Patriotism

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 02:46 PM

He does go on and on, on his solitary topic, doesn't "he".
As if anyone takes such propaganda seriously.

If one wanted to find close to the same stuff on the internet, a simple Google search under gay hate groups, the literature would uncover material with mostly similar arguments (if not the same).

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: akenaton
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 02:29 PM

I am a homosexual who opposes "gay marriage", am I a bigot?

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: akenaton
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 02:18 PM

Achmelvich, I neither approve nor disapprove of homosexuals...I feel rather sorry for them in the way that they are abused by the "liberal" activists and in the way they must live their lives without the pain and joy of procreation and upbringing of their natural children. Homosexuality is a fact, to approve or disapprove of their choice of sexual partner would be ludicrous, like being "against homosexuality"...ludicrous. That does not equate to wishing homosexuality to be brought into the mainstream.
I know three homosexual couples and none of them have an desire to "marry", they are different and proud of their difference.
Homosexual "marriage" is a device to divide and distract from all the real inequalities which are so obvious to socialists....it is a smokescreen, a non issue, which has been built into a monolith by a greedy, immoral media and self serving politicians.

All the human rights are available through Civil Union...in fact in the UK at this juncture, homos have more "rights" that heteros. :0)
A real socialist looks to strengthening the whole community both economically and socially, not through personal rights....Homosexual "marriage" does nothing to strengthen society, it devalues marriage in the eyes of many and is used by "liberal" activists to attack and if possible abolish the Church, to them, a bastion of conservatism.
I myself am an atheist but I understand the strength many of my neighbours derive from a belief in their "god".

Despite the opposition on this forum, the health figures are stark and incontrovertible.
Which other demographic is "advised" to be tested every three months? None. If infection rates continue on their present course, what is to be done?
In London in 2011, 1 in 11 MSM carried the virus, in 2013, it was 1 in 8.
In some American cities it is 1 in 5......is this type of sexual relationship "just the same as a heterosexual one"......I don't think so

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Musket
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 08:47 AM

Akenaton seems rather old fashioned. I thought national socialism went out of fashion sixty mine years ago?

Achmelvich. I most certainly don't get on his back. I have the sneaking suspicion he might enjoy it. After all, he has an unhealthy interest in the sex life of those gay men who have a sex life in the first place and fantasies about them all being willing to be unfaithful.

Whatever floats your boat I suppose, but keep it 'up there' Eh Alex? We all have fantasising thoughts from time to time but you are a wee bit transparent..

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 08:25 AM

"If you want the truth to stand clear before you, never be for or against. The struggle between for and against is the mind's worst disease."

Zen master Seng-ts'an 

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST,achmelvich
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 07:56 AM

i can't agree with that . akenaton - surely the personal is political. if we tolerate the power of one group over another - as in the male/female thing in many countries of the world, or the lack of equal human rights for anyone- then these are conservative political laws that affect us all at a personal level. if you look at the usually religious based conservatism making life impossible for homosexuals (or christians in some parts)in africa surely we have to be grateful that things are somewhat better in the west and respectful for all of those who have had to fight for their rights against people like yourself. please don't call yourself a socialist if you are really in favour of legislating against any group of people that you don't approve of.
why are you so bothered about this issue? do you enjoy the likes of musket getting on your back about it so often?!
is liberal ideology really changing society for the worse? tell the women in saudi that or the guys building the world cup stadiums in qatar. sounds very conservative thinking for a 'radical socialist'

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST,Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 07:44 AM

Oh, you're radical all right. But you're no socialist. On second thoughts, maybe you're a socialist with an adjective in front of the word.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: akenaton
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 05:01 AM

Steve, I am certainly NOT obsessed by homosexuality, in real life I hardly give it a thought, but I am VERY concerned about how "liberal" ideology in general and the media in particular are changing society for the worse.

The homosexual "marriage" debate is a glaring example of intimidation by the media and the "liberal left" to further their ideological agenda. I have yet to see a reasonable case made to explain the epidemic of STD's amongst male homosexuals, I have yet to see a positive case for homosexual "marriage" other than the myth that "it's just not FAIR".....and the we live in a fair society.
If you are REALLY interested in any sort of equality take a look at the system which oppresses the poorest and most vulnerable in our society.....grow up and join the real world.

I am anti capitalist and about as radical a socialist as you will ever meet, but I understand the value of conservative social policies, which are completely separate from conservative political views.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Musket
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 02:54 AM

I don't often agree with any limitations of opinion and yes, there are many people with opinions we can have a comfortable laugh about when they spout it off in the pub. We can even join in the fun when a TV reporter asks them a question and broadcasts their froth at the mouth reaction for our entrrtainment.

But there has to be a limit.

Shouting "fire" in a cinema or publishing hatred in publicly accessible places where moderators suppress the challenge but leave the crime intact.

Sorry Al, neither I, the Musket in Scotland (presumably the guest, cookie run out?) nor it would seem, some others on these threads feel acceptance of propagation of hate is acceptable, not when it can be removed with no detriment to the hater other than removing the oxygen of publicity.

Yes, there are plenty of people set in their ways and those ways are set in a time when we were younger and beyond. Yes, not everybody has the intelligence to move forward with the times. The comic on your cruise. I bet you might have laughed more thirty years ago? I might have. I once went to see Jim Davidson in Blackpool and couldn't stop laughing. A few years later on a stag night there, I was taken to see Chubby Brown. Despite my beer intake and even saying I ain't no prude, I wandered out to the bar instead and found quite a few disillusioned fellow theatre goers who found out the expensive way that Brown, Manning and that awful lot just aren't even funny, even if you can laugh at outrageous concepts.

We live with and try to accommodate all views.

But it doesn't mean you leave them a billboard, paper, bucket of paste and crayons outside their house.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 04 Dec 14 - 02:08 AM

Frotho the Magnificent: "No, Chongo, I need the Goofed Up One about as much as I need a case of toenail fungus. I have something of import to say to those with intelligence enough to grasp it, and he tries to distract everyone's attention by jumping up on the table and pissing in the punch bowl."

"Import to say"???? ...Important to YOU!....Nonsense to reality, and usually unproven bullshit!..But that's Okay...because as I told you before, Throw it all out there, the best you can...and when it falls down, at least the bullshit gets exposed!..........(Now if only he was able, in his desperate attempts to mislead people, to stop twisting people's posts, and the truth, to suit his dumb agenda....which is, Look at how 'astute' I've convinced myself that I am!).

Sometimes, it's downright hilarious!
Pathetic is one actually 'believes' it.....but we MUST...We're 'liberals'.......cough cough...

GfS

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 07:59 PM

""Ake is an individual. a sympton of the disease. almost a victim""

Possibly "a result", versus "the source", of such skewed attitudes? As such, are some here focusing on the wrong target to garner meaningful change?

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 07:47 PM

no what i said is, given our history of intolerance of different races and sexual predilections. there are going to be pockets of intolerance in our population.

abusing the intolerant just makes you look like an abusive person.

you have registered your disapproval of Ake - there isn't much more you can do. eventually he will find himself in a lonely place - but not while the Daily Mail is publishing very similar editorials and front pages.

Ake is an individual. a sympton of the disease. almost a victim.   do your best to get your head round that.

What we need to do is bring our media to heel. call them to account. they hanged the editor of der sturmer. every prime minister cosies up to these fuckers.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 03:12 PM

Big Al Whittle says we have to sit patiently till time solves the problem. Nice idea, but any chance in the meantime of stopping him publishing distressing hatred on a website where you don't go on to expect to see it?

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST,Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 02:48 PM

Male homosexual practice is shown to be extremely dangerous, due in part to the promiscuous nature of men in general and to physical aspects of male to male sex.

Phew. This is the most ignorant sentence I've ever read on this forum. Shown by who? Extremely dangerous, eh? So I suppose that explains why the vast majority of gay men manage to live long and healthy lives. Men in general are promiscuous, are they? And where did you get that little gem from? What do you mean, physical aspects? Not, by any chance, the same kinds of penetrative sex enjoyed by millions of people, male with male, male with female, female with female, the world over?

You are unhealthily obsessed with this, to the point of needing some help to get you over it. In addition, you are ignorantly opinionated in a manner clearly driven by your bigotry. In a nutshell, you're quite a nasty piece of work, aren't you?

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Don Firth
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 01:33 PM

No, Chongo, I need the Goofed Up One about as much as I need a case of toenail fungus. I have something of import to say to those with intelligence enough to grasp it, and he tries to distract everyone's attention by jumping up on the table and pissing in the punch bowl.

Shows his level of intelligence.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 01:24 PM

Come to think about it, what does "we criminalise certain forms of sexual conduct" have do with loving gay relationships?

You really do need help. Please stop saying it in public. It is distressing for people to read your wicked hate.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 12:14 PM

What does homosexuality have to do with patriotism?

Akenaton is a one-trick pony.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 04:56 AM

I detect your fixation with homosexuality, Ake, and frequent attempts to spin many thread discussions towards this, and related topics. By doing that, IMO, you do discussion on Mudcat a disservice- by "harping on" to promote your one-dimensional theories on homosexuals and homosexuality.

Why not give other posters a break and broaden your horizons beyond homosexuality? A side benefit would be to minimize your contribution to the frequent "sniping" that, in my observation, you contribute to, and most likely (IMO) knowingly seem to encourage and seek (maybe for some machochistic reason, maybe not-I am not a psychologist).

My comments related to the negative aspects of (historic) assimilation, and are more broad-based than the narrow topic of homosexuality, of course. So, no, I will not bite on the bait and discuss homosexuality with you as related to assimilation. Pick another topic/aspect, and if I see you are not being deceptive-maybe we could have something to discuss with other members on this thread related to patriotism.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 04:41 AM

What do you mean by practice? Why are men promiscuous? What has Islamic extremism to do with choice of lover? What has CDC to do with The UK? What is unsafe about gay sex as opposed to any other gender arrangements? Where is the evidence that gay men don't attend screening versus any other vulnerable group?

Moreover, why does Mudcat moderation allow this awful hatred when a website hosted in The UK would be obliged to remove it and the police consider taking action against this person for posting hate based on publishing lies designed to upset and malign decent ordinary members of the public?

Is everybody happy to ignore? Is it only gay men such as myself who should shout?

Really?

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: akenaton
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 04:06 AM

Ed...We do not have to "embrace" every culture or behavioural minority, we look at the evidence and the effects on our society.

We criminalise several forms of sexual conduct for societal or health reasons.....others are discouraged.

We would be unwise to "embrace" the culture of Islamic Extremism for obvious reasons, like ending up without heads on our shoulders.

Male homosexual practice is shown to be extremely dangerous, due in part to the promiscuous nature of men in general and to physical aspects of male to male sex.

When I started writing on this subject years ago I was completely unaware of the facts associated with the practice, but since then the situation has worsened dramatically and continues to worsen steadily year upon year.
Putting our heads in the sand is no longer an option.
When I first mentioned the MSM sexual health figures I was roundly accused of lying, then I produced proof in the form of CDC fact sheets.....the evidence is overwhelming, we should not be promoting this behaviour as safe and healthy by bringing it into mainstream society and redefining marriage to accommodate it.

At the moment the health agencies are "advising" three monthly HIV testing for MSM, but there is little evidence that anyone is listening

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST,Chongo Chimp
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 02:08 AM

Just admit it. You two need each other.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Don Firth
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 02:05 AM

Let's put it this way, Goofus: I've always believed in generosity. People with multiple personalities should share them with unfortunate people such as yourself, who don't have any.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Don Firth
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 12:45 AM

Boy, are YOU confused!!!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 03 Dec 14 - 12:02 AM

Don 'Multiple Personalities' Froth: "The concentration camps will not be socialist, they will be fascist.
You don't know the difference, do you?
Cthulhu"

Don't you remember when you were arguing that there was no difference??

At first I thought you were just a rabid, radical liberal wannabe activist....but it appears that behind the disguise, you are really an ultra right wing-nut, posing as a liberal...and doing everything to make all liberals and progressives look like complete raving idiots...
Good job! Keep it up!

GfS

P.S....that's not saying that the rest of the right wing-nuts aren't moronic loons, either....

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 08:09 PM

""Assimilation is embracing if it means contributing and developing a culture""

True, but unfortunately, far too often it has involved marginalizing a culture and peoples-to where only "cute customs", art and good food are embraced by the dominant culture. History is rife with such examples, especially from economic colonization. Unfortunately, some of the results remain with evident to today.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 06:11 PM

Assimilation is embracing if it means contributing and developing a culture. Curry is the national dish apparently, and we in The UK seem to like a good cup of tea.

Religions love enclaves and to be frank, sectarian apartheid is the fault of those who listen to their self styled leaders rather than popping next door to say Hi. History is a place of superstition. This is about now.

Keith A of Hertford insists that people read a report that is summarised already on this thread, says what the summary says and in any case is only of interest in his context to cast doubt on the status of gay people. I take it that is what Ed means when he says thinly disguised. It is the stance, almost verbatim to those appearing on some of the more repugnant Christian sites. A rather obvious link, given what we read here on Mudcat.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 05:46 PM

""Its whole history is one of embracing and assimilating different people with different heritage.""

While the term "embracing" is indeed positive, historically, the term "assimilation" has been far too often used to justify some fairly horrible and unhumaine actions, including hatred, to individuals and specific groups.

As I look back in history, RCs were so "assimilated", in an unfortunate way, as were many of the North American First Nations and Acadian farmers. I will leave the Scottish and Irish examples for others.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Musket
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 05:12 PM

The consensus seems to be washing their hands of you.

Ed. The reason Akenaton jars and sounds so awful is merely that it is so odd these days to hear such filth, other than from dubious religious bigots and ignorant chavs, and in a population of 60 million, they are few enough to be irrelevant. The UK is a tolerant and welcoming melting pot. Its whole history is one of embracing and assimilating different people with different heritage.

That said, I guess nobody who isn't gay can understand any more than a gay person can understand being straight. But 99% of us respect the differences. Same as respecting culture, creed, gender and choice.

Al, of course you can't educate pork and as you said, you just have to wait for bigotry to die. It doesn't mean you have to embrace it by indifference in the meantime. Any doubts, just re read his posts, past and present.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: akenaton
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 03:03 PM

Hah!!I hope you washed your hands after speaking to the post master Ian :0)

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 02:47 PM

Good points Big Al. However, my observation is Canada-with a few other progressive nations, is far ahead of the UK and US of A when it comes to accepting gay rights. (However, the acceptance of aboriginal peoples rights in Canadian society is lagging. One rarely hears the thinky disguised and regressive views towards gays, as put forward by some on Mudcat.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 02:29 PM

Wrong again!!

The concentration camps will not be socialist, they will be fascist.

You don't know the difference, do you?

Cthulhu (and I'm not laughing)

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 02:24 PM

What's age got to do with it 《~got to do with it~》-save, if you have bunions, of course■

Alternative "skirt-pump" for an "Alpha-Scot" 

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 02:24 PM

That report in case anyone is taken in by Musket.
It says what I said it says.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/377194/2014_PHE_HIV_annual_report_19_11_2014.pdf

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 02:20 PM

well i suppose where patriotism comes in is that England is traditionally a tolerant country.

America has always been a long way in front of us in recognising the rights of the gay population and recognising their great contribution to society.

i think you are wrong to intrude into other peoples lives Ake by mouthing off about the gay right to marriage. let me assure you that many gay people have loving passionate relationships - sometimes lasting a lifetime. and they are deserving of all the dignity that society can confer.

when i gave up smoking, what really did it was that i became aware that society had changed. and ian, that's how it will be for people like Ake. society will change, and just as we see the racist humour of the 70's is wrong - Ake will change, or die an anachronism.

i was on a cruise last year, and there was a comedian in the bar. the elderly audience were doubled over laughing at the racist jokes. thirty years out of date - the act and the audience.

don't descend to the level of abuse. you won't change some people. but society will change, and everyone with the wit to know it has, will move on.

abuse is ugly, and its a bad talent to develop.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 02:07 PM

Donald the Froth: "...and Donald of the Firth tries to warn what's-his-face from the asylum that the barbarians are at the gates and the goofy one gets religion. When he finds himself staring out through the barbed wire, he's still not going to know what happened."

GfS did NOT get 'religion'....merely pointing out your issue of books and influence. If you could read and comprehend, at the same time you would have got that....but alas, brain-lock has captivated another victim!

As so far as your socialist concentration camps..(some without barbed wire)...well, that's what politics bring.....time and time AGAIN, and AGAIN....and still the crazies don't learn! The mega-lunatics still promote it!

Stand up and take a bow, and be acknowledged!


GfS

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Musket
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 02:06 PM

I commend to anyone to read the report themselves. At least someone told Akenaton how to spell epidemic. Pity for him it isnt relevant to gay people.

One day, hopefully soon, the air around the loch will be cleaner. The people coming into the area since we came have certainly made it a nicer place to live.

By the way, people around here do know you, you are right. You are known as "here he comes" and "there he goes." You have spoken to me by the way. I was discussing moog keyboards in a post office when you came in. I genuinely washed my hands afterwards.

I prefer to call you, in your own words, as repugnant, against nature and based on psychological problems.

Knowing people is easy. Retaining friendships without them laughing behind your back? Priceless.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 02:02 PM

It is not a huge report and I did not scour it.

I gave you the main chunk of their findings on those two groups.

You do not like it because it shows that you were wrong when you said hetero numbers were not falling, and lying when you said you had figures not in public domain that proved you right.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: akenaton
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 01:46 PM

Ed...I hope you are happy and comfortable in them, but at your age????

I love tartan high heels, but ONLY on young lassies wi' bonny red hair!!   :0)

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Jeri
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 01:36 PM

Hi Don

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 01:25 PM

As far as a thread that started out to be on patriotism is concerned, this thread has gone completely pear-shaped. The arguments about homosexuality rear their rears heads again (with the usual suspects--one wonders why always them...?) and Donald of the Firth tries to warn what's-his-face from the asylum that the barbarians are at the gates and the goofy one gets religion. When he finds himself staring out through the barbed wire, he's still not going to know what happened.

Weird!!

Gwynplaine (The Man who Laughs)

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: akenaton
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 01:23 PM

BTW Ian, leave Teribus out of this argument, he has expressed no view.
The post you dug up was an attempt at humour on my part...must be ten years ago now.....you sad person.

Teribus and I disagree amicably on political matters, though I bow to his superior knowledge of all things military.
I have the greatest of respect for Mr T, he is honest and straightforward, and defends his beliefs without resort to obscenity.

He will not stand for any abuse from pygmies like you tho'...as you have already discovered.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: akenaton
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 01:09 PM

Stop wriggling, the new infection rates for all sexually transmitted diseases tell the full and incontrovertible story.

Keith is perfectly correct, hetero rates, even for drug injectors are low and falling, while homo rates are at epidemic proportions and rising steadily

Regarding black SSAfricans and IDU's, the majority who test positive from these demographics are also MSM.

Al there are more than 5 people where I live, and my work takes me over a wide area.....I bet I know more people than you and Ian do, put together :0)
I travel around thirty miles every day and know all the old long established families....the carpetbaggers from down south all need their houses maintained and my phone never stops ringing.
My village is the ancestral home of every Maclachlan who ever lived and my lifelong friend, the clan chief can trace his ancestry back to the tenth century. I worked for his father and his grandfather

No problem for me, I enjoy socialising and there is also the racing fraternity hundreds of them.
Some of the loneliest people in the world live in cities.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Musket
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 12:30 PM

Two of which are my husband and I, just round the loch. (McMusket, not pit moggy Musket.)

Anyway, who said anything about dialogue? Isnt it better to hound bigotry down so it knows it has no place in society. He isn't in Scotland, he's everywhere. Its called the internet. Read what he puts again, exchange my husband and I for you and your wife and see how long you quietly ignore him.

The Musket you know feels strongly about this too, and has empathy, but tell you what, it is only when you read of how Germans turned the other way in the '30s when Jews were being villified that you feel the need to shout down bigotry.

Not just his honest hatred either. See how hard Keith A of Hertford scours a huge report to draw conclusions that support Akenaton's reasoning, despite both the report and Pit Moggy Musket's post above mentioning the huge under reporting of sub Sahara heterosexual skewing the figures. Every section about gay men in that report begins with pointing out that the vast majority of gay men are not the subject of the report, but read the cherry picking.

Absolutely awful. Luckily, Akenaton is not typical of the people up here and Inverary has a well established mix of people who live side by side in a single community, and I include most of the hamlets around the loch.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 12:22 PM

Ahhh, the feel of the tartans 

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 12:14 PM

""Ake's safe enough up there in Scotland. theres only about four people where he lives. his problem. forget it.""

Now, wouldn't that put a pleat in your skirt;)

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 12:12 PM

the thing is Musket, old fruit - do you really think any sort of dialogue, particularly an abusive one is going to be productive with outlandish views like this.

its a bit like arguing with the natives in new guinea about headhunting;

Ake's safe enough up there in Scotland. theres only about four people where he lives. his problem. forget it.

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 12:11 PM

(Globally) ""Most new infections are transmitted heterosexually, although risk factors vary. In some countries, men who have sex with men, injecting drug users, and sex workers are at significant risk. When compared to the general population, HIV prevalence rates are  estimated to be 19 times higher among men who have sex with men, 28 times higher among injecting drug users, and 12 times higher among sex workers."


World AIDS Day information 


Major impacted countries 

Global perspevtives 

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 11:35 AM

"People who acquired their infection through heterosexual contact (hereafter referred to as "heterosexuals") accounted for 2,490 (45%) of new HIV diagnoses in the UK in 2013 (after adjusting for missing risk information), a decline of 13% compared to 2,780 cases in 2012.
In 2013, 1,070 heterosexual men were newly diagnosed with HIV, 350 fewer than the number of new diagnoses reported among heterosexual women (1,420). However, the decline in heterosexual cases over the past decade was substantially steeper among women than men (3,100 to 1,420 and 1,780 to 1,070 respectively)."

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 11:28 AM

Not a "headline statistic" Musket, but a clearly explained finding of the report.

"Gay, bisexual men and other men who have sex with men
Since the first reports of HIV in the early 1980s, MSM have remained the group most at risk of acquiring HIV in the UK. In 2013, after adjusting for missing exposure category, there were 3,250 new HIV diagnoses reported among MSM; this compares to 3,230 reported in 2012 and represents the highest number ever reported in the UK. New HIV diagnoses among MSM accounted for 54% of all diagnoses reported in 2013.
Both the proportion and number of new HIV diagnoses among MSM aged 15-24 years have increased over the past decade, from 8.7% (250/2,420) in 2004 to 16% (460/2,950) in 2013. One in ten MSM were diagnosed at the age of 50 years or above, with an overall median age at diagnosis of 33 years (Appendix 7)."

Subject: RE: Patriotism
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 09:50 AM

"If You don't like Gay Marriage, Don't Marry a Gay Person."
– Whoopi Goldberg