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YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now??
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: mousethief Date: 15 Dec 00 - 12:13 PM Congratulations, Wesley! Sounds like you two have your work cut out for you! Yeeeeeee haaaaaaa indeed! |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Naemanson Date: 15 Dec 00 - 12:09 PM Yes, Wesley, I think it's safe to say you are about to have a very productive new year! And a very busy one! Merry Christmas and A Very Happy New Year to you and your wife. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mrrzy Date: 15 Dec 00 - 11:08 AM Yes, how's it going? |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Geoff the Duck Date: 15 Dec 00 - 10:09 AM It's not long until the big final countdown will start in earnest. I hope that everything is going smoothly. Have a merry Christmas and a happy New Year - assuming that you celebrate the forthcoming season. Otherwise have a good winter solstice, or any other excuse for celebrating! Post a thread when they arrive - we would like to share the happy event! Quack! Geoff the Duck |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Lepus Rex Date: 14 Oct 00 - 12:00 AM Congratulations, Wesley. That's all. :) ---Lepus Rex |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Geoff the Duck Date: 13 Oct 00 - 10:09 PM Look forward to it. It is THE most rewarding, if knackering, exprience I have ever had. Our Molly and Rowan are now 14 months old and walking/ climbing / wrecking the place/ throwing their food all over the carpet and then eating the bits we miss several days later if given the opportunity. Sing,talk and throw them in the air - but most importantly LOVE THEM!!! QUACK!!!!!!
duplicate posting deleted; left the one with the correction:-) |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: wysiwyg Date: 13 Oct 00 - 12:28 PM What next? Praise God, always! ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mrrzy Date: 13 Oct 00 - 11:00 AM Great site, Michael in Swansea! Will have to send to my sister with twins... and Wesley, how's in going? I'd been thinking of refreshing this thread for a couple of days now...
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Michael in Swansea Date: 13 Oct 00 - 10:44 AM Wesley I've only just seen this thread so firstly congratulations and secondly you may like THIS Mike |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler Date: 23 Jun 00 - 06:50 AM Congrats! What now? Try this from today's Times Pregnant clause
A question on the Income Support for Pensioners form asks: "Are you pregnant?" Harold Cox, of the Southern Derbyshire Pensioners' Association, pointed it out in a meeting with Alistair Darling, the Social Security Secretary. "They were so embarrassed I think they'll change it," Mr Cox said. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mbo Date: 22 Jun 00 - 10:24 PM We always wince at Steve from Blues Clues...he was on Homicide: Life On The Street (one of the greatest TV shows ever, IMO) and he DID IT!! Kinda hard to see him now as a good guy. Just don't let yer kids watch the episode...they'll never be the same again! --Mbo |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Psaltry Psue Date: 22 Jun 00 - 10:10 PM Skip Barney - Go for Blue Clues. Not only is Blue adorable but Steve is cute and fun to watch. I had read something about the reason babies scrunch up their eyes is because the light is too much (after all they were in a semi-dark enviroment for the last 9 mo.) So when my grandaughter was born we turned all the lights in the room off except for one very dim light. As soon as we did her eyes popped open and she was so quiet and just couldn't get enough of looking around. Even the nurses commented on how bright and calm she was.
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mrrzy Date: 22 Jun 00 - 08:32 PM As a statistician, I have to chime in, you guys are all wrong on the math. With multiples, it isn't times the number of kids, it's to the power of. So having 3-year old twins isn't 6 parent-years, it's 3(exponent)2=9 parent-years. My twins are 5, so it's like I've had them for 25 years, heh heh. My sister-who-has-twins warned me of this, and so far it suits! |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Pixie Date: 22 Jun 00 - 05:12 PM Blessings x2!!! I work with babies and young children and the babies are the best...the greatest stress reliever in the world! A parent where I work called this morning to say she was having twins in November, and I grinned so much you would have thought it was me carrying them! As you have already received so much good advice, I'm just going to add a little prayer for a healthy pregnancy and an uneventful delivery! Pixie |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: GUEST,Wesley S at Home Date: 22 Jun 00 - 12:24 AM Thanks for all of the wonderful suggestions folks. All will be considered. Bretta and I are headed to San Antonio and Corpus Christi for some R & R { meaning rest and research }. Feel free to add more ideas and we'll check in next week. Personal messages can be sent to wsmith@lokeyiron.com. Y'all are wonderful people. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Giac Date: 21 Jun 00 - 06:27 PM Best two you, Wesley and Bretta.
You know, it won't really matter what lullabys Enjoy. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Sailor Dan working?? Date: 21 Jun 00 - 05:34 PM Just think, twice the diapers, twice the crying,twice the bottles, twice the furniture, twice the clothes, twice the work, twice the aggravation, twice the tears. twice the smiles, twice the joy, twice the love, twice the happiness, twice the best of everything in the world that kids can bring. The best of luck and joy to you both. Dan. PS, If they bring you half the joy my Great-Grandaughter brings to me you wont have time to worry for all the smiles and loves. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mary in Kentucky Date: 21 Jun 00 - 11:32 AM Hi Wesley, I just can't seem to stay out of this thread. What Mrr said about making lullabies plural is exactly what I suggest. Actually, when my babies were very small, I found it very helpful to not get them in the habit of being rocked to sleep. We had a routine of just going to bed to sleep. All the rocking and singing were at different times other than naptime or bedtime. I saw some 4 year old twin boys yesterday, and it reminded me of when I had three kids within 2 years of age. They would all talk at the same time, so we had a rule that I would listen to the one that was touching me. Some of their teachers later asked why my kids were always touching them. Getting in and out of the car in a crowded parking lot was dangerous, so everyone had to put a hand on the car until we were ready to hold hands and walk. Also, bedtime was special because I would take turns lying in bed with each one, and only the one I was in bed with could talk at that time. They would save up their long narratives for this uninterrupted time. As several people mentioned, check out the MOTC club near you. They have tremendous resources. For right now you might like the book Twins and Supertwins. Mary |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: GUEST,Mrr Date: 21 Jun 00 - 10:39 AM Mark Cohen, I love the term and didn't come up with it, honesty forces me to footnote that to DivorceNet.com. At least that is where I encountered it. You can also say the mother/father of my children, if appropriate, rather than my ex-spouse... And about lullabies: I sang the same several to them and they have picked, over the years, different favorites, so now Tim always gets Hush a bye (the Peter Paul & Mary version) and Wil always gets Castle of Dromore (the Clancy Brothers & Tommy Makem version). I hardly ever get to sing the one my father sang to me, Hush Little Baby, any more. Or The MLF Lullaby, another one of my faves. I read books to both at once, though, and there we have to decide on who's bed to read and then the other gets ferried over to his own bed. About identical v. fraternal: you will probably be able to tell on the ultrasound what is shared, mine had separate placentas and separate sacs and were thus extremely likely to be fraternal, then they came out looking exactly alike but with different blood types, so we know they are fraternal. Also, whether twins run in your family or not will affect the probabilities of having fraternal v. identical twins. And I agree that it is important to know. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: AllisonA(Animaterra) Date: 21 Jun 00 - 07:07 AM Congratulations!!! As for the Vile Purple Reptile, I agree with those who say he's not That Bad- except that later in life, some perfectly fine songs become unacceptable because "That's a Barney song!!! I've tried to explain that those songs are a hundred years older than the Reptile but to no avail. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Sorcha Date: 20 Jun 00 - 11:26 PM Jeeze O, you own personal cypber pediatrician!! What more can you ask for? |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mark Cohen Date: 20 Jun 00 - 11:22 PM Mrs. Duck, yes we do have Teletubbies. Aauugggh! Mrr, thanks for that great term, X2B. I've been referring to my soon-to-be-ex-wife. (Way back in high school somebody came up with "the future former Mrs. So-and-so.") Hope you're doing ok. Sorry to creep on your thread, Wes. There was a thread not too long ago about what songs people sang to their kids...you can probably get some good ideas there. I'll creep out again now. But I'd be happy to answer any medical-type baby questions if you send me a personal message. Aloha, Mark |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: alison Date: 20 Jun 00 - 09:22 PM one of the best pieces of advice I was given was that when it gets really bad and you've had enough... go to McDonalds!!! Because you'll see many other parents there whose children are MUCH worse than yours. Makes you appreciate your little angels more.....*grin* slainte alison |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Sorcha Date: 20 Jun 00 - 07:53 PM The "14 Angel Song" (?) from the operetta Hansel and Gretel, "Sleep, Baby, Sleep", "Pretty Saro", "Peace in the Valley" |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mbo Date: 20 Jun 00 - 06:29 PM Hey Wes, Kenny G does a gorgeous version of Brahms' Lullaby (Weigenlied) on his album "Miracles"...in face the whole CD is good for putting babies to sleep. It sure calms our cat down! |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Wesley S Date: 20 Jun 00 - 06:20 PM Thanks folks - Lots of great ideas here that I'll share with the Mrs. Can anyone come up with a lullaby for twins?? I'm headed home - who knows - maybe I'll get more than three hours of sleep tonight. It sounds like I'll need it. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Sorcha Date: 20 Jun 00 - 06:18 PM Wes, if you and Bretta are pleased and happy about this, that is all that is necessary (aside from all the good advice above *BG*). I am 48, almost 49, and if it were me the last thing I would be doing is jumping for joy........Both of our two singles were difficult enough for me, and I remember thinking, when Kate was born,"Thank God there is not another one in there!" Happy for you both, tho. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Catlin Date: 20 Jun 00 - 03:05 PM Being the mother of a singleton baby, I can't give advice on twins, but I can sympathise. My son is just ten months and I'm really starting to feel it. All I can say is try to get as much rest and sleep as possible. I haven't slept properly in about two weeks now and I'm knacked. I'd dread to think what I'd be like with twins *Hugs* Catlin |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Jon W. Date: 20 Jun 00 - 12:29 PM Congratulations x 2, Wesley. Our second pregnancy turned out to be twins, who are now 15. We were somewhat isolated from extended family at the time so it was hard. Fortunately my job at the time wasn't very demanding and I got by with little sleep. I heartily endorse what has been said about cultivating a support system - it will be needed. Mothers of Twins club can be a great resource - especially getting some of the paraphernalia like twin strollers etc. used and cheap, if that's a consideration. Our twins never wanted to dress alike and we rarely had them do it. Sometimes we regret that because they missed out a lot of advantages of being twins (extra attention etc.) It seems that they grew apart for a while but in the last couple of years they've grown a lot closer. Still they have very distinct personalities. My best advice is to give your wife lots of support so she will feel as peaceful as possible - this will help her bond with both babies at once. Encourage her to breastfeed if at all possible - that really helps too. Our twins were due in Feb. but born in Jan. They were so small it was difficult for them to breastfeed, so we mostly missed that opportunity and my wife still regrets it - especially compared to the four subsequent kids who each nursed until they were darn good and ready to quit. Also, let the hospital staff know that you want to know for sure whether the twins are identical or not (they can examine the placenta) if there is any doubt. Not that it's very important usually, but they will be constantly asked and it's nice to have a definitive answer. We don't know for sure and now we're thinking of getting expensive DNA tests to find out. Another question you will face when they start school is whether to have them in the same class or not. Usually the school will try to pressure you to separate them (it's easier for the teachers) but we found our twins had more problems when they were separated and we put them back together for a few years and it helped. I'd say keep them together in school as long as they want to be (i.e. unless they themselves have strong objections). Again, congratulations and have fun. Jon W. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Easy Rider Date: 20 Jun 00 - 12:18 PM Congratulations, mazeltov and all the best wishes I can send your way. I have no advice about babies, having only become a father (of a 22 year old girl) less than two years ago. We adopted each other! Still, being a parent has changed my life, for the better, in ways I can't begin to describe. Children are Real! You have to be Real! My wife and I started late, had several miscarriages, got too old and gave up, several years ago. You have a long trip ahead of you, and a lot can happen that is not in your control. It 'aint over till the fat lady sings. Good luck, EZR |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: GUEST,Mrr Date: 20 Jun 00 - 11:27 AM FIRST - CONGRATS!!! Then: 5) And last: When they are small and you have had no sleep and cannot stand it any more and want to bash their teeny heads together, which will happen even if you only had one, USE THE SOCIAL SUPPORT that is widely available, just look at this thread. We used to take ours to the Mall when we got frustrated, and 17 people would swarm around going Oh honey, you must work so HARD! How do you do it? and so on... not to mention the other 17 who are twins, have twins, have twin siblings or parents or relatives or something... and in about 2 mn you feel right back on top of the world. You don't get this kind of reaction with singletons (who ever went up to a baby and cooed Ooh, my father was a baby once!), so although you get smiles and all, with twins you get a lot of attention right when you need it. Also: many companies give twin discounts, all you have to do is ask. When buying one car seat say I have twins, give me the second at half-price and this is where we'll buy the cribs. They often will do it even if they have no set policy, just chat up the manager and talk about all the stuff your wee ones will need, and wouldn't it be nice if you had a favorite store... Not advice, just a note: Mine are fraternal twins, as are my sister's, and I would sometimes dress them the same and sometimes differently. My favorite thing when it was up to me was to dress them similarly but not identically - both in purple shirts but one says Pennsylvania and the other, Philadelphia, or something, UNLESS I was taking them to something crowded. Even now (they just turned 5)I try to dress them as brightly and as identically as they will put up with when going to a crowded and outdoor event, for my own peace of mind when looking around for them. This was very helpful once when Tim got lost at an outdoor wedding and I was able to walk around with Wil and say Anybody seen a kid who looks just like this? And we found Tim in no time. I had tried earlier just by description and the same person who knew where he was when shown the model had just denied all knowledge of small blond curls in a striped turtleneck. You are in for the ride of your lives, and it will be GREAT! |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: SINSULL Date: 20 Jun 00 - 11:05 AM At the risk of being trite: There is nothing more exciting than a new baby. Love them, treasure them, teach them right from wrong and stand back while they take over the world. But first, get some rest. They will be 35 before you can rest easy again. SS |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mrs.Duck Date: 20 Jun 00 - 11:02 AM I think you're all very mean to Barney. When my daughter Maddie (now 6) was little it was a godsend as in the UK it is shown at around 6.30 am just as she woke up and she would sit transfixed for half an hour while I dozed off. Of course America hasn't been treated to the delights of the Yeletubbies or the Tweenies. Anyway Wesley you get to choose what they do for fun for the first five years until they get to school but then no matter how youn try they will go with the latest trend!!! |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mbo Date: 20 Jun 00 - 09:45 AM Reminds me of a sketch from Saturday Night Live. "Coming soon to theaters---Barney's Titanic Adventure!!! 'Hello sky! Hello sun! Hello water! Hello iceberg!' Watch Barney go to a watery grave! (Scene of Barney laying on the ocean floor....still waving...)" --Mbo |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: GUEST Date: 20 Jun 00 - 08:40 AM What a great Father's Day gift. Fathers by necessity have to take a more active role with twins than with single babies. I wasn't too inclined to learn the finer points of parenting - like changing diapers, giving baths, preparing formula - with our first child...but with twins there was nowhere to hide! Being so similar in age and physical appearance, as they grow older and become aware they'll struggle to differentiate themselves from each other. One of our boys is a typical boy: baseball; patron saint of stray dogs; learning to spit. His brother is a study in contrast: shy; sensitive; artistic. They both have worked hard to become their own person, in opposition to friends' and relatives' penchant for getting their identities confused. It's fascinating to observe. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: dwditty Date: 20 Jun 00 - 08:14 AM A group called MOTA (Mothers of Twins) meets at our church every month. I don't know much about it, but there seems to be a level of support that only those going through the same experience can really appreciate. Not to mention the sharing of clothes, strollers, etc. Check it out. By the way, my youngest of 4 girls is almost 5. I am almost 53. I couldn't be happier. Congrats to you and Bretta. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: GUEST,JulieF Date: 20 Jun 00 - 07:44 AM Congratulations on the great news. It's also refreshing to know that all parents have not succumbed to the curse of the large Purple dinosaur. We were quite lucky as Cat's favourite program was a sort of anachistic puppet called POB. If you want a bit of variety music wise to play to them try Peter and the Wolf - It worked for us , we got through about four tapes. All the best Julie |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mrs.Duck Date: 20 Jun 00 - 07:39 AM Many congratulations Wesley and Bretta. Our twins Molly and Rowan were born naturally on th7th August last year and attended their first fol session on the 11th and their first festival on th 21st(Whitby) They have been breast fed in pubs all over England and once we established a routine I had no trouble. When we were out I fed them on their own but at home I built a big nest on the bed and just settled down with the telly on or music and a packet of biscuits and stayed until we all went off to sleep.Its a lot easier now of course although the one thing noone warned me about was how much longer the shopping would take. Not because of the extra groceries but because everyone youpass will want to bill and coo over the babies-far more than with any singleton. Keep us posted and any problems or queries that someone who's been there might be able to help with feel free to mudcat mail us. Get plenty of rest and play them your favourite music now and they'll settle to that when they're born OOH I'm getting all excited for you. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: GUEST,Wesley S at Home Date: 20 Jun 00 - 07:01 AM Thanks one and all. It's about 5:45 here in Texas and I've been awake since 2:30. Too many thoughts in my head for sleep. Bretta and I are very lucky to have a great support system in place. A close friend and my sister are nurses, good friends who have gone through this recently and a boss with twins of his own { his wife is a child phycologist [ however thats spelled] }. I do plan to start singing to my children soon - I'm already looking at my songbooks. My Creole Belle may just have to have a rewrite. I need more songs - ideas welcome. I like the idea of teaching these children to be individuals. We'll have to try not to refer to them as "the twins". Thanks - more after I get to work. PS - Did I tell y'all that these children will restore old time, bluegrass and celtic music to the top 40?? I'll put you on the guest list of their Carnegie and Albert Hall debuts if their manager will allow it. { no pressure } |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: catspaw49 Date: 20 Jun 00 - 01:17 AM That's Barney the Purple Dinosaur......and you have obviously not had any kids around you in the past ten years!!! Spaw |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: GUEST,leeneia Date: 20 Jun 00 - 01:05 AM What exactly is the the "purple oil deposit" mentioned in an earlier post? As an acoustic musician, I think I could use this diatribe. |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: katlaughing Date: 20 Jun 00 - 12:29 AM hey, Don! I'm a grandma and I don't hate it!**BG** |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Mark Cohen Date: 20 Jun 00 - 12:29 AM Wesley, it's not really a lullaby, but this song, Both of You, may give you something to think about for the future. (It was written for Sandy Bradley and Jere and Greg Canote, Seattle musicians and radio stars.) As a pediatrician, the best advice I can give you is to take advantage of the advice you can get from alison and katlaughing. Also know that many twins are born early, so don't panic if that happens. And remember that they are two children, not one person called "the twins." All the best, my friend. Aloha, Mark |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: DonMeixner Date: 20 Jun 00 - 12:06 AM As the owner of twins my best advice to you is let them be singular. Allow them to grow up as individuals and not as repeats. I my case as often as i say Greg and Geof I try to say Geof and Greg. The world will always keep them as twins, you should try to keep them as individuals. Grandmothers will hate it but the kids will love you for it later. Don |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: catspaw49 Date: 19 Jun 00 - 11:56 PM And Wes, let's not be worrying over ol' Barney. I really detested the damn thing until I saw what fun he gave my boys. Besides, you aren't his target audience and the dinosaur really understands his demographics. They'll pass on to other things all too soon. ........And don't forget to get them signed up for that "NRA Kidz" program and let them start choosing their weapons!!! Spaw |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: Big Mick Date: 19 Jun 00 - 11:51 PM EEEEEEEEHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAA! Mudcat babies........and I do love the wee'uns. Wesley, I strongly advise you to begin right now to sit and play and sing to the children. Right now while they are still cooking. I did this to the wee Ciara and her mother said she could feel the baby react to it. I would sing kids songs to her, and when she was born, she would sing with me as soon as she heard the guitar. She was very expressive, in a positive way right from the beginning. It builds a bond that is amazing. Congratulations to you and Britta. Big Mick |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: katlaughing Date: 19 Jun 00 - 11:40 PM Alison! That's exactly the description I was looking for for those pillows and you are right...they are perfect for propping a wee one up until they can hold their heads up. I have some adorable pix of my grandsons, plopped down in a bommerang pillow, together when they were small enough, then their parents went out and bought another, just so they could both be in their own pillow as they grew bigger. My mom always said she thought twins weren't that difficult because they entertained each other so much of the time. My sisters even had their own language when they were really little....used it only with one another. This is going to be so much fun for you and Bretta...what joy! kat |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: GUEST Date: 19 Jun 00 - 10:58 PM Sweet Mario - as a parent who is blessed with people who treat my daughters as beloved nieces, daughters, granddaughters without benefit of blood.... I thank you. People like you who step into those roles are making it possible for newfangled/oldfashioned parents like me to make a go of it in this 'village' (read: crazy country) we occupy. Dani |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: thosp Date: 19 Jun 00 - 10:40 PM so you don't get confused -- i strongly advise you to give them the same name! --- peace (Y) thosp |
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Subject: RE: YEE HAA !!!! TWINS !!!! What now?? From: thosp Date: 19 Jun 00 - 10:39 PM so you don't get confused -- i strongly advise you to give them the same name! --- peace (Y) thosp |
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