BS: A sinking ship?

Subject: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,Chief Chaos
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 07:44 PM

Is it just me or are the rats (not that I'd call Colin Powell a rat but you get the gist)abandoning ship here? That's what, five moderate republicans who have in some way dissapointed the Prez leaving?

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Blissfully Ignorant
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 07:46 PM

The man is a rat. One of those shifty, evil looking rats. A plague rat....

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Rapparee
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 07:47 PM

Yes, and there are now six.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 07:57 PM

Don't be so rude about rats. I mean, compared with some people, they are charming creatures.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Rapparee
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 07:58 PM

I think that the moderates who are leaving will be replaced by ideologues.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Blissfully Ignorant
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 07:59 PM

I stand corrected. The man is a pus-filled, greasy boil on the a**echeek of humanity.:0)

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,Chief Chaos
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:09 PM

BI

Are you refering to Powell?

What's he done to get you so excited?

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: curmudgeon
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:11 PM

Powell is retiring because of his aching feet. He's been standing at te back of the bus for the better part of four years!

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Blissfully Ignorant
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:13 PM

I'm referring to Powell specifically, and politicians in general. The problem with politicians is that they, by default, desire power...i just can't get my head round the concept.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:13 PM

Powell is the only one I wish was staying. The rest aren't worth the powder to . . . , well, you know.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: freda underhill
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:18 PM

Powell is a decent guy who tried to talk George W out of invading Iraq, prior to the event. After that, he did his job. now he's getting out.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: freda underhill
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:23 PM

Colin Powell, the lone dove, quits

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Blissfully Ignorant
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:27 PM

From what i could see he was only a dove relative to the rabid warmongers around him.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:59 PM

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: freda underhill
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:01 PM

Colin Powell resigns as US Secretary of State

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: freda underhill
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:04 PM

CIA spies quit amid reforms

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Alba
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:07 PM

this just popped up on MSN homepage:
WASHINGTON - A senior administration official says President Bush has asked national security adviser Condoleezza Rice to replace Colin Powell as secretary of state. Stephen Hadley, deputy national security adviser, would become Bush's new national security adviser, the official said.
no comment says me.
Jude

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:07 PM

The above post could be the most intelligent thing I've said all day. I will rectify that.

IMO, Powell was a good soldier who valued his me. He knew the realities of combat because he's been there and done that.

"Defense Distinguished Service Medal, the Purple Heart and the Legion of Merit. As a civilian Colin Powell has received two Presidential Medals of Freedom, the President's Citizens Medal and the Congressional Gold Medal. He is also the recipient of honors from many foreign countries including Canada, France, Germany, Senegal, Greece, and Jamaica. As well, he received an honorary Knight Commander of the Bath conferred by H.M. Queen Elizabeth II."

He was a soldier, and thinking of him as a dove is somewhat 'over the top'. But, in a roomful of idiots he tried for moderation and a UN-supported Iraq invasion. Likely, had he been heeded, the disaster that is today the Iraq War would have a very different ending. Let me rephrase that: It would have ended by now. It would not be the CF it is.

I think Powell had and has respect for the guys and gals at the sharp end, and they are real people to him. They are just numbers to what's left in the White House now.

Bruce M

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:09 PM

The opening remark in the above post was in reference to a BLANK post I had done by accident. The clones are sharp today. Sorry Alba.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:10 PM

And I forgot the n in men. I give up. See y'all tomorrow. lol

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Rapparee
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:14 PM

I have respect for Colin Powell. As for the others, well....

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:16 PM

My understanding is that, when a president is re-elected, all the cabinet secretaries submit letters of resignation and the president decides which ones to accept. In other words, it's firing with the edge taken off. So, it's not really that the moderates are abandoning ship as much as that the captain is throwing them overboard.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:50 PM

Starting the second term with many new people is not at all unusual. Including a different vice president. Haven't actually checked but if I recall correctly FDR had three different VPs.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Shanghaiceltic
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 11:17 PM

Would not normally comment on a US issue like this but as it has been said Colin Powell has experience of both the sharp end and the political end, he is one who has had experience of politicians starting a war and leaving it for the armed forces to finish it.

As for rats, well most politicians would do things rats wouldn't, so maybe the medical research people should start using them for experimentation.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: mack/misophist
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 12:03 AM

The Colin Powell matter must have been discussed somewhere last week because Friday, my cousin mentioned that he expected Rice to replace him. By now, she might even be qualified. She's certainly not stupid.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 12:04 AM

How could anyone consider John Ashcroft a moderate?

I'm sure Condi will do a bang up job at State, just like she did at NSA.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Amos
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 12:10 AM

Right!! As the NSA she ignored explicit warnings about terrorist activity resulting in attacks, and accepted and acted on false information concerning the munitions available to Saddam, pushed the nightmare of nuclear devastation on American soil without justification, and helped hurry the nation into a gruesome and murderous war.

Bang up job.

Maybe NOW she'll find herself, and her real talent will be diplomacy!

A

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: dianavan
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 01:03 AM

Is the new CIA boss former Republican governor, Goss?

My, my, what a big surprise!

d

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 02:26 AM

The ship isn't sinkin' ---it's stinkin'.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Greg F.
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 08:16 AM

By now, she might even be qualified. She's certainly not stupid.

And, more importantly, she lies like a champ.

As far as Powell goes, he once had my respect, until he started playing Step'n Fetchit to President Bush's Cheney's lead.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: ToulouseCruise
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 10:54 AM

I personally respect Powell for what I know about him... especially for resigning since his views of wanting diplomacy as opposed to the iron fist approach of Bush. Mind you, he should have resigned BEFORE the election.

Brian

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 11:23 AM

Maybe a sinking ship but one that in the process is turning into a neuclear submarine...

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: grumpy al
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 02:30 PM

did they jump or were they pushed? ask the neo conservatives if you think you can get an honest answer

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: DougR
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 03:04 PM

Hilarous! It's great fun to see so many of you still licking your wounds over the election. There was a 527 group that poured millions of dollars into the campaign to defeat Bush. Why don't you folks do what the title of the group was? Move on.org.

It is NOT unusual for there to be changes in the Cabinet in any new administration.

Still it is amusing to read your posts. Rave on I say!

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Once Famous
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 03:23 PM

Ebbie is completely right.

It is customary for cabinet members to offer their resignation before a second term and it is not at all unusual for cabinet members to be somewhat shaken up for a second term.

All of the usual piss and anger comes out of the usual left wing nuts here when they see a chance to just go on with their usual rant.

Try supporting American government for a change.

Give the new people who are being chosen a chance you yourself would want.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 06:42 PM

Condi Rice ain't "new people".

We know too well what she has (and worse, has NOT) done.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Bill D
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 07:43 PM

and time will show that most of these resignations are a bit more than just 'change' or 'tired managers'....they are a bit similar to rats leaving. In this case, not wanting to be associated with the legacy of the next 4 years. No, I can't prove that...but I'll bet ya' 47¢. (if my social security holds out)

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,Chief Chaos
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 12:21 PM

Doug and Martin,

This ain't about the election. The democrats lost, big whoop!
I know that Colin Powell has been expected to retire. It's just that aside from Ashcroft the people who have left have been the advisers that disagreed with the Pres. They have almost all been replaced with what I would simply call Yes Men.

Now the Pres. himself said that he wasn't necessarily the smartest man and so he was surrounding himself with cabinet members who were. Unfortuantely recent retirements taken with previous retiremnets seem to show that the administration only wants to hear from experts who agree with their position.

This is akin to scientists throwing out valid experiments until they finally have results that support their foregone conclusion.

Cars have breaks, skydivers have parachutes, ships have anchors.
This administration has very few people left who can influence the direction of this country from the course set by the Pres. Regardless of who is in charge, I'd rather not have a rubber stamp cabinet.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Ebbie
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 12:36 PM

"Did you notice? The White House has new security fences around it and guards are posted there 24 hours a day now. Not to keep terrorists out but to keep the government in." Jay Leno

"President Bush is getting worried. He called a Cabinet meeting and only two people showed up. Him and Cheney." Jay Leno

"Even though Colin Powell has resigned, he'll stay around to help with the transition. So now he's kind of a "semi-colon". Jay Leno

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Peace
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 03:35 PM

"It's great fun to see so many of you still licking your wounds over the election."

Fer keriste's sake, Doug! Your country is in two pieces--even more so than it was during the Vietnam War--and you gloat? Hell's tha matter with you? Your whole country is ailing, and you get off taking shots at your own people? Sheesh.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Cluin
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 03:46 PM

Colin Powell was the last person in that administration I had an ounce of respect for.

Frankly, I'm surprised he stuck it out as long as he did. I suppose he was dedicated to effecting some sort of decent changes in the way they did things. The fact he's throwing in the towel is pretty telling IMO; he must have a good idea of what's coming up in the future from Jorge and his Loco Caballeros and wants some distance.

Clench yer butt muscles folks! They ain't even gonna buy ya dinner first.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Peace
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 03:58 PM

But they will whisper sweet nothings in yer ear.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Cluin
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 04:11 PM

Yagotdatright.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Bill D
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 04:46 PM

I got a friend who's WAY high up at the EPA, and he makes the point that "while you are on the payroll, you MUST keep your lip zipped and not bad mouth the boss openly, because if YOUR group gets back in, you want to have a reputation for integrity".....

Powell plays the game that way. We shall see what he might have to say in a few months.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 02:01 AM

But for that daft "WMD" speech at the UN., Colin Powell could have been a shoo-in for the republicans at the next election.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Paco Rabanne
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 10:54 AM

Hang on chaps, Have any of you thought that He is retiring because he is OLD? In England the retirement age is 65 years.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,Chief Chaos
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 11:58 AM

Being active military myself I can tell you that the time put in by anyone in military service, aside from the possibility of getting yourself killed, is very draining. Whatever his reasons I wish Mr. Powell the best and hope his retiremnt is long (which isn't always the case for former military) and enjoyable.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 12:42 PM

well, we know that John Ashcroft wanted to retire to spend more time
with his family.

Apparently he still hasnt finished rounding up
and questioning them.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: GUEST,Larry K
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 03:40 PM

In the last 40 years the only Sec of State that has stayed two terms was Dean Rusk.    And he gave presided over Viet Nam.   Not exactly a medal of honor.

I am apalled to see the democratic racists come out in force against Condalisa Rice.   Not surprized, but apalled.    The cartoons using black derogatory slang were racist and mean spirited.    I would think that Mudcatters would also be apalled over the racist derogatory slang used in the cartoons.

My guess is that Mudcat ideology will triump over common sense.   

PS:   If a republican had drawn the same cartoons about Bettie Currie, or Sheila Jackson Lee, or the black woman who ran Gore's campaing it would be front page news and they would be calling for resignations.   Just ask Trent Lott.

Subject: RE: BS: A sinking ship?
From: Peace
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 03:42 PM

The dislike of Rice has to do with politics, not colour. You have made one helluva leap in logic there, Larry.