BS: Shortbread advice

Subject: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Janie
Date: 03 Jan 17 - 06:27 PM

I use an old family recipe to make 1 1/2" shortbread rounds. Bake them at 275F for 45 minutes and if I do say so myself, they are perfect.

This year I have been working on using the same recipe to make petticoat tails. 1st time I used a 9" tart pan and extended the bake time to 60 minutes. OK, but not not uniformly baked through as are the small rounds. Next, I used 2 8" tart pans, raised the temp to 300F and baked for 45 minutes. Better, but still not perfect. This afternoon I again used the 8" tart pans, kept the temp at 275F but baked them until the tops were slightly golden - way too long and when I cut them, the cookies are golden brown all the way through except for the very top. Right now they are tasty but once cool are going to be very over done and hard. Unfortunately, I am not entirely sure how long I baked them at 275F. Set the time for 50 minutes then kept adding 10 minutes until the tops were slightly golden - lost track of how many additional 10 minutes I added.

I'm gonna try again in a little bit - waiting for the butter to freeze. What temp and for how long might some of you bakers recommend?

FYI, the recipe I use is 2 cups flour, 1 cup less 2 tablespoons white rice flour, 1/2 lb. grated frozen unsalted butter, 1/2 cup sugar and 1/2 tsp salt. Willing to change the recipe if that is necessary to get good results in a tart pan vs. 2 1/2 dozen small 1/2 thick cookies/biscuits.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 04 Jan 17 - 04:33 AM

thread creep -

As a three-time failure at making cheesy shortbread rounds in hot humid weather, I can't help, except as a bad example.

Leaving the butter & grated cheese out was the first disaster, using frozen butter & refrigerated grated cheese the second & third times didn't really help. Every batch ended up pressed into a tin as the mixtures never became a dough & couldn't be be made into rounds. I'm hoping that making them in winter will create a perfect batch!

The broken bits were yummy, but they had to be picked up carefully with hand underneath to catch the crumbs. The crumbly bits also made an excellent salad topping!


Cheese biscuits

2 cups crushed cheese and onion crisps (or salt and vinegar)
100g butter
1 1/2 cups grated strong cheddar cheese
1 1/2 cups flour
pinch salt, pepper, dried mustard and paprika (cayenne pepper optional)

Mix all together using your hands to knead the butter in. It should be a nice softish dough. Roll into balls and place on a baking tray. Press down with a fork and bake at 180 for 15 minutes until golden brown. (do watch as burnt cheese taste is not great)

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Mr Red
Date: 04 Jan 17 - 04:52 AM

personally I don't like anemic shortbread. a bit of brown adds variations in taste. Sadly I only get this as a Christmas present.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Thompson
Date: 04 Jan 17 - 04:58 AM

Cheesy shortbread? Is that a thing?

I've never succeeded with shortbread - the dough just falls apart into crumbs on me.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Charmion
Date: 04 Jan 17 - 05:53 PM

I am grateful to those who make shortbread, for I never do; I seem to have lost whatever touch is required for pastry. Instead, I make fruitcake -- pounds of it -- every year, and eat my sister-in-law's fine shortbread. But not too much ... Too much being enough to make me bilious, which (objectively speaking) is actually rather a lot.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 04 Jan 17 - 08:19 PM

Thompson - I've tried it with & without the crisps, it's not difficult to combine the ingredients & it is yummy ...

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Janie
Date: 04 Jan 17 - 08:44 PM

A friend saw this and e-mailed me a recipe. I will definitely try that recipe but will have to go on a hunt in specialty shops to find the sugar called for. Other than the caster sugar the recipe is very similar to the one I have always used, and also calls for 8" tart pans. Recommended temp converts to 320F baked for 50 minutes. Will try it out in the morning.

Mr. Red, if it were feasible I'd send you some of the batch I made last night. Turns out they did not get hard but the texture is a tad too dry and not enough of the buttery richness comes through in the taste. At least for my taste, but we tend to love what we know as that shapes our expectations.

Re the crumbliness of the dough - for the tart pans I have found that while I want to work the mixture until it begins begins to form clumps when a handful is squeezed, I don't have to work it as much as needed to roll and cut out into 1/2" thick rounds, as it can be pressed down into the pan. I did learn in my experiments that getting it to clump is needed if I don't want lots of crumbs along the edges when I score the dough. For the cut out rounds, the dough has to be worked much more but the nature of shortbread 'dough' especially if no liquid flavor extracts are added, is to be crumbly.    So it requires working the dough with the hands much more, taking small portions to pat out laboriously, often stopping to squeeze in the edges again, and just enough dough at a time to cut out 4-6 rounds at a time. I use the rolling pin only to smooth the top of the dough and reduce the thickness from about 3/4" to 1/2" and accept that unlike other rolled cookies or pastry doughs, a good 1/2 inch around the edge will not be cut but will be reworked into the next handful that I roll/pat out.

Charmion, I know what you mean. I never was much of a pastry cook but did used to bake biscuits and pies regularly. Biscuits several times a week and pies several times a month. Now I rarely do either and when I do the results are not the same. Have lost the feel and touch. However, I also remember that when I first started I also did not have the 'feel' but developed it with frequent practice. I am confidence either one of us would get the 'feel' back if our current life circumstances warranted (allowed) us doing it on a regular basis.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Thompson
Date: 05 Jan 17 - 07:57 AM

Thanks, Janie.

For your information, you can make quick-and-dirty caster sugar by putting granulated sugar into a coffee grinder and whizzing till it's a powdery texture.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Jan 17 - 08:26 AM

Shortbread advice

Eat it. Wash it down with a good single malt.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Jan 17 - 11:28 AM

I would try rolling them a little thinner,it may work

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Thompson
Date: 06 Jan 17 - 12:48 AM

Trouble with working the dough more is that it makes a tough biscuit. Most of the instructions I've come across say to work it as little as possible.
Ah well, lentil soup tonight… at least there's something I'm definitely good at.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Mr Red
Date: 06 Jan 17 - 05:27 AM

by putting granulated sugar into a coffee grinder and whizzing till it's a powdery texture -
timing is important, as it might become icing sugar. Though I think the sugar content varies too from granulated through caster to icing. And won't it taste of coffee? For caster I would suggest a food blender as it is less fierce and you can judge it better. Not too much at a time, though.

Sounds daft but I have been to a sweet factory and there was talk of such things as sugar content. This was located next to a beet sugar factory, and they used only certain grades.

And there is such a thing as preserving sugar!

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Thompson
Date: 06 Jan 17 - 05:36 AM

Icing sugar isn't just finer than caster sugar, though, doesn't it contain corn starch?

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Jan 17 - 09:41 AM

You beat me to it, Dave. My advice was going to be:

Buy large tin of shortbread with pictures of tartan and thistles and Scottish castles all over the in.

Stack a heap of eight or nine pieces per person on a large saucer.

Consume with large mug of PG Tips tea. Dunking compulsory.   

Repeat at daily intervals.

Go out and buy another tin. You need the exercise.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Mrrzy
Date: 06 Jan 17 - 11:05 AM

Everybody loves shortnin' bread!

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Raggytash
Date: 06 Jan 17 - 12:32 PM

Well Momma's little baby does for sure

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Janie
Date: 06 Jan 17 - 06:20 PM

Now children, Shortnin' bread and shortbread are related but not synonymous.

Thompson. True. But 'working as little as possible' varies, as I have learned over the past 6 weeks. It is necessary to work the dough a good bit more to cut out into shapes using a biscuit or cookie cutter than is necessary if patting into a pan. Patting into a rectangle or square shape without using a pan and scoring into diamonds or rectangles probably requires something in between.

I'm newly semi-retired and having fun in the kitchen for the first time in years, btw, and on a shortbread binge of experimentation.

The petticoat tails I've made, so far at varying temperatures and baking times, all are more tender than the shortbread rounds I have been making for years and that is surely because of the difference in handling the dough. Maybe - probably - because the small cut-out rounds are what I first knew, I love their solidity and lack of crumbliness on the palate. Gritty but not crumbly. I don't find them tough but I can imagine that some people would. I am realizing that the petticoat tails are going to feel different on the palate no matter what, and developing a different appreciation for that different texture. Will be more crumbly and more tender than the rounds.

Re: rolling or patting them thinner - I guess it comes down to personal taste. I've never been a huge fan of the thin shortbread cookies one can buy, whether domestic or imported. Not short enough and too sweet for me. However, I also make some every year that I pat out much thinner, probably 1/4 inch and cut into small Holiday shapes. For those I usually add orange zest or almond extract both of which add a bit more moisture and make it more possible to pat them out to a thinner depth. These are much more cookie-like in taste, crisper, and I often dip the bottom half in dark chocolate. Some of my friends much prefer them to the rounds. Family still prefer the rounds. Haven't shared the petticoat tail trial batches with many folks yet to get feedback.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Joe Offer
Date: 06 Jan 17 - 09:37 PM

I have a friend, Allan MacLeod, who brings back tins of shortbread every time he goes home to Scotland. He must buy a lot, because he brings a fresh tin every time I sing with him. We polish off a tin every month. Allan's the man who made me really serious about shortbread.

On top of that, he has one of the most beautiful male voices I've ever heard.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Janie
Date: 07 Jan 17 - 01:21 PM

Perfection at last. 50 minutes at 320F did the trick.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 07 Jan 17 - 09:23 PM

I'm a shortbread purist. One stick of butter creamed with 1/3 cup of sugar (I prefer granulated to powdered), a splash of vanilla (I make my own with a vanilla bean and brandy), and a cup of flour. I mix together first with a fork and then take my rings off and use my hands. I form it into a ball and flatten it into a shortbread mold, pushing the dough out to the edge. Prick with a fork and bake in a 325F oven for approximately 25 minutes until the edges are just starting to turn golden. Underdone in the middle is preferable to overdone all over.

I took a batch to a New Year's party on Monday -- several people stood over the plate and inhaled and it was gone. Everyone (who got some) raved and I repeated the recipe over and over.

I've made chocolate shortbread, I've made brown sugar shortbread... I've made regular shortbread and dipped it in chocolate (gilding the lily). It's best just simply shortbread.

Linn

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Jan 17 - 06:18 AM

Sticks and cups? Cor, I can't cope without weights!

"Prick with a fork" - seem to remember being called that when I was barbecuing some sausages last summer...

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Mr Red
Date: 08 Jan 17 - 06:55 AM

Wiki on Powdered Sugar (aka Icing Sugar) - notably says:

It usually contains a small amount of anti-caking agent—usually cornstarch in North America, or tricalcium phosphate in other regions

So now we know. Or more specifically I have found out.

Subject: RE: BS: Shortbread advice
From: Janie
Date: 08 Jan 17 - 08:02 AM

I see recipes that call for creaming the butter and sugar. The recipe I use calls using very cold or frozen butter, grated over the dry ingredients if frozen, or cut into very small pieces if cold and scattered through the flour before gently working the butter in with your hands.

I also see recipes that use corn flour or semolina in place of the rice flour, and even one recipe that calls for a small amount of cornmeal.