Joseph Grimaldi (1778-1838)-seeking compositions

Subject: Iron Legs & Garibaldi's fatther ??
From: Mr Red
Date: 17 Sep 07 - 06:39 PM

Told at a session at Bromyard.

the father of Garibaldi, the clown, was a stage performer who had extremely strong legs and his act consisted of amazing leaps. the tune Iron Legs was named after him.

So the questions are -
Who was Garibadli's father? yea yea Mr Garibaldi (probably)
and what is the provenence of the tune? age, composer, etc

My searches via alltheweb.com have not revealed anything that I can see as relevant.

Subject: RE: Iron Legs & Garibaldi's fatther ??
From: Lynn W
Date: 18 Sep 07 - 02:55 PM

Try looking for Grimaldi, not Garibaldi - different chap!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Grimaldi

Subject: RE: Iron Legs & Garibaldi's fatther ??
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 18 Sep 07 - 08:28 PM

Somebody has been reading Barry Callaghan's Hardcore English, I suspect.

Barry didn't say where he got that idea, and sadly I can't ask him now. I certainly would have; that title has been nagging me for years, and I had assumed that it was a corruption of 'The Iron League', under which name the tune has also been found. In the couple of years since I last looked into it, quite a bit of new information seems to have appeared, though; and it may well be that the connection with Guiseppe Grimaldi has a good basis. Joseph Grimaldi's Memoirs (largely ghosted by Dickens, it appears) would be a good place to start.

Subject: RE: Iron Legs & Garibaldi's fatther ??
From: greg stephens
Date: 19 Sep 07 - 03:07 AM

And for a recording of Iron Legs, the tune from William Irwin's collection that the fuss is all about, may I recommend the Boat Band's "A Trip to the Lakes".

Subject: RE: Iron Legs & Garibaldi's fatther ??
From: Mr Happy
Date: 19 Sep 07 - 04:24 AM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Grimaldi

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giuseppe_Garibaldi

Subject: RE: Iron Legs & Garibaldi's father ??
From: GUEST,Fogie
Date: 19 Sep 07 - 05:58 AM

I stand corrected - it was of course not Garibaldi - and after 3 pints of Stella I was lucky to remember it began with a G andi anded in an i - very good wikipedia info.

Subject: RE: Iron Legs & Garibaldi's father ??
From: Mr Happy
Date: 19 Sep 07 - 10:02 AM

http://trillian.mit.edu/~jc/cgi/abc/tuneget?F=MIDI&U=/~jc/music/abc/Contra/reel/Iron_Legs.abc&X=54=IRONLEGS

Click on midi to hear tune

Subject: RE: Iron Legs & Garibaldi's father ??
From: Mr Red
Date: 19 Sep 07 - 12:28 PM

Garibaldi - doesn't that just take the biscuit?

Bromyard must have some gurt good cider - Grimaldi of course but the memory is not as strong as the cider.

so it is true, maybe.......... That is a bit clearer.

Thanks for the info.

Subject: RE: Joseph Grimaldi (1778-1838)-seeking compositions
From: GUEST,Email from Ashley H
Date: 06 Jun 22 - 12:18 AM

Hi Joe

I am undertaking some research on Joseph Grimaldi and would be most grateful if you could help me locate sheet music or a recording, to the original melody, of “hot codlins” Which was one of his most famous songs.

I would be most grateful can you help!

Best wishes

Ashley

Subject: RE: Joseph Grimaldi (1778-1838)-seeking compositions
From: Joe Offer
Date: 06 Jun 22 - 01:09 AM

Wikipedia (click) says that Joseph Grimaldi (1778-1837) was an English actor, comedian and dancer, who became the most popular English entertainer of the Regency era.

YouTube has an album by Daniel and Laura Curtis titled The Pantomime Life of Joseph Grimaldi (click)

The two songs requested are "Iron Legs" and "Hot Codlins." Can anyone help with either? And do Iron Legs and Hot Codlins have any connection to Joseph Grimaldi the 19th-century English clown>

Here's a recording of "Hot Codlins" by the Grimaldi Band:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hw6YJQcw-m0

And here's a live performance of "Hot Codlins" by a clown, so it DOES appear to be connected to Grimaldi the clown:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nIvFcpKxw8

Wikipedia says:

At Easter 1819, in The Talking Bird, or, Perizade Columbine, he introduced perhaps his best known song "Hot Codlins", an audience participation song about a seller of roasted apples who gets drunk on gin while working the streets of London. Songs about trades were popular on the stage in the 1800s. Grimaldi sought inspiration for the character of the apple seller by walking around the streets of London and observing real-life tradespeople.

And here's a "Hot Codlins" cartoon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDRs4KWu74o

So, what about "Iron Legs"?
Joe

Subject: ADD: Hot Codlings (Dibdin & Whitaker)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 06 Jun 22 - 01:12 AM

HOT CODLINGS
(Written and composed by Charles Dibdin Jnr. & John Whitaker - 1819)

A little old woman her living she got
By selling hot codlings, hot, hot, hot
And this little old woman whose codlings sold
Tho' her codlings were hot, she felt herself cold
So to keep herself warm, she thought it no sin
To fetch for herself a quartern of RI tol iddy
Iddy, iddy, iddy, Ri tol iddy, iddy, ri tol lay.

This little old woman set off at a trot
To fetch herself a quartern of hot! hot! hot!
She swallowed one glass, and it was so nice
She tipped off another in a trice
The glass she filled till the bottle shrunk
And this little old woman she got RI tol iddy
Iddy, iddy, iddy, Ri tol iddy, iddy, ri tol lay.

This little old woman, while muzzy she got
Some boys stole her codlings hot, hot, hot,
Powder under her pan put, and in it round stones
Says the little old woman, 'These apples have bones'
The powder the pan in her face did send
Which sent the old woman on her latter RI tol iddy
Iddy, iddy, iddy, Ri tol iddy, iddy, ri tol lay.

The little old woman then up she got
All in a fury hot, hot, hot,
Says she, 'Such boys never were known
They never will let an old woman alone.'
Now here is a moral, round let it buz
If you mean to sell codlins, never get RI tol iddy
Iddy, iddy, iddy, Ri tol iddy, iddy, ri tol lay.



Written and composed by Charles Dibdin Jnr. & John Whitaker - 1819
Performed by Sam Cowell (1820-1864)
Performed by Joseph Grimaldi (1779-1837)
Performed by Tom Mathews (1805-1989)


Source: https://monologues.co.uk/musichall/Songs-H/Hot-Codlings.htm

Another recording: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVtR2UVM9gU

Here's the entry on the song by the Traditional Ballad Index:

Hot Codlings

DESCRIPTION: "A little old woman her living she got By selling hot codlings hot, hot, hot." But she feels cold, so she seeks "a quartern of RI tol iddy iddy iddy...." She drinks a whole bottle, and boys steal her codlings while she is drunk. She warns of drunkenness
AUTHOR: unknown
EARLIEST DATE: 1926 (Scott); said to have been sung by Grimaldi in 1828 and earlier
KEYWORDS: food commerce drink humorous
FOUND IN:
REFERENCES (2 citations):
Scott-EnglishSongBook, pp. 58-59, "Hot Codlings" (1 text, 1 tune)
Wolf-AmericanSongSheets, #907, p. 61, "Hot Codlins" (3 references)
Roud #13942
NOTES [37 words]: Grimaldi seems to have been the first to sing this song, but its real fame may have arisen from its use by others; Wolf, p. 61, lists three broadsides, with the credit "as sung by the great Comic Vocalist, Tony Pastor." - RBW
Last updated in version 3.5
File: ScED058

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Subject: RE: Joseph Grimaldi (1778-1838)-seeking compositions
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 06 Jun 22 - 01:25 AM

Iron Legs was the nickname of Joseph Grimaldi senior who was famed for his jumping abilities.

Subject: ADD Version: Hot Codlins
From: Joe Offer
Date: 06 Jun 22 - 02:26 AM

There are many entries in the Roud Index, but most of them seem very much the same. Very few are attributed to any particular songwriter. Here's the version from Page 287 of The Universal Songster, or Museum of Mirth (1825), available for download from many sources but containing only lyrics, not melodies.

HOT CODLINS

A little old woman her living she got
By selling hot codlins, hot! hot! hot!
And this little old woman who codlins sold,
Though her codlins were hot, thought she herself cold;
So to keep herself warm, she thought it no sin,
To fetch for herself a quartern of — Ri tol iddy
Iddy, iddy, iddy, Ri tol iddy, iddy, ri tol lay.

This little old woman set off at a trot,
To fetch herself a quartern of hot! hot! hot!
She swallowed one glass, and, it was so nice,
She tipt off another in a trice;
The glass she filled till the bottle shrunk,
And this little old woman they say, she got — RI tol iddy
Iddy, iddy, iddy, Ri tol iddy, iddy, ri tol lay.

This little old woman, while muzzy she got,
Some boys stole her codlins hot! hot! hot!
Powder under her pan put, and in it round stones;
Says the little old woman, 'These apples have bones'
The powder the pan in her face did send,
Which sent the old woman on her latter — RI tol iddy
Iddy, iddy, iddy, Ri tol iddy, iddy, ri tol lay.

The little old woman then up she got,
All in a fury, hot! hot! hot!
Says she, 'Such boys, sure, never were known
They never will let an old woman alone.'
Now here is a moral, round let it buz
If you mean to sell codlins, never get — RI tol iddy
Iddy, iddy, iddy, Ri tol iddy, iddy, ri tol lay.

Subject: RE: Joseph Grimaldi (1778-1838)-seeking compositions
From: Raggytash
Date: 06 Jun 22 - 09:20 AM

"And the people applaud for Grimaldi the clown
and the crowds eating out his hand
the posters acclaim him the talk of the town
and the funniest man in the land"

Taken from a song by Peter Bond on the album he made with Tim Laycock and Bill Caddick, the album is named "With a duck on his head"

The song (roughly) is about a fight with depression.

Subject: RE: Joseph Grimaldi (1778-1838)-seeking compositions
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 07 Jun 22 - 10:49 AM

Hot Codlins with music is in The English Song Book by W. Scott, 1926, p59. It may be archived on the net somewhere but copies turn up in charity shops. I culled my copy some time ago.
But I have Sam Cowell's copy with tune in his 120 Comic Songs which I can easily scan and email to anyone who wants to pm me with their email address.

Subject: RE: Joseph Grimaldi (1778-1838)-seeking compositions
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 08 Jun 22 - 02:32 PM

There are at least 2 substantial books on the life of Joe Grimaldi. I have one to hand and the other one hidden somewhere, probably the loft.