BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?

Subject: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Dec 15 - 01:35 PM

With flooding, tornadoes, snowstorms, and other disasters in the US, UK, Ireland, Australia, and other places, I was wondering how Mudcatters are doing.

How is it where you are?

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Dec 15 - 09:23 PM

My mum and dad live in Radcliffe, near Warth Bridge over the Irwell. Nearby houses were flooded but the parents were on high enough ground to stay safe. They had a power cut for several hours on Saturday evening. Fortunately, they were still able to use their gas cooker. I'd bought my dad, in sheer desperation, a large wind-up LED lantern for Christmas. Definitely a back-of-the-net job!

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Dec 15 - 10:09 AM

Local park was flooded by Sutton beck breaching. It meets Eastburn beck which is about 100 yards from us and that was raging but still around 3 feet from the top of the bank. Road just next to that was closed to traffic but fortunately it did not reach us. Drove to Keighley on Saturday as the road to Skipton was completely closed. The Aire was breached all along that stretch and almost reached the main road and railway line. Looks set for some heavy rain tonight and tomorrow but warning is just yellow at present.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Dec 15 - 10:52 AM

turn the Earth to focus on Great Britain to see what is getting you.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 29 Dec 15 - 11:00 AM

The Texas tornadoes came through my region but not my part of this particular county. Heavy rain, but the creek stayed in it's banks (a good thing, because it's at the bottom of my back yard) and high winds hit everyone.

The tornado had a very long and wide track, Dec. 26 storm path as seen by a graphic they put up on their facebook page. (Sorry, the full-octane web site doesn't seem to show past images, only graphical forecasts of the current day. This is a current overview, not sure how long it will stay up).

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Sean Belt
Date: 29 Dec 15 - 03:15 PM

The heavy rains over the last several days have just about put the rivers and creeks around St. Louis out of their banks. So far it's been more of an inconvenience than anything with low-lying roads being closed, etc. Some sandbagging is going on a few blocks from my home for those that live along the River Des Peres, which flows into the Mississippi about a mile and a half away. But my flat is up the hill and should remain dry (except the somewhat soggy basement!). We did have a number of fatalities due to the flooding, but those were further out state and south of here.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Dec 15 - 04:15 PM

This was the deluge in our village. A few photos down you see one labelled "Holme Bridge, flooded Thampson's Field in the background". It is the view from our side of Holme Lane with your back to our house about 100 yards behind you. Scary stuff!

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 29 Dec 15 - 04:29 PM

That's a great graphic, Bill D! Thank you.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Joe_F
Date: 29 Dec 15 - 06:10 PM

Thank you, Satan, for visiting Boston (MA) with a very ordinary wretched winter day!

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 30 Dec 15 - 11:19 AM

We are suddenly back in the "typical" weather for Texas this week. Cold, frosty mornings and afternoons in the mid-40s to the low-50s. If it will stay put for a while I'll get accustomed to it.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 30 Dec 15 - 11:30 AM

It occurred to me that despite the enormous amounts of snow to be found during the winter months on Swiss mountains, you never hear of any floods during the melt season. Now I find this strange, or is it just that the Swiss are more clued up on flood prevention?

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: keberoxu
Date: 30 Dec 15 - 12:17 PM

Re Boston, MA: Into each life, a little Satan must fall.

I know what he means, though. My little town struggled valiantly with the ice -- that's the worst of it in the end, the way everything froze up.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 30 Dec 15 - 12:25 PM

Floods in Switzerland may not make the news, but if it is like Washington State and north into BC and Alaska (where there is a similar configuration of Swiss mountains) the snow melt is gradual and feeds rivers during the warmer months. When it warms too quickly or rains too hard in conjunction with the seasonal melting, then you hear about floods. This year there wasn't enough rain/snow to build up the snow pack, and the storms that hit this autumn were from offshore and causing mud slides and flooding just from the current rainfall.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Rapparee
Date: 30 Dec 15 - 10:31 PM

Snow here, and more coming. Bitter, bitter cold coming -- as low at -14F (-26C) fifty miles north. Here it reached 16F (-9C) today; it's 5F (-15C) right now.

Fortunately we usually have the snow evaporate because it's high desert and the humidity is pretty low. The mountains are gorgeous, especially when the setting or rising sun hits them. We are hoping for a good snowpack up high -- three years after the snow goes into the aquifer it comes out of the faucet. But rain and a several warm days can cause dangerous flood conditions.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Bill D
Date: 30 Dec 15 - 10:42 PM

Another graphic for the U.S. showing major patterns.

Very clear and can be viewed as large or small.. (reload each time you go there)

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 01:28 AM

here in Australia we're in bushfire season - Australia faces heightened bushfire threat summer 2015/16

current fires
Victorian bushfires: Three Surf Coast communities evacuated (31st December article)

Victoria-Great Ocean Road fire: 116 homes destroyed Christmas day (Surf Coast area)

Great Ocean Rd fire: Residents begin to return to assess damage (27th Dec article)

OZ journalist in US has house in fire zone - house not destroyed

fires in other states - nothing in my state (New South Wales) - yet. As I live on the harbour edge of Sydney CBD I'm never directly affected, but I have friends in the Blue Mountains 50km to the west who are, as are friends in Central Victoria & other places.

sandra

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 05:25 AM

As a matter of interest I looked up the details of the Lynmouth flood disaster of 1952. This was caused by a flash flood of 9" of rain in 24 hours and resulted in 34 deaths according to wikipedia. My father was travelling on the train from Taunton to Watchet in the late evening before the rain started and said that the sky was a very peculiar copper colour that he had never seen before.

What is not mentioned is that a even greater number of deaths were caused by accidents with machinery during the subsequent clear up operation and rebuilding. Perhaps there is a place for Health and Safety regulations.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 05:35 AM

I am glad to report that Frank seems to have left our little corner of the Yorkshire dales pretty unscathed. Any chance the fields will get a chance to drain before the next lot do you think?

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 06:03 AM

We had some scary winds overnight the night before last and another ¾" of rain. No harm done around here though our garden's like porridge. The 2004 Boscastle flood happened 52 years to the day after the Lynmouth disaster. The circumstances were quite similar. Three river systems converge just above Boscastle and 200mm, eight inches all but, fell on the catchments around Otterham Station, just down the road from us, in a few hours. We watched the storm almost static over the Boscastle area for about two hours from our village fete a few miles away until it finally got a move on and dumped two inches on us in under an hour (it was already clapped out by then so we got away lightly!). That was some day.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 06:11 AM

As a matter of interest I looked up the details of the Lynmouth flood disaster of 1952. This was caused by a flash flood of 9" of rain in 24 hours and resulted in 34 deaths according to wikipedia. My father was travelling on the train from Taunton to Watchet in the late evening before the rain started and said that the sky was a very peculiar copper colour that he had never seen before.

1952?
Is this more evidence for global climate change?

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 06:23 AM

I am sure you already know, Steve, but if not you will glad to hear that Prestwich seemed unscathed. Gnomeson No. 3 went through there on the X43 bus yesterday and had the quickest journey from Burnley to Manchester he has ever done!

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 07:41 AM

We'll never be able to ascribe a single weather event to global warming. What we have to do is look for global temperature patterns over decades and the changes in frequency and locations of extreme events. We can then look for correlations with natural phenomena such as El Niño and with human effects such as increases in greenhouse gases.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Stu
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 07:56 AM

Very blustery here in Cheshire last night, but the worst of the rain seems to have passed a smidgeon to the north of us. The rivers coming off the peaks are pretty full but nothing out of the ordinary, in banks broken as far as I am aware of.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: GUEST,LynnH
Date: 01 Jan 16 - 05:47 AM

I suggested to Pete Coe that, for the annual New Year Long Company Mummers tour around Sowerby Bridge and the Ryburn Valley, wet suits and flippers or waders might be more appropriate costumes!

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 01 Jan 16 - 10:04 AM

I have had ice and snow, but the ice soon melted. Fortunately we did not have to drive anywhere when the ice was bad. Snow is not a problem.

Southern Missouri has it far worse. So far, 14 have died, all but one from being swept away by running water while driving. (I don't know how the other death occurred.) Some people are missing, and we don't know where they are - could simply be visiting family for the holidays.

The Highway Patrol has performed "four dozen" rescues in the past two days. One involved getting a man and his dog off the roof of their house. Another man had spent an entire night on the top of his car, surrounded by flood water.

People who haven't been here think the Midwest is flat. They are wrong. There are plenty of small, steep valleys where flood waters soon grow dangerously powerful.
==============
Ya know, if 14 people got shot to death in Missouri, the Internet would be ablaze with gun threads. But here 14 people die in a way easily preventable by education and media warnings, and nobody says a thing.

When my great-nephew came for the summer, the first piece of advice we gave him was "never go into running water."

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Jan 16 - 11:38 AM

45 years ago I watched a film about the hazards of building in a flood plain. St Louis was featured in part of it. St Louis got part of the message and has built 'pretty good walls' to help control the dangers of building where they shouldn't.
Other smaller towns in the area could not spend that level of money, so every few years we read about them.
The same basic warnings apply to building on landslide-prone hills, in areas where wild fires are likely, on coastlines subject to hurricanes and on earthquake faults.

I do understand that not all problems are evident when building is planned, but desire for 'that special place' and population pressure.... along with developer hype.... will keep us in news stories and provide jobs for rescue teams.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 01 Jan 16 - 07:31 PM

One of the largest natural disasters in Australia was the loss of around 90 people from a population of 250 when the original town of Gundagai was destroyed by floods in the winter of 1852. The settlers ignored advise of the local people not to build on the flood plain & water came up to the second story of buildings. Gundagai was rebuilt further up the hill & the flood plain used for grazing & was soon crossed by a wooden bridge almost a kilometre long.
2 historic wooden bridges across the plain
modern railway bridge across the plain

Yarri of Wiradjuri A Song & Verse Cycle by John Warner tells the story of the flood

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 01 Jan 16 - 09:03 PM

The rains which have caused the present flooding are estimated to be 100-300 year events.

Subject: RE: BS: How are the flooded, tornadoed, etc.?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Jan 16 - 10:24 PM

Well...in 100+ years,your grand children could lose the house you left them.... and besides, 100-300 year events are only an average. Some towns have a had 100 year events 3 times in the last 2-3 decades.

Pretty but flood prone areas should be parks & recreation areas and only visited when they are not flooded. We humans need to both live on higher ground and reduce our population so that we have that choice.