BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan

Subject: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Goose Gander
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 02:45 PM

Some people like to eat like a caveman according to the NY Times.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 03:05 PM

There is a massive pool of people available for duty as morons, nabobs,freakazoids, and general dumbfucks.

While almost every "movement" has some basis in reality and a few good ideas, there will always be, especially in the United States, some number of folks who carry things to ridiculous extremes.

I doubt any of these assholes are Geico customers............


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 03:07 PM

Yuck. Besides which I seem to remember a recent article which said meat was not a very common part of the diet because it was so difficult to get and no way to preserve large quantities.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 03:09 PM

Actually kat, there were a shitload of home freezers back then and still the meat spoiled. No electricity was a major issue..........

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 03:30 PM

Head-Smashed-In-Buffalo-Jump and other such places point out the feast-or-famine problem, but they also point out that much of the meat was dried for later use.

I wonder where these folks would be if they REALLY had to hunt/gather their food?

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: SINSULL
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 03:38 PM

No problem, Rap. Central Park is a hunter's paradise. Rats the size of small dogs.
Did cavemen run FROM mastodon? I thought they hunted them which requires running towards them.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: gnu
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 03:45 PM

SINS. Ya only gotta get close enough to rile the suckers and get them to chase you. Then, sprint and leap over the pit and... mastadon rib BBQ! Beats them scrawny deer ribs.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 03:46 PM

I don't think the drying for later was thought of that early, was it? Isn't your reference to Native Americans of a later date, Rap?

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Goose Gander
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 03:58 PM

I'll stick with my smoker and the butcher shop.

What's the point of discovering fire if you're not going to use it?

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: MMario
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 04:20 PM

One of the things I remember from Anthropology during my university days was that though meat was a high STATUS meal in most hunter/gatherer societies it was a small percentage of the actual diet.

The "gathered" portion, including starchy items which were made into bread like substances, or porridges, formed most of the diet

Much of the protien came, not from the hunt, but from "gathered" low status items, such as grubs, frogs, insects.

These conclusins came from detailed sutdies of several hunter gathering societies. (And made for very boring reading)

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 05:00 PM

Yeah, there's nothing quite like seeing someone alone at a party and trying to get them involved..............

Hey man.....How are you?
Fine....Fine....
My name's Pat.....What's yours?
Oh....well, I'm Fred.
So what do you do Fred?
I'm an anthropologist.

(.....aw geeziz...fuck me...)

uh....Yeah...I gotta' run Fred.


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 05:04 PM

I imagine that mmario is mostly correct. It is unlikely that these folks are getting a real cave man diet unless they are eating bugs and the stomach contents of larger herbivores.

Also the fasting idea seems pretty silly unless they are emulating bachelor cave men with no one to gather for them,

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 05:11 PM

Thank yew, MMario!

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 05:37 PM

Nitrites for preserving meat were known before Homer's time (c. 850 BC), but no idea of the time preservatives were first used.

Drying goes back before recorded history, but back to Paleolithic times? Some have speculated about Neanderthals drying meat but there are no data.

I received some excellent Serrano ham from Spain at Christmas- it is preserved by drying.

Drying over heat (Indians and many other peoples) goes quite far back, but who was first- dunno.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 05:43 PM

I imagine that their digestive systems were hardier than ours. And even so, bad food was probably one reason that the paleo life span was half as long.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 05:48 PM

...the paleo life span was half as long.

Evidence for that?

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: gnu
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 06:13 PM

Well, I got a pick of the drying process for caplin in Nain, Labrador about thirty years ago. They just chucked them up on the roof.

Lots of good protein for later. Especially with the MILLIONS of flies laying eggs on em. You could here the buzz from 20 feet away.

Gag me with a maggot?

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Jack Campin
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 08:15 PM

NYTimes stuff is subscriber-only so most of us can't see that article.

The Stone Age diet (or variants thereof) works for a lot of people when nothing else does. It's hardly a new idea.

You might google for articles on Usenet forums by Don Wiss, who lives in Manhattan and has been eating that way for about 15 years (at least, I've been reading his messages for that long). Lots of practical information.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: GUEST,hg
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 09:18 PM

Actually, meat was the major portion of neanderthal diet because they needed so many calories to function in the cold environments of Western Europe. Mastodons were a favorite: shellfish and fish on the temperate coasts.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Goose Gander
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 11:45 PM

I'm not a subscriber and I can read the article.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: catspaw49
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 07:48 AM

Well lessee here..............
So far we have:

Meat was a major portion of their diet.
Meat was not a major portion of their diet.
This diet works.
This diet does not work.
Cave men got their protein from meat.
Cave men got their protein from other sources.
I can read the article.
I cannot read the article.

What I love around here is that we can argue over anything, no matter how stupid.
Trying for something of a general consensus here, I think we can all agree:

Anthropologists are boring motherfuckers.....
A video of Harpy running naked along the river should be sent to Spaw.



Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 07:55 AM

OH NO WE CAN'T!!

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: catspaw49
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 08:22 AM

Well then, how about a few high quality still photos?

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: GUEST,hg
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 11:23 AM

Too late shriveled buckeyes. I'm no longer young and svelte. You would not want to see my cottage cheese ass.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: GUEST,hg
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 11:50 AM

Also there is no evidence that neanderthals had any tools to process grains or plants They probably did gather but there is no indication that they had division of labor which the anthropologists believe was a plus in the rise of homo sapiens. Homo sapiens also seemed to have lived in larger groups which was a plus in survival. Gorge and starve was definitely a part of neanderthal life, I think. Gathering would have been of nuts, berries, and fruits as well as shellfish and fish with spears. But modern man, who supplanted neanderthal about 20 to 40 thousand years ago processed grains and the need for meat became less. Neanderthals may have cooked their meat since they had fire. NO indication that they had drying techniques. I think that is largely considered to be a skill of modern hunter gatherers.

The latest research supports the notion that many neanderthals were light skinned, and possibly had red hair and freckles because of their need to process vitamin D in the cold climates. They also may have worn shell jewelry and used pigments, probably took long sleeps as well to conserve calories. They needed up to five thousand calories a day to live in the cold climates.

(spaw snoring, farting...caveman style)

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: SINSULL
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 11:58 AM

McGrath,
Skeletons of early man have been found in burial sites and analyzed. 45 was a ripe old age.GOOGLE Neanderthal Life Span for more info.
M

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 12:21 PM

>>...the paleo life span was half as long.
Evidence for that? <<

Its in the article.
Not that the article is all that authoritative, but the article seems to be referencing the beliefs of these people.

Not that it matters. This is not a serious scientific discussion. At least it isn't to me.

By the way, I doubt that cave men had tooth brushes. Wouldn't using a tooth brush be less authentic than "eating nightshade?"

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: MMario
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 12:54 PM

Eggplant is old world and is a nightshade. So that premise is wrong.

I was out browsing articles on the Paleo diet and here is an excerpt from the author of one Paleo Diet book.

"Eat lots of produce. Paleolithic diet contained about 10-12 portions of produce per day, with a portion being around a half cup.

and

The nutrients in produce are not particularly affected by cooking. In fact, cooking breaks down some of the cellulose that we have no enzymes to digest, making the vitamin and mineral content of the vegetables much more available. This is even more important for those with weak digestive systems. For this reason, we recommend that vegetables be eaten mainly in the cooked form, with raw foods as a condiment for the most part.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 01:55 PM

A cute little article about a caveman wannabe, but of course no bearing on what the Paleolithic caveman ate.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: catspaw49
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 02:07 PM

Well, then, maybe just a Polaroid?

Listen, why don't we all start a new culty type of thing? Put up a couple of websites, do some blogging, send out some news release things, hit a few other forums..............Now then all we need is premise.........Maybe clearing up skin blemishes and wrinkles wit cow manure. I'm open for suggestions here..........

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 02:35 PM

Psychological cleansing through scatological utterances?

Call it Spaw Therapy.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: catspaw49
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 03:16 PM

Wow....That one is VERY good Jack and a real honor.........I am truly touched. By what I have no idea........Say, that proves it works doesn't it?

Should we issue membership cards?


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: MMario
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 03:38 PM

uhmm ---- what the neanderthal ate and how long they lived is irrelevant, since Neanderthal died out and we are the descendants of Cro-Magnons. And there IS evidence of gathering and much plant use by Cro-Magnon.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: gnu
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 03:39 PM

Spawthepy? Works for me.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: GUEST,999
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 04:23 PM

"Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan"

PT Barnum was right.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 04:27 PM

"The Paglicci 23 individual (Cro-Magnon) "carried a mtDNA sequence that is still common in Europe, and which radically differs from those of the almost contemporary Neanderthals, demonstrating a genealogical continuity across 28,000 years, from Cro-Magnoid to modern Europeans."
News item in Science Daily
Cro-magnoid men developed group hunting techniques, made use of a wide variety of foods, cooked, etc.


It may be a vile calumny that they ate the Neanderthals, causing their extinction. Then again .....

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Gurney
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 09:45 PM

I understood that early Europeans often lived in very cold climates, and could use permafrost to freeze foodstuffs. Some Scandinavian people air-dry meat even today, and fish too. An acquired taste, but!
You have to remember that there weren't very many of them, and there was a lot of 'nature' about, so food may have been plentiful but life was hard, and you could die young from a good many causes other than poor nutrition.
Like that poor sod they call 'The Iceman.' He had clothes, shoes, a thatched coat, knife, bow and arrows..... and got caught in a storm, probably.
Local settlers record here in NZ that the small birds used to pick off the maggots from the carcases hanging on the shaded verandas.
Maggotty meat is easily digested, because maggots feed by spitting pepsin and drinking the resultant soup, and maggot pepsin is similar to human pepsin.
I'm glad times have changed. Just random thoughts.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Goose Gander
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 10:12 PM

I thought the iceman was murdered(?)

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Goose Gander
Date: 14 Jan 10 - 10:15 PM

The Iceman was murdered says Time Magazine.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Charley Noble
Date: 15 Jan 10 - 09:05 AM

Yes, the Iceman was found to have an arrowhead within his ribs.

I've been here in NYC for a week and have encountered no Neo-Paleolithites. We did go to the Ghenet for a great meal, an Ethiopian restaurant in Brooklyn, and McSorley's Old Ale House for cheese & crackers & onions & dark ale & dark ale & dark ale...

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Jan 10 - 10:06 AM

It seems like a profoundly silly idea. But then again, no sillier than a lot of other fad diets.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Goose Gander
Date: 15 Jan 10 - 10:19 AM

When I first saw the article, I thought it was an 'Onion' - style parody.

And they say California is full of fruits and nuts.

(irony both intended and unintended).

G.G.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Gurney
Date: 16 Jan 10 - 03:29 AM

I hadn't heard the 'iceman murdered' theory. Maybe he was a hitman?
I have read that early trappers and explorers in America sometimes carried cut-off arrows, a when the attaching sinew rotted, arrowheads, until they finally they found a surgeon to cut them out.

Subject: RE: BS: Paleolithic Diet in Manhattan
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 16 Jan 10 - 05:29 PM

Steak tartare

1 pound finely ground beef tenderloin
1 teaspoon brown mustard
1/2 teaspoon tabasco
1 teaspoon Worcester
1 teaspoon brandy
White pepper and salt to taste
1 egg.

Mix and blend. Refrigerate for one hour to blend. Serve on bread, crackers or toast.