BS: Casual sexism

Subject: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 01:42 AM

A driftish train of thought in the "Bumper" thread reminded me of a French-language record course I once came across, with episode about a party, at which "les hommes parlent politiques, pendant que les dames causent chiffons" (think I have it about right) -- trans: "the men discuss politics while the ladies talk about clothes & fashions".

Any more examples of such unthinking & casual sexism?

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Monique
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 04:16 AM

Reading book in the 50's-60's "Papa fume la pipe pendant que Maman fait la vaisselle" (Daddy's smoking his pipe while Mommy's washing the dishes).

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:05 AM

"It must be a woman driver"

... my wife's reaction when she comes upon a hesitant driver who's dithering is disrupting the flow of traffic.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Megan L
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:07 AM

The same is also true of a friend of mine when a car goes wizzing past her says "These boy racers"

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST,Henry Piper of Ottery
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:09 AM

Could we not find some more genuine and relevant examples of prejudice and discrimination against Women, to discuss than these pathetic examples !!

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:32 AM

Sure could Henry - compare wage packets of women doing the same jobs as men, or count the number of women in top jobs or in Parliament.
I overheard a discussion between two professional types in a bar in Limerick last week on the film 'Suffragette' - "I think I'll go to see it - want to find out where we went wrong!"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:40 AM

The title of the thread is "casual sexism" Henry. I'm sure the OP is well aware of the greater issues at play but is keen to discuss matters which although they may not seem as important serve to strengthen the inequality that prevails.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:41 AM

Just picked up 'The Times' - lovely example on the front page from "leading female scientist", Averil MacDonald, chairwoman of UK Onshore Oil and Gas, whose job it is to sell fracking to the population.
"Women don't understand (fracking) and follow their gut instinct rather than the facts".
You can't contradict an "expert"!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:44 AM

Quite so. It's these at first sight petty examples that seem to me so symptomatic of that wider big issue. Never underrate or trivialise these apparently minor symptoms, Henry.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Ed T
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 06:01 AM

About five years ago, I worked in a unit where I was the only male. At lunch breaks, the female emoloyees would gather together to knit. I was never invited to join in.
One day, I asked why I was excluded, as I know how to knit (my Mom taught me). The answer was, "because you are a male, and we knew you were not interested and woukd noit know how to knit, anyway".

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST,Sol
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 07:16 AM

I've never bought into the new non-gender vocabulary i.e. "chair" instead of chairman or chairwoman. With the utmost respect to both sexes, I say "Vive la difference".
Men are from Mars .... etc

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 07:34 AM

Many years ago I signed up for some lessons in touch typing. I was the only man in a class of 24. We'd all be clattering away on our exercises when every now and again the tutor would call out "Right, girls, just stop what you're doing for a moment..."

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 07:42 AM

I take it you continued typing, Steve; till she had thge coiurtesy to acknowledge your presence?

No? Oh dearie·weary·me!

☺〠☺~M~☺〠☺

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:00 AM

If sexism is decrying members of the opposite sex, is casual sexism decrying casual sex?

:D

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Ed T
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:00 AM

Locally, Academics poo poo the apparently, politically incorrect, word fisherman, prefering fisher. Both female and male fishermen continue to reject fisher, and also fish harvester, claiming they have the right to decide what they are called and the intellectual choice of of the word is condescending (additionally, to add insult, a fisher is a small, weasle-like animal). Some, in an attempt at compromise, have opted for fish harvester. But, many fishermen claim this does not adequately capture what they do.

Well, in their defense, I suspect most folks do understand what a fisherman does.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:12 AM

If sexism is decrying members of the opposite sex, ......

In my wife's case, mentioned above, she is blaming her own sex but it is casual sexism nonetheless.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:57 AM

Back in the seventies, hitching through Scandinavia, it was explained to me in one small town that the women looked after children and managing the household whilst men took care of important things like politics and sport.

Recounting this caused me a great deal of grief from my 'progressive' friends.

;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 09:10 AM

Reminds me of the old story of the woman who said that decisions were all shared in their home; but she left the important decisions to her husband: "I decide what we are going to eat, when it's time to get the children new shoes, where we should go on holiday this year. He makes the important decisions, tho -- like when the Prime Minister should call the next election, whether we should stay in the EU, what should be the Government's attitude to any Nuclear Proliferation treaty..."

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 09:37 AM

What people prefer to talk about is entirely up to them. If they prefer to talk about sport rather than clothes, or the other way round is their choice.

Observing whether the groups of women and men in your experience tend to talk in different ways about different things is interesting, and commenting on that is not sexist. Where sexism comes in is if on the basis of that you were to presume what a man or woman in a mixed group might wish to talk about.

There are differences in the way men and women communicate in my experience. How far that is cultural is unclear. It is common for men who are casual acquaintances or even friends to regularly socialise for years without knowing anything about each other's circumstances. My impression is that this would be highly unusual in women. I cannot see that such differences should somehow be seen as shameful, or something that should not be recognised.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Greg F.
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 09:54 AM

Both female and male fishermen continue to reject fisher

I should hope so! A fisher is a
Weasel

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MikeL2
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:16 AM

Hi

I am not sure whether this is sexism or ageism ....or both ??

When driving my wife always says when she sees a man driving wearing a cap and/or smoking a pipe - "give him a wide berth he doesn't know what he's doing.

Cheers

MikeL2

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MikeL2
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:22 AM

Hi

We have friends where the husband always calls a female police officer as "a woman policeman" and the wife always uses "policewoman"...

Any sexism here ??

Cheers

MikeL2

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:26 AM

"I will make you fishers of men," said Jesus: Matthew 4.19. He didn't mean weasels. It's really not·rite·brite to go on as if every word in the language had one sole application and definition, you know.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Ed T
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:49 AM

Well, could it mean that Jesus was politically correct, way back then?

(I suspect, if captured correctly, he was "getting at" something else).

Regardless, fishermen can be fishers of fish, can they not?

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:56 AM

He wasn't actually speaking in English, you know...

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 11:02 AM

What language he was talking in is beside the point, Kevin -- which is that "fishers" was the word chosen by Wycliff, the 1616-ers, et al, to render what he said into English.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 11:32 AM

If I were a gay man, I guess I could take a different meaning to Wycliffs translation (if he were infallible in his translatHe wasn't actually speaking in English, you know...ion, that is).
;)

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 11:34 AM

Oddly, MOH,s comment appeared in my text-could it be devine intervention?

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Greg F.
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 12:20 PM

It's really not·rite·brite to go on as if every word in the language had one sole application and definition, you know.

You really do need to get a life, Em Gee. Or at least a sense of humor.

Oh - and piss off.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 12:22 PM

GF yourself!

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 12:35 PM

Another deep and meaningful comment from Greg. Just once Greg, say something constructive.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Mrrzy
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 12:36 PM

Casual sexism is different from black tie sexism, I presume.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Greg F.
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 01:55 PM

Just once Greg, say something constructive.

Ya mean by following Em Gee's sterling example It's really not·rite·brite to go on as if every word in the language had one sole application and definition, you know. perhaps, Hi?

Apparently you need to get a life as well, eh?

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 02:02 PM

Has anyone the remotest idea what this preternaturally unpleasant little person is on about? He is making not the faintest communication in this direction. Perhaps it is all part of this 'sense of humour' that he appears to rejoice in enjoining his betters to acquire.

In which case, to be obliging:

Hohoho ♥ily...

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Greg F.
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 02:10 PM

More to the point, Em Gee, is what are YOU on about, beginning with 23 Oct 15 - 10:26 AM??

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 02:25 PM

Oh, what a nasty mouth. Just mind you don't poison yourself with your own spit, darling ❤

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Donuel
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 02:33 PM

Each language has sexist phrases and ideas but their are certain languages that have sexism built into their grammar such as gender based nouns. Even the gender of the changes with various European languages. I suppose that is more classic than casual.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Greg F.
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 02:46 PM

Well, Em Gee- you intend to address the question, or just continue being rude ?

No need to respond, the answer is obvious.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Ed T
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 03:59 PM

Causal sexism causality?

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Ed T
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 04:01 PM

Causal sexism, causation causalty?

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 04:46 PM

I wish people would restrain themselves from getting into pointless tantrums like that.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:13 PM

Sorry, GF -- what question? Let's look back.

Oh -- I see. What I said about words with more than one meaning. Oh, right.

Well, there had been several posts about a 'fisher' being a species of weasel (notably yours), so what had that to do with it? So I pointed out that it had other meanings too (as words frequently have); in particular, and relevant to the question that was being canvassed, a synonym for 'fisherman'; as used by Jesus in the Gospel According To St Matthew. Then it appears, from you going on about senses of humour & stuff, that you meant it as a joke after all; so I obligingly said hoho; but even that wouldn't do for your wounded sensibilities, and you had to go on & on about it; climaxing in you saying I was being 'rude' — after you had o-so-charmingly concluded a post with an entirely otiose "Piss off" — which really was a laugh hohohohoho.

That all looks clear enough to me; so what on earth was your problem, that you thought worth being so peculiarly unpleasant and unmannerly about?

Got it now, ducky?

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:18 PM

...Not but what "unpleasant & unmannerly" would appear to be a fair summary of your pretty-well typical & customary MO. You really are the crabgrass in the Mudcat lawn, aren't you! - & seem to take an odd perverse sort of pride in coming across as a filthy-tempered yobbo. Boy, you must be a bundle of laughs to live with.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 05:56 PM

I just had to consult the NT lexicon and the Greek word is there rendered ...fisherman..., but presumably the Wycliffe/king James chose fisher , perhaps, as as well as retaining the same meaning , it would read better than .....make you fishermen of men !....

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Greg F.
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 06:27 PM

RE: 23 Oct 15 - 05:13 PM Em Gee:

Piss off.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 07:35 PM

Brilliant Greg! Very thought provoking and informative.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 24 Oct 15 - 06:31 AM

Ooh. 24 hours gone and not another peep from poor old Gregory Filth. Sulking, is it den, coz some other person seems to think you as big a nasty steaming heap of drivelling dribbling brown stuff as I do?

Well that's what you get for setting out to spoil good, interesting threads started by your betters, you pathetic little upstart.

Off this thread now. I started it with best of intentions, and I think it was quite a good one. But it got polluted by that persistent stinking pollutant of this nice decent site. I wonder the vindictive little swine hasn't been flung off it neck & crop long since. High time he was if you ask me.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Mo the caller
Date: 24 Oct 15 - 08:23 AM

Well, back in the mid 60s we all got a newsletter from the Keele office that helped us find jobs. One of the visiting recruiters was looking for
"Arts and Science Graduates. Also openings for women"

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: Greg F.
Date: 24 Oct 15 - 08:57 AM

Em Gee: RE: 23 Oct 15 - 05:18 PM & 24 Oct 15 - 06:31 AM

You really a piece of work, aren't you? You've been throwing your childish tantrum for close to 48 hours now.

Subject: RE: BS: Casual sexism
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Oct 15 - 08:58 AM

Give it up man, you're starting to look like a nut case.