Subject: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: Bob Date: 05 Dec 97 - 12:41 PM Looking for lyrics to the Wreck of the 1262. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: Bruce O. Date: 05 Dec 97 - 01:07 PM In Norm Cohen's 'The Long Steel Rail' (with music) as "The Freight Wreck at Altoona". It's by Riley Puckett. Wreck was Nov. 29, 1925. Song copyrighted Jan. 30 1926. |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: Bruce O. Date: 05 Dec 97 - 01:10 PM Corection, the copyrighted version was by a Carson Robison. Pucket's version was 1935. Cohen gives the 1st recorded version also, 1926. |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: Dale Rose Date: 05 Dec 97 - 01:34 PM Yes, the Carson Robison attribution would be more likely. I have a recording (somewhere) by Vernon Dalhart. If no one beats me to it, I will dig it out and try to decipher the lyrics. |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: lesblank Date: 05 Dec 97 - 02:29 PM The best version, IMHU, is by Doc Watson on his Vanguard CD,"Doc Watson on Stage featuring Merle Watson". It's a 1982 vinyl or a 1988 CD and is available from Vanguard, 1299 Ocean Ave, Santa Monica CA 90401. |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: Bruce O. Date: 05 Dec 97 - 04:49 PM What does best mean? To me it's always the one closest to the original, even if the author of song and tune wasn't the best performer of it. I'm primarly interested in songs, not performers. Dale's Vernon Dalhart recording may be the original, recoprded by Dalhart, Jan 15, 1926, on a Columbia recording, released in March. |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: Dale Rose Date: 06 Dec 97 - 12:34 AM Well, so far I have not found it, though Dalhart DID record it. The closest I have come to it is The Wreck of the 1256. By my count that is about six short. Train songs by Dalhart that I have located are The Lightning Express, In the Baggage Coach Ahead, The Runaway Train, The New River Train, Billy Richardson's Last Ride, The Wreck of the Number Nine, The Wreck of the Norfolk & Western Cannonball, Casey Jones, Got the Railroad Blues, The Wreck of the Royal Palm Express, and The Engineer's Dream. It is possible that I have it on an anthology that I passed over. (Easy for me to do) Train songs by others that I located during my search include: Engineer Frank Hawk, The Engineer's Last Run, The Nine Pound Hammer, Southern Number 111, Double Headed Train, Casey Jones, Railroad Blues, C C & O Number 558, I'm Nine Hundred Miles From Home, The C & O Excursion, The Little Red Caboose Behind the Train, When The Train Comes Along, East Bound Train, Orange Blossom Special (the original version!), The Train's Done Left Me, Engine One Forty Three, Jerry Go Ile that Car, If I Die a Railroad Man, The Wreck of the Virginian, The Davis Limited, The Cannonball, The Longest Train, The Red and Green Signal Lights, Peanut Special, Crime of the D'Autremont Brothers, McAbee's Railroad Piece, Bill Mason, then I quit looking. Gene, it's your turn.
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE WRECK OF THE 1262 (Doc Watson) From: Gene Date: 06 Dec 97 - 12:25 PM Here's Doc Watson's version... THE WRECK OF THE 1262 Recorded by Doc Watson/Trad. He'd just left the point at kittanning The engineer pulled at the whistle With all of the strength that God gave him He travelled at sixty an hour It's not the amount of the damage They found them at their post in the wreckage Now this story is told of a freight train
Source: DOC WATSON ON STAGE/VSD 9/10
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Subject: Lyr/Chords Add: THE WRECK OF THE 1256 (Robison) From: Gene Date: 06 Dec 97 - 12:39 PM And while we're on the subject of trains....
THE WRECK OF THE 1256 Recorded by Marty Robbins Words and music by Carson Robison [C] On a cold day and dark, [C7] cloudy [F] ev'nin' From Clifton Fort they started On the main line once more they started They were gay and they joked with each other In an instant the story was ended Railroad men you should all take a warnin' SOURCE: Marty Robbins/Me And My Guitar/1983 CBS LSP-15388\BFX-15119
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Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: GUEST,Jonathan Hewlett Date: 12 Oct 07 - 07:04 PM I have found the song Wreck of the 1256 by Curly Fox on Rounder Record's cd, ''Train 45''. |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: catspaw49 Date: 12 Oct 07 - 08:53 PM IF you can Jonathan, post the lyrics here. We have two very different songs which have only the fact of telling a tale of a wreck in common.....a similar number, but that's about it. I think maybe in the 1256 song which Gene posted, Clifton Fort is probably Clifton Forge.....possibly misheard. Clifton Forge was a part of the Chessie (C&O) for many years. The other, the 1262 sung by Doc, takes place on the Pennsy somewhere around Altoona, PA and the famous Horseshoe Curve just to the west whose location is Kittanning Point where there used to be a station. Spaw |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: Padre Date: 12 Oct 07 - 11:45 PM I pass the scene of the wreck of C&O #1256 every day going from home to work. |
Subject: ADD: The Wreck of the 1256 (Carson Robison) From: Joe Offer Date: 13 Oct 07 - 03:17 AM Well, Spaw, they're two different wrecks and two different songs - but both were at least partly written by Carson Robison. This version is very close to Gene's transcription of the Marty Robbins version. -Joe- The Wreck of the 1256 (Carson Robison, AKA Carlos B. McAfee) (as recorded by Vernon Dalhart) On that cold and dark cloudy evenin', Just before the close of the day, There came Harry Lyle and Dillard, And with Anderson they rode away. From Clifton Forge they started, And their spirits were running high, As they stopped at Iron Gate and waited, Till old Number Nine went by. On the main line once more they started, Down the James River so dark and drear; And they gave no thought to the danger, Or the death that was waiting so near. They were gay and they joked with each other, As they sped on their way side by side; And the old engine rocked as she traveled, Through the night on that last fatal ride. In an instant the story was ended, On her side in that cold river bed; With poor Harry Lyle in the cabin, With a deep fatal wound in his head. Railroad men, you should all take warning, From the fate that befell this young man; Don't forget that the step is a short one, From this earth to that sweet Promised Land. Source: Long Steel Rail, (Second edition, 2000) Norm Cohen, pp. 240-242 Cohen says:
Click to play |
Subject: ADD: Altoona Freight Wreck / Wreck of the 1262 From: Joe Offer Date: 13 Oct 07 - 03:34 AM Altoona Freight Wreck (Riley Puckett) They had just left the point at Kittanning, Freight Number Twelve Sixty-two; She traveled right on down the mountain, And brave were the men in her crew. The engineer pulled at the whistle, For the brakes wouldn't work when applied; The brakeman climbed out on the car top, For he knew what that whistle had cried. With all of the strength that God gave him, He tightened [?tied in] those brakes with a prayer; But she kept right on down that mountain, Her whistle was piercing the air. She traveled at sixty an hour, Gaining speed every foot of the way; And then in a crash it was over, And there on the track the freight lay. They found them at their post in the wreckage, Both had done their duty so well; The engineer still held the whistle, And the fireman still hung to the bell. Click to playSource: Long Steel Rail, (Second edition, 2000) Norm Cohen, pp. 243-246. notes from Cohen:
-Joe- |
Subject: ADD: The Freight Wreck at Altoona (freight #1262) From: Joe Offer Date: 13 Oct 07 - 04:32 AM I hear the Doc Watson recording just a bit different from Gene's transcription - the main difference is that I'm sure he refers to the train as "she." Here is Norm Cohen's transcription of the 1926 Vernon Dalhart recording, the earliest known recording of the ballad. It's almost the same as Doc Watson's version. -Joe- The Freight Wreck at Altoona (Carson Robison and Fred Tait-Douglas) (as recorded by Vernon Dalhart, 1926) She just left the point at Kittanning, The freight number Twelve Sixty Two; And on down the mountain she traveled, And brave were the men in her crew. The engineer pulled at the whistle, For the brakes wouldn't work when applied; And the brakeman climbed out on the car tops, For he knew what the whistle had cried. With all of the strength that God gave him, He tightened the brakes with a prayer; But the train kept right on down the mountain, And her whistle still piercing the air. And on down the grade she went racing, She sped like a demon from Hell; With the engineer blowing the whistle, And the fireman was ringing the bell. She traveled at sixty an hour Gaining speed every foot of the way; And then with a crash it was over, And there on the track the freight lay. It's not the amount of the damage, Or the value of what it all cost; It's the sad tale that came from the cabin, Where the lives of two brave men were lost. They were found at their posts in the wreckage, They died when the engine had fell; The engineer still held the whistle And the fireman still hung to the bell. This story is told of a freight train, And it should be a warning to all; You should be prepared every minute, For you cannot tell when He'll call. note that the Riley Puckett version has five verses and a significant text change in the last stanza. The Dahlart-Robison version has nine verses. Source: Long Steel Rail, Norm Cohen |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: catspaw49 Date: 13 Oct 07 - 08:10 AM Thanks Joe.........I gotta' get a copy of LSR. But you hafta' admit I know my railroads........LOL. Ever been to Horseshoe Curve in your travels? Neat place even today. On one of your trips back east you need to skip the lighthouses and dig into a little railroad lore in Pennsylvania. And come see me and we'll go to a few other rail places that you will never forget. Spaw |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: Joe Offer Date: 13 Oct 07 - 02:53 PM Thanks for the tip, Spaw. I've been meaning to go to Horseshoe Curve for years. I figured I could get to the Sing Out! center and a coal mine tour at the same time. I'll tie it to my Getaway trip one of these years. This year's a quick trip, but I can go back to my leisurely rambles next year because I'll be finished with homeschooling. -Joe- |
Subject: RE: REQ: Wreck of the 1262 From: dick greenhaus Date: 13 Oct 07 - 08:41 PM and to think..it's been hiding in DigiTrad for 9 years. Search for Altoona. |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: Joe Offer Date: 14 Oct 07 - 03:59 AM I hate it when that happens, Dick. Still, I think the versions we've posted are different here and there from what's in the DT. Both are great songs, aren't they? -Joe- |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 18 Oct 07 - 05:49 PM Joe - next time you give a sitation like Cohen....could you please include the page number?
New York Times, November 30, 1925 page 4 (as noted in footnote #1 by Cohen p.246.)
Freight Train Dashes Down Horseshoe Curve
Special to the New York Times
ALTOONA, Pa., Nov. 29 - Two men
The dead are F.C. Scheline, aged
The VL-4, made up of fifty-eight cars,
From Kittanning Point to the city the
As the runaway train thundered
At Bridge Street the train encoun-
Freight train No. 260, west bound,
http://www.grimshaworigin.org/NYtimesArticles.htm
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Freight Train Wreck at 17th Street Bridge, Altoona, PA, November 30, 1925
wreck_at_17th_St_1927.jpg (77540 bytes)
The wreck occurred when an eastbound freight train "lost its air" descending the East Slope and ran away, derailing and striking the old Seventeenth Street Bridge moving it 32 inches off its foundation. The bridge had to be rebuilt before it could be used for vehicular traffic again.
http://www.trainweb.org/horseshoecurve-nrhs/conrail.htm
PHOTOGRAPH -
http://www.trainweb.org/horseshoecurve-nrhs/Guide-p2.htm#17st
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�THE FREIGHT WRECK AT ALTOONA/THE WRECK OF THE 1262� Many folksongs focus on train wrecks. One November 29, 1925, the wreck of theeastbound freight train, VL-4, led to one such ballad. After leaving the Kittanning Point Station at the Horseshoe Curve, the 1262 started down a grade. When the train was 3.3 miles from Altoona, the brakes failed, causing a derailment. The engineer and fireman were killed; most of the cars were demolished. Another folksong, � The New Market Wreck� also came about in this way.
The Railroad Comes to Pettis County Curriculum Guide Unit Four "Quality of Life" Hobo Signs - Railroad Songs Copyright � 2003. Sedalia Area Chamber of Commerce.Page 77
www.sedaliakatydepot.com
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The Newlanders - audio, photo and text with liner notes. The Altoona Freight Wreck
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Sincerely, |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 23 Oct 07 - 07:46 AM DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORATION
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: catspaw49 Date: 23 Oct 07 - 05:26 PM Thank you garg.....I suppose to add on to this.........Has everyone noticed that the engine number in the report and the song (and on other account) don't match?????? The song say 1262 but the report is 1282...hmmm????? My best guess is that the song may have come from a news account but the report is accurate. 1262 was an engine numberr to a type not used on the Pittsburgh Division whereas the 1282 was a Mikado, by far the biggest choice of the day on the Pennsy for hauling freight. The engine involved here was a PRR Mikado Class L1 Locomotive with Mikado wheel arrangement 2-8-2. Built betweem 1914 and 1919, they were built by the PRR at their Juanita shops and also by Baldwin Locomotive Co. A few were built by Lima Loco Works as well.The L1 's were built as freight haulers and shared the same boiler with the passenger type K4 Pacifics (4-6-2). Both classes used the same PRR exclusive (and classic looking) Belpaire firebox (see the photo-the firebox is the very squared off section next to the cab. The flat-sided squared off design made both the Belpaire firebox and most PRR engines readily identifiable). The wrecked #1282 and oddly enough, the #520 in THIS picture were BOTH built in 1916 at Baldwin. I say oddly because the #520 is the only surviving PRR Mikado L1. The engines came in at about 60,000 pounds and the PRR used 62 inch drivers so you have some idea of the size. Here is another shot of a PRR Mikado "back in the day." Over 61,000 pounds of startup tractive force made them a powerful hauler but they had no stoker which put a lot of excessive work and effort on the fireman and they often were not fired to capacity. They were retired in the 30's but used some during WWII because of need. Spaw |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: catspaw49 Date: 23 Oct 07 - 08:55 PM Well this has been really bugging me.
I called a friend who is another son of a PRR railroader who collects old stuff from the Pennsy, C&O,B&O, and Nickel Plate, like timetables and freight schedules from the past hundred years. He's looking but it may take awhile. He too thinks (after some quick checking) that the number 1262 was on an aging Atlantic type or possibly a B6 Switcher on the Eastern Division at that time. He also has some material on the wreck and I linked him this thread to look at as well. Its hard to find all of that type of info frankly. |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: Mrrzy Date: 23 Oct 07 - 09:39 PM Hey, they got the number wrong on Engine 143 also - it was apparently 134. But this is excellent info, is this the source of the train wreck song about a house I had bought for our own? |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 23 Oct 07 - 10:01 PM Mr. SCpawn you are slowly learning About
Thank you, for the links
Sincerely Gargoyle
At the decade.... "no one gave a damm" .... as the DT evolves into a legitimate academice resource....the attributions of: Source, Pub, Time, Page, URL becomes more and more important....
Without a REAL reference to primary source....someone's profession/professor/ may be left hanging in polymere.
Sincerely, |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 24 Oct 07 - 01:50 AM RE: 1282 - the government report would stand up in court....and I would wager its accuracy over a Folk Ballad issused in early 1926. As Usual....Stick to the FACTS...CS...stick to the facts as reported.
Cohen, p.243 notes it as 1282
CS Mudcat 23, Oct. 2007 8:55 pm. a friend...thinks... that the number 1262 was on an aging Atlantic type never was a Mikado numbered 1262.... your reference is sketchy....WHO, WHEN, HOW????
Department of Transportation Report Nov. 29, 1925 records:
DOT Paragraph #2
DOT Paragraph #13
DOT Paragraph # 13
Sincerely,
Consider it as "poetic liscence" let it be "leid" to rest |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 24 Oct 07 - 01:55 AM Mr. Spaw.... I cannot fathom posting the 10:01 to this thread.
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: catspaw49 Date: 24 Oct 07 - 04:48 AM I have no idea what you're talking about to begin with unless you're just agreeing with what I posted in your usual confusing style when you do anything other than a site reference or a copy/paste. Honest to gawd Garg, between your spellings and syntax in combination with your own weird self, it becomes a serious chore to figure your posts out. I take it you agree with the idea that the news folks got it wrong and it travelled to us in song with the wrong engine number thanks to their inaccuracy. The actual number as stated by the report was 1282. If that's what you meant please send me an award. Spaw |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: catspaw49 Date: 24 Oct 07 - 05:17 AM Oh yeah.......Something else these two wrecks DO have in common was the engine type. Thankfully the Chesapeake and Ohio always used a block numbering system. Engine 1256 was also a Mikado built by Alco(Richmond) in late 1924. As this wreck happened in January of 1925, this locomotive was basically brand new. Bless you Chessie for having an easily researched numbering system. There are no surviving C&O Mikados but here's a nice photo of the Chessie version for comparison. THIS ENGINE, number 2338, was built in 1925. Spaw |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: catspaw49 Date: 24 Oct 07 - 02:00 PM I seem to be hung up on this thread but its a kind of therapy right now so bear with me.....LOL. There is already an abundance of worthless and unneeded information on this thread (do you really care that the engines were both Mikados or that the Pennsy used Belpaire fireboxes?......yeah, I thought not!) but I guess there's always room for more so............... In looking for pictures I ran across an interesting tidbit of info. First, here's a small picture of the C&O 1252 wreck. It notes that Head End Brakeman Hardy Lyle was killed in the wreck but Long Steel Rail says he was the Engineer. Personally, although I know LSR is a fine work, I'll go with the Chessie Historical Society. ALSO---and even more intersting is that the Fireman of 1256, Sidney Dillard, was now Engineer Sidney Dillard in 1951 when THIS wreck occurred 12 miles away. Here is another picture of yet another Mikado, this one upside down. If Mr. Dillard survived the second wreck, I think I would have suggested retirement(;<)) I'll try to add more worthless drivel at another time. Spaw |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,Jonathan Hewlett Date: 24 Oct 07 - 02:53 PM I have heard of these 2 songs. The wreck of the 1256, and Train No.1262. Here are the lyrics. WRECK OF THE 1256 On a cold and dark, cloudy ev'nin' Just before the close of day There came Harry Lyle and Dillard And with Anderson they rode a way. From Clifton Fort they started And their spirits were runnin' high And they stopped at Iron Gate and waited 'Til Old Number 9 went by. Down the main line once more they started Down the James River cold, dark and drear And they gave no thought to the danger Or the death that was waiting so near. They were gay and they joked with each other As they sped on their way side by side And the old engine rocked as she travelled Through the night on that last fatal ride. In an instant the story was ended On here side in that cold river bed With poor Harry Lyle in the cabin With a deep, fatal wound in his head. Railroad men you should all take a warnin' From the fate that befell this young man Don't forget that the step is a short one From this earth to that sweet, promised land. TRAIN NO.1262 She'd just left the point at kittanning The freight number 1262 And on down the mountains she traveled So brave were the men in her crew. The engineer pulled at the whistle For the brakes wouldn't work when applied And the brakeman climbed out on the car top For he knew what that whistle had cried. With all of the strength that God gave him He tied in those brakes with a prayer But the train went right on down that mountain Her whistle still piercing the air. He traveled at sixty an hour Gaining speed every foot of the way And then with a crash it was over And there on the track the freight lay. It's not the amount of the damage Or the value of what the wreck cost It's the sad scene they found in the cabin Where the lives of two brave men were lost. They found them at their post in the wreckage Where they died when the engine had fell The engineer still held the whistle And the fireman still clung to the bell. Now this story is told of a freight train But it should be a warning to all We need to be prepared every moment For we can never tell when He'll call. Wreck of the 1256 I heard by Curly Fox on the CD ''Train 45,'' and the song Train No.1262 I heard on the tape, Flatt & Scruggs sing songs of Rivers and Rails. Thank You |
Subject: The Longest Train From: GUEST,Jonathan Hewlett Date: 24 Oct 07 - 05:10 PM Hi, Me again, anybody want lyrics to the song, The Longest Train, well, I listened to a record by RCA Victor called, ''The Railroad in Folksong,'' and I listened carefully and wrote down the words, and I just thought you dudes might like it. The Longest Train (Recorded by J.E. Mainer's Mountaineers.) The Longest train I every saw, was the day I left my home. The engine had left at 6 o'clock, and the driver never left town Look up, look down the lonesome road, where you, and I must go. To the pines, to the pines, where the sun never shines, Where I shiver when the cold wind blows. The prettiest little girl I ever saw, was walking down the line. Her cheeks was painted rosy red, and her hair hung down behind. Look up, look down the lonesome road, where you, and I must go. To the pines, to the pines, where the sun never shines, Where I shiver when the cold wind blows. The train, run bad 4 miles from town, and killed my girl you know. her head was found in the driver wheel, and her body I never could find. Look up, look down the lonesome road, where you, and I must go. Thank You |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,Jonathan Hewlett Date: 24 Oct 07 - 05:37 PM I know about the song Engine One-Forty-Three, and I also know it involved the C&O Railroad with engineer, George Alley. I also know that he was driving, the C&O's, FFV, ''Fast Flying Vestibule'' and had a train wreck near Hinton, West Virginia, October 23, 1890. His train crashed against the rocks, and his engine was turned upside-down and landed right into the river. He was taken to the doctor, but it was too late. He died, very quickly. That is all that I know. Thank You |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST Date: 24 Oct 07 - 10:14 PM Somewhere I read/heard this verse, I thought it was from the Vernon Dalhart version, maybe it's shown earlier in the thread but I don't think so. I believe it was before the verse that starts "It's not the extent of the damage." The engine was broken in pieces, The freight cars were thrown far and near A mile up the track lay the wreckage; 'Twas the worst wreck in many a year. |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,harpgirl Date: 24 Oct 07 - 10:28 PM Can any of you braniacs help me find information about Madison Goodson. He worked the L&N railroad from Pensacola to River Junction near Chattahootchee Florida from the turn of the 20th century. He was Ida Goodson's father and he played piano and was a deacon at Mount Olive Baptist Church in Pensacola Florida. I have looked around on the L&n site but I don't know how to best search for this information. Abby |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 24 Oct 07 - 10:48 PM Explain you interst / connection HARPY ..... and there might be reason to dig.
Gargoyle |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: catspaw49 Date: 24 Oct 07 - 11:14 PM Perhaps grave robbing or necrophilia Greg? Geeziz Garg, are you doin' a whole helluva' lot else? Hey Harpy......How's tricks? I don't belong to any of those cool genealogical type sites but I'll do whatever checking I can for ya'. Leave the Gutter Spout a note so he feels important 'cause he really can do great research as you know........You'd think after all these years he wouldn't be such a dick but he is....an not even a hard-on.....just a floppy little thing above two tiny balls dessicated from lack of use. Any additional info is helpful, ue., birth/death years and where maybe.....that sort of thing. Ever in an accident on the L&N? Shallow Running Crank Bait |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,hg Date: 25 Oct 07 - 10:11 PM Hey, SRCB, how are you? Okay....I am writing an ethnography of Ida Goodson. Ida was born near Marianna Florida and grew up in Pensacola. She lived in a neighborhood called "Hawkshaw( I think they called it that) which was nine or ten blocks north of the L&N depot in Pensacola which was on the bay. She had six sisters, all of whom played piano. Her sister Wilhelmina was married to DeDe Pierce and was known as Billie Pierce. They lived in New Orleans and toured and are well known in jazz circles. Ida played mostly in north Florida. Ida played at the many jazz clubs in Pensacola and was well respected as a musician. She once played for Bessie Smith. The Goodson's were extraordinarily talented musicians. Ida won a Folk Heritage Award in Florida in 1987. I am trying to find out more about her family. I am doing my research in the Florida State Museum Archives and Library and I am also hoping to travel to Pensacola to interview some folks who played with her. I am learning to do ethnography and have written one on Veronika Jackson and one on Elizabeth Cotten. Is that enough? gargoyle would like her piano playing. But I can't send him anything because he's so damn mysterious and all....but his Seboomook picture is cute! |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: catspaw49 Date: 26 Oct 07 - 11:42 PM Great zot Harpster! That's great work and sounds like you're doing well. Hate to be that serious with you but that's pretty neat. I'm impressed! Haven't found anything myself, but I did find a great L&N site for other stuff! Spaw |
Subject: Wreck of the 1262 Doc Watson - Station Name From: GUEST,Robert Date: 13 Aug 10 - 09:48 AM Hello! Sorry to revive an old thread, but this one coincide best with what I search for. I have read this thread with great interest, however I must ask if anyone here might know what Doc Watson say instead of "Kittanning"? The recording is found on the CD/LP On Stage from 1970, but also on Youtube - a clip from 1988. Since he must use some known station or somesuch name it could be obvious to some who might have heard this: "Shecamy" (that translates best of what he is saying or more like pronouncing. It could be "She-came-in" (as one word) but that I think unlikely. "Shecaemie" ? Hopefully some of you might know a name or place that Watson is referring to? Thanks for reading! Robert |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,Robert Date: 16 Aug 10 - 02:18 PM Anyone knows of a name pronounced that way in the US or should I create a new thread for this? I think it's better to have the question in this thread though... Since Kittanning can't be correct in this case if it wasn't another way of spelling that (very unlikely), I hope someone here can help, after all this seem to be the best place on the web for those kind of questions. |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST Date: 16 Aug 10 - 02:20 PM "I hope someone here could help" it should be. Regards, Robert |
Subject: Lyr Req: Wreck of 1262 (Doc Watson's version) From: GUEST Date: 18 Aug 10 - 05:21 AM Okay, since threads disappear so fast here, I post a specific lyrics request. This version appears only on Doc Watson On Stage (1970) or here . Clearly this text appears in Wreck of 1262 origins at the forum Except for what Doc sings instead of "Kittanning" (the station name which the train leaves, I think). This message is more of a "clarifier" if for those of us who aren't from US or Britain if Kittanning should be pronounced this way or if Doc sings something else entirely. He's been known to add different lyrics than most common versions of traditional songs, so I wouldn't be surprised if he has changed this one too... So if anyone could give some light to this subject it would be appreciated. Best Regards, Robert (By the way: My other posts to the different thread: Wreck 1262 (origins) can be deleted by an administrator to avoid confusion to readers as this is essentially the same message). |
Subject: ADD Version: Wreck of the 1262 (from Doc Watson) From: Joe Offer Date: 02 Feb 14 - 09:08 PM Refresh. Can anyone come up with any other corrections to Gene's transcription of Doc Watson's version of "Wreck of the 1262"? -Joe- This is what I hear: Here's Doc Watson's version... THE WRECK OF THE 1262 Recorded by Doc Watson/Trad. She'd just left the point at Kittanning, The engineer pulled at the whistle, With all of the strength that God gave him, She traveled at sixty an hour, It's not the amount of the damage, They found them at their post in the wreckage, Now this story is told of a freight train,
Source: DOC WATSON ON STAGE/VSD 9/10 The only things I corrected were substituting female pronouns for male when referring to the train. I agree with the poster above that the name of the town sure doesn't sound like "Kitanning." It's sounds like Doc is singing "Chicannie," or something like that, but I think he just got it wrong. All the versions of the song in Norm Cohen's Long Steel Rail say Kitanning, a town 79 miles from from Altoona, Pennsylvania. |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST,gillymor Date: 02 Feb 14 - 09:52 PM You've got it the way I've always heard it,Joe and I always thought Doc was saying Chicannie or Shikannie. On Stage is one of my favorite LP's. |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: GUEST Date: 02 Feb 14 - 11:15 PM http://www3.gendisasters.com/pennsylvania/14412/altoona-pa-freight-train-crash-nov-1925 Press report at the time. |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: Mik2 Date: 04 Feb 14 - 02:00 PM The video from 1988 I mentioned is here from Philadelphia Folk Festival part 7 Doc Watson here sings the 'station' name exactly as 18 years earlier. It starts with a 1 minute story of his friend 'Philadelphia' Jerry Ricks - the blues musician. I found the nickname 'Philadelphia' on Wirz discography page and elsewhere. |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: Mik2 Date: 08 Feb 14 - 09:40 AM Thanks, Guest@ for the info link. Gillymore and Joe , thanks for the help! |
Subject: Wreck of the 1262 - Flatt & Scruggs (1967) From: Mik2 Date: 09 Mar 14 - 11:47 AM I just located another version of Wreck of 1262 that uses another ''Point" or location: It is on the Flatt & Scruggs album "Hear the Whistle Blow" (1967) Lester Flatt pronounces it ' Chiekanu or Shecamou ' . |
Subject: RE: Origins: Wreck of the 1262/1256 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 30 Oct 17 - 10:21 AM Shame about the spam which has brought this thread back to the top. But a great thread to re-read. I'll raise a glass to Spaw tonight. |
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