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blacked up morris dancers abused in uk

Related threads:
Shrewsbury FF to ban 'blacked up' Morris (264)
All Black Tup (7)
Black-faced Morris dancers (286)


The Sandman 25 Jan 17 - 08:24 PM
GUEST,pauperback 25 Jan 17 - 09:40 PM
RTim 25 Jan 17 - 10:27 PM
Steve Shaw 26 Jan 17 - 06:38 AM
punkfolkrocker 26 Jan 17 - 07:31 AM
GUEST 26 Jan 17 - 08:03 AM
GUEST,pauperback 26 Jan 17 - 09:56 AM
Steve Shaw 26 Jan 17 - 10:24 AM
Steve Shaw 26 Jan 17 - 10:26 AM
GUEST,Morris-ey 26 Jan 17 - 12:03 PM
Steve Shaw 26 Jan 17 - 12:14 PM
punkfolkrocker 26 Jan 17 - 12:38 PM
GUEST,pauperback 26 Jan 17 - 10:56 PM
punkfolkrocker 19 Mar 17 - 09:01 PM
Big Al Whittle 20 Mar 17 - 06:19 AM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 06:41 AM
punkfolkrocker 20 Mar 17 - 07:43 AM
Senoufou 20 Mar 17 - 07:51 AM
Dave the Gnome 20 Mar 17 - 04:29 PM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 05:20 PM
punkfolkrocker 20 Mar 17 - 06:15 PM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 06:57 PM
Senoufou 20 Mar 17 - 07:18 PM
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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: The Sandman
Date: 25 Jan 17 - 08:24 PM

Steve you are probably pink not white


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: GUEST,pauperback
Date: 25 Jan 17 - 09:40 PM

us whiteys. Now would you be brave enough to spout that sitting across the table from a Moor?

Watch it.


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: RTim
Date: 25 Jan 17 - 10:27 PM

This thread us going nowhere - and there no conclusion to be made.
Maybe it's time to give it a rest (until the next time!)

Tim Radford


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 06:38 AM

How tall is this "Moor" and has he been working out?


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 07:31 AM

Taking offence.. feeling disgust.. ??????

could someone explain that to me.. what does it feel like...???

is it an emotional response, a bio mechanical trigger...???

just what..???

..Seriously I have never experienced offence or disgust in my life
and wonder what it feels like to wallow self indulgently in it..????

Maybe i have a genetic deficiency; my mother in her 80s, or her mother,
narrow survivors of hitler's bombing raids, had never to my knowledge,
ever took offence or been sanctimonious about anything...

Maybe it's because we are working class
and the family had real serious problems that affect the council estate lower orders to contend with...????/

That must be it, we are just not refined enough to be offended and get up on our high horse..

[we only have bicycles anyway...].....

I must join a church or a border morris side to learn how to be offended...!!!!??? 😜


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 08:03 AM

I think there are both cultural equity (http://www.culturalequity.org/ace/ce_ace_about_ce.php) and cultural appropration (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_appropriation) angles on this.

That the first gets respect and the second caution and/or disdain in the 'above the line' discussions here are part of what makes them a great resource.

I think that aspects of both are getting stirred into a incoherent mud in this discussion.

One thing that strikes me is that minstrel shows, and UK TV's 'Black and White Minstrel Show' in particular, included both and appropriation and lack of respect for a culture - that of African Americans. In the UK most black people are of Afro-Caribbean or African extraction. Are they offended by black-face and how much attention did they pay to the B&W Minstrel Show?

Lumping all black people together strikes me as as disrespectful.


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: GUEST,pauperback
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 09:56 AM

Six foot four with a parrot on his shoulder.


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 10:24 AM

As I said, an objective discussion about this has to exclude the concept of "being offended." There's an article in this week's Bude and Stratton Post about a chap who was taking his dog and two little daughters for a walk in a local wood. They came across two fellows who were, er, engaged in a rapturous embrace, shall we say, and not entirely clothed at that. Should he have:
Taken offence and called the police?
Taken offence and shut up (that's the British way, you know!)
Taken offence and ranted and raved at the men?
Had a quiet giggle and discreetly shepherded his kids out of sight? He could have explained the situation to them later...
Got indignant with his daughters over their ignorance of the traditions of homosexual behaviour (remind you of any comments in this thread...)?

And would he have worried as much had it been a boy and a girl? Hmm...

In my view there's one correct answer in that lot....

I agree with you about not lumping all black people together. We shouldn't really be lumping any people together. As for measuring how bad racist activities against black peoples are by seeing how many black people are offended, it's probably worth remembering that some black people call other black people niggers. Does anyone here think that that mitigates or excuses the horridness of calling black people niggers?


By the way, yer man in the wood responded to what he saw by...putting the story on Facebook. 😂😂😂


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 10:26 AM

One leg or two, pauperback? I can run faster than the average unidexter...


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: GUEST,Morris-ey
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 12:03 PM

Steve

I hoped never to interact with you again, however: "As I said, an objective discussion about this has to exclude the concept of "being offended."

In law "being offended" might well be a crime, depending on the circumstances.

White people in the UK rarely have cause to invoke such legislation. As to irony, how about a white man in blackface complaining about being assaulted in Birmingham by a non-white.


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 12:14 PM

"Being offended" can never be a crime. As for a blacked-up chap in Birmingham complaining, I think he should complain irrespective of who attacked him. Don't you?

I don't recall ever having "interacted" with you before, but anyway, don't interact if you feel your temperature rising.


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 12:38 PM

"As to irony, how about a white man in blackface complaining about being assaulted in Birmingham by a non-white."


errrrmmm... it's a white British gentleman's god given traditional right
to black face up where ever and whenever they jolly well like...!!!! 😜


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: GUEST,pauperback
Date: 26 Jan 17 - 10:56 PM

pfr sez - I must join a church or a border morris side to learn how to be offended.

Oh no - don't become one of those decent people, I wouldn't recommend it at all, really. What I would recommend would be to come to the United States. You'd love it. I understand your family obligation wouldn't permit it tho, (I cared for my mom & dad for 20 years, the last 12 were 24/7 365).

Take care & and thanks for the huge laff, (i loved being called sanctimonious, had tears rolling down my cheeks, literally).

P.S. this is not a wind-up


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 19 Mar 17 - 09:01 PM

at risk of reigniting a contentious issue with a "wtf - did no one realise what they were doing" example of very recent mainstream imagery.....

errrrrrrrmmmm...????? 🤔


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 06:19 AM

An occasional guitar pupil of mine, Sunjay Brayne, will soon be touring the country in a musical where he has the title role as Buddy Holly.

THis is a dream role for Sunjay as since he was eight years old, he would have won a Buddy Holly guitar style soundalike competition,with Buddy Holly coming second.

Sunjay assures me that due to the vagaries of harsh theatre lighting he will not have to 'white up'.


https://www.ents24.com/uk/tour-dates/buddy-holly-and-the-cricketers


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 06:41 AM

Errr, what were you doing searching for that, pfr?? Horse, bolted, stable door...?


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 07:43 AM

wellll.. It's slap bang at the top of today's Amazon deals of the the day...

couldn't miss it...

That's the point.. from conception to publishing, how many people would have passed this imagery for mainstream consumption without even realising...???

By the end of today, it might be interesting to see if any comments in the user feedback, if the item is still so prominently displayed...???

Remember, in perspective..this will be on display to more than hundreds of thousands of people,,
the 'problematic' morris side would be lucky if their 'war paint' is seen by more than a few tens at any one performance...


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Senoufou
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 07:51 AM


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 04:29 PM

Thta isn't blacking up though is it PFR? It states it is a mask and, as discussed a lot before, masks are OK. Mind you, I wouldn't walk around in that one myself :-)

Sunjay will be brilliant in that role, Al. He has the looks, style and talent to carry it off very well indeed.

DtG


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 05:20 PM

There are people who plaster what looks like pigshit all over their faces then stick a lump of cucumber over each eye. I mean, what's all that about? I reckon the women who do that should just go the whole hog and mud-wrestle in skimpy t-shirts and knickers. But let's not go there.

No, let's... 😜


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 06:15 PM

Must say one of my favourite LP sleeves by one of my favourite 1970s bands did go there very nicely indeed...


my ideal morris side 😜


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 06:57 PM

But where are the sticks, bells and hankies??

Alternatively, who needs 'em...


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Subject: RE: blacked up morris dancers abused in uk
From: Senoufou
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 07:18 PM

Looking at those three ladies, a few hankies in strategic places would probably be advisable.
I tried to post earlier on this thread but it wouldn't work. What I wanted to say was the black face mask has powdered carbon in it 'to remove clogged pores', so that's why the face is blacked up. (I do hope it doesn't actually remove pores!)


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