Origins: Spanish Is the Loving Tongue

Subject: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 01:16 AM

Any of you heard the female version of this song? Here is what I can remember and before you post it, it is different than what is here already.

Spanish is the loving tongue,
Soft as laughter light as spray.
Knew a boy who once taught me some.
Said he came down Sonora way.

He didn’t look much like a lover.
Still he’d say these love words over:
“Tu eres mi luna. Tu eres mi sol,
Mi amor, mi corazon.”

His eyes were shy. His smile was bold,
My young vaquero 20 years old.
But every night the stories were told:
Towns of silver, streets paved with gold

I had dreams of far off places,
Dresses made of silk and laces.
I heard him say as the stage started on:
“Aidos, mi amor, mi corazon.”

I’ve dealt cards in so many places....

I’ve forgotten the ending !!

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: GUEST,Mrr
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 10:36 AM

The only person I ever heard actually sing this song was Richard Dyer-Bennet, on one of those old, RED vinyl albums... in his little falsetto... so I cannot ever again take this song seriously... But I would be interested in the female version if it pops up, perhaps I can imagine Cynthia Gooding or someone with a DEEP voice singing it!

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 01:31 PM

Actually, I sing it from the female perspective, having changed the words just slightly from the original. I've never heard the one referred to in the first post. Mrr, I have a high voice, and I think my version comes off rather well when I sing it. People like it. For a good recording of the original, listen to Ian Tysan.

Alice

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Art Thieme
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 03:46 PM

This song was written by Badger Clark and was a poem entitled The Border Affair. It was first published in the Pacific Monthly---June 1907. Later, it was naturally included in Clark's fine collection of songs called Sun And Saddle Leather. In 1925 Bill Simon of Prescott, Arizona was the one who fit the generally sung tune to Badger Clark's words. Simon rarely, if ever, was given credit for the tune. Simon wrote it out and sent it to Clark asking permission to use it on a network radio program. In 1972 Bill Simon recorded his own version of the song on an LP put out by the Arizona Friends Of Folklore. (N. Ariz. University--Flagstaff).

(from John White's great book Git Along Little Doggies (Songs and songmakers of the American west). University of Illinois Press--Urbana, IL)

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 04:11 PM

Thanks, Art. This song was mentioned a bit when Bill and Allan were here.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 04:20 PM

ok these things always seem to go away off on a tangent but the version i heard was being sung by one RONNIE GILBERT i lost my version but she credited as trad and the words done got nothin' to do with no outlaw story in the other one and usually when someone jazzes up a folk song they take them foriegn words out not put more in so i am having my suspicions that anyone can say "i wrote that"

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 04:54 PM

Hold on, this is not a very old song in "folk" terms, and the author is documented.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Metchosin
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 05:53 PM

I have this song on a 1962 Vanguard Album by Ian and Sylvia with basically the same info on the liner notes as Art Theime's.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 07:22 PM

these threads alwalys end up being about something other than what you want em to be about. i have heard a different version very different from the documented version you all are talking about and i am just looking for the last verse of the song. you know bob dylan wrote bob dylans dream and dont think twice and girl from the north country and about a dozen more songs that were trad and it dont mean nothing. i just want me that last verse and if you dont know it dont tell me you dont know it cause i can figure that out for myself.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 07:30 PM

Twilight on the patio
Old sen~ora nodding near
Me and Juana talking low
So the madre could not hear

Well, yes, bob jr, lyrics do "morph", as in the above verse being one version, so try sending an email to the webpage where I found THIS if no one here can add to the version you are searching for.

Alice

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Metchosin
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 07:43 PM

Or you can buy Ronnie Gilbert's album and transcribe the lyrics youself if you believe that route will be less circumambulate.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 07:50 PM

i cant find the ronnie gilbert album i wish i could i have remebered another line something about dealing cards but that is it!

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 08:09 PM

Was it this album? Record available for $7. Singing With You

Or maybe this one, "Lifeline" click here

alice

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Art Thieme
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 08:10 PM

bob jr,

TheWeaversusedtocopyrightalloftheirtraditionalsongsunderthenamePaulCampbell.RonnieGilbert,beinga majorpartoftheWeaversfortheirentireexistence,mayjusthavebeenusedtodoingthingsthatwayandcouldn'tgetoutofthehabit,

And, no, she wasn't a nun.

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: GUEST,Gene Shay
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 08:24 PM

The best version I ever heard of this---on record--is by Jan Marra, from her Flying Fish LP, These Crazy Years. On the liner she says that the song was originally a poem called "The Border Affair" and that she learned the song from the singing of Bill Staines. The album never came out as a CD, to my knowledge.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Art Thieme
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 09:59 PM

Jan was/is a great singer.

Gene, thanks for reminding me. (Good to see you here.)

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 11:18 PM

so anyhow the last verse goes something about i have dealt cards.... that is all i can remeber the song has a little to do lyrically with the other one that was taken from that poem but not too much if you read it and the tune is the same so maybe somebody did write that though it appears he didnt copyright it which was too bad for him. i cant figure how this song that i have heard is so different from the other it has no border in it no gambling fight no nothing just the guy ups and leaves .

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 11:56 PM

bob jr, maybe if you start a thread titled something like "need Ronnie Gilbert lyrics" you may get a wider response to your question, since it is her recording that you are trying to remember. Just a thought.

Alice

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: DonMeixner
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 12:30 AM

My favorite version is Bill Staines. Maybe not the most accurate to the original, but my favorite none the less.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Stewie
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 04:21 AM

Jan Marra's FF album is excellent. It certainly deserves reissue on CD. I had forgotten that 'Spanish is a loving tongue' is on it. Thanks for reminding me; I shall go and have a listen. The stand-out track for me was always the lovely 'Maria Consuela Arroyo'.

--Stewie.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Pixie
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 11:20 AM

Am I the only one who has it by Michael Martin Murphy? At the risk of being booted out, I think Joan Baez did a version years ago????

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 11:27 AM

Pixie, if you do a dogpile.com search, most of the hits are the Michael Martin Murphy recording. Well placed in the search engines. It has been recorded by many singers.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Metchosin
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 12:12 PM

Pixi, I think you right re Joan Baez, but I couldn't find it among the recordings I still have in my possession.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: raredance
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 10:05 PM

You shouldn't be booted out for saying that Joan Baez recorded it, because I am going to add that the Chad Mitchell Trio also recorded it ( Mike Kobluk solo actually). Katie Lee also recorded it with the first verse done by Billy Simon, the original tunesmith, and Katie also wrote extensively about it in her book "Ten Thousand Goddam Cattle."

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: GUEST,Bruce O.
Date: 18 Jun 00 - 06:13 PM

The song was also sung by Milt Okun on 'Traditional American Love Songs', Riverside RLP 12-634 (1956). The notes on the back, by Ellen Stekert, note this it was from Charles Clark's "The Border Affair".

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Art Thieme
Date: 18 Jun 00 - 11:53 PM

Bruce,

Great to see you !

Yes, Charles Badger Clark was his full name I believe.

Art

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 12:39 AM

will you folks stop with that stupid badger clark poem it aint got very little to do with the words i am looking for in fact its gone nothin' to do with it ENOUGH ALREADY

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: DonMeixner
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 12:47 AM

I heard a song by "Raccoon" Clarke once. maybe thats the one you want, about a Mexican girl who wants to be a dancer but discovers welding instead. While trying to meld the two artforms together she falls in love with the foreman who used to dance with the Ballet Rus when he was a steam fitter in Gdansk. She could plie but not Barre very well and while he was dancing The Corsair she up and left him. That the one?

Hope so or was it just another waste of time?

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Crowhugger
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 12:54 AM

Alice, I do as you do, learned it that way from my Mom. Just the minimum adjustment for gender.

CH.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 09:23 PM

well someone at a country and western site had the answer i am sure none of you will be at all interested but here it is ive dealt cards in so many places so many voices,such sweet phrases seems these nights i here only one mi amor mi carazon

no gambling no fight no border no nothing just like i always thought i guess folk tradition and country tradition are different ?

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 10:49 PM

no, bob jr, I AM interested. Can you write out the whole version here? How does that line fit in with the rest of the song? Or if you don't want to copy and paste it, can you give us the URL to where you found it?

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 20 Jun 00 - 05:55 PM

Okay, here is the whole text. I will divide the lyrics with / marks. If you play guitar, the chord structure for the verses is C-F-C-G. The middle bits are all Am-Em-F-C-C-F-C-G-C.

It goes as follows:

Spanish is the loving tongue,
Soft as music light as spray.
Knew a boy who once taught me some.
Came from down Sonora way.

He didn’t look much like a lover.
Still he’d say these love words over:
“Tu eres mi luna. Tu eres mi sol,
Mi amor, mi corazon.”

His eyes where shy. His smile was bold,
My young vaquero 20 years old.
But every day the stories were told:
Towns of silver paved with gold.

I dreamed dreams of far-off places,
Dresses made of silk and laces.
I heard him say as the stage started on:
“Adios, mi amor, mi corazon.”

I’ve dealt cards in so many places,
So many voices, such sweet phrases.
Most nights it seems I hear only one:
“Mi amor, mi corazon.”

End. I am not sure if my Spanish spelling is right, but this is from a version by Ronnie Gilbert who was one of the Weavers.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Art Thieme
Date: 20 Jun 00 - 10:16 PM

Now, bob,

Go to the board and write this 200 times.

"Mr. Badger Clark, I'M SORRY !!!! Didn't mean nothin' by it."

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: paddyc
Date: 20 Jun 00 - 11:02 PM

Liam Clancy does a kickass version on his Dutchman cd

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 01:59 AM

i dont care about no badger song it aint the same except the title even the damn melodies are different only a few of the words are in common and the chords are different in the two versions that badgers long dead and gone anyhow and this song has little to do with his poem about some border fight and gambling and all that....does anyone read these thread from the begining?

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Ranks
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 01:20 PM

I thought you meant a song with the phrase

"Spanish is a loving tongue, but she never spoke Spanish to me" whcih was done I think by Freddy Fender

Ralf

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Songster Bob
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 01:53 PM

Well, this HAS been a fine to-do, hasn't it? Bob, Jr. wanted a song which obviously started life as a parody -- well, an extension maybe -- of "Spanish Is the Loving Tongue," which started life as the Badger Clark poem "A Border Affair."

Now, it also seems that most people here, not being familiar with the Ronnie Gilbert performance of the song Bob Jr. wanted, went off on their own tangent about the Badger Clark and Bill Somon song, since, among other things, that's what the heading of the thread was about.

My guess is that the song Ronnie recorded is much more modern, possibly written by or for her, and it certainly bears only slight resemblance to the older song. Now that Bob, Jr. has printed the lyric he had in mind, all that remains is to find out the real authors' name(s) and put the whole thing in the Digital Tradition.

When I sing the older version, I always change one line (I don't have to change the gender). I change "She was Mex and I was White" to "Still want me for that gambling fight." It's too hard to explain to today's audiences why the original was written as it was, so I change it.

Bob Clayton

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Jim Krause
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 02:33 PM

Nope, I have a copy of the Michael Martin Murphy album on cassette, and that's where I learned it. Almost brings a tear to my eye when I sing it. Soddy

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Art Thieme
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 03:05 PM

Mr. Clayton,

Always good to hear from you. Hope you and Jennifer are well.

I've continued along the lines I started with just 'cause it was so much fun discommoding bob jr after I realized how bent out of shape he was getting. Bob jr, I'm sorry. But it was fun !

Art

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 03:39 PM

Staines' recording of the song that Bob Jr didn't want IS available on CD - CD-66 Just Play One Tune More - from the friendly folks at Folk-Legacy. You can get it through the Mudcat Shop.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Scotsbard
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 05:57 PM

I've heard a beautiful version of this recorded by either the Limelighters or Kingston Trio somewhere around 1960. Thanks for tracing the history!

~S~

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Art Thieme
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 07:25 PM

I did hear a great parody of this once. I don't remember much, but the first line was, "Yiddish is a loving tongue..."

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 22 Jun 00 - 12:25 AM

ah shucks folks i dont get bent out of shape that easily when i tried to find out who "wrote" the song it was listed as trad which could mean one of two things 1)whoever wrote didnt bother to copyright it 2)maybe its an amalgamtion of other trad songs or melodies? who knows i didnt realize that nobody knew ronnie gilbert i mean i am no expert (hence i ask lots of pretty dumb questions i reckon) but i even knew who she was (is i dont even know if she is dead !) but i guess maybe she aint so well known after all i guess i should have called the link SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE NOT BY A BADGER which would have confused things and yes yiddish is the kvelling tongue

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: WyoWoman
Date: 22 Jun 00 - 08:57 PM

To further muck up the waters, I thought Judy Collins did a version of this in the 1970s. Probably the same one Ronnie Gilbert did. I don't recall hearing Joan Baez do it, but unless my mind is completely failing me, which is much more than a remote possibility, Collins recorded it. I'll do some checking around and get back here, but only if the song is not by a badger. Those badger-written songs are so ... prickly.

ww

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 22 Jun 00 - 10:20 PM

bob jr, to answer your question "..does anyone read these thread from the begining", I think the answer is that even if we do, it's fun to chip in with other comments, kind of like a conversation in a crowded room. Like Art said, it's part of the fun.

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 22 Jun 00 - 11:04 PM

wyo woman i would appreciate it if you could find out that judy collins thing for me thanks. as for badgers and song i had some badgers in my garden once and the damn things never sang nothing which makes me think that these folks talking bout a song a badger wrote is an urban myth like finding a rat in your chicken bucket .anyways if you do find one its most likely the work of rogue badgers which is another reason i dont rightly trust em!!! i think phil ochs had a line about not singing no more badger songs on his last album but i could have been drunk when i heard that or real tired .....

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: Alice
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 12:20 AM

Badgers... Badgers.... We don't need no stinkin' Badgers!

(I love the treasure of the Sierra Madre, amazing how versatile that line can be)

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: WyoWoman
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 12:52 AM

When I was Outdoors editor for my former newspaper, we ran a story about badgers and I had to forcibly restrain myself from using that as a headline. A missed opportunity I will always regret...

ww

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: WyoWoman
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 01:00 AM

Yup. Just went to Amazon.com and found the Judy Collins anthology. On disc 2 is "Spanish is the Loving Tongue." A beauty of a song -- this is actually the only version of it I've ever heard.

And bob jr., I have never trusted a rogue badger one day of my life. I think you're wise not to.

ww

Subject: RE: SPANISH IS THE LOVING TONGUE
From: bob jr
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 01:33 AM

wyo woman thanks i will find that album for sure to see if she sings the good version and not the one that some mean spirited badger wrote. having read the other lyric it seems like that badger was into gambling which just goes to show you that those critters are up to no good again! down through the ages kids authors have tried to make these untrustable creatures cute and cuddly but dont you believe it i have it from reliable sources (ok not so reliable) that speculative badger investors caused both the great depression and the savings and loan scandels....look around that waco thing and you know some badgers are near by snickering i just betcha