The US Election

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: katlaughing
Date: 19 Nov 08 - 09:59 AM

DonT, I was pretty sure you weren't one of them! **bg** Thanks for the clarification, though.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: CarolC
Date: 19 Nov 08 - 08:38 AM

The consequences of either W or Palin would both be the same in the long run because they both have the same crew pulling their strings (the right wing dominionist Christian crowd and the oil companies).

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Riginslinger
Date: 19 Nov 08 - 06:53 AM

Christianity

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 09:43 PM

What substance abuse was Ms Palin's preferred variety? Ice-crystals with oxygen?



A

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Riginslinger
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 09:17 PM

It can all be traced back to substance abuse!

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 08:58 PM

One reason for making that awful choice is that he has already caused the deaths of hundreds/thousands of people and probably would less enthusiastic about doing so a second time that one like Ms P whose dath toll is limited to wolves, moose and other desperate critturs of the wild. Plus pulling the wings off of flies.


A

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 08:53 PM

Well, I dunno, Kevin. George W. is crafty, but he's not what could be called smart. No really well-formed personal philosophy other that a collection of clichés, and his main asset to the neo-cons was that he would do what he was told. He didn't really have an agenda of his own.

Palin, on the other hand, is smart. And her personal philosophy is right in line with the neo-cons and with the extreme religious right. And she definitely has an agenda.

If I had to chose one or the other as the lesser of two evils (which, thank God, I don't!) I might just have to opt for George.

'Scuse me a moment. I think I'm gonna be sick!

Don Firth

P. S. And this, by the way, has nothing to do with gender. Strictly which one of them would be more dangerous.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 08:41 PM

If there wasn't any way out of having one of that pair, I think I'd opt for Palin.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 08:05 PM

""Thanks, McGrath. I think a woman could manage the job, too,""

Sorry Kat, just realised I gave an unintended impression.

The kind of balls I was talking about are not an exclusively male trait, in fact not necessarily even a PREDOMINANTLY male trait.

There are plenty of women who could do as good a job as any man, and IMHO there are NO women who couldn't do better than Geedubya, except possibly Palin, and that would be a CLOSE race.

Don T.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Bill D
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 03:36 PM

To be fair, I have seen a couple of panels where there were 3-4 women and no men. Hadn't thought much about it till now. The salient point is, there ARE plenty of women reporters, pundits, politicians etc. now and we are seeing more of them. I no longer worry about the makeup of any one group....unless it 'feels' obviously loaded and unbalanced.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Ebbie
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 10:37 AM

Last night on television they ran a panel made up of five men and a moderator (believe me, they commented on the fact that there were no women present. The moderator said that the schedule had not fit any woman but Dean said that was inexcusable)

Here is a Summary of those participating:

A panelists (sic) who worked for various 2008 presidential campaigns discussed what strategies worked, what lessons were learned, and how the winner prevailed. Kenneth Walsh moderated.

Cornell Belcher was a pollster for the Barack Obama campaign,
Frank Donatelli was a senior adviser to the John McCain campaign, Geoffrey Garin was a pollster and strategist for the Hillary Clinton campaign, and
Kevin Madden was national press secretary and senior communications specialist for the Mitt Romney campaign.

(http://www.c-spanarchives.org/library/index.php?main_page=product_video_info&products_id=282377-1)

It was interesting, to say the least. They were polite to each other but they also punched. I love Howard Dean. Not to mention, Cornell Belcher!

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 10:16 AM

Thanks, McGrath. I think a woman could manage the job, too, just as long as it's not Palin!**bg** That said, I am ecstatic about Obama's win!

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 10:14 AM

They certainly help make a better incumbent than the last corporate lackey. I think this one may have sufficient to say NO to vested interests.

I'd have thought you would be pro Obama, McG

Don T.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 05:39 AM

I don't think balls are necessary for a good president.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 04:20 AM

I couldn't agree more, Don, and half the world is waiting, with baited breath, for the inauguration and the promised change.

Personally, I reckon he has already started, behind the scenes, and I'm confident that there will be rapid progress.

It's not just a question of a real president, but a real MAN too, a complete departure from the cardboard cut-outs of recent years.

This one has BALLS and a BRAIN.

Don T.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Nov 08 - 03:38 PM

I watched Steve Kroft's interview with Barack Obama on 60 Minutes last night - the whole program - and I firmly believe that for the first time in a long time, as of January 20th, 2009, the United States will have a real president.

Watch for yourself.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: CarolC
Date: 17 Nov 08 - 01:56 PM

(just kidding... don't post the login info)

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: CarolC
Date: 17 Nov 08 - 01:54 PM

We need the login info for that email account if we want to read the emails in it.

;-)

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: katlaughing
Date: 17 Nov 08 - 01:52 PM

Just got this in the email: Click Here

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 17 Nov 08 - 03:39 AM

Whatever it is, or is not, it bears NO relationship to any characteristic of Obama's personality, and the use of it in referring to him is simply another example of how low some people will sink in a desperate attempt to hide the fact that they have run out of LOGICAL arguments.

Don T.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Nov 08 - 01:31 PM

Of course that's what "Uncle Tom" has come to mean. But it doesn't bear much relationship to the character as written. Probably the fault of stage or screen adaptations.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 16 Nov 08 - 01:30 PM

The phrase "Uncle Tom", however, was coopted by the Black Power movement in the 60-70's to disdainfully refer to a black person who "cooperated with Whitey" -- cooperating with the system instead of standing up militantly for his race.

A

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Alice
Date: 16 Nov 08 - 01:10 PM

Ask anyone in the USA the definition of an "Uncle Tom". It is as Don T said.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Nov 08 - 12:52 PM

Except that the actual Uncle Tom in the book isn't the least "servile and obsequious".

Here is the text of Uncle Tom's Cabin. Searchable text - which indicates that there is not a single "Massa" in the book.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 16 Nov 08 - 11:59 AM

""Die Tageszeitung, a Berlin newspaper that supports socialist and leftist causes, predicted Obama's election in June when it published a large front-page photo of the White House under the headline, "Uncle Barack's Cabin.""


If you actually knew anything about literature, you would know that the book having its title parodied here was "Uncle Tom's Cabin", by Harriet Beecher-Stowe.

You would also understand that the main character referred to as Uncle Tom was the kind of black slave who pandered to the white slave owners, and their cronies by being servile and obsequious in the extreme.

In short, he would have been tugging his forelock and saying Yassuh Massa Rig, sho' nuff Massa Sawzaw.

Not, you will have to admit, characteristics exhibited by Barack Obama, and I derive considerable pleasure from the fact that many republicans, to their eternal chagrin, will have to say Yessir MR. President to him for at least four years.

Don T.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 16 Nov 08 - 03:38 AM

Ah, Riginslimer, you have upheld your shining reputation once again.



A

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Nov 08 - 11:41 PM

I meant to also refer to Emma B's November 4, 6:15 pm post where she cites an article that says 'President-elect Barack Obama inspired Americans with a promise of change that will improve their lives.'

I can't speak for other Americans but I will speak for myself: I don't expect President Obama to "improve my life". I don't need that. However, I do expect that President Obama will improve the standing of the United States of America. We do need that.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Nov 08 - 11:36 PM

I read the article, bb, and beyond. There are several questionable assertions one could point to. Such as 'the first candidate to forgo public funding', without going on to say that he is the first since Watergate.

Vogel also says that Obama went back on his word to limit himself to public funding if McCain did, which is patently false, as he himself tacitly admits when he quotes the actual transaction: "In response to a questionnaire in November from the Midwest Democracy Network, which is made up of nonpartisan government oversight groups, Obama said: "Senator John McCain has already pledged to accept this fundraising pledge. If I am the Democratic nominee, I will aggressively pursue an agreement with the Republican nominee to preserve a publicly financed general election."

As CarolC and others long since have shown, "aggressively pursue an agreement" is not at all the same thing as saying that he would do it if McCain would. Vogel lists the negating factors that deterred Obama from the final agreement.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 15 Nov 08 - 08:25 PM

The US Election.... enuf already!

Thank God it's over. Maybe now we English folk can have some English programs to watch on TV!

Sal

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Nov 08 - 09:24 PM

LOL!

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Riginslinger
Date: 14 Nov 08 - 09:00 PM

He has to reveal himself first. So far he hasn't said anything.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 14 Nov 08 - 08:33 PM

Defend your assertion that there is an unknown "real" Obama that would somehow alienate his present supporters, sir.



A

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Riginslinger
Date: 14 Nov 08 - 08:43 AM

Come on! If he'd taken his shoes off he could have gotten to 20:-)

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: the pom
Date: 14 Nov 08 - 07:07 AM

The best man won
Kevin asked George if he was going to the G20 meeting in NY
George :What's the G20?
The question was too difficult. Should have asked him if he was going to the G8

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Riginslinger
Date: 13 Nov 08 - 07:10 PM

Yes, well, pointing people in the correct direction is a full time proposition.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Barry Finn
Date: 13 Nov 08 - 07:00 PM

Obviously you haven't either Rig, probably never will but the rest of US have a pretty good picture, that's why he won by a landslide.
The world is saying "he's the man". You always seem to be the odd man out?????????

Barry

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Riginslinger
Date: 13 Nov 08 - 06:43 PM

They aren't afraid yet. They haven't come to know the real Obama.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 08:14 PM

So?

Just about everyone in Germany and the whole rest of Europe (not to mention the rest of the world except for Israel) massively favored the election of Obama over McCain in this past election.

AAAAGGHHHH!!!! They must ALL be "socialists"! Be afraid. Be very afraid. (grin)

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 06:14 PM

Die Tageszeitung, a Berlin newspaper that supports socialist and leftist causes, predicted Obama's election in June when it published a large front-page photo of the White House under the headline, "Uncle Barack's Cabin."

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 11 Nov 08 - 10:20 PM

I don't think so Bruce. I never lambasted the Bush Administration for their campaign finances, nor any other politician as far as I recall. What I lambasted them for continuously was their harmful policies and tactics.

So far the noise surrounding the Obama ramp up includes rolling back some of the more egregious executive orders that Bush is putting out, including those which allow or encourage environmental damage, and rolling back the scandals of Gitmo and the usurpation of habeas corpus. So far so good.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: CarolC
Date: 11 Nov 08 - 10:16 PM

'The Obama campaign does not expect to be audited, but spokesman Ben LaBolt said it would be ready in the event it is.

"We have had a first rate compliance operation for an unprecedented national grassroots fundraising effort," LaBolt said.'

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 08 - 06:52 PM

Amos,

If you are not willing to read the article, and see what is being claimed, then you are certainly not interested in maintaining any kind of watch on the Obama presidency, unlike your constant scrutiny of the Bush admoinistration.

OK by me if you want to treat Obama like he does not have to comply with the law, but at least admit you were lying when you said you would give him the same level of oversight as you did Bush. _If this were the Bush campaigne, you would have already called for summary executions and impeachment.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 11 Nov 08 - 05:29 PM

"Potentially embarassing"??? IS that equivalent to "Potentially NOT embarassing"? What does it mean? Or is it a snarky innuendo? Hell, at my age getting dressed int he morning is potentially embarassing!!! :D


A

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 08 - 05:03 PM

Obama likely to escape campaign audit
By KENNETH P. VOGEL | 11/11/08 11:14 AM EST   

Barack Obama's campaign will likely not undergo an audit by the FEC.

The Federal Election Commission is unlikely to conduct a potentially embarrassing audit of how Barack Obama raised and spent his presidential campaign's record-shattering windfall, despite allegations of questionable donations and accounting that had the McCain campaign crying foul.

Adding insult to injury for Republicans: The FEC is obligated to complete a rigorous audit of McCain's campaign coffers, which will take months, if not years, and cost McCain millions of dollars to defend.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1108/15497.html

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 10 Nov 08 - 12:06 PM

"... on the day that the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. famously called "the most segregated day of the week," black and white Christian clergy members asked God to give Obama the wisdom and strength to lead the country out of what many consider a wilderness of despair and gloom.

At Hungary Road Baptist Church in a working-class suburb of Richmond, Va., the service was part celebration, part history lesson, led by a pastor who had felt the sting of the Jim Crow South. The Rev. J. Rayfield Vines Jr., pastor of the predominantly African-American congregation, paused briefly as he recalled the indignities he endured but did not bow to while growing up Suffolk, in southeastern Virginia.

"I was there when you had ride in the back of the bus," Vines said under a simple cross illuminated by eight light bulbs. "I was there when you went to the department store and you couldn't try on the clothes. I was there when they had a colored toilet and a white toilet."

The pastor said he shared his humiliations Sunday to help give those "who had not tasted the bitterness of segregation ... an idea why we all shouted."

Inside Harlem's Abyssinian Baptist Church, member Sheila Chestnut, 61, proudly wore a rhinestone Obama pin on her suit lapel.

"I am so happy," she said. "I cried so much. I never thought that in this lifetime I would live to see an African-American become president of these United States."

When the Rev. Calvin Butts invited the congregation to stand up "and give God praise for the election," several hundred churchgoers rose as one, lifted their hands and gave a sustained cheer, then chanted, "Yes we can! Yes we can!"

At Apostolic Church of God on Chicago's South Side, less than two miles from Obama's home, jubilant Sunday services were peppered with references to the election and calls to be grateful for his victory.

"We thank the Lord for this second Sunday (in November) after the first Tuesday," Dr. Byron Brazier said to resounding applause and cheers from the mostly black congregation. "This is a wonderful time to be alive."

Obama spoke at Apostolic on Father's Day in his first address to a congregation after leaving his longtime church, Trinity United Church of Christ, following inflammatory remarks there by his former longtime pastor and others.

In Los Angeles, tears flowed freely at the First AME Church during the raucous two-hour service of house-busting music and prayer. There were some white and yellow faces among the congregants, and the Rev. John J. Hunter felt the need to let them know they were not being left out.

"The smiles on our faces are not gloating looks of victory," he said. "The smiles on our faces are not the sign or any symbol that it is now our time and our chance to get even. Rather, the smiles on our faces are expressions of thanksgiving."

At a white church in Mississippi, where roughly nine in 10 whites voted for Republican John McCain, the scene was more muted.

The neighborhood around the Alta Woods United Methodist Church in Jackson has seen its demographics shift from white to black in recent decades, and most of the parishioners have moved to the suburbs. While the Rev. David W. Carroll recognized Obama's election as a "historic shift," he spent just as much time praising McCain's patriotism in defeat.

"As the crowd began to boo a little bit ... he quieted them down and said, 'Now is not my time, but I'm an American first and I will serve the president-elect,'" he said. "In a loss, he showed us still how he could win through his service."

In his Web message last week, the Rev. Gregg Matte of Houston's mostly white First Baptist Church decried a society that has turned to government as its savior. "Today," he wrote, "Hollywood is our pastor, technology is our Bible, charisma is our value and Barack Obama is our President."

But from the pulpit Sunday, Matte asked the 1,000 or so mostly white faces staring back at him to "lift up President-elect Obama" even if he wasn't their choice on Tuesday.

"Regardless of whether you voted for him or not, he's now our president come Jan. 20," he said. "So we're going to come behind him and pray for him and pray for wisdom, that God will give him wisdom and be able to really speak to his heart."

Perhaps nowhere was the weight of history more palpable Sunday than at Atlanta's Ebenezer Baptist Church, from whose pulpit King spread his message of inclusion and across from which he lies entombed.

When the Rev. Raphael G. Warnock tried to put into words what it meant for Obama to win Virginia, where the first American slaves landed nearly 400 years ago, his words were drowned out by applause and cheers from a capacity crowd whose faces captured the spectrum of the human rainbow.

"Barack Obama stood against the fierce tide of history and achieved the unimaginable," he said. "But he did not get here by himself. Give God some credit. He is the Lord."

But while he told the congregation that it was a time for celebration, he also reminded them it was a serious time.

"We still have a whole lot of work to do," he said. "You have two little girls who will grow up in the White House. Around the corner, you have two little girls who will grow up in a crack house."
****
Among those in attendance was the slain civil rights leader's sister, Christine King Farris. She was reminded of her brother's prescience.

"As he predicted the night before he left us, 'I may not be with you, but as a people we will reach the promised land,'" she said stoically. "That promised land was realized Tuesday. Yes, it is our promised land."...
****

From AJC.com from AP.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 10 Nov 08 - 11:43 AM

I take it that "vituberation" is a neologism meaning the vibrations of hateful signals?


A

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Nov 08 - 11:41 AM

The idea that the real American is the rural conservative white family guided by new religion and Limbaugh talk radio is fading into history.

The vituberation of wild talk by fear mongers will continue but at the receeding fringes of society.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Amos
Date: 10 Nov 08 - 10:31 AM

Republican Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger said that even though his party didn't win the presidential election, he has at least one thing to be happy about.

"I can get back into the bedroom, so there's the big advantage," the California governor said Sunday on CNN's "Late Edition."

Schwarzenegger, a leading Republican, is married to Maria Shriver, a member of the very Democratic Kennedy clan.

Shriver endorsed Barack Obama in February, just days after her husband announced his support of John McCain.

Schwarzenegger said his wife has been "gloating now for these last few days" and running around the house with a life-size cutout of Obama saying, "We won."

Striking a more serious tone, Schwarzenegger said he doesn't see how any incumbent party could have held onto power this year, given the economic situation and the housing crisis.

"I think no one knew that it's going to be that bad. I think the Republicans were trying to hold on to, you know, if it would have been just the housing crisis or the mortgage crisis. But then when the stock market crash came, I think it was just too much," he said.

---

Shades of Lysistrata!

A

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 08 Nov 08 - 08:24 AM

..but not final "g"s.

Subject: RE: The US Election
From: Alice
Date: 07 Nov 08 - 06:22 PM

now at the White House, (click)