Smokers in clubs

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Apr 14 - 05:16 AM

Eliza, the real damage done by cigarettes is mostly from the tars which are created by the burning. The nicotine is relatively harmless, were it not for its addictive quality. Separate the two and you can noticeably diminish the risks: the electronic gaspers simply deliver nicotine released by warming, through the lungs, rather than through the skin as in nicotine patches.
The problem lies rather in the psychology involved. Retaining an inhaled form means the fag companies still have the habit entrenched for anyone wanting to go back to cigarettes to hook into more easily: I suspect it's linked to a nipple fixation, a very powerful hook because it's rooted so far back in our childhoods. If you want to break this finally - and Jim's case shows why it is so attractive economically - then you have to break every grip the murderers have on their victims. I won't use a lesser word for companies which know that every day what they do will kill hundreds of people, it makes them outrank any terrorist organisation, and the pain they cause in doing so places them somewhere up alongside the greatest mass-murderers in history. They have no moral case, and the cost to our entire society so far outweighs their profits that I can see no rational case for not banning the stuff outright, bar perhaps for those who have already been addicted doing cold turkey, weaning themselves off. The major reason so many who try fail is because cigarettes remain available as a temptation.
If you want to smoke, don't do so at my expense, please. Your ilk did enough blasting it in my face when I was young, and now charge the consequences to the taxpayer, which includes me. Those over 65 may have started smoking before this was known, so can just about claim ignorance, although 50 years resisting the data by not breaking the addiction and surviving the consequences is rather stretching the credit they may be able to claim. Those between 18 and 65 have started smoking in a period when it was clear what the risks were, and must be told to break the addiction. And let the cost of this be charged to the remaining asset value of the cigarette companies after liquidation. Finally, for those under 18, if they still want to smoke, require them to hold private health insurance for the rest of their lives for the consequences.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 20 Apr 14 - 04:30 AM

It is difficult to put actual figures when dealing with goods entering the country without duty paid, but there is little evidence to suggest tobacco duty is enough to pay for anything. Some studies suggest the majority of those smoking larger quantities buy via a man with a van and regular trips to Calais.

I recall a few years ago, Drum was the most popular rolling tobacco but at the time, the Dutch company did not have a UK licence so every last but then was brought in and sold illegally. Available openly now, sadly.

A more reliable superlative is that tobacco is the root of over 35% of all NHS spending in England. That it is falling is due to a combination of bad diet and healthy people living longer so getting conditions late in life.

As England NHS budget is £108 billion, that would have to be a hell if a lot of duty to fund 35% of it.....





Such things are subjective but a quick look at treasury data on opengov website and a calculator suggests it funds 0.0004% of health spending.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 20 Apr 14 - 04:27 AM

To put the matter of food and cooking smells in pubs and clubs into context - they were always there, wherever food was prepared and served. However, before the smoking ban, you didn't notice them on your clothes because they were masked by the even worse stench of other people's fags. Same thing applies with regard to dirty, unwashed buggers' BO.

It's a PITA that your clothes smell of food and cooking after a pub visit but, on the positive side, I never heard of anyone contracting lung-cancer from the smell of the sausage, egg and chips the guy at the next table was eating!

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Apr 14 - 03:46 AM

If the tobacco industry was not as powerful as it is, and if the revenue it brought in, in the form of taxation was not as large as it is, I have no doubt that the sale of this lethal drug would have been banned long ago.
A smoking ban in public places is the teetering first step in taking control of something that has long been out-of-hand.
Its positive effects are reflected in health report figures - slowly, but surely....
There are now discussions on banning smoking in cars and in the presence of children - this latter is long, long overdue and perhaps should have been the first move.
Remembering the oppressive atmosphere in pubs and on public transport was like in my younger days in Liverpool and in Ireland, I was convinced that the ban wouldn't last five minutes - now, some of the loudest advocates of it are the hardened smokers.
My parents were both heavy smokers , so I understand the urge people have to smoke and the undeniable addictive nature of nicotine.
What I don't understand is why a vocal handful of those who are unfortunate enough to be hooked, feel it necessary to inflict their addiction on others.
Wonder if they could explain, rather than hiding behind Their "worse examples of pollution" - I'm sure a more rationally put case would attract more understanding and sympathy .
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 20 Apr 14 - 03:21 AM

I can understand it.

Drug addiction means the craving overtakes all other concerns. This is why less available drugs such as crack lead to the addicts resorting to crime to feed their habit.

Cigarettes are more available, that's all. The selfishness that comes from feeding your habit is there to be seen. Have a look at the awful website Forest, funded by the global drug pushers such as BAT, that lobbies to overturn public health measures in the interest of perpetuating addiction and lining the pockets of shareholders.

I too was rather shocked to hear Mike's experience.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Guest - Lin
Date: 20 Apr 14 - 01:26 AM

To MikeL 2

I'm trying to write a post but it accidently got submitted twice before I could write my message.
Anyway, I first wanted to say how sorry to hear what you had to go through after getting throat cancer. How terrible you had to suffer so much, but glad you seem to be better now.

I just have to kind of just shake my head thinking about how inconsiderate and thoughtless that your wife's sister is for smoking around you after all that you went through. You say that you do not prevent family or friends or anyone else from smoking at your home.

You are trying to be tolerant and accommodating for these family, friends, etc. when they should be thinking of what cigarette smoke did to you. Even though you do not prevent them from smoking if they so desire - THEY SHOULD REFRAIN FROM IT ANYWAY. How could people be so selfish as to smoke around you after what you went through?

How could your wife's sister just think about her own selfish desire to smoke even though you "do not prevent it." I know you probably don't want to make waves and be a good host and everything - but Mike you need to think about your health and really think about the long term effects and not allow it in your home at all. Your family and friends should be caring enough and NOT SMOKE NEAR YOU AT ALL even though you allow it. It is so wrong that people would think about their own selfish desires and not put you first when it comes to smoking around you. Especially what you had to go through DUE TO CIGARETTE SMOKE TAKING IT'S TOLL ON YOU. I know I am judging your wife's sister or other people who smoke around you when I do not know any one them. They may be very nice people - but Mike - they need to just consider your health and not just think about themselves and their terrible habit when they are at your home.
I am sorry for coming on so strong in this message but I just cannot believe people (your own family) can be so inconsiderate of you.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Apr 14 - 08:32 AM

"The following morning though our clothes and instruments smelt of cooking oil needless to say will not be going back."
I know that feeling well and refuse to frequent restaurants or coofee shops like that.
I think that if all restaurants were like that we'd be in trouble.
Not so long ago, all pubs were like that and we had to put up with other peoples bad habits if we wanted a drink - thankfully - in Ireland at least, we no longer have to, and long may that continue to be the case.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 19 Apr 14 - 07:30 AM

For the benefit of a rather thick, old lady behind the times, could someone be kind enough to explain to me about these electronic cigarettes and how they work? My husband went on a bus to London recently and said people were smoking plastic things 'with steam coming out'. And I'm sure I've heard they can explode or ignite or something. And what exactly do nicotine addicts get from these strange devices? I'd be most interested to learn all about them.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: selby
Date: 19 Apr 14 - 07:13 AM

Nothing to do with smoking. Went to a session in a Gastro Pub the other night and never thought much about the smell of food coming from the kitchens. The following morning though our clothes and instruments smelt of cooking oil needless to say will not be going back.
Keith

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Musket
Date: 19 Apr 14 - 06:58 AM

Herbal cigarettes are a health risk.

Er.. Not much to add really.


Full stop?

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Johnny J
Date: 19 Apr 14 - 06:43 AM

http://rememberwhen.gazettelive.co.uk/craven.jpg

Also "Cool as a mountain stream" Peter Styvesant

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 19 Apr 14 - 06:23 AM

I too remember tobacco and cigarette adverts in the early days of commercial TV, and you'd think they were God's gift to health.
Regarding herbal cigarettes, one is still inhaling smoke as the vector. Presumably the things are lit and burn to give off the smoke from the herbs. Any kind of combustion is carcinogenic if the products are inhaled. If people want to dice with death they can, just not anywhere me or my lungs thank you.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Apr 14 - 06:13 AM

"I sort of felt uncomfortable, but for the life of me I just cant see why."
I feel the same Mike.
When cigarettes came into general use there was no harm attached to them - in fact some of them were marketed as being health products - I've seen some of the early ads.
The industry has suppressed and is still suppressing researched facts pin-pointing the health risks of smoking - if you want to know what's what, you have to plough through often impenetrable journals to find whether you are likely to have your lungs into lace curtains.
I believe that, at the very least, these pseudo-cigarettes should not be made available until they have been full researched - the way cigarettes weren't
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,MikeL2
Date: 19 Apr 14 - 05:49 AM

Hi Jim

I agree about the being made to feel uncomfortable about people smoking these vapor things.

I went into town yesterday and once again the shops selling these things were packed and there were quite a number of people walking around the streets and the shops smoking them.

I sort of felt uncomfortable, but for the life of me I just cant see why.

Regards

Mike

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: The Sandman
Date: 18 Apr 14 - 03:36 PM

Herbal tobacco is still unnecessarily something that irritates asthma and other bronchial condition sufferers and even the rest of us shouldn't have to move away to escape selfish people"

Herbal cigarettes are made of natural and organic ingredients.        Herbal cigarettes are made of natural and organic ingredients

    Marshmallow

       According to the University of Maryland Medical Center, the leaves and roots of marshmallow have been used for centuries as an herbal medicine. The scientific name for marshmallow is althea officinalis. It is believed to be beneficial for asthma, bronchitis and inflammatory bowel diseases. Marshmallow roots and leaves contain a gummy substance called mucilage, which is thought to relieve digestion issues by coating the stomach. Marshmallow is added to herbal cigarettes as a binding substance. Few scientific studies have been done on marshmallow, so it is recommended that you use it with caution.
    Ginseng

       Ginseng has been used for many centuries by Asian cultures as an antiviral remedy, immune stimulant and as a blood tonic. In Western medicine, ginseng is used in stress relief formulas and as an immune stimulant. Ginseng is also known as an adaptogen, meaning it increases resistance to physical, emotional and biological stress. This is why it is often sold in physical performance formulas for athletes. Ginseng was added to erectile dysfunction herbal formulas after various studies showed marginal improvements over placebos. It is added to herbal cigarettes as a flavor enhancer. Ginseng can interfere with blood thinners and certain heart medications, so use caution when smoking ginseng cigarettes.
    Cloves

       Cloves are the dried flower buds of the clove tree, and their health benefits have been known for centuries. Cloves are considered an aphrodisiac in China and Persia. They are also believed to be a powerful antibacterial, antiviral and antifungal remedy. Cloves were once used as a natural anesthetic and are still a popular treatment for toothaches in some Asian cultures. Cloves are used to add an exotic, spicy aroma to specialty brand herbal cigarettes.
    Mint

       According to Organic Facts, mint is most well known as a breath refresher. Scientifically known as menthe, mint is an herb with remarkable medicinal properties. Just the aroma of mint activates our salivary glands and causes an increase in the release of digestive enzymes. It is a powerful nausea remedy and has been used for many years as a decongestant for respiratory illnesses. Mint is added to herbal cigarettes for its aroma and its menthol-like taste for smokers who prefer menthol flavored tobacco products.
    Lemongrass

       Lemongrass is a tropical herb known for its lemon citrus fragrance and rose aroma. Lemongrass is a common ingredient in Thai and Indonesian cooking. It is often used as a medicinal herb for fever control, nausea and as a diuretic. Lemongrass is most popular for its use in citronella candles as an insect repellent. It is added to herbal cigarettes for its unique aroma and pleasant aftertaste.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Apr 14 - 03:27 PM

"Do they have any of the bad effects of tobacco products...?"
The jury's still out on that one Mike
Some experts claim they do if they're used in excess.
Someone came into our session with one a few weeks ago, and one of the old time hardened smokers asked him to smoke it outside as it made him uncomfortable
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,MikeL2
Date: 18 Apr 14 - 02:45 PM

ps to my early post.

I notice in our small town there are three vapor parlours.

They are always busy and I notice lots of people of all ages walking around and in pubs; not restaurants... sucking on these things.

I really don't know anything about them. Do they have any of the bad effects of tobacco products...?

Cheers

MikeL2

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,MikeL2
Date: 18 Apr 14 - 02:38 PM

Hi

I have never smoked....not even one !!!

But being a semi-pro musician for most of my life I played in kinds of pubs, clubs etc like many others here.

In 1995 I was diagnosed with throat cancer and went through a terrible time but I survived through the treatment and am glad to say that the medics say I am completely free of the thing.

I believe it was through passive smoking and I am convinced that if I hadn't had been in the music game I would not have contacted cancer.

Even so I do not prevent friends and family ( or anyone else ) from smoking if they come to our home. But I do hate the smell and like others here these days I can detect a smoker from 50 yards away.

My wife's sister who lives in Spain came over to stay recently. She is a chain smoker and rolls her own these days. When we went out for meals or a drink she was up and down all the time. One night we had a taxi to a pub. It was only 10 minutes but she was first out of the taxi lighting up as she did so.

I can't say that I was sorry she went back home.

The best way to stop smoking is to not start!!!

Cheers

MikeL2

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Musket
Date: 18 Apr 14 - 08:07 AM

It's seeing cigarettes being stuck in your mouth by your role models. That's what encourages children to be the next generation of smokers. Not sure that e fags stop making smoking look acceptable to impressionable children.

I have mixed feelings about e fags. They contain addictive drugs so once PHE sponsored studies are completed, there will be a decision as to whether they remain freely open for sale or by prescription as a smoking cessation aid. (UK.)

On the other hand, they are an improvement for those in the vicinity of smokers.

Herbal tobacco is still unnecessarily something that irritates asthma and other bronchial condition sufferers and even the rest of us shouldn't have to move away to escape selfish people.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: The Sandman
Date: 18 Apr 14 - 03:49 AM

the banning of smoking of e cigarettes is however ridiculous, it should be just tobacco that is banned but not herbal tobacco or e cigarettes, in my opinion it is not the smoke but what you are inhaling passively through the smoke, those things that cause bronchitis and lung cancer.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Tony Rath aka Tonyteach
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 08:36 PM

I am lucky I have never been a ciggy smoker. So I cannot take the ssmoral high ground here, however if plain chocolate Hobnob eaters were treated similarly I would be out in the cold and rain chewing away. I am just lucky that the smokes were not my addiction. I do not like second hand smoke and pubs are much better for being smoke free. My dad was a band leader in working mens clubs and at the weekend you could cut the atmosphere with a knife and serve it on butties. I am glad that has now gone

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 06:41 PM

The reason you don't see as many complaints about perfume allergy as you do about tobacco pong is that people with serious perfume allergies don't dare go near places where they might get exposed to the stuff.

When forced to by the missus (and one does has to comply at times, I find) I walk through the perfume dept of those department stores in order to get to whatever other bits of the shop we're supposed to be visiting. They always put the perfume dept just inside the entrance. I swoon and nearly die every time. Only the sight of the gorgeous young ladies peddling the perfumes helps me to survive.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Musket
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 02:14 PM

I just read the thread.

Yes, she speaks of inhaling second hand tobacco. The smell of the person is also there, but the thread is about smoking.

I repeat. The thread is about smoking.



Check.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 01:40 PM

I repeat....this is a thread about odours not about smoking...no one is defending tobacco use. Read the thread please.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Stringsinger
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 12:50 PM

Michelle is right. If you can smell it, it will hurt you.

Affirming life is not sanctimonious but attaching that label to those who cry out for health is
hypocritical.

I can't think of a single instance that smoking has ever helped a singer or musician.
In fact, in some cases, it was a gateway drug, even more that pot.

I wish that musicians would stop romanticizing tobacco and alcohol as if it made one damn bit of difference in the development of a musician, singer, or performer.

Addiction is the result of smoking. All kinds of rationalizations, just like any other addict, are given to defend tobacco use.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 12:12 PM

HILO is right. This is a thread about objecting to the *smell of stale tobacco smoke on other peoples clothes*, not about inhaling second hand cigarette smoke.

As I said below, while I might remove myself from smoking in a closed space due to asthma and potential migraines, personally I find perfume to be far more unpleasant and invasive than the smell of stale smoke on other peoples clothes. Tailor made cigs are not nice smelling, but I find nothing at all especially unpleasant about wood smoke or old tobacco smoke from roll ups or cigars.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jack Campin
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 11:55 AM

Second/third hand smoke can cause allergic reactions as well, but they're a lot less common than perfume-induced ones.

I get such severe sneezing attacks from lemon-scented cleaning products that I had to warn the hospital ward I was in to ban them when I was there for a heart stent operation.

The reason you don't see as many complaints about perfume allergy as you do about tobacco pong is that people with serious perfume allergies don't dare go near places where they might get exposed to the stuff.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,HILO
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 11:42 AM

This NOT a thread about smoking in Public places or second hand smoke..it is about the "smell" of smokers. No one has advocated a return to smoking in public places, nor has anyone suggested that people be exposed to second hand smoke, you have clearly misread the opening post as well as many others.This is essentially about the pristine being exposed to the odour of the smokers among us. So far as can be determined , no one has died of the smell of smoke...however, many have been seriously injured by falling off thier high horse.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 11:18 AM

Firstly I am NOT suggesting that perfume is as dangerous to health as cigarette smoke ............... however my wife reacts extremely to Lavender.

Blinding headaches, loss of vision, swelling of the throat, nausea, you name it, she gets it. She has had to seek medical intervention on numerous occasions and has even been hospitalised. We avoid Lavender and people who have Lavender on for obvious reasons.


Bit of a bugger really because I love the smell of Lavender!

Bit of a difference from getting a whiff of someone else's second hand smoke in the street though.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Apr 14 - 09:40 AM

I always regard a garlicky or oniony aroma about a person to be a sign that they love good food and enjoy a positive outlook on life. Easily the best way to avoid offence by onion or garlic aroma is to eat lots of onions and garlic yourself. You are then immune from others' breath and you'll live forever.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Michelle
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 08:50 PM

I think we have lost millions more people in this world who have died from smoking or 2nd hand smoke and long time suffering death - then from perfume - my dear father one of them from smoking.
   
Sorry, there is no comparison of perfume to the long term effects of cigarettes. I believe there are millions more people in this world - both men & woman who are smokers then people wearing too much perfume! "The likelihood of damage (from perfume) is probably less than with second-hand smoke." There is no "probably" here - damage from smoking and second-hand smoke IS THE ULTIMATE WORST THING!!

This is a post about smoking and second-hand smoke and seems like many are getting on the soap box talking about perfume, garlic, body odor - the likelihood of being exposed to these things in a club that permits smoking is many times less than those who are smoking.

When I used to go to music venues - smoking was by far outnumbered then people with those other problems. I can't recall people with body odors, or garlic or too much perfume at all. And I don't like those odors either but the problem of having to put up with smokers is far, far greater!

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jack Campin
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 08:06 PM

never heard of 2nd hand perfume, 2nd hand bad breathe,2nd hand sweat, effecting people's health to the extent that one can die from exposure as does 2nd hand smoke!

I have, with perfume. Allergic anaphylaxis.

http://whatallergy.com/2012-02/please-dont-wear-perfume

http://www.examiner.com/article/perfume-allergies-can-be-the-sweet-smell-of-death

assault by perfume spray with a close to fatal outcome (PDF)

The likelihood of damage is probably less than with second-hand smoke, but when it happens it's a hell of a lot more dramatic.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 07:37 PM

Some of the arguments for tolerating smoking remind me of no pissing areas in a swimming pool.

Heheh. I remember Billy Connolly suggesting that a chemical could be added to swimming pools that would turn bright purple all round your arse area if you peed in the pool. Let those without sin... :-)

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: The Sandman
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 06:55 PM

the odour of sanctity is stifling

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Michelle
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 04:09 PM

It is really unbelievable about the people who have posted messages mentioning all the other foul odors, too much perfume, sweat, body odor, bad breath, etc. but like Stringsinger said, "But none of these will kill you." He is right!
(Bath daily, use deodorant, brush your teeth/use mouth wash, wash your dirty clothes, etc.)

Although very offensive of course - none of those other things can effect another one's lungs (never heard of 2nd hand perfume, 2nd hand bad breathe,2nd hand sweat, effecting people's health to the extent that one can die from exposure as does 2nd hand smoke!)

I did try to find on-line anywhere where these other offensive odors can actually cause someone to get cancer as 2nd hand smoke does - but have not found any conclusive studies.

Smoking should be banned 100 % everywhere in this world. There is not anything beneficial that comes from smoking. It is a terrible, terrible habit.
Yes, I used to be a smoker too. Never heavy - about 4 or 5 cigarettes a day at the most but so glad that I quit in the early 1980's.
Geez, I don't any know how people can afford them nowadays!
Just think of the extra money one would have if they didn't smoke.
Wonder if smokers have ever tried to calculate what they spend a year on cigarettes? Probably not, but if one sat down and tried to get an actual figure as to the amount they spend on cigarettes a year would probably be astounded.   

I am glad that I live in a state where it is banned in all public places. Only place I have to sometimes be near smokers is at bus stops.I do my best to try and move some distance away but don't want to miss my bus either so I can only move so far away if someone at the bus stop is smoking. Of course there is no smoking allowed on public transportation and that includes E. cigarettes. where I live.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Stringsinger
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 11:09 AM

>My own pet hates are beer breath, farts, garlic, sweat and people who douse themselves in perfume and aftershave. >

But none of these things will kill you.

How would it be for a law to passed allowing toxic gas to be administered in public places?

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 08:10 AM

"Just smokers?"
Not really - if I feel like a pee, I don't piss against the counter because I don't feel like going outside.
Breathing is a matter of necessity - smoking is one of choice.
Smoking in enclosed areas is simply selfish
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Musket
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 07:53 AM

Some of the arguments for tolerating smoking remind me of no pissing areas in a swimming pool.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Johnny J
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 07:49 AM

"I suppose for the seriously addicted ,listening to other participants is a pleasure they must forego !. "

Smoking has a few advantages after all.

:-)))))

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 07:26 AM

Guest something for you to ponder. If one person is alone in a room they have access to all the air in that room for their own use. If another person enters that room they, during the course of breathing, exhale carbon dioxide thus polluting the room for the other person. Where do want to draw the line? Just smokers?

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Pete from seven stars link
Date: 16 Apr 14 - 07:20 AM

It is my observation that often smokers are out of the sing around much of the time, but usually manage to re emerge to take their turn.   I suppose for the seriously addicted ,listening to other participants is a pleasure they must forego !.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Apr 14 - 03:42 PM

There is no way a smoker can justify polluting the air we have to breathe. Mentioning all the other odors we have to put up with is a smoke screen.

Most people don't smoke, the message is clear.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,FloraG
Date: 15 Apr 14 - 03:37 AM

Have you noticed how sessions are more disrupted as smokers pop in and out - some not even waiting for a set to finish. You go to ask someone to take a turn - and they are not there - but reappear 5 minutes later.
FloraG.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: The Sandman
Date: 15 Apr 14 - 02:10 AM

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jack Campin - PM
Date: 14 Apr 14 - 06:18 PM

The level of contact with smoke from someone smoking in the street must be miniscule

I'll stand in rain or snow rather than share a bus shelter or doorway with somebody doing it."
hilarious, it sounds like you would be happy to die of pneumonia, in your fight against the perfidious cigarette smoke.it reminds me of the song lumley kettlewell Who used a potter's crate as a bed in the company of ducks, geese, a fox and other animals?

A citizen of York named Lumley Kettlewell, the son of a Mr. Richard Kettlewell, a prosperous farmer of Bolton Percy.

He was born at Clementhorpe in 1741, and although given education, culture and the material means to provide a life of ease and tastes of a gentleman, chose an existence which was not only eccentric but squalid, sordid and degrading.

Kettlewell was a man of delicate build and was gentle and refined in manner, yet although in possession of the qualities and means which might have given him admission to the drawing-room and fashionable salon, Kettlewell sought a way of life which was, to say the least, extraordinary.

He eschewed the costume of the conventional and respectable, appearing on the streets of York in a tattered ballroom coat, a fur cap and hussar boots, or wearing a high-crowned hat and old oilskin coat.

Throughout his life Kettlewell kept fine bloodstock horses and game-dogs, the poor creatures usually starving to death as a result of neglect.

His house, the front door of which he kept strongly barred, was entered by means of a ladder which gave entrance to the first floor.
His living quarters consisted of one room in which he passed the hours of slumber in a potter's crate stuffed with hay.
The chamber was shared with dogs, a fox, muscovy ducks and a Maltese ass, which poor creatures usually terminated their existence as a result of neglect and starvation.

Kettlewell in spite of his very meagre existence, was careless of his money, leaving it in any odd corner and littered over the window seats, much of it, being in the form of banknotes, being devoured by the rats which overran the place.

In spite of a seeming difference in the way of fellows, Kettlewell had a strong sense of humour and was regarded as a man whose word was his bond.
He never indulged in a quarrel or calumny and never broke a promise.

Nothing delighted him more than an intellectual discussion, particularly concerning natural history and chemistry.
He never received visitors, which is hardly surprising, but would spend hours in the houses of educated and thoughtful persons, discussing scientific and philosophical subjects for hours on end.

In warm weather, Kettlewell would carry a large sponge on his person, dipping it occasionally in water and placing it on the top of his head, remarking that such a method of cooling oneself was the equal of food and drink.

His diet was a curious one and he regarded the heads of cocks as a particular delicacy.
Unfortunately for the creatures in his care, his dietetic theories did not prove beneficial to them and he wrote of his favourite horse, "As soon as the beast grew accustomed to living without food, it died."

Kettlewell died in 1819 in conditions of poverty and degredation, and having left his mark as one of the oddest characters Yorkshire has ever known.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Fumblefingers
Date: 14 Apr 14 - 08:39 PM

E-cigarettes are the way to go. No combustion. no smoke, no smell. Of course there are busybodies that want them banned where smoking is banned. They just can't stand seeing someone enjoying himself.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,roisin white
Date: 14 Apr 14 - 06:52 PM

Hello all you happy smokers!!it gives you a gravelly singing voice. R

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Apr 14 - 06:26 PM

Old thinking. Yolo.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jack Campin
Date: 14 Apr 14 - 06:18 PM

The level of contact with smoke from someone smoking in the street must be miniscule

I'll stand in rain or snow rather than share a bus shelter or doorway with somebody doing it.

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Apr 14 - 01:24 PM

According to a recent report on the effects of the smoking ban in Ireland, the number of smokers has fallen from 29% of the population to 22% in ten years.
It is estimated that 3,700 lives have been saved thanks to the cleaner air.
A start....
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smokers in clubs
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 14 Apr 14 - 01:09 PM

All these years on since the smoking ban in pubs, clubs and other enclosed venues I have got used to it exactly as they said we would and by and large most people seem to abide by it even in the most rundown of establishments. I remember too the days when cinemas had started to divide the auditorium into smoking and nonsmoking areas which was ridiculous as the smoke still drifted over to the nonsmoking side anyway and my eyes would be streaming by the time the film was over! There are times when I long for the smokey cavern type clubs of the 60s or 70s but it soon passes when I remember the stench of the overfilled ashtrays full of cigarette butts especially if you happened to be in the unfortunate position of clearing it.

It would be interesting to hear views on the 'E' cigarette as it seems that Wales is putting a ban on them also in public places.