BS: 25th Amendment Time

Subject: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 23 Aug 17 - 09:37 PM

Rick Wilson**, a conservative pundit, discussing Trump's speach, went even further.

"It was an astounding chain of lies tied together by lunatic asides by a man who obviously is mentally unstable. I mean, I'm not joking about it or being a smartass; this is a man who is not well," Wilson said. "This is a man who is not qualified or mentally or morally fit to be the president of the United States and tonight was one more proof of it."

"He alternated between being a whiny 6-year-old who's had his Nintendo taken away and between being the cranky old man who's being out there condemning everyone who doesn't worship him adequately," he added. "I know the 25th Amendment is a remote possibility, but if people around him don't think this guy is absolutely batcrap crazy, they are mistaken."

---------

** Rick Wilson is a national Republican political strategist and media consultant based in Florida who has produced television for governors, U.S. Senate candidates, super PACS, and corporations.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 23 Aug 17 - 10:14 PM

If Trump tries to crash the U.S. by shutting down the government in September, I predict the Congress will use this maneuver, or another suitably designed failsafe application to remove him. They've gotten a lot of service out of his self-serving attitude toward his business friends. Damaged a number of important safety net programs. Time to take him out of office.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: gillymor
Date: 23 Aug 17 - 11:16 PM

James Clapper characterized Twit as unfit for office this morning and articulated my greatest fear regarding this unstable man-child, his access to the nuclear codes and what he might do with them in a fit of pique. If we wind up with Pence I suppose the best we can hope for is that Twit's nitwit supporters will be outraged at his removal and stay home in 2018 and 2020.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Teribus
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 01:43 AM

Great to hear that you guys have got this sorted - any chance of you stopping whining about it and getting it done?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Joe Offer
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 02:37 AM

Well, no, Teribus. We can't do the 25th amendment thing. All we can do is whine until the Powers That Be get it done.
So, we'll whine. It's very therapeutic.
-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 03:33 AM

"Great to hear that you guys have got this sorted -"
Yeah - just as we sort outout=r problems over here
So far, our lot have been allowed to do £ Billiom deals of taxpayers money with an overseas party with terrorist connection without a murmer from our protectors of democracy
Smugness from someone who is happy to let that go by without a comment is somewhat laughable.
At least these people are raising their voices, while sycophants like yourself bend over and take your shafting
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Iains
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 04:07 AM

Glad to see it is all sweetness and light on here as usual. Seems to me Trump has been dragged kicking and screaming to the point where the Killary would have been within week one of her presidency.
I wonder who really calls the shots in the US of A.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Joe Offer
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 04:45 AM

There's a Wikipedia article that explains the 25th Amendment quite well. I have to say that it makes me nervous. It seems to authorize a "palace coup." After all, Trump is doing exactly what his constituents elected him for. I think what he's doing is awful, but my side didn't get enough electoral votes.
But yeah, I do wonder what Jim is talking about. I often wonder that...
-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 05:29 AM

Yes, Joe
I'd already read that, several times.
It took a few reads before I realised it wasn't all to do with the succession in case of incapacity of the President, but section 4 does actually give details of what is required for a coup

Cheers
Nigel

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Iains
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 06:15 AM

Do we get to see Rick Wilson's medical qualifications, or is he simply blowing smoke a - bit more ground preparation and loosening up for the ongoing engineered take down of the Presidency by those that refuse to accept the election results.
Their tactics are so obvious, that should a transition occur, there will likely be blood on the streets.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: akenaton
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 06:59 AM

Well it won't be their blood...you can be sure of that.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: gillymor
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 07:09 AM

A serious man, James Clapper, on a clown:

CNN

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 07:15 AM

Seems to me Trump has been dragged kicking and screaming to the point

It would seem that way to you, which is why I dismiss it out of hand. You and Ake continue to wade in where you have no understanding.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Iains
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 10:29 AM

Seems understanding has no role in this party. All gotta follow the party line? So much for the liberal left eh?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Mrrzy
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 10:47 AM

Are we talking second amendment? I thought the point of us all having the right to guns was because we have the responsibility to take over the government when they start acting like twats? Not that I'm advocating that, mind, but isn't that exactly what is spelled out in the Constitution in the phrase that comes after Pursuit of happiness?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: michaelr
Date: 24 Aug 17 - 11:15 PM

It does not take a degree in psychology to see that the assclown-in chief is seriously deranged. There has never been a president (or prime minister, or kanzler) as unhinged as Trump.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 25 Aug 17 - 09:21 AM

I don't hold a candle for Hillary Clinton, but to suggest that she would have been where Trump is now within a week of her becoming president is patently ridiculous and completely without foundation. It's far more likely that it would have been business as usual.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Iains
Date: 25 Aug 17 - 11:53 AM

"It's far more likely that it would have been business as usual."

Business as usual is apparently just what Trump is being manoeuvred into. So what is your point?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 25 Aug 17 - 12:05 PM

My point is to state that your point about what state Hillary Clinton might have been in one week after attaining the presidency is completely ridiculous and without even a hint of having a sound basis.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: gillymor
Date: 25 Aug 17 - 12:22 PM

If the GOP couldn't bring HRC down in more than 30 years of relentless effort they were never going to. As Prez Obama put it, she was the most thouroughly vetted Presidential candidate in our history.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Donuel
Date: 25 Aug 17 - 04:48 PM

The 25th amendment traces 3 basic paths for a transfer of power WHEN; the President is seriously indisposed, unaware of his or her surroundings or in the parlance of centuries past; his cheese has slipped off his cracker, he is a sandwich, thermos and blanket short of a picnic, the lights are on but the elevator never arrives,
or in the idiom of today, His operating system was never loaded but to be most precise with all due respect and dignity incumbent in the office of the presidency, he's motherfucking nuts and stunningly stupid.

Unfortunately Pence is Trump's mini me, is just as racist and far more religiously berserk on a fundamentalist level.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Iains
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 03:45 AM

If Trumps apparent stupidity can turn a $40 million inheritance into $4 billion, while all the while spending lavishly, then it is a shame that the vast bulk of humanity do not share his acumen and stupidity.
Rather makes a mockery of the supposed argument. Time y'all got real.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: gillymor
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 05:06 AM

Go hunt a fox.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: gillymor
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 06:39 AM

According to David S. Cohen, in a May 24th article at rollingstone.com, invoking the 25th would be "a steep hill to climb" and impeachment seems far more doable.

rollingstone.com


From the article:

"Why am I so confident the 25th Amendment will never be used, and really should cease being a part of the conversation? Because as hard as it is to imagine 42 Republicans voting to remove Donald Trump from office via impeachment, it's downright impossible to imagine 123 doing so. (Remember that the VP and the majority of the cabinet would have to vote against Trump twice. So that's at least 132 Republican votes against Trump.) To put an even finer point on it, if we were anywhere approaching 123 Republicans abandoning Trump, they'd just impeach him rather than go through the more difficult process. Even if the Democrats do well in the 2018 midterm elections, the number of Republicans needed to use the 25th Amendment will always be greater than the number needed for impeachment; it will be a steep hill to climb throughout Trump's time in office.

So by all means, please keep thinking about how to remove this dangerous, erratic, obstructive man from the White House. It's our patriotic duty to do so. But we must stop talking about the 25th Amendment as a serious option – because it's not one."

Impeachment and Senate trial may be the only viable path for his removal because he's not likely to resign in disgrace, a la Nixon, and give up the power of Presidential pardon that he may need to get Don Jr. off the hook and to take care of anyone who might turn on him to avoid jail time (e.g. Manafort and Flynn) and apparently he's even examined the possibilities of pardoning himself (after which he could step down). One thing is certain, this guy is scared shitless about what these various investigations might turn up and is acting like a guilty person. I hate to see this taking place in my country but people could have educated themselves about Trump and gone a different way at the polls. Anyhoo, it couldn't happen to a nicer guy.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 07:21 AM

I think of the 25th as an emergency pressure release valve. It comes into play when there is no pressure or too much. The Founding fathers may have seen a weakness in the application if they had imagined the top three figures assigned with the authority to remove the President - all guilty of enabling treason - thus needing the eventual pardon from the President to avoid punishment. Its too weird to imagine but the worst 'what ifs' have become real.

It is not written if a President can pardon themselves

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: gillymor
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 08:06 AM

Well,Don, I did say he was looking into it (pardoning himself). The constitution states-

Article II, Section 2, Clause 1 of the Constitution says that the president "shall have Power to Grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment." but there is the pardon that preempts prosecution like the one Ford did for Tricky Dick. I know Nixon was out of office at the time but I could see Twit trying to issue one for himself and then fighting for it in the legal system until the Grim Reaper comes for him. That is his way,

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 08:29 AM

A pardon may be given prior to charges or indictment even if charges never arise. A pardon may come after charges or prosecution. It is open ended on 'both sides' of now.

Did you know many Americans were given a PRESIDENTIAL PARDON by Jimmy Carter and they did not even know it themselves?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 08:38 AM

HEIL TRUMP!

Arpaio walks free. Another win for white supremacy & racism. The Klan must be pleased.

HEIL TRUMP!!

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: gillymor
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 08:44 AM

Add it to the list.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 08:49 AM

If Trumps apparent stupidity can turn a $40 million inheritance into $4 billion

And he did it by stiffing & cheating his workers, his creditors, his contractors and uncle Tom Cobly and all, by declaring multiple bankruptcies, by crooked & illegal business practices and by generally being a complete POS. While people he hired did all the work for him.

Certainly someone to admire.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: frogprince
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 09:40 AM

Jesse James also accrued a lot more money than he inherited; he would have made a great POTUS.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: gillymor
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 09:46 AM

LOL, frogprince.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 09:50 AM

Jesse James ......would have made a great POTUS.

Arguably a much better one than tRump.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Iains
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 09:58 AM

If guilty of all he is accused of and still out of jail the man must be a complete genius.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: gillymor
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 10:09 AM

It's like he famously said "no one knows how to work the system like I do."

Catch up to that fox yet?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Iains
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 11:54 AM

Running rings round y'all then?

Member of Parliament for Ipswich, William Churchill, in 1717:

    " Hunt circling Hares, or wily Foxes chase, Their mazy Rings, and fly Meanders trace."

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 12:06 PM

If guilty of all he is accused of and still out of jail

Not quite- he was convicted several times, as was his father, and paid massive fines- Several other times Roy Cohn - famous crooked lawyer - managed to get him off.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 12:13 PM

The Arizona Republic newspaper's editorial board said Trump's pardon showed the president entirely accepted institutional racism.

"By pardoning Arpaio, Trump made it clear that institutional racism is not just OK with him. It is a goal," the board wrote. The pardon, they wrote "elevates Arpaio once again to the pantheon of those who see institutional racism as something that made America great."

http://www.azcentral.com/story/opinion/editorial/2017/08/25/donald-trump-resurrects-joe-arpaio-irrelevance/604067001/

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 02:36 PM

Well Greg you look a bit Immigrinty to me. Where are your papers?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 05:40 PM

"This is side five. Follow in your book and repeat after me, as we learn three new words in Turkish...'towel'...'bath'...'border'...
May I see your passport please.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: akenaton
Date: 27 Aug 17 - 11:09 AM

I agree with Janie and would it not be possible to poll the residents of places where the "Jim Crow" statues exist, as to their removal?
I do think that a statue of Robert E Lee is appropriate historically.
He did have his name used on a very famous steamboat.....or do we have the associated songs proscribed?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 27 Aug 17 - 11:58 AM

Clueless. Also, wrong thread.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 28 Aug 17 - 05:14 PM

From: Donuel - PM
Date: 26 Aug 17 - 07:21 AM

I think of the 25th as an emergency pressure release valve. It comes into play when there is no pressure or too much. The Founding fathers may have seen a weakness in the application if they had imagined the top three figures assigned with the authority to remove the President - all guilty of enabling treason - thus needing the eventual pardon from the President to avoid punishment. Its too weird to imagine but the worst 'what ifs' have become real.

Surely the 25th amendment has nothing to do with the 'founding fathers' It was only ratified in 1967.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Aug 17 - 06:02 PM

OK, so it was the Founding Mothers. Or their descendants.

But neither the Fathers or Mothers concieved of the posibility a chief excecutive who was such an ignorant piece of racist, lying shit as the current incumbent.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Teribus
Date: 29 Aug 17 - 02:39 AM

Any progress to report Greg F - or is this just yet another pointless gum beating exercise?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Greg F.
Date: 29 Aug 17 - 09:07 AM

Well, T, I suppose you ARE rather an expert on pointless gum beating exercises, having initiated and perpetuated so many...

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Donuel
Date: 29 Aug 17 - 09:16 AM

Nigel I indeed made a Trump sized historical rhetorical mistake.
Keep the thread honest :^/
I must now retire. I wish he would too.

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 29 Aug 17 - 07:02 PM

Iains - Did you do basic arithmetic at school, can you work out interest, and do you understand the concept of honesty?

Subject: RE: BS: 25th Amendment Time
From: Iains
Date: 30 Aug 17 - 05:20 AM

Too Deep for me. Try using English.