Tommy Makem and the Clancys

Subject: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST,Nick
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 09:35 AM

Why is it that all ye lovers of "Irish Music" always mention the Clancys--in some form--good or bad, but always forget Tommy Makem? I just thought I'd start this thread.

Nick

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From:
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 09:51 AM

Just to mention, the Nova Scotia Kitchen Party will be having Tommy Makem at one of the Saturday afternoon shows. Since he's here on Sunday March 26 and there is no mention of a show on April 1st, I am assuming that it will be recorded for broadcast the following weekend.

For details, check out the schedule for Nova Scotia's Kitchen Party series at Kitchen Party

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: Clinton Hammond2
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 10:01 AM

Me and the band had the pleasure of opening for Tommy last year... great guy, but unfortunalty, I had to take off right after we were done to play another gig...

What a Life eh!?!

{~`

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: zander (inactive)
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 10:15 AM

Tommy Makem comes from a long line of superb traditional singers ie. mother Sarah and Aunty Jane, Liam Clancy is also a fine solo musician but as a group the Clancy Bros censored their songs to make them respectable for middle class American audiences, folk song and the word respectable are not comfortable bedfellows. Dave

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 10:35 AM

Well Nick, in my case is sheer laziness. The Clancey Brothers and Tommy Makem tahes more typing and everybody knows (I think) what I mean by the Clanceys.

Jon

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: pastorpest
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 10:39 AM

I enjoy Tommy Makem's music and have several discs that are played often. He is also a fine song writer: "Four Green Fields", "Winds of Morning", etc. As a singer I listen carefully to his pronunciation: you can hear every letter and every sylable he sings. Clearly heard lyrics really matter in folk songs!

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 10:48 AM

To Jon-- Good answer!I do it too. I just think Tommy doesn't get the credit he is do.

Nick

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: paddymac
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 01:01 PM

My group had the pleasure of opening for him three years ago in Tallahassee. He' a fine gentleman, and ardent supporter and promoter of the "song tradition". He brought down the house with his clenched-fist rendition of his best-known song, "Four Green Fields".

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: Harold W
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 02:37 PM

There is an album under the Shanachie label. It is entitled "The Clancy Brothers & Tommy Makem: Reunion." It is a live concert recorded at Avery Fisher Hall at the Lincoln Centre in New York on May 20, 1984. I hope this will be of some help.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: Harold W
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 02:58 PM

In further research, they have done some other albums under different labels. There is also two new albums coming out. I do know that one of the Clancys passed away recently. Tommy Makem is working with his sons. These new albums might be compilations.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: DonMeixner
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 04:13 PM

I too resist to laziness when talking about TCB&TM. Its so much quicker for me to type TCB.

T Y

D R M

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: kendall
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 04:40 PM

I've had the pleasure of having dinner and performing with Tommy a couple of times, we swapped stories that you will never hear on stage. I consider him to be one of the most accomplished performers in the world. He can do any thing.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST,Clancy Bros & Tommy Makem Fan
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 05:45 PM

It appears that some are not aware that both Tom Clancy and his brother Paddy are dead. Paddy the more recently, and both were given a truly fitting "send-off", with many of the finest folk-song and trad performers in Ireland present. Paddy's son (I've not got his name) sang a most heartfelt and beautiful rendition of his father's best loved song, "The jug of punch", as his coffin was borne out shoulder high by the members of the younger Clancy generation. Their other brother Bobby who joined the group for a while is still performing with his son and daughter (Finbarr and Aoife, she is also a member of "Cherish the Ladies") on occasional American tours.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST,Frank Hamilton
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 06:00 PM

Tommy has a School of Traditional Music in Ireland. He has a summer program which should be marvelous.

Tommy Makem is not only the Bard of Armagh but in my view the Bard of Ireland today. His mission to carry forth the traditional songs of his country should be regarded as a paradigm for how it should be done in our own.

There is nobody quite like Tommy Makem today. His encylopedic knowledge of Irish traditional songs is a treasure. He is a treasure. Wish there were more like him in America.

There are those who would qualify on this side of the pond for American traditional folk music. Margaret MacArthur, Jean Ritchie, Mike Seeger, our own Art Thieme, Sandy Paton, Joe Hickerson, Bess Lomax Hawes, Sam Hinton and a handful of others that really care about traditional American folksong. Others seem to be jumping on the singer/songwriter bandwagon.

Frank Hamilton

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 11:07 PM

I just finished Frank McCourts' "Tis today. Enjoyed the hell out of it, I was quite enthralled with his references to the Clancys's as they were starting out.

One of my earliest associations with folk music was an album that my father played for me when I was a wee lad at the knee of my semi sober 'da. The Clancys and Tommy Makem doing the 'Gypsy Rover' was one of the first songs I remember singing in its' entirety, I was about 5 yrs. old.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Mar 00 - 11:10 PM

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: TheOldMole
Date: 05 Mar 00 - 02:12 AM

I'd take issue with the characterization of the Clancys and Tommy Makem as respectable and comfortable. You could say the same of the Weavers, but who'd want to? These gentlemen made great music and paid respect to their culture.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST,Frank Hamilton
Date: 05 Mar 00 - 10:16 AM

I find it amusing that the "boys" could be considered "respectable and comfortable". These are not adjectives I would apply to them. I prefer the descriptive title of the recording that we did at The Gate of Horn, many years ago, "Hearty and Hellish".

Frank

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 05 Mar 00 - 12:02 PM

There are an amazing number of recordings of the Clancy Brothers and Tommy Makem. For Makem only, I find: Song Tradition · Tommy Makem's Christmas · Songs Of Tommy Makem · Lark In The Morning · From The Archives · Irish Pipe & Tinwhistle Songs

All available, of course, from CAMSCO Music

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: DonMeixner
Date: 05 Mar 00 - 01:16 PM

If my first introduction to Scotts folk music was The Corries, my intro to Irish music was by way of The Clancy Brothers and Tommy Makem. I would take issue with the notion that they sanitized music to fit an American audience. That they arranged music to suit what they thot was marketable perhaps but I doubt sanitizing was their intent.

In the 50's (Hell at any time.) I would have not liked to be an immigrant looking for a way to feed myself or family. These men were lucky to be who they were and stumble into a marketable product that would allow them to eat.

The Clancy/Makem musical tradition at the time is not any different than my family tradition of silversmithing providing me with a living.

I make a good product for a specific market. So did they.

I learned from my Father. They learned from family sources too.

My father changed his style a bit from that of the American Indian artist who taught him.

I'm sure The Clancy/Makem arrangements were changed from the ones they learned, slightly or only the tune remained.

If The Clancy's and Tommy Makem are guilty of changing the lyrics to suit a market and being true to the folk tradition, am I guilty of doing the same with different designs from my fathers and very different designs from those of the Indian artist who taught him?

In tradition folk singing I will always maintain that the song that is sung is much less important than the fact of the singing.

( IMHO. The Clancy's version of " The Banks of Sicily" was the work of Hamish Henderson ( Paddy Clancy on Pete Seegar's Rainbow Quest TV show, mid 60's) if my memory serves. Altho I am wrong at times and admit it. The major difference I hear in it is it was removed from Scotts dialect and sung in a more understandable English form. A tactic I employ very often. My personal thought is if your audience isn't French and doesn't speak or more important, doesn't understand French, why sing in French. The job of the artist is to communicate after all., IMHO.)

Don Meixner

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST,Frank Hamilton
Date: 05 Mar 00 - 09:51 PM

The Clancys and Tommy were actors. They were professional entertainers in the best sense of the word. They had their own integrity and individuality. They wanted to sanitze nothing in my view. They sang from their hearts and they had a helluva good time doing it, so much that those of us around them learned to love Irish music. Tommy Makem is a treasure who's integrity should not be questioned in any way as far as I'm concerned. The boys always put on a great show and offered a program of substance, important content and with a terrific sense of humor.

"Oh me name is Dick Darby I'm a cobbler........"

Frank

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: Sourdough
Date: 06 Mar 00 - 01:20 AM

I'm glad Frank Hamilton mention, "The Cobbler". I saw Tommy Makhem do that song several times over the years, once close up in a bar, more often from the audience in a large hall. He had such power, a power I felt was rooted in an authenticity that I didn't even begin to appreciate (for instsance, until recently, I didn't know about his mother and his family tradition of music) but his showmanship channeled his authenticity and that song was a tour de force. I don't think I've ever thought of him since that first time I heard him in the White Horse Tavern without thinking, too, of Dick Darby, the cobbler.

SD

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST,Regis Philbin
Date: 06 Mar 00 - 09:40 AM

Final Answer: The Clancy Brothers and Tommy Makem were influential on the young Bob Dylan who modeled several songs on their versions of Irish folk songs. Dylan has acknowledged that influence in a number of interviews and statements from the stage and the Clancys said they were honored to be part of the Bob Dylan thirtieth anniversary concert a few years back at Madison Square Garden.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: zander (inactive)
Date: 06 Mar 00 - 02:14 PM

Regis, Bob Dylan based most of his early songs on the songs he learned from Martin Carthy whildt stopping with Martin in London. All of it Traditional British

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 06 Mar 00 - 02:44 PM

Bob who?

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST,Dan D
Date: 06 Mar 00 - 03:32 PM

I had the pleasure of spending a few minutes with Tommy Makem last summer as he rehearsed for a performance at the Irish Pub in Harwich, MA. When I told him that I'd enjoyed his music over the years but the last time I'd seen him in person was in New York sometime in the late sixties, he took my hand in his, placed his other hand solidly on my shoulder, looked me square in the eye and said "Well, thanks fer comin' back". It's hard to convey a tone of voice in print, but anyone who's been in Tommy's company will understand.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: John Nolan
Date: 06 Mar 00 - 10:29 PM

Visit makem.com for many more details of where Tommy, and also his sons, The Makem Brothers, are playing. The family has a recording studio in the basement of Tommy's home in Dover (NH), and has put out several compact disks, recently, on their own Red Biddy label. Ancient Pulsing is greatly recommended. It is a collection of poetry superbly recited by Tommy Makem, to musical accompaniment, and includes Patrick Kavanagh's "Pegasus" -reason alone to consider the purchase. It must also be noted that The Brothers, (Shane, Rory and Conor Makem), are very much worth seeing in their own right, and, with their love of folk lore and great senses of humor, are sure to keep the family's tradition alive for decades to come. Very heartening!

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: paddyc
Date: 07 Mar 00 - 08:37 PM

For me, the Clancys were my most influential band ever. Their repertoire covered everything and so what if they censored some stuff. I've met Tommy Makem a few times and Tommy is a true gentleman. What's wrong with not recording songs with a few dirty words? As for rebel songs, listen to the RISING OF THE MOON album. One of they're best and best known.

Willy Brennan

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST,Mrrzy-at-work
Date: 12 Apr 00 - 12:10 PM

Not to reup anything too old, but on the "spontaneous concert" album, Liam Clancy introduces himself with a middle name I've never been able to get - does anyone know it?

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 10:58 AM

Tommy Makem you were a gent and I only met you a handfull of times. You came to my father's funeral from a long way away and you were so kind to my mother when her grief got the better of her. A great man and a great musical historian. We will raise a parting glass to you tonight.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: Mrrzy
Date: 02 Aug 07 - 11:03 PM

BTW, I've since understood the "middle name" - turns out to have been a mondegreen of sorts. Tommy Makem's "Here's the young fella, Liam Clancy," I heard as Liam (mumble mumble) Clancy...
Liam was always my secret favorite, even though I was way more impressed with (sigh, the late) Tommy Makem as a songwriter, probably because he was the youngest.

Subject: RE: Tommy Makem and the Clancys
From: GUEST,Aanders Aand
Date: 05 Aug 07 - 11:24 PM

CBTM censoring lyrics for middle class America? I am not suggesting that in the 5o's they did not do that but alot of what they did change was to make some of the lyrics more understandable to a wider audience.
Remember in the 1980's, a pop song called "Not gonna play Sun City" (South Africa)? CBTM refused play to South Africa in the 60's because of the injustices happening there until relatively recently.
The line they sang in Johnny McEldoo-" Johnny McEldoo turned red, white and blue" was originally "Johnny McEldoo turned as blue as a Jew". I am a much more comfortable with their version.