Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST Date: 29 Sep 02 - 07:24 AM Wrong link. try here |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: DMcG Date: 29 Sep 02 - 07:43 AM Ok, I'll try to stick to that name in future! |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Mark Clark Date: 04 Oct 02 - 01:05 PM More ABC software—check it out!
I found these because of the work Gary and Susan, et al., were doing on the Charlie Poole collection. Thanks to both of them. - Mark |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: John in Brisbane Date: 25 Oct 02 - 03:04 AM Mark, the freeware for Ukelele players at Jerry Dallal's page looks really good. It produces chord patterns above the lyric line and lokks quite easy to use. Regards, John |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: John in Brisbane Date: 11 Dec 02 - 08:14 PM For those interested in experimenting with Music XML format here a link to a free program that converts XML to abc format and vice versa. XML to abc
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Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Mark Clark Date: 11 Dec 02 - 08:37 PM Thanks, John. I'll check it out. This sort of capability will allow Finale users to import and export ABC files. Soon there will be other programs that exchange with Music XML if they don't already exchange with ABC. The nice thing is that all of this just keeps getting better. - Mark |
Subject: Band In A Box Conversion From: John in Brisbane Date: 12 Dec 02 - 02:37 AM Just for posterity Alf Warnock has written a utility to convert the melody line in Band In A Box files to abc notation. Not of widespread interest of course, but you don't need BIAB to access the melody. BIAB to abc Conversion. Alf also has a nice collection of tunes at this site and most contain embedded chords of good quality in the abc notation format. Regards, John |
Subject: Muse 2 From: John in Brisbane Date: 12 Dec 02 - 02:55 AM It is with deep regret thatI inform you that the creator of the MUSE software package, Mr Laurie Griffiths, was killed tragically by a motor vehicle while walking near his home in Southampton. I had been in regular communication with Laurie up until the time of his death and his daughter was kind enough to let me know the day after he died. Laurie was just about to release Muse2 - a multifeatured music package incorporating a huge range of MIDI and abc functions, including the ability to handle the two broad types of lyrics in the latest abc draft standard. Laurie was very generous with his time and advice - I will greatly miss him. His daughter raised the possibility that Muse2 may be released in some form. While that would be a fantastic legacy to her late father, I have not pressed the subject further. Regards, John |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Mark Clark Date: 12 Dec 02 - 11:00 AM John, I'm sorry to hear of Mr. Griffiths' tragic death. This is not only tragic for his family and frends and sad from a Muse development point of view, it's also very sad for the Spike Island Band that Laurie helped start. Mr. Griffiths is the second from the left in the photo. - Mark |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: John in Brisbane Date: 12 Dec 02 - 09:46 PM Here is a pre-Christmas update on some freeware for abc notation: abcm2ps I have described this package above as being useful for propeller heard, but a number of new Windows interfaces are being made available. The pre-compiled version is available from Guido Gonzato's site (this may be a new address). Download the package known as Stable release abcm2ps-2.11.3.zip from Download . GUI interface to abcm2ps: If you don't like running abcm2ps in DOS mode, you can try out a little Windows GUI front end Ewan Macpherson has thrown together, Here . You still need to learn about the command-line options in order to fully exploit the wide rahnge of functionality available in abcm2ps, but it is very useful in its standard form. Download it and put it in the same directory as abcm2ps.exe . You'll of course need something like Ghostview to view or print the resulting .ps files. ABC Navigator - Tune Player A freeware program for organizing ABC tunes: File editing, with the possibility to merge tunes from different ones and good working search functions; tune editing, with a built in syntax highlighting text editor; midi player - no guitar chord support, but you can change tempo and instrument while playing. Download abc Navigator here. Regards
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Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST Date: 12 Dec 02 - 11:55 PM John's link for abc2ps is wrong, it points to a png screenshot of jedabc. The correct link is http://abcplus.sourceforge.net/. Those wanting their own source code (or not able to use the pre-compiled Win/ Linux RPMs) should go to Jean Fancios Moine's own homepage which is http://moinejf.free.fr/ I had heard about Laurie Griffiths through abcusers, John. I hadn't realised you had had contact with him. I never had any contact with him (other than read his posting in abcusers) but it is a tragic loss to the music community and obviously a personal loss to you too - sorry. Jon |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,pavane Date: 13 Dec 02 - 07:23 AM I am sorry to hear the news, although I confess that I have not actually tried MUSE, so I don't know what facilities it provides. (Maybe I can fill a gap with enhancements to HARMONY. The version currently under test handles both types of lyric). |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,pavane Date: 13 Dec 02 - 07:28 AM No, just checked it out and MUSE addresses a totally different application area. It is not intended that HARMONY offers real-time or streaming facilities. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: John in Brisbane Date: 13 Dec 02 - 08:04 AM As mentioned earlier iabc is an excellent no frills piece of freeware for printing songs in abc format. It certainly handles lyrics quite competently. I see that Version 6 has been recently released and is available Here to Download. Regards, John PS Looking forward to Pavane's newest version of Harmony as well. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Mark Clark Date: 10 Mar 03 - 05:05 PM Here is a cross link to another thread, TECH: Sing it in, get dots out. If the WAV to MIDI products work, people could sing a melody, convert to MIDI and generate the ABC. We might get more melodies captured sooner if everyone could participate. - Mark |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Ed. Date: 10 Mar 03 - 05:31 PM Mmmm, OK Mark, Reality doesn't quite work like that... |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: MMario Date: 11 Mar 03 - 08:37 AM *if* being the operative word... |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: MMario Date: 11 Jul 03 - 02:04 PM HAHAHA! I just actually READ some of the guide...rather then skimming it for the specific things I needed... Large quadrepeds! Small animals! *chortle* |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: John in Brisbane Date: 26 Nov 03 - 10:26 PM Long time no post. This is not a subject for the faint hearted, but for the billions of people on this planet who play instruments that employ quarter tones some mods have been made to accomplish this - plus some unofficial changes to the ABC Standard to suit. http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/persian_music.html focusses on Persian Music but could be used for a variety of music genres East of Istanbul. Regards, John |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Mark Clark Date: 07 Dec 03 - 09:14 PM Here is an example of Byzantine notation from the EBYPES project site on Byzantine chant notation. This ancient form has been used as music notation far longer than European notation and was designed exactly to express the subtile nuances of pitch found in eastern music. I don't read Byzantine notation but there are many priests and chanters who still read it today. I don't know whether a system like this was ever used for secular music but there must have been some form of written expression as eastern music developed. - Mark |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: John in Brisbane Date: 02 Jul 04 - 07:48 AM I've mentioned in another thread about a website which allows you to create Harmonica Tablature using (amongst other things) ABC Notation. Click Here for On Line Harmonica Tablature. Regards, John |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: John in Brisbane Date: 06 Jul 04 - 08:24 AM I've just come across a site which claims to: - Transpose ABC tunes On-Line. - Produce 'printed' file versions in either (.ps) PostScript or (.pdf) Acrobat Reader format. In fact you will need a PostScript Reader (GhostScript and GhostView) or Acrobat Reader for the .pdf files. The author has written the scripts in PHP, (a Web scripting language that I'd never heard of until an hour or so ago), largely as a scripting exercise. The truth is that even though the transposition seems to work OK, the print file output appears to be corrupted. I'm sure that the author will iron out the bugs at some future stage. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: MudGuard Date: 06 Jul 04 - 08:30 AM John, could you provide a link to that page? |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: John in Brisbane Date: 06 Jul 04 - 08:38 AM ... continued/ The developer is Andre Jensen and you'll find his On-Line ABC utility Here. Nearly forgot to mention that the On-Line version should operate under any operating system which can access the Web and does not require that you have PHP installed in your machine. Best Regards, John PS There is a downloadable version of the PHP script at Andre's site. For the very curious you would need to download a version of PHP (from php.net) and you would need your own versions of abc2ps and abc2abc installed on your PC. For true devotees only. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: MudGuard Date: 06 Jul 04 - 08:51 AM John, I also get an error when using pdf as output - Acrobat Reader says "File does not begin with %pdf-". |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,Jon Date: 06 Jul 04 - 09:16 AM Strange, the last post I saw from him on abcusers (11-June-2004) said: "That was mine. I took it down since my server now is so slow that it doesn't make much sense... When I get something faster I'll probl. put it online again." Maybe he now has something faster. I may be re-instating my own attempt at this sort of thing soon. The holdups have been due to me having a back so bad I couldn't sit at the computer for more than 5 minutes, a problem with a domain re-registration and now BT have messed our phoneline up and I don't want to be uploading/downloading stuff on pay as you go dial up which I'm being forced to use because of crossed phone lines... I took ours down because I discovered that abcmp2s can loop if it gets bad abc and once had an ISP phone me up asking what it was, why it was using most of the servers processing for so long, etc. It would be OK if I could afford my own server but not what you risk when you are sharing services with many other users on the same server. John Chambers has given me some code using signal.h that should cause abcm2ps to terminate itself if it runs for more than a few seconds and I plan on trying to compile my own version of the program with this code added to give me the safety net I need. Jon |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: John in Brisbane Date: 06 Jul 04 - 09:47 AM Yes Mudguard, the problem is truly his. I guess it's like hanging a WET PAINT sign. By all means try it out, but until Andre fixes it you'll end up with sticky fingers. And Jon, welcome to the world of old crocks. I only have to sit on a Virgin flight for a couple of hours and end up with rooter's rick. If only! Regards, John |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,MCP Date: 06 Jul 04 - 11:47 AM John (in Brisbane) I've just had a call from Les suggesting you've had trouble e-mailing me. Did you get the missing files - I did send them when I got your last e-mail (24 May)? Let me know if you didn't. I've just sent you another e-mail suggesting contacting me through a PM to Zany Mouse if there's a problem. Mick |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: semi-submersible Date: 21 Jun 08 - 02:38 AM I tried to follow the links above to the Official abc Notation Site but the University of Greenwich website doesn't recognise that address anymore. Is there a new location for comprehensive ABC information? I would like to learn more about advanced features like synchronised lyrics, since ABC is a portable format I can actually read or write without extra hardware or software. I haven't figured out what the backslash \ means in ABC files (found through JC's ABC Tune Finder through DigiTrad Power Search) such as Erich Rickheit's conversion of The Streets of London. (This clicky doesn't work: http://sniff.numachi.com/~rickheit/dtrad/abc/STLONDON.abc.) - another MCP in BC |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: DMcG Date: 21 Jun 08 - 03:14 AM You can use http://www.walshaw.plus.com/abc/ to get at what used to be a Greenwich University I have never use the backslash myself but it is to do with joining lines together. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: DMcG Date: 22 Jun 08 - 03:51 AM I'm not sure if this an undocumented feature or a bug, but putting a meter of M: suppresses the time signature for all the abc software I am using. This has been useful for my latest entry at folkinfo where the song as printed by Cecil Sharp had no time signature and it varies bar-by-bar. Omitting the M: line (or using M withour a colon) gave 4/4 time. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: DMcG Date: 22 Jun 08 - 04:21 AM Ok, its probably a bug! In the 1.7.6 draft and later, the correct form is M:none As far as I can see, though, this is not defined for the latest official version (1.6) |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: DaveP Date: 23 Jun 08 - 11:42 AM I have a free ABC to TAB converter program written in VB6. If you wish to try it please follow the folowing link. ABC to TAB converter (on page 3) Download the zip file. Copy the contents into your desired folder. click on ABCtoTAB.exe and off you go! The first 5 tunes in the 'FIRST50BIG.ABC' file will give an idea of what the program can do. Quick intro to program use Hilight the required instrument and tuning Guitar - EADGBE Guitar - DADGBE Guitar - DADGAD Mandolin - GDAE Double left click to select items in the folder, file and tune list. A selected tune is displayed in the large text box. Left click the 'Make TAB' button to create the TAB. The main window will close and a 'TAB generated' window will open. Closing the 'TAB generated' window (left click on 'x') will return you to the main window. If an ABC line is too long to be converted the source file in the main window can be edited. Any questions or comments please contact me here Have fun, DaveP |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Mark Clark Date: 23 Jun 08 - 03:40 PM I think most use of ABC notation has moved to the ABC Plus Project. At least the ABC Plus project references the best collection of tools and documentation available for the notation. - Mark |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Les in Chorlton Date: 03 May 13 - 08:45 AM It's easy for you to say that |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,Grishka Date: 03 May 13 - 11:18 AM Les, you mean the spam that has now been deleted by the elves ("I ordered from ***.ru and received my parcel four days later ...")? Sometimes we must be grateful to the spammers - I would welcome this thread to be updated. On another thread I just learned that the ABC standard is still somewhat in confusion. Whoever has news from the Inner Circle is welcome to leak it here anonymously ;-). |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Chris Partington Date: 03 May 13 - 03:32 PM Grishka says "On another thread I just learned that the ABC standard is still somewhat in confusion". I don't understand why you say that. I have been following the intense discussions on the abcusers discussion list over the last three years or so, even if I have not fully understood some of them. I would characterise the atmosphere there as re-invigorated and somewhat optimistic after a dormancy of nearly a decade where nothing progressed. There has been a new standard agreed, v2.1, the first for over a decade, which deals with some of the unresolved issues from the abandonment of the proposed v2.0 in c2003. The current discussions for the next version, to deal with new functionality, are ongoing if a little quiet ATM while everybody has a big think, but hopefully shouldn't be too long in coming to fruition. ABC is in better health than it has been for over a decade. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Jack Campin Date: 03 May 13 - 04:08 PM Where is this discussion happening? The forum at http://abcnotation.com seems to be moribund. The only other forum I know about was the old one at Toby Rider's site, which somebody hijacked to Yahoo (where I flatly refuse to go, so I've no idea what happened to it there). |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,Grishka Date: 03 May 13 - 05:59 PM Chris, I was referring to Mick Pearce's posts at the thread "Midi, abc and words", not to any wisdom of my own. I am glad to read that his rather gloomy prognosis is not shared by everybody. Of course I know about the 2.1 standard as described on abcnotation.com, with its many "volatiles" (but to some extent supported by abcm2ps, in contrast to 2.0). Although I do not miss any feature at the moment, I am looking forward to the fruition you are announcing, to feel on safer ground. I would appreciate if you and other discussers kept us informed from time to time. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,Grishka Date: 04 May 13 - 06:45 AM Jack, obviously Chris talks about that Yahoo group "abcusers", which is also mentioned on the official site http://abcnotation.com/. It can be read without registration. I just browsed through some recent threads containing discussions as mentioned by Chris, very technical. Members include (persons who sign as) Chris Walshaw and Jean-François Moine, though posting infrequently. I wonder whether "abcusers" is really the "Inner Circle" - it looks very public, in spite of requiring registration for posting. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Chris Partington Date: 05 May 13 - 07:59 AM Yes, Jack, I'm afraid you have to go to the Yahoo group as mentioned to find out what's going on. One of the driving force members is anxious that it's gone a bit quiet, but my reading of this is that Chris Walshaw is formulating a proposal incorporating the recent discussions about transpositions and other matters, which are very technical and have been very contentious. He cannot rush this and also he has a very active life outside of his computer. The topical debate on the ABC users group as it stands at the moment (and anyone could join and change its character) is mainly focussed on development matters, as it is felt important to further progress this after the near decade of stagnation, while the iron is hot. However, there is also a fairly regular stream of other questions that arise in people's daily experience of using ABC. Chris Walshaw's ABC Notation site remains the principal ABC hub, containing information, a little used forum, and links, and also an excellent ABC tune search engine. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,Calum Date: 05 May 13 - 08:26 AM It is possible to subscribe to the abcusers group at yahoo directly by emailing abcusers-subscribe@yahoogroups.com - one does not need to sully one's browser. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Nigel Parsons Date: 05 May 13 - 10:34 AM For those doubting the versatility of ABC, here's one I prepared earlier (Christmas before last) At "Mandolintab" it gives some weird notes in the lower staves, but at Concertina.net it gives a lovely print out in PDF, ready to sing.(complete with 4 part harmonies, an words linked to each part separately) X: 1 T: Adam lay ybounden M: 3/4 L: 1/4 C: Boris Ord (1897-1961) Z: NP 31/10/2011 K: D V: 1 B>B A/2 B/2 | F F2 | B>d c/2B/2 | F3 | dcd | BB2 | A/2A/2 B ^G | F3 | F2 F/2B/2 | A A>A | d>d A/2B/2 | A2 z | AAB | (A/2G/2) G2 | F/2F/2 G B | F3 | d d/2d/2 c/2d/2 | A/2A/2 A>A | d>f e/2d/2 | B3 | e/2e/2 d/2d/2 e | A A>B | c d/2 e/2 f | e3 | d d c/2B/2 | A2 A | f>f e/2 d/2 | e3 | e>e f/2d/2 | e e e/2f/2 | (g>f d/2e/2 | f>e c/2)d/2 | e f d | (B>A B/2d/2 | c)(>BA) | B3 || w: A-dam lay y-bound-en bound-en in a bond; Four thou-sand win-ter thought he not too long. All for an ap-ple, an ap-ple that he took, as clerk-es find-*en writ-ten in their book. Ne had the ap-ple tak-en been, the ap-ple tak-en been, Ne had nev-er our la-dy A been hea-ven-é queen. Bless-ed be the time that ap-ple tak-en was, There-fore we moun sing-en, De-o gra_____-ci-as! De-o gra___-ci-|as! V:2 F F E/2D/2 | C C2 | D F E/2D/2 | (D C2) | F (F/2E/2) A | A2 G | F/2F/2 F (E/2D/2) | C3 | D2 C/2B,/2 | C C>F | G>F E/2D/2 | C2 z | F (F/2E/2) F | E D2 | D/2D/2 D E | C3 | F F/2G/2 A/2F/2 | E/2E/2 E F | F F G/2A/2 | (A G2) | G/2G/2 F/2F/2 E | D F F | A A/2A/2 F | A3 | d d c/2B/2 | A2 A | A A A/2^G/2 | A3 | ^G A A/2F/2 | A A =G/2A/2 | (B>A F/2)G/2 | A2 A/2F/2 | (B A) A | A G>G | G2 F | ^D3 || w: A-dam lay y-bound-en bound-en in a bond;| Four thou- *sand win-ter thought he not too| long. All for an ap-ple, an ap-ple that he took, as clerk-*es find-en writ-ten in their book. Ne had the ap-ple tak-en been, the ap-ple tak-en been,| Ne had nev-er our la-dy A been hea-ven-é queen. Bless-ed be the time that ap-ple tak-en was, There-fore we moun sing-en, De-o gra_-ci-as! De-o gra-*ci-as! De-o gra-ci-as! V: 3 clef=bass d' d' c'/ b/ | b ^a2 | b f g/2g/2 | (b ^a2) | =a a d' | d'2 e' | c'/2c'/2 d' b | (b ^a)>f | b>b a/2b/2 | f f>f | b>d' c'/2 b/2 | f2 z | d' c' d' | b b2 | a/2a/2 b g | f3 | a d'/2d'/2 a/2a/2 | d'/2d'/2 c' c' | b b b/2a/2 | d'3 | b/2b/2 d'/2c'/2 (b/2c'/2)| d' c' d' | e' d' (a/2b/2) | c'3 | d' d' c'/ b/ | a2 e' | d' d' e'/e'/ | c'3 |b c' d'/d'/ |d' c' =c'/c'/ | d'2 b | d'>(c' a/2)b/2 | (b/2c'/ d')>a | (b/c'/) d'>b | (e' d') c' | b3 | w: A-dam lay y-bound-en bound-en in a bond;| Four thou-sand win-ter thought he not too long. *And all was for an ap-ple, an ap-ple that he took, as clerk-es find-en writ-ten in their book. Ne had the ap-ple tak-en been, the ap-ple tak-en been, Ne had nev-er our| la-dy A been hea-ven-é| queen. Bless-ed be the time that ap-ple tak-en was, There-fore we moun sing-en, De-o gra-ci-as! De-*o gra-**ci-as! *De-o gra-*ci-as! V: 4 clef=bass d' d e/e/ | f f2 | b d e/e/ | f3 | d a f | g2 e | f/f/ d e | f3 | Z | Z |Z | Z | d a d | e g2 | d/d/ B e | f3 | d d/e/ f/f/ |a/a/ a f |b d e/f/ | g3 | e/e/ b/a/ g | f f d |a f/f/ d | a3 | d' d' c'/b/ |a2 c' |d' d' c'/b/ | a3 |e a d/b/ | a a =c'/c'/ |(g/a/ b>g |d/e/ f>)b | g (d/e/) f |(g2 f | e2) f | [B3f3] | w: A-dam lay y-bound-en bound-en in a bond; Four thou-sand win-ter thought he not too long As clerk-es find-en writ-ten in their book. Ne had the ap-ple tak-en been, the ap-ple tak-en been, Ne had nev-er our la-dy A been hea-ven-é queen. Bless-ed be the time that ap-ple tak-en was, There-fore we moun sing-en, De-o gra_____-ci|as! De-*o gra__ci-as! |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,Grishka Date: 05 May 13 - 12:49 PM On a public forum, some contention is inevitable, as we see on Mudcat. Is it only about details, or are there politics involved? Jack, you call the "abcusers" group "hijacked", and on yet another forum (easy to google) you wrote about spamming <expletive>s. Do we have to fear a new schism among programmers? And if so, what is the main issue? Does "spamming" indicate commercial interests? Nigel, your example illustrates nicely that there is still something left to do regarding compatibility. I hope the train is not going the other direction. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Jack Campin Date: 05 May 13 - 05:48 PM Shortly before the abcusers list was taken there, Yahoo announced they were going to sell their database of subscribers to anyone who'd pay. There was huge outcry that forced them to change their position, but the fact that they ever considered doing it shows them to be a bunch of slime. And their record of protecting users' privacy since has been abysmal. So, no way in hell am I ever going to subscribe to any list hosted at Yahoo. There is a working forum at abcnotation.com, which is a well-designed and well-run site - why not use it and migrate the Yahoo message base there? |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,Grishka Date: 06 May 13 - 05:02 AM I see, Jack: it is Yahoo whom you accuse of spamming, not the members of abcusers. These seem to operate in full public with their own names, many of them known to us as programmers or musicians, and volunteering their email addresses on their own websites, so that they do not seem to have any wish for privacy. (I always wonder though, particularly at Mudcat, whether posters of "contentious" messages are aware that these can be googled by anyone interested in the person, not in the subject.) Anyway, you can read "abcusers" without compromising your privacy. The question remains whether we can hope for a common standard supported by the major ABC software and websites soon, also to become the Mudcat standard. It took me some time to tweak the "weird notes in the lower staves" of Nigel Parson's example into my abcm2ps. |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Mick Pearce (MCP) Date: 06 May 13 - 09:02 AM Grishka - the last two voices V3, V4 in Nigel's abc should include some extra information to print correctly In 2.1 octave=-2 as well as the clef=bass will treat the notes as being two octaves below the written notes (eg written D is treated as D,,) In 2.0 (and 2.0draft) you'd have to add middle=d as well as clef=bass to get the same effect. It looks as though the concertina.net converter assumes middle=d for the bass clef, though I don't think any of the standards make that default. The mandolintab.net converter applies the 2.1 standard - it needs either octave=-2 or middle=d to print the bass clefs correctly. Mick |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: GUEST,Grishka Date: 06 May 13 - 12:00 PM Thanks, Mick. I found out about octave=-2 myself, but I am still somewhat puzzeled about versions. I remember that using Concertina.net was discouraged at Mudcat, presumably because of such problems. It seems that mandolintab.net is our best bet; Mudcat may declare its behaviour the Mudcat Standard, for the time being. This thread is called "Mudcat ABC Tune Guide", so it is the right place for such declarations by authorized personnel (not by me). Of course we may run into problems if mandolintab updates to an incompatible software version. I personally don't have any problems with printing my own music correctly, but if I post some ABC to Mudcat or elsewhere, I would like all its printouts, conversions to MusicXML, etc. to be equivalent, with any from a sufficiently long list of "good" software, and forever. (If necessary, I can live with a list of features to be avoided because of uncertain compatibility, similar to the one from abcm2ps against ABC 2.1.) Am I asking too much? Can we hope for such lists, if not from abcnotation.com, then from the Mudcat experts? |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Mick Pearce (MCP) Date: 06 May 13 - 01:19 PM I agree Grishka - when you do post a tune, you'd like it to appear the same to everyone! To summarize the current state of play, abc 2.1 is the current standard and this is what people should try and adhere to at the moment. But note that the intention of 2.1 was to iron out problems relating to single line tunes; various things relating to multi-voice tunes are liable to change. To get an idea of the proposed changes to 2.1 being envisioned have a look at abc 2.1 proposals, which contains links to the main areas of proposed change from 2.1 to 2.2 (or 2.2.1 for minor changes). These relate mainly to how to handle multivoice tunes in a manner which will make them unambiguous (various points of synchronization and control between the various voices). There is also a lot of discussion about the stylesheet directives (or alternative equivalent specification), particularly the things relating to printing tunebooks, giving greater formatting control down to page level, with commands having scope at file, tune, movement, and page,levels. This appears to have generated a lot of discussion and I if I read Chris Walshaw's comments correctly is likely to be left for a later revision of the standard. One of the problems is the stated desire or Chris Walshaw's to maintain backward compatibility with the old versions of abc out there (of which there are no doubt countless files). This is a problem for software developers, since they have to allow for various old constructs as well as supporting the new ones. Personally I would favour being stricter about a new standard, but provide converters to bring old files up to the new standard. For really old files (abc 1.6 and 1.7, there would be very little change to make - only add an abc version header in many cases). From various version of the 2.0 standard there might be more to do, but while 2.1 is relatively close to 2.0, now would be a good time to make the converter. I would aim to make 2.1, or maybe 2.2, an enforced standard for new/updated software. Mick |
Subject: RE: Mudcat ABC Tune Guide From: Mick Pearce (MCP) Date: 06 May 13 - 01:22 PM PS - Re the software. I've now set up my virtual XP machine (running in VirtualBox under Ubuntu12.04 - kvm was surprisingly a lot slower - and the virtual machine runs faster than my old hardware version!), so I'll try and have a look at the windows and linux versions of some of the available programs. It's a few years since I last did that, so it won't be a wasted exercise. Mick |
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