this is to put on a show and interact with the audience before, during and after the dance. Fools - just putting on a silly costume doesn't make you funny - get in among the audience and do your stuff. Dancers - don't ignore the public - talk to them, do stuff, entertain them. Musicians - have fun with the tunes - get off on the beat - feel part of the dance. Remember, the audience want a show not a visit to a museum. Great dancing is a bonus - even the crappiest of sides can still be entertaining and memorable.

PS Go and watch Great Western Morris at Sidmouth to see what I mean.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,Ex-squire
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 10:35 AM

Admirable aims.

And then team politics comes into it...

Why is the worst dancer (almost always) the most willing, not only to turn up, but to do other stuff too?

Who are we dancing for? Ourselves, primarily, I suggest, but for the buzz of the public too - otherwise we'd only ever dance in private. (Hmm - back to the Ring feast?)

I remember someone from the Fed commenting years ago that the male team squires complained they could never get some members to practice, but dance-outs were never a problem, whereas for women's teams it was the opposite way round. (Still something to do with having the kids & shopping in tow, I suspect, despite years of 'equality')

How do you encourage people to improve when they just want to be social? With some small village/community sides there's not a lot of choice - you take what comes, and those who want to make it good have to dance with those less concerned, or not dance, or travel miles and miles to find an alternative.

But I agree totally with 'engaging the audience'. You can't fail to have noticed the ones who stand at the front are the other dancers - it's as if we never contemplate the public might actually WANT to watch!

Afternoon ramblings...

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: The Sandman
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 10:36 AM

MANITAS AT WORK,I am not retreating to another thread ,you may disagree with me it doesnt mean that I am wrong,I am starting another thread because it is a different subject,we are no longer discussing the morris ring and its health.,on this thread.
Dick the Box, has made a good point about entertainment,with which Owould also agree.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 11:03 AM

Morris dancing doesn't need to be perfect. The worst thing you can do to morris dancing is not to do it! In order for the masses not to get embarrased at the spectacle, they need to put aside what they believe they are required to like - disco dancing and other jigging on the spot for instance.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,PMB
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 11:18 AM

As a non- dancer, I can only talk as a spectator. A few points though- first, the music is all too often bloody awful. Some will argue that it isn't about the music, but the dance. But the crowd are listening too, and if they think the music's naff it will prejudice them against the dancing. OK, you can't all have ace musicians with loud instruments, but all too often the ethos seems to be directly against any quality here. Is it better to use a band of non- dancers who can play, or a dancer or two who know the dances inside out, but who can't string a tune together?

Most of the dancers we seem to get locally are Cotswold, and it gets a bit same-ish- same dances, same squeaky melodeons, same dress, same tunes, same jokes. Same every year. I know it's ritual, and traditional, but there must be some scope for variation. If you are following the same tour pattern, even the determinedly ignborant will find it getting stale after a view viewings. Be prepared to mix traditions and styles a bit?

Would integration help? Don't know, but an injection of youth and enthusiasm might. Many of the sides I see are the same as 10 years ago, but fatter, older, greyer and more arthritic. I would suggest that a side that doesn't have a new young dancer every other year will eventually die. And if this means persuading some of the older members to retire, remember Kronos and Ouranos. Perhaps run a veterans' side.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Morris-ey
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 11:21 AM

Birdseye

"
In my opinion,Morris dancings image needs to be improved with the general public."

Why?

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: dermod in salisbury
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 11:23 AM

Male morris sides have a vigour which suits the dances themes, ritualised combat among them. The appeal of traditional female dance groups, with beautifully coloured and embroidered costumes is equally attractive, but seen less often these days. Where UK seems to differ from European folk dance tradition, particularly that in the slav countries, is that we have fewer opportunities for mixing the best of both traditions in a combined dance. Mixed morris sides are a poor substitute. I visitedd Saintes in France a few years ago during its annual festival of international folk dancing. What a revelation that was.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Morris-ey
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 11:26 AM

"Male morris sides have a vigour which suits the dances themes,..."

If only that were true...most are old, fat, and unfit. Some are young, fat and unfit. Some are young and unfit. And then there is Bad Border...

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Folkiedave
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 11:48 AM

Dick, it would help if you would say how often you have seen dancing recently, and precisely what you saw that you think needs improving.

Otherwise you are taking other people's opinions as gospel and it just looks like a troll.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: RogerTCB
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 11:57 AM

The gender mix of a side has nothing at all to do with their technical ability nor their entertainment value.

The worst sides I've seen have all been mixed (sorry, I'm not prepared to name them here) but I suspect that's only because they are more of social club than morris side. They do the dances they enjoy performing & allow anyone to have a go regardless of ability because its sociable & fun & inclusive.

The best dance sides seem have a strong control on the quality of those who are allowed dance out - Hammersmith, Great Western, Berkshire Bedlam & Windsor spring readily to mind but there are others, including some mixed ones I'm sure. They get their kicks from dancing well, getting it right reliably & looking good doing so.

Whether a side is good or not is down to the sides culture and the drive of their officers and not the gender mix.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: The Sandman
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 12:10 PM

folkie dave Iwill pm you.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: The Sandman
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 01:09 PM

Morrisey ,Because it has been portrayed on the mass media by people like the two Ronnies,As just a load of pillocks prancing about waving hankies.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,Mikefule
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 02:00 PM

Interesting. Does Captain Birdseye put all this intellectual effort into improving his/her own Morris side and still have time to share it with the rest of us? Or is this a bit like me (a non cricketer) holding forth in the pub about how poorly the England cricket team sometimes performs?

90% of everything is technically very poor quality. Most books, most poems, most pop records, most brass band music, most football matches, and most Morris dancing. That doesn't mean it isn't fun or worthwhile.

I have been dancing for 24 years in a Cotswold side. Periodically, we trim our repertoire because it keeps grwoing.

It typically stands at about 30 dances plus half a dozen jigs, plus a few that we dance from memory with little or no practice.

The practice season is about 34 weeks long, from which we lose one practice for the AGM, one for Christmas, one for New Year. If everyone turns up every week for an entire hour of solid practice, that gives us roughly 1 hour's practice per dance per year.

With other commitments such as work, family, bands, other hobbies, and eating and sleeping, one evening a week set aside for Morris practice is a big commitment. Not everyone can manage it.

So if we can manage straight lines, a reasonable level of vigour, no collisions or falls, and some degree of uniformity of style, over 30 dances from six varied traditions, that's pretty good going.

As for the performance, as a Fool, I constantly talk to the audience, trying to make a show from the limited ingredients available.

All the dances the same? Only in the same way as all Irish reels, all Bluegrass tunes, all ballads... I notice that we have in our repertoire:
Handkerchief corner dances
Handkerchief set dances
Handkerchief column dances
Single long stick dances (set and corner versions)
Two long stick dances (set and corner versions)
Single short stick dances
Two short stick dances
Rounds dances
Solo jigs
Double jigs
dances for four, six and eight men.

We could do a long show without doing two dances that looked similar to anyone who was watching with any degree of interest at all.

Go to Bampton and watch the real thing: six men and anything from one to three or four musicians. The dances are simple. The costumes are simple. It is done with reasonable vigour and dignity, smiles, straight lines, and a respect for what they are doing. But they manage without all the paraphernalia that has attached to revival sides. There are no extreme costumes, no throwing of sticks (no sticks at all), no beast, no circus skills, no blackened faces.

Go to Headington Quarry and see the real thing: six men and a musician. Simple, almost boring, costumes. Simple steps, simple figures. A reasonable level of vigour and dignity, smiles, straight lines and a respect for what they are doing.

Go to Winster and see the real thing: a dozen or so men doing a very simple dance to a small "band". Simple costumes, rough and ready lines, broad smiles.

Go to Hayfield and see the real thing: one simple dance with only three figures, danced all day.

It is a mistake (one I have made over the years) to try to make the Morris into more than it really is. It's simplicity is part of its magic. It is there whether the person in the audience watches or not. We all prefer a good crowd and a bit of banter, but that is not esssential to the tradition. It is part of the modern "show business/street circus/competing for attention" attitude. "Look at me, I'm a Morris dancer; I'm mad I am."

The Bampton sides attract a crowd on a wet morning in May simply because they are there.

The music, I agree, is often done badly in many Morris sides. The priority has to be the dance. The musicians should play for the dance, rather than the dancers dancing to the music. One instrument or several; melodeons or fiddles; pipes or concertinas, the principle is the same: play to the dancers. However, even this is not clear cut when dealing with processional dances where the band marches ahead and plays and the dancers follow.

It isn't perfect; it is what it is.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Folkiedave
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 02:49 PM

We could do a long show,

We couldn't. The whole of your side must be mega-fit. Or young.

Or both......:-)

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Marje
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 05:04 PM

Guest PMB, I used to be a morris musician and I know what you're saying. But the sad truth is that most morris sides don't have a lot of choice about the music, because they have to find people who are prepared to do it for free, every week of the practice season and for every dancing-out occasion. Many really good musicians prefer to go off and form a dance band and make some money for their performances (sometimes having served their "apprenticeship" playing for a morris side).
And, however it may look, the musicians have to have practised with the dancers on practice nights. They don't have to be dancers, and in many cases they are not, but they need to be even more committed than the dancers because they have to be there every time and maybe even do some practice (although I agree that's not always evident).
Another problem is that sometimes the dancers themselves, who are mostly not musicians, don't really know how to tell the musicians what they want. They know when it's good and when it's not, but they often can't say why, so they're not much help to the aspiring musician.
Some sides are lucky enough to have a really good musician or group of players, but others have to make do with whoever knows the dances and is prepared to turn up on the night.
Marje

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: treewind
Date: 01 Aug 07 - 05:25 PM

I went on a trip to Germany with White Horse Morris from Wiltshire some years ago. Our hosts there were a local German dance group who do complex couple and set dances rather like fancy version of our ceilidh and social dances, but in costume as a street display. They invariably used recorded music played though a ghetto-blaster. We thought this was odd, and they were very impressed that we had live music.

It brought home to me the value of our tradition that that, however incompetent the musicians, we always have live music for morris dancers. Don't knock it, though it's a bonus when the musicians are good as well, and it's a great challenge even for a good musician to do it really well.

By the way, on that German tour there we had an 18 year old lad with a big mop of dark hair, playing fiddle and English concertina some of the time. His name: John Dipper!

Anahata

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,EnfieldPete
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 02:30 AM

Good/Bad I think it's great - always a great time can be had by all. Wish I had the courage to 'have a go' - but with no dancing ability, I'll remain a dedicated spectator. Lomg live Morris Dancing - however it's presented. It's the taking part that matters - not the outcome.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST, Mikefule
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 02:31 AM

Morris teams aren't "lucky to have musicians".

There was a time a few years ago (a few = 20, ahem!) when our side was temporarily short of musicians. So I bought a melodeon and learned to play some of the Morris tunes on it. Being a dancer does not stop you becoming a musician too. In our practices, the musicians take it in turns to play, sometimes solo, sometimes in twos and threes. I cannot remember ever having a musician in the side who didn't dance.

Right now, we can dance to 1, 2, 2.5 and 3 row melodeons, fiddle, pipe and tabor, and harmonica, trombone and (soon) Anglo concertina, with 7 out of 14 of us able to play for the dance at least some of the time.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,Ruston Hornsby
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 02:56 AM

Following on from Mikefule, a team that I danced with years ago owned a Hohner Pokerwork which the dancers could borrow, the idea being to encourage new musicians by letting people "have a go".

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 04:21 AM

I remember at the Morris Ring day in Essex somewhere in 1985, that the majority of the musicians stood well back from the microphone supplied at the display except for those with an excellent side from New England - what a difference it made.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Morris-ey
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 04:42 AM

I don't believe the general public gives a damn about morris dancing.

We dance firstly for our own enjoyment, secondly for the approbation of our peers and thirdly for money. If we could combine all 3 and drink loads of ale - result!

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Folkiedave
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 04:45 AM

If we could combine all 3 and drink loads of ale - result!

If? What do you mean "if"?

What do you do? :-)

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Marje
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 05:05 AM

Mikefule - your side is lucky to have such a choice of musicians, including people like you who take the trouble to learn to play. Many sides simply don't have enough people with the talent and/or enthusiasm to take up an instrument, and I know several morris musicians who play for more than one side because in some areas there simply aren't enough musicians to go around.

As far as playing to an audience goes, I agree up to a point that the dance has to be done for its own sake, but if you forget about your audience, you do yourselves and them a disservice. A good side will think about where their audience is positioned before they decide "which way is up"; they'll make eye contact with the audience and perhaps involve them in an occasional novelty or closing dance. Dancers who appear to ignore the audience come across as self-indulgent and precious, and that just irritates people. If you're going to invade people's space and impose music and dance on them as they sit ouside a pub or at a fete, you owe them some sort of respect and attention.

Marje

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,redmax
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 05:14 AM

I think Dick The Box nailed it when he recommended putting on a show and interacting with the audience. I saw a local dance team perform in a country pub last year. The bar was filled with young lads drinking lager and there were plenty of sarcastic grins and sneers when things kicked off. It looked doomed, but the team's captain kept circling round the pub chatting and joking with everyone, and pretty soon the dances were getting jovial applause. By the end of the evening the lager-drinking lads were all joining in the dances and having a roaring time. Fun is infectious, and the morris should be fun, yes?

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: The Sandman
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 06:38 AM

yes, and the same could be said about music,technique for techniques sake is not music.,
But technique is required,tp perform certain manouevres so an optimum aim, might be good dancing with fun.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST, Mikefule
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 03:23 PM

Yes, maybe my side is lucky to have so many musicians - but it is the sort of luck you make for yourself.

One lad played melodeon, but took a shine to the pipe and tabor and spent hours and pounds learning - an instrument that is precious little use outside the Morris context.

I played "only" harmonica. It was too quiet for outdoor Morris. So I bought a melodeon and learned to play it. I didn't particularly like the standard 2 row box so I borrowed a 1 row from a friend's wife who plays for her Morris side. I liked it and bought one myself. I developed an idea I'd like to play Anglo. I bought one, and instantly was lent a "how to" book by a member of the side. Encouragement and sharing of knowledge and instruments.

A violinist joined us. He wanted to become a fiddler... he organised some get togethers at his house for the other musicians to practise and to help him to learn the tunes and style.

Another lad has no desire to play music, much preferring to sing, yet he has a box because he knows at any time we might need someone who can knock out a tune for a dance.

Right now we have seven out of fourteen who can play for some of the dances. 50% of a group of ordinary middle aged blokes. If we can, any other side can. In my 24 years with the side, at least three semi-professional musicians have lapsed their membership, but we have always been able to replace them.

It's something to do with the side's ethos. Everyone is allowed to believe he can do it if he wants. Five of us teach the dance, and nine of us sing in pub sessions. The technical quality is variable, but the enthusiasm level is consistent. It comes from believing that the Morris is important.

Does the pubic care? We have had one actively hostile response this year - but even at that pub, most of the other customers came out and watched and cheered. At every other pub this year, in a dreadful wet summer, we have had people come out to watch us, or we have danced inside and received a good welcome. They have laughed at the right bits, cheered at the right bits, and asked us questions afterwards.

Sometimes the "crowd" at a pub has been two people; sometimes it has been thirty or more. At Thaxted a crowd of thousands watched two set piece shows each an hour or so long. Last year we did a weekend in Spain and had the local ex pat population proudly showing us off to their Spanish friends.

Yes, the public cares, if only you give them an opportunity to do so.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,PMB
Date: 03 Aug 07 - 03:53 AM

the pipe and tabor ... an instrument that is precious little use outside the Morris context.

O stone me not so. Get anything by Poul Høxbro and judge for yourself.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST, Mikefule
Date: 03 Aug 07 - 01:03 PM

I am happy to stand corrected.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Dick The Box
Date: 12 Aug 07 - 05:24 AM

Reply to FolkieDave.

Sorry about the delay in posting but I have been at Sidmouth playing for the morris, stewarding & performing in a booked ceilidh band.

I have been involved with morris since the late seventies including starting a couple of teams (both single sex and mixed). I started my dancing career with Great Western in Exeter and although I no longer dance due to dodgy knees I am still a regular musician for them (although I live in the Midlands!).

I have seen many morris teams during that 30 years and I stand by my comments. A good standard of dancing is a great help but not essential. It is engaging with the public and entertaining them that wins them over.

Cheers,

Richard Ashe aka DickTheBox

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Penny S.
Date: 12 Aug 07 - 04:28 PM

Ummm. As audience, not dancer or musician, could I make a small suggestion?

I was watching - I don't know how many I had already watched that day - a side performing near the old east gate of Rochester, when I realised that what I was watching shared something with English bell ringing. Of which I have read someone expressing astonishment that only the English would use bells to do maths. Leaving out the leaping and the handkerchief waving and stick bashing, the way the men change places does seem a bit mathematical.

I don't suppose most of the sudience would be that interested in maths, but would it help to demonstrate a particular figure before the dance and ask people how many times they saw it repeated. Or ask if they could follow where a particular dancer travelled in the dance?

(I went on that day to devise a Dr Who plot involving getting all the sides to perform a particular sequence of moves at the same time as the local ringers rang a particular ring which would activate together some buried .... anyway, the activities are an attempt to restore some ancient mathematics. Can't remember whether it was a buried spaceship or a Buffy type apocalypse sort of thing.

How to prevent the disaster? Free beer, I should think.)

Penny

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,Malcolm
Date: 12 Aug 07 - 06:16 PM

RogerTCB said "The best dance sides seem have a strong control on the quality of those who are allowed dance out - Hammersmith, Great Western, Berkshire Bedlam & Windsor spring readily to mind but there are others, including some mixed ones I'm sure. They get their kicks from dancing well, getting it right reliably & looking good doing so."

First, were it not for the "ordinary" Morris sides there wouldn't BE any "best dance sides", in the same way that professional football couldn't exist without the local clubs and kick-abouts.

Second, few sides can manage the sheer numbers from which to pick an elite squad. And what are the others supposed to do, when told they are not "good enough" to dance out (after practising all winter)?

Those of us who don't (and never will) reach the standard of the 'smiffs still get our kicks from dancing as well as we can, getting it right as often as we can, looking as good as we can, and using the summer dance-outs to improve as much as we can.

And we still get applause.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,Muso Dancer
Date: 12 Aug 07 - 08:44 PM

and why do Festival organiser - rip off Morris Teams? Expect them to dance for nothing - or maybe the odd complimentary ticket, but pay other artistes?

come on you Fest organiser get your hand in your pockets - Morris teams start standing up for you rights - if festival organisers don't offer a fair payment for your performances tell them where to go!

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Snuffy
Date: 13 Aug 07 - 09:01 AM

Say £60 for a weekend ticket, minimum 12 dancers per side, and ten sides and you're looking at over £7,000 worth of concert seats and campsite places the organiser can't sell.

And dancing for "nothing" (a free ticket) at a festival is a lot cheaper than having to pay 60-odd quid to dance at a Ring Meeting

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Folkiedave
Date: 13 Aug 07 - 09:12 AM

Dick - Sorry cos' you got the wrong Dick. My comments were aimed at Captain Birdseye - (Dick Miles) and have been long answered so no need to go back over that ground.

I have long been an admirer of Great Western and have danced with them a number of times. (Sheffield City)

I think you have the complete answer - a high standard of dancing, and great engagement with the audience.

Best regards to my old friend Dave Brassington if you would be so kind.

Dave Eyre

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 13 Aug 07 - 08:26 PM

From what I saw at Sidmouth and Dartmoor - I thought Tarka danced with oomph, and so did Bampton. If you have time to spare, spend it in the air...

Kitty

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Dick The Box
Date: 14 Aug 07 - 05:20 AM

Thanks Dave. I will certainly pass on your regards to Dave Brass when I next see him. If you could return the favour to Dougie MacCallum. It was good to see Doug and Jane at the Whit Tour in May. His rendition of "Doon in the wee room" left many a moist nostalgic eye. It's a shame we never allow him to sing anything else!

PS Perhaps there too many Dicks in the folk world?????

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: Folkiedave
Date: 14 Aug 07 - 06:59 AM

The problem with Morris sides at festivals is that some Morris sides do take advantage - six dancers and ten musicians six of whom play triangles - badly. Often festivals give tickets to non-performing partners too.

I suspect festival organisers are getting wise to this.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,Ruston Hornsby
Date: 14 Aug 07 - 07:35 AM

From the inside as the bandleader for a fairly high profile NW morris side, I agree with what Folkiedave has just said. Whenever we get a major festival booking there are always certain musicians who we don't see for months on end because they are "busy" (sometimes with the other five teams they are attached to) who suddenly, miraculously, become available. From my point of view they are a pain because they put off the "regulars" by needing nods and winks all the time to let them know when to change tunes etc, drawing your concentration away from the core job of providing a good solid backing for the dancers. The quality of the music suffers. In the end you have to be hard and tell people that they aren't welcome - I would personally rather have a small band who know what they are doing than a freeloading cast of thousands who put everybody off.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,Ruston Hornsby - again
Date: 14 Aug 07 - 08:03 AM

...just to add a further point the the above, I don't necessarily agree on the point regarding partners. It is often assumed that every morris dancer and musician and their non-performer partner if they have one are folkies to the core and would be coming to the festival anyway if they hadn't been booked as a performer. This is not always the case. It certainly isn't in our team. Quite a few members would not want to come without their partner and family but would not be prepared to pay for a ticket for them as they aren't into the music and even if they are would be hanging around with the team rather than taking up a seat in aconcer - so wouldn't really get anything like value from it. The other point which has been discussed on Mudcat before is the amout of money morris teams collect on behalf of the festival. Certainly in the case of Whitby last year this was an impressive amount which would have paid for several concert acts.

Subject: RE: Morris segregation
From: GUEST,Ruston Hornsby - yet again.
Date: 14 Aug 07 - 08:06 AM

Typo error - for "aconcer" please read "a concert". Sorry.

I'll go away now and shut up.