BS: The best pie

Subject: BS: The best pie
From: olddude
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 08:04 AM

I gave my Amish friend a bunch of frozen raspberries that I picked. His wife made me the greatest pie I ever had ... no idea how she can get the crust that flaky and perfect ... Wow ...

Now I love pie, I have eaten every pie in the world I think .. but wow this was great

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: olddude
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 08:10 AM

cast iron wood stove maybe .. hmmm don't want to ask just speculating

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: catspaw49
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 08:31 AM

lard

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Nick
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 08:56 AM

With picture - pie chart

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: GUEST,999
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 10:07 AM

Spaw nailed it in one.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: maeve
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 10:35 AM

Lard tends to make a flaky crust, yes- but it's the handling that makes the biggest difference. One can make a tender, flaky butter pie crust- depending on the temperature and handling of the flour, butter, and water.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 10:59 AM

You have to come to Lancashire for the best pies.

Always have. Always will.

:D (tG)

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Ebbie
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 11:00 AM

Yep, lard. And a generations' long tradition of how it is done.

On the other hand, my mother used to ruin strawberries by putting them in with rhubarb...

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: frogprince
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 11:16 AM

Awww, Ebbie, you've just about broken my heart. I've always thought of you as one of the people "here" with taste, class, and discernment. I've thought that if my wife and I ever got to Alaska, I would see if we could stop by to meet you. And now you go putting down strawberry rhubarb pie. I make have to turn away, and shake the dust off my boots...
                         ; )

                      Dean

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Bill D
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 11:40 AM

Ebbie & I will sit and eat our strawberries plain..or on good shortcake, and watch you eat the pie with rhubarb.... and not be a bit envious.

(won't we, Ebbie?)

Me? I have had many, many excellent pies... and many, many more which were between 'quite good' and 'atrocious'..... it is hard to pick just one as the 'best' I have ever had, but if I were going to be hanged tomorrow and had ONE choice, it would be fresh Gooseberry pie...done right.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 11:50 AM

Pie! I think it was watching Twin Peaks which taught me all about American Pie (though I'm sure I've probably also seen the films long ago). Never understood the phrase "as American as Apple Pie" of course, as Apple Pie has been a part of my diet (and all English people's diet since a very long time ago - the Middle Ages I think) since an infant. Exotic imports such as 'Blueberry Pie" or "Key Lime Pie" however are entirely intriguing and 'alien' (to borrow from US parlance).

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: GUEST,999
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 12:01 PM

"You have to come to Lancashire for the best pies."

My gran was from Lancashire and Dave may have something there. She could make pies like no tomorrow. Apple, and Beef and Kidley. Wow. No, WOW!

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: olddude
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 02:14 PM

I get grapes all that I want and I get grape juice all that I want for free. Everytime I bring the kids jugs of grape juice from the processing plant they clap their hands. Little girls with their little bonnets and the little guys with their coveralls and hats .. Omg how cute the little ones are. She made me a jar of grape jelly last fall that was the best I ever had also ...

The Amish eat well ....

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: maeve
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 02:20 PM

You can't do better than good fresh ingredients prepared with skill.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: olddude
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 02:21 PM

Today I tried to pay him for a RR watch that he restored for me, Nope no way. I learned never argue. I just drove 7 miles to the grocery store and got them stuff they love like Oranges, baking stuff and other things. It is hard to drive a buggie 7 miles in snow ... The oranges they normally won't buy them but love them. Maybe the cost or maybe church thing don't know but they are certainly allowed to eat them. Little guys jumping up and down with the German accents .. so fun

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Bill D
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 02:28 PM

*smile*.. the last time I found fresh gooseberries was at an Amish stand in PA, coming back from a trip. Tended by a girl about 16 in her bonnet. Cheap, too,,,

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: gnu
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 02:34 PM

Ebbie... "Yep, lard. And a generations' long tradition of how it is done."

They don't call it Tenderflake lard fer nothin.

Mind you, ya can make 99% as good a crust with shortening if, as Ebbie said, ya do it right.

Strawberry-Rhubard and hot, strong tea please.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 02:40 PM

So what ARE the all-time best American Pie's ('apple pie' excepted as Mediaeval Europe bagged that one long since).

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 03:07 PM

Lard is essential to a good crust, as noted by several posters above.

There is no best pie; if well-made, there are many that are excellent (well, my pumpkin I consider the best, but I wouldn't reject other fine examples).

Gooseberry used to be a favorite of mine, but many plants have been poisoned or rooted out in this province (Alberta) because the rust they carry can infect field crops. Occasionally found frozen at the grocery.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Jon Corelis
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 03:27 PM

Lard of course has a terrible reputation nowadays -- "ewww, fat!!"

But there are two kinds of lard. The type you find unrefrigerated in boxes on store shelves is indeed nasty stuff -- hydrogenated fat, tastes terrible and is worse for you.

But "real" lard -- rendered fresh pork fat -- is virtually a different substance with the same name. It can sometimes be found at good butcher shops. It needs to be refrigerated. Or you can make it at home. Some cookery books will give recipes, but it basically involves cutting up pork fat and cooking it covered with water until the water evaporates. Julia Child claims in one of her books that this "real" lard actually has nutritional properties similar to olive oil. I've never verified that, but having had it, I can testify that it is from a culinary viewpoint simply a different substance than hydrogenated lard.

A teaspoon of (real) lard added to cooked dishes along with the butter or oil used for their preliminary cooking will add a lot of the lard flavor without so much of the richness or calories.

Jon Corelis
Poems, Plays, Songs, and Essays

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 03:29 PM

I heart lard, even though we live as vegetarians.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: gnu
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 03:38 PM

Partridge Berry-Rhubarb-Strawberry for me here in Atlantic Canada... but it's RARE. Ya can't buy it and few people make it. The Partridge Berries are used in jam 99.9% of the time. Some people might make one per year. I have only ever eaten it in NFLD. It's outta this world... only on The Granite Planet, eh b'y.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: maeve
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 04:07 PM

One of the reasons lard makes a good flaky crust is the hardness of it when cold. It won't become amalgamated into the flour. Soft lard and oil or soft butter can't make layers in the crust in the same way. Cold unsalted butter or cold pork lard handled properly make flaky layers of tender and tasty pastry. Add egg yolk, sour cream, cream cheese, etc. for a richer, more tender crust suitable for different baked goods. Make a sturdy crust to hold a tasty meat filling.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Paul Burke
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 04:53 PM

pie = 8.5397...

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 05:22 PM

Pure lard is available at all grocery stores here. Never seen hydrogenated stuff except for cosmetic use.

Canada; labeled analysis, per 10 gm:
Calories- 90
Fat- 10 gm
(Saturated, 4 gm, Transfats 0.1 gm)
Cholesterol 5 mg
Protein 0.1 gm
(Maple Leaf Tenderflake)

Shelf life, 1 year. Best kept in the fridge after opening. I remember we bought it in small pails years ago, but all markets here now have 454 gram packages (same size as butter).

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: gnu
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 06:16 PM

I use shortening on accounta the shelf life because I don't use a lot. The Crisco website has some good info.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Bert
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 06:40 PM

1/4 pound of lard
1/4 cup water
1 1/3 cups flour
1/4 teaspoon of salt

all at room temperature

With a fork, mix the lard water salt and HALF of the flour in a bowl
until you get a smooth paste.

Gently work in the rest of the flour.

It doesn't get any easier than that. No refrigerating.

Just roll out on a well floured board.

You can trade flavour for texture by using half butter, half lard.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Bobert
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 08:13 PM

Screw lard...

The P-Vine will win any pie contest (and has) without any lard...

Her crusts are so good that she makes a little extra when she does a pie and bakes them and people fight over 'um...

As fir her pies... She makes an apple pie that makes a man crawl for just one slice... Kinda like her...

(Bad, boberdz, bad...)

B;~)

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: gnu
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 09:36 PM

Thread drift...

I was about 13. Made Johnny Cake (corn bread) and sausages for supper rather than what I was told to make for supper when Mum and Dad got home from work. It smelled great. It looked okay. My old man tucked in and this look came over his face. He spat it on the plate and looked at me with a scowl (he was quick to anger) and asked, "What the fuck is this?" At 13 years old with not a lot of training baking, baking powder and baking soda can get mixed up. I stuck with meat and potatoes after that.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Bert
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 11:34 PM

OK. Bobert, recipe please.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 01:21 AM

A friend just shared this link: single serving pie in a jar (wider, shallower half-pint jars). Freeze uncooked to have ready to bake any time.

If you wanted a lower-fat version (I know, what's the point?), you could just put the lid on it, since there's a higher proportion of crust to filling in the jars.

~ Becky in Tucson

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Ebbie
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 02:57 AM

Fresh ingredients, as was mentioned above, has a lot to do with it too. Until I was 14 and our family moved away from Oregon we never owned a refrigerator. Things that had to be kept cool were put in the deep cellar accessed by a big trap door on the back porch; otherwise whatever we had was fresh again at the next meal.

There were nine children and in addition we frequently had cousins from 'back east' living with us so most of the time there were 14 at our table. I was the next to youngest in the family; I and the sis that was five years older had to do the mountains of dishes and pots and pans. Had we hurried we could have been done in 45 minutes or so- but sometimes we barely got done before it was time to cook the next meal.

Every week we baked 12 loaves of bread and seven pies. lol

We butchered our own pork, beef, chicken, ducks and geese, milked our own cows, made our own butter and cheeses and ice cream. We had a huge garden and an orchard out back of the house.

We canned everything. Our meat was processed in 2-quart Mason jars, as was our fruit. One-quart jars were for jellies and jams. We cooked our own apple butter outdoors in a big copper kettle stirred by a big wooden paddle that Mom made. We kids took turns keeping that paddle in motion, back and forth, back and forth.

One item we 'put up' was unique to us in our Amish community: My mother had us slice apples and pears and peaches that we then dried on a tin roof over butcher paper and under cheese cloth. I remember how good that dried, chewy fruit tasted.

Mom said that in the '40s for her weekly shopping she took a five-dollar bill to the stores...

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Mr Red
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 08:59 AM

and the best place to "way a pie"?

ducks and runs for cover

I will shout the answer from there - if anyone wants it.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Mr Happy
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 10:09 AM

Johnny cake? Made from johnnies, sounds most unappetising!

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Neil D
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 11:08 PM

The best American pie? My pumpkin pie is pretty damn good. I use double the spices and 4 times the clove of any recipe. Store bought pumpkin pie is way too bland. In the deep south the best pie by far is pecan pie. And when you say pecan make sure it rhymes with Dan, not Don.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Ebbie
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 11:34 PM

As in 'peekin', Neil? I had to get used to that in Virginia. On he west coast it is pronounced 'peeCON.'

I just remembered: of those 7 weekly pies my mother (and my older sisters) used to make, there would be two or three cream pies, three various berry pies, and one or two nut pies, as in walnut or peeCON.

Subject: RE: BS: The best pie
From: Bert
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 12:41 AM

Bobert, we don't doubt your word. We just want to be able to make some for ourselves.

The recipe that I posted is the best that I have found so far, but I am always open to trying something better.