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Subject: RE: Tune Req: The Galway Shawl From: GUEST,noel Date: 11 Nov 11 - 01:43 PM hi all .does any one know how to play the do ra me notes for this song would be gratefull as im a begainer thank you |
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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: MartinRyan Date: 06 Apr 11 - 08:48 AM "Boulavouge" is quite recent. It was written around the time of the centenary of the 1798 rebellion - and was originally sung to a different air. As far as I recall, someone sang it to the current air at a Feis Ceoil (Irish music festival/competition) in the early 20C. - and the rest is history, so to speak! Throughout the 19C. the air was known as "Youghal Harbour" and was adapted to many songs e.g. Sweet Omagh Town. Regards p.s. For all that, Galway Shawl always sounds closer to The Ould Triangle than to Boulavogue to me. |
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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Jack Campin Date: 06 Apr 11 - 08:33 AM I don't see any mention on this thread yet of "Boulavogue", which also uses the same tune. I always assumed "Boulavogue" was much older, but I don't actually know. |
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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray Date: 05 Apr 11 - 03:58 PM Galway what there? Never heard of it! |
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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: ossonflags Date: 05 Apr 11 - 03:50 PM Has any one got the chords to this song? |
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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST Date: 05 Apr 11 - 11:45 AM If any one know who to get hold of a pattern to make a Galway shawl, could you please email me at klimorr@shaw.ca Thank you Carolyn |
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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Peterr Date: 26 Aug 04 - 12:38 PM Sang it last night, and was asked if I knew who had written it, or was it Trad Anon. Can anyone help? |
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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Martin Ryan Date: 26 Apr 04 - 10:16 AM June Better start a separate thread for that one... Regards |
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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST Date: 26 Apr 04 - 04:39 AM Please can someone supply the words/ full poem "Rodney's Glory? Thanks June McCarthy |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 10 Nov 03 - 11:30 AM Banned by whom? All sorts of songs are rumoured to have been banned by someone or other at some time and place or other, but it's very rare that anyone ever produces any evidence; and I'll be astonished if any appears here. Still, you never know. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,John Prange Date: 10 Nov 03 - 09:55 AM It is my understanding the song was banned because Patrick (Paddy ) Moran of Co. Roscommon sung it on the way to his hanging in 1916 or 1917. He was buried in Killmanhamn Gaol yard and dug up last year and given a State Funeral. ANy information would be appreciated. JAP drprange@cox.net |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Keith A o Hertford Date: 03 Oct 02 - 08:03 AM In another thread I asked about the 'shoes and stockings' version but got no rssponse. I wondered if I had just picked up a one off. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 02 Oct 02 - 03:56 PM Thanks, George. I just harvested that one. Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,NSc George Henderson Date: 02 Oct 02 - 03:41 PM Joe perhaps you will sort this out. i doubled up on page breaks. Didn't realise the automatic was there. George |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Nsc George Henderson Date: 02 Oct 02 - 03:39 PM |
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE GALWAY SHAWL From: GUEST,NSC George Henderson Date: 02 Oct 02 - 03:38 PM I got this most beautiful version of the Galway Shawl from the late and great Fred Jordan. How a Shropshire farmer came to have this beauty in his repertoire I do not know. Note the subtle differences in the chorus: 1st chorus "no shoes nor stockings on her feet at all." 2nd chorus "no paint nor powder on her face at all" 3rd chorus "no paint nor powder, yarra none at all." And Brendan Behan borrowed the air for his great song the ould triangle and why not. It is beautiful. In Oranmore in the County Galway, One pleasant evening in the month of May, I spied a colleen; she was fair and handsome, Her beauty stole my heart away, She wore no jewels, no costly diamonds No shoes nor stockings on her feet at all, But she wore a bonnet with a ribbon on it, And round her shoulders hung the Galway shawl. We kept on walking; she kept on talking, 'Til her fathers cottage it came into view, She said, "Kind sir, won't you bide a minute, And play for me the Foggy Dew." She set me down all by the hearthstone, I met her father, who was six feet tall, And soon her mother had the kettle by me, And all I could think of was the Galway shawl. She wore no jewels, no costly diamonds, No paint nor powder on her face at all, But she wore a bonnet with a ribbon on it, And round her shoulders hung the Galway shawl. I played the Blackbird, and the Stack of Barley, Rodney's Glory and the Foggy Dew, And she sang each note like an Irish linnet, 'Til tears fell from her eyes of woe. It was early, early, the very next morning, I took the road for sweet Donegal, She climbed the gate and kissed me dearly, And wished me God speed in that Galway shawl. She wore no jewels, no costly diamonds, No paint nor powder, yarra none at all, But she wore a bonnet with a ribbon on it, And round her shoulders hung the Galway shawl. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 02 Oct 02 - 11:49 AM aughhh! But I need to remember to hit that Preview button! That should be Makes things easier. Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 02 Oct 02 - 11:45 AM It was Joe's version which reminded me of what a great song this is. Here is a midi for RODNEY'S GLORY which I was playing this morning: JC'S TUNEFINDER Wow, this link creator sure makes thins easier! Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,folkiedave Date: 02 Oct 02 - 10:35 AM Just one short comment to an earlier query in this thread about Napoleon and "The Green Linnet". Joe Heaney who sang also Galway Shawl used to introduce "Green Linnet" by saying that the Irish had so many songs about Napoleon because they were looking for - and saw Napoleon- as a liberator. And then with a great flourish he said - "And they still are looking for a liberator. (This was in the 1960's of course. Dave |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: belfast Date: 02 Oct 02 - 10:22 AM I have sat at a bar listening to Maggie Barry singing "The Galway Shawl" and in another pub I have heard Luke Kelly belting out "The Oul' Triangle". I have heard these songs about a thousand times each. I've even been known to sing them. Not once did it occur to me that they have the same tune. I gather from the reactions of Brían above that I am not the only one. You live and, sometimes, you learn. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 02 Oct 02 - 06:58 AM *BOING* What a revelation Gurney! It's the same melody. It's also the same one for MULDOON THE SOLID MAN. Brían (Really digging these automatic line breaks) |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Gurney Date: 02 Oct 02 - 04:53 AM One of my favourite singers, Sean Cannon, from Galway, I believe, sang/sings 'The Galway Shawl' to the tune usually used for "The Old Triangle.' I've heard other tunes used too, but they didn't register with me. Wassail. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST Date: 01 Oct 02 - 02:34 PM Aaaah yes!! belfast, was that the version that included the infamous lines?- And all she wore was a Galway shawl... |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: belfast Date: 01 Oct 02 - 12:52 PM Once I was tempted to write a song which began "There's red sails in the sunset Fortunately my friends convinced me not to perservere. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Brían Date: 30 Sep 02 - 08:52 PM Thanks, GUEST. I meant to say that THE BLACKBIRD hornpipe was composed by a Mrs Galvin a fiddler of Co. Clare(My error, not my friend who, apparently has the mind like a steel trap which I have not). I am merely adding some information about references in the song THE GALWAY SHAWL that other people might find interesting. Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST Date: 30 Sep 02 - 04:35 PM Some notes on Eoghan Ruadh Ó Súilleabháin (Eoghan an Bheoil Bhínn) 1748-84
Known in English as Owen Roe O'Sullivan, or Owen of the Sweet Mouth, he was once one of the most popular and widely known of Irish poets for his eloquence, and for his rakish life.Stories about him were once widespread throughout Munster; celebrating his womanising, his drinking exploits, and his quick-wittedness. It was said of him that he had so many sons by different women "that if he threw a copper over a fence it would, like as not, fall on the head of one of his own [children]."
A Father Dineen collected his poetry from various sources, including oral tradition. But none of his poems/songs appear to be still sung, as the very eloquence which once preserved them in the menory of the people is now thought to be too grandiose, and too full of obscure references to mythology and history. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Brían Date: 30 Sep 02 - 03:28 PM I was talking to my friend Tom the piper who is a well-known fixture in Portland ME about RODNEY'S GLORY and THE BLACKBIRD. It was he who toldme that O'Sullivan wrote the poem RODNEY'S GLORY as an attempt to get an early release from the British navy and he was absoluelt right. He also says that THE BLACKBIRD set dance tune was composed by a Mrs. McGarvey of Co. Clare to the tune of the song of the same name. It was in the repetoire of Willie Clancy. The poem RODNEY'S GLORY fits to the tune of the same name Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Sorcha Date: 29 Sep 02 - 11:19 PM I miss Annroi too, Brian......... |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Brían Date: 29 Sep 02 - 11:12 PM O'Sullivan appears to be saying,"We will try another game on you". Brían(Wishing Annraoi were here to correct his Gaeilge) |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Brían Date: 29 Sep 02 - 11:05 PM Here is some of the poem RODNEY'S GLORY: Patrick Walsh, MA Diss., UUC 1993, p.72]; cites Rodney's Glory, 'Now may prosperity attend/Brave Rodbey and his Irishmen/And may he never want a friend/While he shall reign commander;/Success to our Irish officers,/Seamen bold and jolly tars/Who like darling sons of Mars/Take delight in the fight/And vindicate bold Erin's right/And die for Erin's glory.' The poet was brought to him and Rodney offered him promotion. However the Irishman requested only to be set free from service. An Irish officer, a Kerryman named McCarthy, answered for the admiral – "Anything but that". Disgusted, the poet turned away and muttered under his breath, "Imireaochaimid beart eigin eile oraibh." McCarthy replied, "I'll take care, Sullivan, you will not." [&c.] (Daniel Corkery, in The Hidden Ireland, 1957 edn., pp.199.) From THIS SITE Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 25 Mar 02 - 06:56 AM Thanks, Malcolm. Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Moleskin Joe Date: 24 Mar 02 - 09:49 AM Thanks for the info Malcolm. That is interesting. Does anyone know who Colonel Rodney was, or Colonel McBain for that matter? |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 24 Mar 02 - 09:34 AM There seems little doubt that Admiral Rodney is the man in question. The following is quoted from Andrew Kuntz's The Fiddler's Companion, which also gives much more background; a direct link is unfeasible as the search engine there returns no results for Rodney's Glory, so one must instead search for Rodney:
"The title "Rodney's Glory," explains O'Sullivan (1983), was derived from verses set to the tune by the poet Eoghain Rua Ó Súilleabháin in 1782, commemorating a naval battle fought that year in which George Rodney (d. 1792), then vice-admiral of Great Britain, encountered the French fleet under Admiral Comte De Grasse... Ó Súilleabháin served on The Formidable, a ship which saw some of the severest fighting and thus "Rodney's Glory" is a first-hand account." |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Moleskin Joe Date: 24 Mar 02 - 09:11 AM It is not necessarily the case that Rodney's Glory refers to the English admiral. It is just as likely to refer to the same soldier who is commemorated in Colonel Rodney, whoever he might have been. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Moleskin Joe Date: 24 Mar 02 - 09:06 AM |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 24 Mar 02 - 05:51 AM Singing a dance tune is usually called lilting or diddling, although I never come to tears singing a dance tune, except, maybe THE BLACK ROGUE, and then only tears of laughter. I got some information from a recording of Cathal McConnell and Len Graham For the Sake of Old Decency: THE BLACKBIRD is a dance tune which can be played as a set dance(which I will talk about later), a slow air, a hornpipe and a reel. There's also a song to it. This is more or less verbatim what Len Graham says about the song THE BLACKBIRD before he sings it: "THE BLACKBIRD doesn't really refer to a feathered species, but it's more to a political, I should say character from history and I'm sure you've all heard of Bonny Prince Charlie. Well, the father of Bonny Prince Charlie who was known as the Young Pretender was known as the Old Pretender, so the Blackbird was an allegory for the Old Pretender and this cause was, of course a very popular cause in Scotland and in Ireland. This is an Irish song..." I won't include the words to this lovely song here, but the melody is the same as the hornpipe and the slow air that Cathal plays. THE BLACKBIRD and RODNEY'S GLORY are both set dances. I don't have any information about RODNEY'S GLORY, but I am glad to look it up, though it may take some time. I got the following information from Breandán Breathnach's Folk Music and Dances of Ireland: "Set or long dances are solo dances, usually with a jig or hornpipe rhythm. They deviate generally from the usual form of the dance tune in having one part, ususally the second, longer than the others, and sometimes the parts maybe in different times. Each tune has its own particular dance which, following the usual Irish custom, has the same title. ..they required an expert to perform them properly, and this skill was exibited much better on the kitchen table than it would have been on the clay floor of the house. Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: greg stephens Date: 23 Mar 02 - 09:21 PM OOOOOOH! So if we are looking for deeeep poitical significance, how come the reference to Rodney's Glory. An English navy admiral, wasn't he? Sounds a bit crypto-Unionist to me. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Noreen Date: 23 Mar 02 - 09:08 PM Evidence seems to point to this song being older... What evidence, Brían? Sorry, but the only relevant bit seems to be your Irish language teacher saying ...that the GALWAY SHAWL are new words sung to an older melody... I've got no axe to grind here, and would like to know more about the song's history, too, but don't see anything new here. For what it's worth, I'd always taken the titles in the song to refer to tunes rather than songs, and the words she sang each note... to mean that she sang along with the tunes, rather than sang them as songs. Noreen |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 23 Mar 02 - 12:23 PM I spoke with several people last night about this song. My friend Mike grew up near Athenry, not far from Oranmore. He says he recalls the song being very popular at dances or gatherings as far back as he can remember. He says he heard it first as a song in the late 1930's or early '40's, although his father played it as a tune on the violin and supposed it was at least 100 years old. He said the tunes mentioned were dance tunes, not songs. He never thought of it having any political significance. I then spoke with my Irish Language teacher whose family is from Carna. She laughed at the suggestion that there was no political references in the song. She said that the melody that the GALWAY SHAWL are new words sung to an older melody and not to try to date it by the fact Mike's dad played it 100 years ago. I then spoke to Máirín, Mary's mother, who was well acquainted with the song and she sang it right off. I asked her what she thought about the tunes. She said that THE BLACKBIRD, THE STACK OF BARLEY and RODNEY'S GLORY are dance tunes. She said that she thought THO FOGGY DEW was a song. She couldn't remeber the words right off, but the melody was THE STAR OF THE COUNTY DOWN, otherwise known as KINGSFOLD(which has been used for probably 100's of songs). Máirín gave a couple of interesting variations: I met a cailín who was tall and handsome instead of I met a cailín she was young and handsome ...And play to please him a tune or two for And play to please him The Foggy Dew ...And Éireann's tears in her eyes of blue(Something similar to what Mickey's dad sang) instead of The tears they filled her eyes of blue. I asked Máiín and Mary what exactly a Galway Shawl was, since I couldn't find anything but stuff being pushed at tourists regarding this. They said that there were 4 types of shawls worn in Galway. Three of them were black, white and grey. Máirín says there were candles(?) on them, or a cable like pattern and they were very heavy. One would never wer them indoors. They said they would bing a picture to me. I'd love to post it on Mudcat, but I don't know that kind of html. Max would probably disapprove as it would slow down most people's computers. I'm taking time to do this, not in any attempt to prove I'm right. Evidence seems to point to this song being older than the common As down the glen one Easter morn to a city fair rode I... I originally thought. I just would like to know more about this song, how old it is its author if possible. Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 22 Mar 02 - 07:45 AM A good song has first of all, a good melody, then interesting words, then a meaning. If there was no meaning to the song other than it being a nice story why sing it at all? I believe the author or person(s) handing this song down made the song ambiguous deliberately, not with any seditious intent, but to make the song more complex, which it is. Like any really good song, the listener is free to enjoy it at one level, or look into deeper or alternative readings as they wish. For instance, THE STACK OF BARLEY is a beautiful tune to play , listen to or dance to. It could be heard at any céilidh or hooley at the time the song was written, as it is now. However, a friend pointed out to me that when dancing the STACK OF BARLEY, the couples dancing around the house with their alternating hop-step look like a stack of barley as well. One doesn't need to know that to enjoy dancing it, but it does make it more interesting. I would venture to say that every detail in the song is significant right down to hitting the road to Donegal, which is about as far as you can get from Oranmore and still be in Ireland. I have some friends that I think I will see tonight who are from Galway. I'll see if they can shed some light on this. I've been looking on the internet for any information on this song. It seems to be listed as Traditional or Anonymous, which means nothing. One site insisted that THE FOGGY DEW was the fiddle tune and had nothing to do with any song by the same name. In spite of the lyrics being fairly consistent, no one has ventured to date the song or name its author. Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Alice Date: 21 Mar 02 - 11:07 PM "I've never saw...?" Ooops, I meant - I never saw. Too tired to type. Good night everyone. Alice |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Alice Date: 21 Mar 02 - 09:54 PM I agree, Noreen. It's a touching song about love and life, music just being a part of it, family and home another - "and soon her mother had the kettle singin', but all I could think of was that Galway shawl". I've never saw a political connection in it. Alice |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Noreen Date: 21 Mar 02 - 08:48 PM I think there are probably many more songs in the Irish tradition (and in others) which are apolitical- dealing with the human condition- than are Political, having reference to tyranny or rebellion. The list of tunes in the Galway Shawl I have always taken to be just that- a collection of tunes which would have been played on such an occasion. Noreen |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 21 Mar 02 - 07:39 PM Point well taken Noreen. I sing the song because it is a beautiful song, not because it is political. I made the last post in a flurry of contractors and electricians running around my house, working and hollering. I am not aiming to make this a political discussion, rather a discussion about the origin of the song, THE GALWAY SHAWL, of which there is not a lot of information about. The references to the songs/tunes seem very ambiguous and may have been made that way deliberately. They might, however lead to clues about the song. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Mickey191 Date: 21 Mar 02 - 07:13 PM That's always been my take on it Noreen. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Noreen Date: 21 Mar 02 - 05:10 PM Brían, I guess that the references are political. Why? Because it's Irish? I've always thought it meant she sang beautifully, like a songbird. Why does there need to be more to it than that? Noreen |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Alice Date: 21 Mar 02 - 03:20 PM The Foggy Dew mp3 file I linked to (a wan cloud...) is a melody that is used as an instrumental tune. I've seen it in session tune books, and the source I found for lyrics is an old song book from 1931. Click here for a scan of the music. Home and Community song book, Foggy Dew Page. Alice |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Brían Date: 21 Mar 02 - 01:44 PM Well, even more questions being raised. The reel, THE FOGGY DEW is a fine tune indeed, but I wonder why she sang each note like an Irish Linnet? I know there is also a very political song known as THE BLACKBIRD, which is a Jacobite song. I guess that the references are poolitical. Brían |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: GUEST,Martin Ryan Date: 21 Mar 02 - 05:20 AM Mr. Red Napoleon appears in a few songs as "The Green linnet". Can't remember why. No republican significance that I know of. Regards p.s. Of course, linnets aren't green.... the name is an old one for greenfinch, I think. |
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Subject: RE: Anybody know 'Galway Shawl'? From: Mickey191 Date: 21 Mar 02 - 02:42 AM My Dad used to sing Galway Shawl with this verse: I played the blackbird, the stack of barley, the old black rogue and the foggy dew. She sang each note like an Irish linnet, with the smile of Erin in her eyes of blue About 5 years ago I heard these same words sung to a totally different tune. Actually, it was a nicer melody. |
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