Flamenco anyone?

Subject: Flamenco anyone?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 12:50 AM

I mentioned on another thread that I've recently discovered the music of Miguel Espinoza and Ty Burhof, who do some really beautiful flamenco music. I've been wearing the CD I got into a wafer, listening to it while moving across country.

I just love this stuff. And every time I hear good flamenco music, I just love it. But despite that, I haven't bought myself any CDs before. Mostly this is because I just don't know where to start.

Any flamenco aficianados out there in MudcatLand who can give me some pointers on starting a modest collection?

And yes, flamenco counts as folk music, don't you think?

Gracias, ww

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Mbo
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 12:53 AM

Try the album Flamenco with classical guitar master (and a bit of an idol of mine) Pepe Romero. Awesome playing, and gritty hard-hitting folk lyrics sung by some of Spain's best Flamenco singers.

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 01:02 AM

You are simply amazing.

I'll go see if I can find it right now...

ww

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 01:15 AM

Howdy Wyo.

For my money Paco De Lucia has it all. His early work is pretty traditional and his later stuff has a lot of jazz elements. He is a wondrous player.

However....however...If you want to hear the REAL McCoy, get anything by Manitas de Plata. Whooeee, that guy can make you feel like you're in a little dive in Andalucia.

Some folks think Paco Pena is the ultimate....but almost everyone probably thinks that Carlos Montoya (who popularized the genre) is not very good. His albums are the easiest to find though. The afficianados always thought he was the "Wayne Newton" of Flamenco guitarists.

Hope that helps a bit. Enjoy.

Rick

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 01:17 AM

Forgot to mention Sabicas. Saw him a number of years ago. He was great.

Rick

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 01:25 AM

Back I go to Amazon.com ... They didn't have Pepe Romero, but I ordered a compilation disc. I'll see if they have any of these that you mentioned, Rick.

And howdy back at ya. Wish I could come up for the soiree this weekend. That ought to be SOME fun...

ww

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 01:32 AM

Hey, Rick. You can earn a $50 gift certificate from Amazon.com if you write a review of Sabicas' cds. They haven't gotten a review yet.

ww

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 01:37 AM

It would be an easy 50 bucks if I REALLY knew what I was talking about, but I'm merely a fan.

Rick

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Escamillo
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 03:50 AM

I love flamenco too - what could be expected from a "toreador" ? - but am no expert. Agreed with Mbo and Rick that Pepe Romero and Paco de Lucía are good approaches, I would only say if you want to start by the roots, avoid De Lucía's recent jazzistic works and overemphasized rumbas, which are nearer to the commercial stuff than to the flamenco art. And try to get a video of a flamenco session, or attend one, cause the viewable part is as valuable as the audible.
Un abrazo bien calé - Andrés

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Morticia
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 05:45 AM

There is something about flamenco that really stirs me up and all my hard floors take a real pounding...I wish I could find a class that would teach me to do it properly, I reckon it would be wonderfully therapeutic

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Dani
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 09:52 AM

Here:

http://www.wilmatheater.org/press/1999_0115.html

is a review of Noche Flamenco, which I'm planning to see at Wolf Trap in August. Can't wait! It really is music to pump your blood. Anyone know more about it as a folk tradition?

Dani

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Kim C
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 10:19 AM

I'd like to learn Flamenco dance too. Is there a video?

I know it's not traditional Flamenco, but I like Ottmar Leibert.

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Mbo
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 10:33 AM

WW, the Pepe Romero album is at amazon.com. It's right here! Chano Lobata is the cool guy who does the singing!

--Mbo

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Mark Clark
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 10:53 AM

Check out Mario Escudero. There was a Folkways ten-inch album of him that I used to check out all the time from the public library. I think I must've worn out the grooves on that copy. That was back in 1960 but I think you could still order this from the Smithsonian. Come to think of it, maybe I'll order one too.

The first time I visited Mexico City (1962) I bought a wonderful flemenco guitar from a luthier on the Avenue of the Americas; I don't remember his name anymore. It was beautifully made with cyprus back and sides that you could actually see light and shadows through. It's sound had that wonderful edge and volume that flemenco guitars have. I sure wish I had that guitar today.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 11:39 AM

Wow, Mark. I've never heard of a guitar like that. I bet that was awesome. Mmmmm.

Morticia and Kim: Maria Benitez in Santa Fe, N.M., used to run a flamenco dance school in the summertime. I don't know if she still does, but I've sent a friend there an email to see if she can find out. They actually had classes for beginners, as well as intermediate and advanced. She's world-renowned and absolutely excellent. I've had this fantasy of going for a week or two and taking the bery-bery-beginners classes. If I do, let's meet up, si?

God, I wish I could win the lottery so I could go travel to all this cool stuff. The Juke Joint site that Roger the Skiffler started makes me want to go tour the Mississippi delta, this thread makes me want to take off for Espana, and the EL SWANNO AND BIG MICK BUCK NEKKID IN TORONTO (or whatever) makes me want to fly immediately to Toronto. Plainly, I need a much bigger travel budget.

WW

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Mark Clark
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 12:39 PM

WW, I think what I described is a common design and construction for high quality flemenco guitars. If you click on the Mario Escudero link I provided you'll see him playing a guitar quite similar (in appearance) to the one I bought in Mexico City. They are so thin and light it's just hard to believe.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: M. Ted (inactive)
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 01:19 PM

Just to add my 2 cents--

Flamenco music and dance are art forms created and perfomed by gypsies. The general consensus(as far as musicians dancers and singers that I have known) is the Ricardo Balliardo, called "Manitas de Plata" is the best of the flamenco guitarists, and he has a very special place in their hearts.(Also is a cousin to the Balliardos in the "Gipsy Kings")

To understand flamenco guitar, you must know that pieces are composed of two elements--Rasgueo, which are strummed rhythmic phrases, and falsetas, which are melodic phrases.

What sounds, at least to the uninitiated ear, like an emotional and hysterical frenzy of musical energy is actually a subtle and intricate interweaving of musical ideas. The music is not written, it is generally passed from father to son, and each player is highly individualistic in his use and development of ideas.

For dancing, the rasgueo predominate--but in solo work, and when accompanying singing, the player works primarily with the falsetas, which may be traditional, taken from the work of other players, or created by the performer.

To my mind, the Alternating structure, the rhythms, and the scales are very closely tied to Arabic music. For that matter, it works a lot like blues and jazz, which tells you where I think that that all came from.

In fact, years ago, in Philadephia, there was an oud player by the name of Chick who used to play at the regular flamenco parties at Julia Lopez-Torres restaurant down at 2nd and Chestnut. He played next door at the Middle East, and worked up a cross cultural repertoire with Julia's husband, a guitarist, who, I believe, was called Juan Lopez.

Chick had stretched the boundaries of the oud considerably, and in addition to his forays into flamenco, had recorded and performed with several famous jazz bands. He fell prey, as many musicians do, to the bottle, in the last years of his career (in the 80's) was often barely able to play.

One night, he was sleeping in his apt when a fire broke out, and, because he was slow to awaken, was severely burned. He never played again. I lost track of him, but heard that he died not many years later, on the West Coast.

Sorry, didn't mean to stray so far off topic, but it just came to mind, and I had to mention it. I suppose the point is that flamenco is is an excellent and important kind of traditional music, and there are many players out there, that not many people may know about, but who are worth hearing and knowing.

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Mark Clark
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 02:27 PM

Yes! Smithsonian Folkways can still supply the Mario Escudero album I mentioned. What would we do without the Smithsonian?

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Peter T.
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 04:18 PM

Don't neglect the poetry -- Garcia Lorca's "Profound Songs" , his plays (Blood Wedding) and other Granadan verse.

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: GUEST,Annraoi
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 04:36 PM

For the ultimate in Flamenco music both Cante Jondo and Cante Chico, hunt up the "Antología del Cante Jondo" by numerous artistes including the incomparable "cantaor" Jacinto de Almadén", issued now in CD format by the "Hispavox" company. Although 30 + years old, it is still, IMHO, the definitive compilation. Annraoi

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: rangeroger
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 09:27 PM

I have been a Carlos Montoya and Sabicas fan for years. Probably the most unusual flamenco album I have is Sabicas- Rock Encounter with Joe Beck.It is a fusion of the two mediums and actually works.Of course the die-hard flemenco purists will dimiss it as trash, but Sabicas was willing to experiment.
rr

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 23 Jun 00 - 09:33 PM

I did find out the dates for the Maria Benitez dance workshop in Santa Fe, N.M. this summer. I have a phone number as well, if anyone is seriously interested. They do take rank beginners (such as myself. I'm very rank.) and my friend who's been says the people are absolutely great -- both the ones teaching and the ones learning. The dates are July 31 - August 13. Unfortunately I'm going to be in Alaska for part of that time, but I'm seeing if the workshop is broken into one-week segments...

Send me a message if you want any more details.

WW

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Escamillo
Date: 24 Jun 00 - 12:32 AM

Wyo, will we see the results of those workshops in the Cantina ? :))
Un abrazo - Andrés

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 29 Oct 03 - 10:39 AM

rrefresh

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Beverley Barton
Date: 29 Oct 03 - 11:16 AM

jOhn from hull,
             i want your babies! thanks for finding this old thread

Subject: RE: Flamenco anyone?
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 29 Oct 03 - 11:18 AM

I havent got no babies, if i did you could have them, 9babies are rubbish, cry to much etc.