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Tech: Internet may shut down?
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Subject: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 04 Jan 12 - 11:31 PM In an apparently serious threat, fairly large numbers of providers of Internet services have threatened to "Nuke" the internet in protest against SOPA. A report on the possibility is at MSNBC's TechnoLog: Will Google, Facebook, others 'nuke' Internet over SOPA? Services who have singed on to at least discuss the possibility include: AOL eBay Etsy Foursquare IAC Mozilla OpenDNS PayPal Yahoo! Zynga If the plan comes together, expect the most likely date for a shutdown of the above (and probably others) on 23 January 2012, the day before the US Senate begins hearings on the SOPA proposal. Although still in the planning stages, this appears to be a serious threat that is rapidly gaining a following. Although no firm date has been set, planning a few outdoor activities might be in order for the day. (or just go to the office and do some actual work for a change) Watch for further news. John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: nickp Date: 05 Jan 12 - 05:01 AM "do some actual work for a change" Hmm, I guess I'd better plan for that!! |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 05 Jan 12 - 05:33 AM But of course you should keep your plans flexible, since the proposed action is still in planning stages. Maybe we need suggestions for a list of things to do instead of e-shopping and cruising the web. Of course we should keep it to simple stuff that can be handled easily by addicts in withdrawal ... John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Artful Codger Date: 05 Jan 12 - 03:37 PM The shutdown will probably occur the day before, when panicked teens begin frantically tweeting each other that they won't be able to survive without their Facebook, Google and YouTube, and they overload the bandwidth capacity. Microsoft servers all over the country will bluescreen by sympathetic osmosis--it doesn't take much. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Arthur_itus Date: 05 Jan 12 - 04:41 PM To be perfectly honest John, It doesn't bother me much if they do that. How would this affect ISP's in the UK? My internet ISP is a business ISP and one of the tops in the UK. How will this affect them, if at all? My main concern, is for my wife who is a freelance translator and gets her work via email and if that sort of action occurs, I need to know if they are going to affect her earnings as that is her salary as such, our only means of paying our bills. What do you think? |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 05 Jan 12 - 04:45 PM No eBay? No Amazon? I will be forced to save money! Lordamercy! |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 05 Jan 12 - 05:23 PM No PayPal, so Arthur_itis won't be able to buy the mudcat CDs easily. Quite likely, if SOPA is passed as proposed, soon no MUDCAT, so he won't know what to order when PayPal comes back up, so I suppose it doesn't matter all that much. As the bill is proposed, YouTube likely will be one of the first major permanent shutdowns. Without Twitter and FaceBook there will be NO NEWS during the shutdown, since virtually all "news reporters and commentators" have forgotten how to write anything original or to do any research except at those sites (although some of the smart ones also apparently check Etsy and LinkedIn). It depends on how steep the re-learning curve is as to whether they'll remember anything they might have known in the past. but a lot of them have demonstrated limited learning capability and may be too young to have that much of a past. The proposed shut-down isn't too big a deal, but passage of SOPA could be a very big thing, so the materializing of a significant PROTEST is a big encouragement for those who will be affected by our lame-brained Congress. John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,999 Date: 05 Jan 12 - 05:51 PM This dovetails with an article I just read to do with Obama's 2008 campaign. He had a site set up and ready to go and lots of blogger working for him, and some analysts figure he won the election because of that. He raised a substantial amount of his campaign cash via the internet. That said, who the hell do these congressional a$$holes think they are? Like some American law can subject non-Americans to serious inconvenience just because an American law can decide with whom we can communicate and what we can say? Get stuffed! It wouldn't surprise me if the internet giants simply decide to move their headquarters elsewhere. The US congress is beyond lame-brained. It also has a seriously puffed up sense of its own importance to non Americans. And where the hell are the American people? They voted for these folks. Get RID of them. They are not very nice. China controls its internet, as does Myanmar and Iran. Now it will be the USA. Anyone see a trend in this? |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Richard Bridge Date: 05 Jan 12 - 06:15 PM There might be a silver lining if the UK and Canada set up their own internet businesses on non-US servers. Until they went Blackberry. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 05 Jan 12 - 06:22 PM Part of that "Change you can believe in"??? Sounds more like China, every day!..Oh well, what did you expect? GfS |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,999 Date: 05 Jan 12 - 06:39 PM See that post when you have a minute, GfS. BS: The Petty Arguments Thread 31-Dec-11 - 11:36 AM |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 05 Jan 12 - 09:24 PM As a Side note, a group advocating the free I believe it was Sweden or Norway that certified them, but didn't make good notes. It might still be up at MSNBC Tech Page(?) if you can find it among the "games news." John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,999 Date: 05 Jan 12 - 10:37 PM I wonder why anyone would want to stifle what's left of the media? As long as everyone feels safe in America . . . |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 06 Jan 12 - 03:02 AM k-1 - As noted above, the reporter apparently is another who's been spending too much time on Twitter(?). "I thought someone was upset about not getting there check," Quoting a verbal statement, one must assume it's the reporter who can't spel.? John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 06 Jan 12 - 05:07 AM In case anyone didn't believe: Piracy 'church' gets approval from Swedish government John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: nickp Date: 06 Jan 12 - 05:49 AM "I thought someone was upset about not getting there check," Quoting a verbal statement, one must assume it's the reporter who can't spel.? "excercise" too! At least the editor should have noticed... |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,chris Date: 06 Jan 12 - 07:14 AM so usa screws world economy now they want to screw the internet - what next - no breathing without usa permission!!!!!! |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Arthur_itus Date: 06 Jan 12 - 06:09 PM Well I don't think it ewill affect me in the UK. I really don't need facbook etc. My wife does need the abilty to receive and send work, which is income and that is what is important. I don't download illegally, so don't have a problem there. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Arkie Date: 07 Jan 12 - 12:41 PM chris, I do not think everyone in the USA is to blame. More likely some very greedy and power hungry individuals and corporations. While they have obviously bought some American political hacks they may not even pay taxes. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,Question Date: 09 Jan 12 - 01:40 AM I do hope that this goes through, it may not be a solution to our problem. But it will show that we are not joking when it comes to our freedoms. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Richard Bridge Date: 09 Jan 12 - 11:09 AM This legal blog may interest some http://scrivenerserror.blogspot.com/2012/01/c105x.html |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Richard Bridge Date: 16 Jan 12 - 03:48 PM A note from a blogger I know. If the examiner.com http://www.examiner.com/computers-in-denver/house-kills-sopa is to be believed, US Congressman Eric Cantor (Republican) has announced he will stop all action on SOPA. More news on Techdirt www.techdirt.com/articles/20120116/02043417413/sopapipa-supporters-pretend-white-house-statement-means-we-can-rush-through-sopap. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,999 Date: 16 Jan 12 - 04:35 PM Good to see, but PIPA is still looming (PIPA is the Senate version of SOPA). I am glad Godaddy lost that amount of business. Serves them right. From the article (the second link doesn't work for me, Richard): "Another reason would be that the White House threatened to veto the bill if it had passed." Yeah, right, and where have we heard THAT before? |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Sandy Mc Lean Date: 16 Jan 12 - 04:43 PM Does Obama have to sign on this shit to make it law? |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Sandy Mc Lean Date: 16 Jan 12 - 04:44 PM Cross post Bruce:; |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 16 Jan 12 - 05:09 PM I haven't looked today, but as of yesterday the headlines were saying "Obama Criticizes SOPA." What actually happened was that three "administration advisors" posted a blog statement pointing out some of the faults in the proposed bill. The articles yesterday said very specifically that Obama had NOT said whether he is considering a veto. A report later in the day (again yesterday) said that one of the main sponsors of the Senate bill had asked that a scheduled vote on whether the bill should be moved out of Committee should be cancelled "to permit more complete review." Moving the bill out of Committee would normally mean an almost immediate vote by the full Senate. Obama was reported as having applauded the purpose of the bills, but expressed reservations about the details; which is, IMO, a polite way of allowing some of the most vocal idiots to "change their minds gracefully" and actually do some usful work without creating a confrontation (before it's necessary). Of course some things may have changed overnight. I may take another look later. John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 16 Jan 12 - 05:11 PM I meant to note: today is a "legal holiday" for Federal Offices, which means most of the legislature is probably off somewhere getting drunk; but also means there's unlikely to have been much useful activity today. John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Richard Bridge Date: 16 Jan 12 - 05:13 PM The mudcat blickifier is truncating the link, Here it is unblickified www.techdirt.com/articles/20120116/02043417413/sopapipa-supporters-pretend-white-house-statement-means-we-can-rush-through-sopapipa.shtml |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,999 Date: 16 Jan 12 - 05:13 PM No problem, Sandy. Great minds think alike and fools . . . JiK: thanks for starting this thread. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,999 Date: 16 Jan 12 - 05:33 PM Richard's link. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: katlaughing Date: 16 Jan 12 - 07:17 PM WIKI DEFINITELY DOING OFF ON WEDNESDAY. The owner sent out a tweet warning students to do their homework early. Yeah! |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Rapparee Date: 16 Jan 12 - 08:43 PM I haven't said anything on this until now because I thought cooler heads would prevail. I was wrong; I forgot how much money talks. This is another case of a passive technology (movies) being overtaken by an active technology (the WWW and the Internet). By that I mean that you view movies and television and videos and so on but you do not take part in them. You are taken from the beginning to the end independent of any action on your part (other than leaving or using the off switch). With the Internet (by which I include the World Wide Web -- they really are different, kids) you can control what you do. Witness the "Arab Spring" and the Occupy movements and the "flash mobs." In the past protest movements, strikes and other "actions" could be stopped with force or with a curfew or by other heavy-handed means. Now a new sort of "reality" has arisen, one that cannot be stopped without the Heavy Handers cutting off their own hands. The Internet has grown to encompass the entire Earth, the emphasis should be on the Internet (i.e., between networks) and the World Wide Web. Nothing can really be accomplished by the MPAA or another other such group until they realize this...and it would be well for all of us to remember it as well. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Richard Bridge Date: 17 Jan 12 - 04:00 PM Overoptimistic Rap. Most ISPs run site blocking protocols - you just don't always know. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Tootler Date: 17 Jan 12 - 06:41 PM Richard, haven't you heard of tinyurl.com? They can shorten your very long url to something more manageable. Here is your link run through tinyurl: http://tinyurl.com/77w78qd Or you could try bitly http://bit.ly/yAWIuS |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Rapparee Date: 17 Jan 12 - 07:21 PM Richard, I ran a network for a dozen years. No, I'm simply stating a fact, not getting smart-ass with you. Yes, an ISP can shut down or block something. But the nodes that make up the Internet are designed to find another route around the non-functioning node. People tend to think of the Internet as a point-to-point telephone-like system. It's not. Here's a map of the ARPANET as of March, 1977. It was simple then. A satellite uplink from, say, London to Rutgers to MIT to Moffett Air Force Base to Hawai'i -- or any other route to get from here to there. Any one or more of those links could shut down and the net would still function. It is the same today, only much more complex -- several hundred orders of magnitude so. If you use a PC, try this: Open your Start menu and click on "Run". Type in "tracert www.mudcat.org" (no quotes, of course) and see how many nodes your signal goes through, and how quickly, to get from you to the 'Cat servers. Do it again in a half an hour and see if the route or number of nodes you go through changes; it almost certainly will. When you get three or more lines of asterix you'll know that you've bumped up against the firewall and that you're there. ("tracert" means "trace route" for all you non-geeks out there.) Try this for various other places around the world. It's the best way I know to get a grasp for how big the Internet actually is. As I said earlier, the World Wide Web (WWW) is not the Internet -- the WWW is information stored on individual servers connected by the Internet. Even much of that information is archived -- you can see what a website looked like (although not, perhaps, view its content) at the Internet archive. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: treewind Date: 18 Jan 12 - 03:20 AM "I don't download illegally, so don't have a problem there." First they came for the communists... |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 18 Jan 12 - 03:52 AM Wikipedia main page says: Imagine a World Without Free Knowledge For over a decade, we have spent millions of hours building the largest encyclopedia in human history. Right now, the U.S. Congress is considering legislation that could fatally damage the free and open Internet. For 24 hours, to raise awareness, we are blacking out Wikipedia. Learn more. Contact your representatives. (Tastefully done) Apparently they decided on a 24-hour blackout, rather than the 12 hr reported earlier. John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Richard Bridge Date: 18 Jan 12 - 04:07 AM Rap, when Wikipedia is up again, have a look here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleanfeed_(content_blocking_system) |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Baz Bowdidge Date: 18 Jan 12 - 08:47 AM >Rap, when Wikipedia is up again, have a look here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleanfeed_(content_blocking_system)< That's blocked too.... The Story |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Rapparee Date: 18 Jan 12 - 09:49 AM I read several comics online every day. These are run by small business people who all seemed to be opposed to SOPA/PIPA. Expedia is not alone. (But scroll down to enjoy the comic.) |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: RichM Date: 19 Jan 12 - 09:37 AM I think the solution is for Non-americans to set up our own internet, free from the control of the American Empire. I don't want a world that is built on American principles and prejudices. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,999 Date: 19 Jan 12 - 09:47 AM Well said, RichM. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Rapparee Date: 19 Jan 12 - 10:04 AM But it already is. Canada, for instance, could opt out of US connections and still get along just fine. The Internet is no longer dependent upon any one country and hasn't been for quite some years. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,olddude Date: 19 Jan 12 - 10:30 AM No problem Al Gore will invent another one |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 19 Jan 12 - 11:54 PM The blackout by numerous sites appears to have gotten some attention from at least some politicians. In the interest of maintaining some sense of humor about the SOPA/PIPA bulls*t, a little lighter view appeared recently. The article doesn't say a whole lot, but the embedded video might be of interest to some: Jon Stewart, Dramatic Chipmunk call out congressional nerd bashing By Helen A.S. Popkin "A series of tubes" is how then-Sen. Ted Stevens (R-Alaska) described the Internet in 2006 while defending his anti-neutrality position, and it seems not a whole lot has changed up on Capitol Hill since then. Six years later, at least half a dozen congressmen referred to those who actually understand the global system of computer networks connected by the standard Internet protocol suite as "nerds." This smart people-bashing took place during discussions of the nerd-hated Stop Online Piracy Act currently before Congress. Jon Stewart shared a montage of left-handed congressional compliments on Wednesday's "Daily Show" in a piece about the day's Internet blackout by websites protesting the bill. He even brought Dramatic Chipmunk — aka Dramatic Prairie Dog aka Dramatic Gopher — to help, and included a montage revealing how "stealing" copyrighted content can age even a host of a fake news TV show. ** Those who watch closely may notice that the "Dramatic Chipmunk" appears actually to be a prairie dog, and Stewart makes about as much fun of himself as of the Congressonal idiots; but it's somewhat amusing. (IMO) John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: Ebbie Date: 20 Jan 12 - 02:42 AM OldDan, I hope your comment is made tongue-in-cheek but just in case: The Al Gore+internet has long been laid to rest. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: GUEST,olddude Date: 20 Jan 12 - 04:01 PM Yes it was Ebbie, teasing |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Internet may shut down? From: JohnInKansas Date: 22 Jan 12 - 07:12 AM Now that SOPA/PIPA is officially dead, there remains the threat that something similar could follow, especially after the #$@%# election crap gets over with. It might be a good idea to begin to consider what restriction are appropriate and what ones are unnecessary and/or harmful. A main problem with the bills most recently considered is that they would have allowed shutting down (without a hearing or legal action) any entire domain, if a copyright holder complained that any site in the domain showed his/her work. Other sites, and especially search engines, could have been barred from linking to any domain (not just the individual site) thus blackballed. The prohibition on linking to sites, even when the site/domain couldn't be shut down, could have been applied to anyone within US jurisdiction (under laws or treaties). Mudcat is one site that might well have been subject to such actions, unjustified as it might have been. A "complaint" that points up a problem seen by many copyright holders is "gently(?) voiced" by a web pundit who's generally opposed the draconian legislation proposed by the idiots; but it is a point that should be considered. Stop pirating my stories about SOPA, or I'll have to support it By Bob Sullivan SOPA – Maybe I'm for it after all. I'm as adamant a supporter of Web free speech as you'll find. And there's a lot to dislike about the Stop Online Piracy Act. But when my stories about Web free speech are stolen and posted in their entirety by "rogue" websites, my head hurts. Stealing content is a funny way to prove your anti-SOPA credentials. Opponents of controversial anti-piracy legislation called SOPA have been gaining momentum in the past week, and on Wednesday, their show of muscle reached orgasmic proportions. Perhaps swept up in the excitement of a protest that seems to be working, a long list of websites copied in its entirety a story I wrote about it over the weekend and placed it on their own sites. Here's one example, viewed early Wednesday afternoon. ... The article continues. Sullivan writes the "Red Tape Chronicles" where I've found quite a few articles well worth some thought, and I've posted links and comments to several of them here. When the articles are short, as most of his are, I've likely pasted a little more than necessary; but I'm pretty sure I've always included a link to the original. Keeping the copy/paste posts within "fair use" permitted, and even more important, showing some respect for (some) sources should mandate providing a link, if one is available; and even if you have to look a bit to find the originator of an article, and link to there, it does seem fair. Especially when starting a thread, it would seem that anything worth talking about (for the rest of us) is worth some explanation of why the initiator thinks it's important enough for the rest of us to be inteested, and it would be polite to indicate "which side" the one starting the conversation thinks is the stronger, especially if it's something even slightly controversial. Reading the original articles linked in discussions surely would contribute to avoiding the appearance of ignorance (although that doesn't really bother some of us all that much), but as Sullivan points out, he also gets his nickel from the number of hits on the article, so as a favor to him I'll request that everyone who reads this post should click the link - even if it's just to help make him happy. (And while you're there, you might look at a few other articles to see if his reporting merits trying to keep him happy if he is quoted again here.(?)) Is this worth discussing? John |
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