BS: American football question

Subject: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 10:25 PM

Recently I was reading a suspense novel, and the main character said something like this:

"I went to sleep in the softest T-shirt in the world. My grandmother thought that when the Immaculate Reception was made by Franco Harris of the Pittsburgh Steelers that it was a miracle, and she gave me a
T-shirt with his number on it for protection."

I showed that statement to the DH and asked, 'Do you know what this is about? I've heard of an interception in football, but not a reception.' He laughed and said, 'You must be the only person in the world that hasn't heard of that!'

We argued playfully for a while, and then I said, 'You can probably see a video of that on YouTube.' Well, his eyes got rounder and rounder, and he said 'Really? I'd like to see that.' (And he thinks I'M unworldly.)

Yes, if you go to YouTube.com and search for 'Franco Harris' or maybe for 'Immaculate Reception,' you can see this play in blurry film from 1972.

In American football, the goal is to kick, throw, hand-off, carry or pretend to carry the ball down the field and into the colored area called the endzone. If you get there, it's called a touchdown and you score 6 points. The other side does everything it can to prevent that and get the ball away. When the ball touches the ground, play stops. The action seems brutal, but there are rules. You can't grab a guy's facemask, and you can't carry a gun.

In the footage, we see Steeler A make a terrific throw to Steeler B, who fails to catch it because an opponent is all over him. The ball (which is spinning and has a lot of KE) bounces off his helmet and heads back upstream, where it is caught (received) by Steeler C, Franco Harris, inches from the ground. This is the Immaculate Reception.

Harris makes an 180-turn with obvious effort, probably because unseen opponents are hanging onto his legs. He gets free and races down the field at terrific speed with only one opponent after him. He carries the ball into the endzone to win the game in the last 73 seconds of the game. Jubilation ensues.

Now what I want to know is, how many Catters have heard of this? Am I really the only person in the world who had never heard of the Immaculate Reception?

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 10:37 PM

You ever hear of the Hail Mary Pass?

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 11:14 PM

I'm not a football fan, but this is one of the greatest plays in the history of the game and the phrase is well known among football fanatics, especially Steeler fans.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 01:16 AM

No, I didn't know what it was, and that's mainly because sports of all kinds bore me and I never pay any attention to football.

However, I would have inferred that it was some sort of spectacular play, and that's probably all you need to know to understand the novel.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: gnu
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 05:52 AM

I would guess that 90% + of the North American males have heard it.

And I would guess that 90% + of those watching the Superbowl this past Sunday thought about it after The Steeler's last touchdown. It was a text book pass and reception, immaculate, if you will. And, with less time on the clock.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 09:50 AM

Well, I can say that I never heard of it, but then I qualify as a "missionary non-athlete". I haven't seen a football game since 1951.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: catspaw49
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 09:54 AM

It was far from a great play but it was "miraculous" and came in a time period that the Steelers were all-powerful and rarely beaten. Terry Bradshaw made many great passes in his career and some are the best the game has ever known. This was not one of them.

Franco was one of the best backs of all time, easily in the NFL's top 25. He was a smart player and always had his head in the game. This "head-in-the-game" quality was the result of excellent coaching by Chuck Noll. So when the ball took that unbelievable bounce, Franco was not surprised and was able to take it out of the air at the last second.

They replayed the thing over and over for weeks and months and still even yearly. Great play by design and initial execution------no. But it was certainly an "Immaculate Reception."

As a footnote, in my younger days I played a lot of handball and racquetball. In '77. Wendy's, the burger chain, rented part of the club I went to for a corporate evening during a national franchisee meeting in Columbus (home to Wendy's). Franco owned a few stores and was there. Guys were lining up to play him and I got my chance. He was playing 11 point games and the guy played well and for HOURS with minimal breaks. He beat me by only the requisite 2 points but he'd already played for a couple of hours. I was a Browns fan and hated the Steelers out of "tradition" but playing racquetball with Franco was not something I would have missed! Nice guy btw.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 09:56 AM

Yes, American football is replete with religious imagery. The best known examples are "Immaculate Reception", "Hail Mary Pass", and "Those God Damned Raiders".

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: catspaw49
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 10:01 AM

Okay B-Dub........So you are the coach of a great team that needs and offense and a quarterback that can score big in the two minute drill. Playing at their best do you want:

Stabler and the Raiders
Bradshaw and the Steelers
Montana and the 49'ers

...or someone else?


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Bobert
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 10:19 AM

I'd take Elway and the Broncos...

But, yeah, when we think of the great plays, most of them were were poorly executed where the ball just happened to bounce the right way...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: KB in Iowa
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 10:37 AM

It was far from a great play but it was "miraculous" and came in a time period that the Steelers were all-powerful and rarely beaten.

Actually spaw, the Immaculate Reception was before the Steelers were all powerful and rarely beaten. It happened in play-off game against the Raiders in 1972 which was only the second post season game in franchise history. The Steelers won 13-7 but lost to the unbeaten Dolphins 21-17 in the AFC title game the next week. They became all powerful and rarely beaten soon after this.

At the start of the '72 season I was in seventh grade and my best bud at the time was a Browns fan so I latched onto the Steelers to be contrary. Great timing for me because they won four Super Bowls in the next few years and I got to ride along vicariously. I was heavily into the NFL through the 70's but haven't much cared since.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: gnu
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 10:53 AM

B-Dub... hahahaaa!!!!

Spaw.... excellent pics... I used to love to watch Montana and the 49'ers "execute" with amazing precision. The coaching and play calling was equally amazing.

Brady has the ability to get there, I hope.

Elway... yeah, but watching him kinda choke twice before he ringed twice was disheartening.

Marino... sigh. Why can't I remember the Bill's QB that never won the big show??? 4 times, wasn't it? a master of the hurryup? and the best comeback ever (I won a lot of money that day). Darn! What's his name?

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: olddude
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 11:01 AM

Bobart

Elway is a good choice but that catch last week was incredible. I know many of the Steelers, and Patriots players due to my work for the foundations . I hope they send me a goodie box like they did the last superbowl. I got all kinds of signed stuff last time and gave away most to sick kids ...

I called it at the begining of the year in the who is going to win thread. Love to say the same thing next year but I am thinking it will be an NFC team

I hope the Packers do well next year. I like so many teams, Pittsburgh however is my team since I was born and raised
in central PA

Many people still think the ball hit the ground on Harris
I think they are just sour grapes

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: KB in Iowa
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 11:13 AM

Many people still think the ball hit the ground on Harris
I think they are just sour grapes

A lot of folks also thought the ball hit the Steelers receiver rather than the Raiders defender before it bounced back to Harris. At the time that would have made it an illegal catch. If a forward pass hit an offensive player it had to be touched by a defensive player before a different offensive player was eligible to catch it.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 11:46 AM

'I would guess that 90% + of the North American males have heard it.'

Thanks, gnu. I'm just a girl, but you paid attention to my question.

Rapaire, I have heard of a Hail Mary pass. A lot of passes could be a Hail Mary pass, but there's only one Immaculate Reception. I wonder if there are any other Catholic/gridiron phrases in circulation.

(In my circle, 'Immaculate Reception' refers to the hors d'ouvres and wine at the downtown Episcopal church.)

I'm not a football fan actually, but my husband is a second-generation Packer fan.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 11:59 AM

Spaw, thanks for the interesting account of the handball game with Franco Harris. It's nice to hear what these famous people are like.

(I bet you just let him win.)

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: jeffp
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 12:02 PM

Spaw, you add Blanda to Stabler and I'll take the Raiders any time. That old man could work wonders when Stabler faltered.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: KB in Iowa
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 12:24 PM

I have always been under the impression that Blanda was the oldest man to ever play in the NFL. Played till he was 48 I think. Quarterback early and then switched to kicker for the Raiders in the 70's.

I was looking at pro-football-reference.com and the 1933 Pittsburgh team (Pirates) has two guys listed as being 63 years old. One of them, James Clark, had 76 carries for 192 yards. He played again the next year as a 64 year old. I just checked Blanda and his last season was 1975 and he was 48. I don't see any listing there of oldest players ever. I will investigate further.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 12:26 PM

Spaw, the "Those God Damned Raiders" line wasn't really meant to disparage the Raiders. They just have the rep of being "The team everyone loves to hate". I'd bet they've had the "God Damned" adjective applied to them more often than any other team in the NFL.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: kendall
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 12:33 PM

I also have a question about American football..Why?

Rugby is far more macho.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: catspaw49
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 01:38 PM

KB, you're quite right about 72 being at the beginning of Steeler dominance but the tools were really in place pretty much by that time and they were playing well then too. The Dolphins with the No-Name" defense were a more miraculous team in my mind. They were a fine team but I was never a fan of them either.

Bradshaw in many ways was one of the dumbest QB's in history but he had that football "sense" that was about second to none. Whether that was a combination of something he'd learned through playing or great vision or a great arm or something, no one ever knew. I remember somebody once said about him, "He's dumber than hell but gawddamn, he's such a SPECIMEN!"


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: gnu
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 02:01 PM

Spaw... "Whether that was a combination of something he'd learned through playing or great vision or a great arm or something,..."

Yup. Vision, focus, arm, size, athletics, toughness, heart... he might come off as a dumb Texas redneck on the talk shows, but he was sure smart on the field.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: KB in Iowa
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 02:02 PM

Bradshaw in many ways was one of the dumbest QB's in history

I remember there was an opposing player at the time who said Bradshaw couldn't spell cat if you spotted him the C and the A.

Even as a Steeler fan I never thought he was a great quarterback. He grew into a very good quarterback who was on a team that could win with his skill set. In 1974, the first year they won the Super Bowl, he was benched for several games. Terry Gilliam started six games and Terry Hanratty started one. I just saw earlier that Gilliam actually led the team in pass attempts that year.

Yes, the '72 Steeler team was quite good. That was the beginning of the Steeler era even though they didn't win the Super Bowl for two more years. First playoff game since they tied Philadelphia for the Eastern division title in 1947. Philadelphia won the playoff 21-0, the same score by which they had won a regular season game three weeks earlier. (Isn't the internet wonderful?) I never liked either the Dolphins or the Raiders but it was because they were good and therefore a threat to the Steelers.

Have not been able to find anything about the two players listed as being 63 on the 1933 Pittsburgh team. Must be typos, I bet they were 23.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 03:37 PM

'I also have a question about American football..Why?'

Being a football fan is not a simple matter. I marvel at my in-laws, who once attended a Packers game when it was zero degrees out. They cheered the Packers on through that bitter, bitter cold. They were playing Miami, who lost for some reason.

My husband just spent three days in North Dakota. People there would talk 10 minutes about the recent Superbowl game and then discuss the commercials for 'two hours.' A commercial for Doritos seems to have won the hearts and minds of many Americans, not just North Dakotans.
I think somebody in the social sciences should study this phenomenon.

So, before this thread, were all of you who are posting aware of the play called Immaculate Reception?

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: kendall
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 03:44 PM

no

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: KB in Iowa
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 09:09 PM

So, before this thread, were all of you who are posting aware of the play called Immaculate Reception?

Intimately

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,Susu's Hubby
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 09:24 PM

If we're talking about the pigskin tussle then we can't fail to mention Staubach and the Doomsday D-Fense.

Whadda decade!


Hubby

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: CarolC
Date: 06 Feb 09 - 12:20 AM

I never heard of it. But I'm so ignorant about football, I call that bit where one of the players has his hands just under another players crotch to take the football at the beginning of something, the "crotch ritual".

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: clueless don
Date: 06 Feb 09 - 09:41 AM

There was also a play called The Immaculate Deception. Apparently it was also called "The Holy Roller".

By the way, gnu, you asked "Why can't I remember the Bill's QB that never won the big show??? 4 times, wasn't it?" That was Jim Kelly. I don't think it is fair to blame him for the fact that The Bills didn't win the Super Bowl those four times. On the other hand, the "greatest comeback", also by the Bills if I recall correctly, did not feature Kelly, but rather backup quarterback Frank Reich (of the University of Maryland. Hooray!)

Don

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: gnu
Date: 07 Feb 09 - 06:32 AM

Holy moly! It WAS Frank! My memory IS gone.

I didn't blame Jim... just that the conversation was mainly about QBs.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,The Walrus (at the library)
Date: 07 Feb 09 - 11:42 AM

As a non-American, may I ask How is it that a game that only has 60 minutes of play takes 3-4 hours to complete?
At least Cricket in MEANT to take all day.

W

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: gnu
Date: 07 Feb 09 - 12:18 PM

As for the stoppage of play, while those not familiar with the game see the stoppage as boring, that is part of what makes it the best game for fans.

It's because the game is as much about strategy as it is about athletics. It is far more complex than any other sport. Thus, it is far more "participatory" for the fans than any other sport.

As for the "padding" and helmets. (Yes, I love rugby, the game they play in heaven... the game that takes leather balls to play... etc). The nature of NA football requires safety equipment. Each "play" is at full speed and full contact. Blocking is part of of this game... imagine a man of 18 stone running 40 yards in 4.4 seconds and slamming into you with the intent of putting you on the pitch on your ass. Or, a man of 15 stone that can run 100 yards in ten seconds leaping into the air to catch a ball and being contacted by a similar opponent with the same intent, and worse, to hit you so hard that you lose the ball.

As for which sport is more macho or entertaining, I suggest they are equal. I have played both and enjoyed each. But, if I had to choose which to watch, NA football would be the easy option... it takes intelligence to play it... and leather balls.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,Jeff
Date: 07 Feb 09 - 01:21 PM

KB,

The 'Gilliam' to whom you refer to as 'Terry' was, actually named 'Joe'. And you're wrong in stating that the 'Immaculate Reception' was an illegal forward pass because it wasn't. On the play as a result of the collision between Jack Tatum(Raiders) and Frenchy Fuqua(Steelers) the ball bounced BACK towards Franco Harris thereby, in effect being a 'lateral'. A perfectly legal play in American Football.

Terry Bradshaw isn't from Texas, he's from Louisiana. So, he comes off as a 'dumb Louisiana redneck' if anything. But he's not...his IQ is above 120...hardly 'dumb'. It's an act and has served him well in his post-football career.

And whoever made the statement that Rugby is 'more macho' than American Football is either a 'Euro-chauvinist' or has never played BOTH games. I played both at the D-2 college level and can say from first-hand, on the field experience that while Rugby is a contact sport, American Football is a COLLISON sport and far, far more 'hard-hitting' than rugby. Because Rugby is played w/o much protective gear(ear guards, etc.) it APPEARS rougher, but trust me I've hit and been hit WAY harder playing Am FB than I ever did playing Rugby. None of this is meant as a dis on Rugby, I LOVED playing it. It's a common mis-perception among the men I met while on cycling tours of the UK and Ireland. The 'general' consensus is that Am FB is played 'with all that equipment' while Gaelic FB or 'Ruggers' are the sports of 'real' men. Well, the 'muy macho' sport in MY eyes is Irish Hurling, anyway. Wow, collison's like Am FB while balancing a little ball on a stick and then whacking it like a baseball towards the goal. One needs to duck if in the line of fire. Some of the best 'all-around' athletes in the world play IH. Run like a tailback, swing and hit like a clean-up hitter...all at the same time! And the 'speed' of the game is unbelievable.

Spaw, I lived in Pittsburgh a few years ago and went to work out at a YMCA just outside of town. Ended up playing 'half-court' 'make it-take it' basketball. We 'matched-up' according to height and I ended up being 'matched-up' w/Franco Harris. We're about the same height, but he outweighs me by at least 50 lbs. At that point I still had 'good quicks' and could get to the rim and had a good 17-19ft jumper. I started at DB/KR in college and was MVP in the intermurals bb league @ school. I was a 'track-star' in HS and the 'best all-around' athlete in my neighborhood growing up. A knee injury kept me from a pro tryout...(that's what I tell my son :-)) I know all this, but I also know HE'S Franco Harris. It took him about 15 seconds to show me that while I WAS good I wasn't 'great'. He was. He was quicker than me(my strength), stronger than me(NOT my strength) and was 'lights out' from 17-19 w/EITHER HAND!! He posted me up, took me outside, drove past me and reverse lay-upped w/his 'off-hand'...basically 'schooled' me. And made it look easy. The thing that was most impressive to me was the 'quickness' of his hands...soft, deft, almost feminine in their grace. And as big as he was he never seemed to be 'off balance' or out of position. We played 3 games and I think I scored 2 or 3 on him the whole time. I'm a pretty fair 'blacktop baller', so it was a lesson in humility for me and I'm glad I made the choice to become a musician. But, you're right he's a very gracious man and I never felt like he was TRYING to show me up...he just did. AND he signed my towel. I gave it to my son. He used it to clean his roller blades. :-(    His Mom didn't know anything about the towel and threw it out w/a bunch of other rags. Being a non-custodial parent at the time it was 2 mos before I found out the towel had been tossed. C'est la vie.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: gnu
Date: 07 Feb 09 - 01:35 PM

My bad. Terry talks about a ranch in Texas? no?

Apparently, I am the one with a low IQM... memory... as shown more than once.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,Jeff
Date: 07 Feb 09 - 09:58 PM

RE Terry Bradshaw:

He probably DOES have a ranch in Texas. I don't know. Was just making the point that he's FROM Louisiana. AND he's not dumb...just acts that way.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Feb 09 - 10:48 PM

To answer leenia, I am NOT a huge football fan, but I sometimes watch big games or historical films, and yes, if you follow at all, you will hear of this play. It was 'immaculate' because it was partly dumb luck...but luck requires skill & concentration to take advantage if it. Harris had both that day.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,Slag
Date: 08 Feb 09 - 06:40 PM

And then there was "The Catch". Surprised that wasn't mentioned.

Football epitomizes the US. A little thing like weather does not stop a game. What is frostbite compared to trouncing your opponent and scoring six big ones? Rules? Sure, we got rules and we follow them religiously, unless we can get away with breaking a few of them here and there to accomplish or goals. But hey, if we get caught, we will pay the price. Fifteen yards or what ever. Through all the mayhem there is a sort of honor, pride and poise (yeah Raiders!)* that comes shining through it all. In the end it's just for the glory or the chance at it next year!

* That would be the Oakland Raiders of Daryl Lamonica through Ken Stabler period. The mess Al Davis has in there now is a far cry from those original miracle boys and their coach, John Madden.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 Feb 09 - 07:02 PM

Am I really the only person in the world who had never heard of the Immaculate Reception?

Confirmation that there are Americans who think that the rest of the planet doesn't exist...

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,Jack The Sailor
Date: 08 Feb 09 - 11:41 PM

I've known about the immaculate receptio n for about 30 years.

Bradshaw belongs in the hall of fame he rose to the occasion when it counted.

Susu's hubby. I gotta agree with you on Staubach and the 'boys. They were awesome. My favorite at the time.

But I watched a couple of summaries of their old Superbowls recently. I loved Landry at the time but know I wonder if he didn't lose them a big game or two with all those gadget plays. I think Knoll's philosophy was better. Put talent on the field and play to their strengths.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Amos
Date: 08 Feb 09 - 11:47 PM

Well, the things you learn on Mudcat. My, my. I am sorry to say I am one who never heard of the Immaculate Reception, but it sounds exciting as hell.


A

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: KB in Iowa
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 10:20 AM

The 'Gilliam' to whom you refer to as 'Terry' was, actually named 'Joe'. And you're wrong in stating that the 'Immaculate Reception' was an illegal forward pass because it wasn't. On the play as a result of the collision between Jack Tatum(Raiders) and Frenchy Fuqua(Steelers) the ball bounced BACK towards Franco Harris thereby, in effect being a 'lateral'. A perfectly legal play in American Football.

Yes, Joe Gilliam, I got 'Terry' happy.

The rule about eligibilty however I stand by. If Fuqua had caught the ball and tossed it back then it would have been a lateral but he did not, it bounced off of someone. The rule was changed some time back but at the time it was illegal for one offensive player to catch a forward pass that had been touched by a different offensive player unless a defensive player touched it in between. The question that was debated was who had the ball bounced off of. If Tatum no problem, if Fuqua then it should not have been a catch. Of course there was no review process so it was an academic argument but there was still a hot debate and Raider fans felt cheated.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 10:25 AM

"Am I really the only person in the world who had never heard of the Immaculate Reception?

""Confirmation that there are Americans who think that the rest of the planet doesn't exist...""

?? I don't follow this point.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: KB in Iowa
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 10:27 AM

This from the Pro Football Hall of Fame website.

"Touchdown? Nobody knew, including the officials. The Raiders argued that Fuqua had batted the ball to Harris (the rules of the time did not permit consecutive touches by offensive players). If Tatum had batted the ball, the play would have been a touchdown."

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: TIA
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 10:41 AM

West of the Susquehanna in PA, even the staunchest Catholics do not think of the mysteries when they hear the phrase "Immaculate Reception". In fact, I bet they think Steelers evey time they hear "Immaculate Conception" as well.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 10:53 AM

"I don't follow this point."

The point being that people who know anything about American Football are actually pretty scarce in the world as a whole.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 11:15 AM

Thanks, clueless don, for the reference to The Immaculate Deception. That makes a third Catholic football term.

I looked it up (1978 game) but couldn't understand all the lingo. The phrase is used again in 2007, but though the 2007 play involves some grand running, I don't see where deception comes in.

The nice thing about YouTube football is that I can see the most exciting bits of the games.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: maire-aine
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 12:22 PM

Hi, all. Thanks to everybody for this great thread. I love it. My father was from the Pittsburgh area, so I've always been a Steelers fan. (I live in the Detroit area, and I love the Lions, but I don't count on them anymore.) And (truth comes out now) I had the biggest crush on Franco Harris back in the day. I'm glad to know he really was a nice guy. It was great to see him at the Super Bowl last week.

Maryanne

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,JTS
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 01:51 PM

See it for yourselves.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: PoppaGator
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 02:01 PM

Is it clear now that anyone with the slightest interest in American football knows about the famous "Immaculate Reception"?

To those without any such interest and knowledge: I promise not to proclaim my moral superiority to you, and expect the same in return.

It's entirely OK with me that you neither know nor care about US pro football. It is not at all OK if you are among those who look down their noses at anyone who is (a) American and (b) a sports fan.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 03:05 PM

"The point being that people who know anything about American Football are actually pretty scarce in the world as a whole."

That is basically true...but it doesn't have the same meaning as a statement that "... there are Americans who think that the rest of the planet doesn't exist."

One reminds us that soccer/'football' is more common about the world, the other is a generalized slap at American attitudes....even if it doesn't say "all" Americans. Couldn't the simpler point have been made?

I see quite a lot of these remarks from certain people who seem to not have much use or respect for American ways in general...from their beer to their politics to their taste in food and sports.

All complaints have some basic truth at their root, but at a certain point it is like the pot calling the kettle black. Show me which countries or ethnic groups do NOT have characteristics that could use improvement.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 03:42 PM

The real key to the 70's Steelers got very little recognition of his talents at the time but had Mr. Rooney not had Chuck Noll..............Yeah, I know that Paterno turned it down but Noll was still the right guy. He'd played for Paul Brown and coached under Don Schula at Baltimore. The Steelers also must have had some fine scouts that hadn't shone their brilliance before.....or maybe Noll just said they'd have to perform or he'd kick their asses. They found Bradshaw and Harris and then in what may have been the greatest draft selection of all time, drafted Mike Webster, Jack Lambert, John Stalworth, and Lynn Swan all in one draft.

I'm not sure anyone ever assembled a defense quite as fine as the Steel Curtain nor has anyone done a better job writing an offense around the personnel. And even if you hated the Steelers, how could you not love Rocky Bleier? Noll used what he had and great drafting to put together a team for the ages that stands up well against the legends like Lombardi and Brown. Noll was a blue collar guy from Cleveland working in another "shot and a beer" town. To me, he's never gotten the credit that he rightly deserves......but that kinda' goes with the image too. Blue collar guy......Doin' his job.


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: PoppaGator
Date: 09 Feb 09 - 03:54 PM

Rocky Blier ~ yessss!

I always thought it was a shame that the Steelers drafted my college classmate Terry Hanratty in the second round in 1969, after taking another quarterback, Bradshaw, as their #1.

With another team, Hanratty would probably have had some kind of career as a player; with Pittsburgh, he put in a lot of years carrying a clipboard. True, he got rings and bonus money as a member of several Super Bowl teams. I wonder if he might not have preferred a few years of starting and playing in actual games on Sundays, even for a less outstanding team. I think I would have...

I suppose management wanted a "safety net" in case Bradshaw didn't work out, or got hurt, or whatever. It's apparent that they were going to make a change at quarterback that year, and that if their first-choice rookie failed to make the grade, they'd have another college star waiting in the wings.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: Ron Davies
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 07:26 AM

I far prefer the Immaculate Contraption, as described by Gamble Rogers.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 03:11 PM

You said it, poppagator.

I didn't want to start a fight over the remark that ""... there are Americans who think that the rest of the planet doesn't exist."

But I ask myself, 'Here's a man (my husband) engaged in affectionate banter with his wife (me), and he's supposed to monitor every word he says because some guy thousands of miles away is ready to take umbrage?'

The heck with that.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 03:13 PM

Thanks for the link, JTS. It has the clearest film I've seen.

Subject: RE: BS: American football question
From: gnu
Date: 15 Feb 09 - 07:29 AM

New York Giant's head coach quits.