BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....

Subject: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Bobert
Date: 11 Mar 05 - 08:41 PM

So, being told by one of my friends that my pudder was shot, I went down to Best Buy and looked at their pudders... So I see's one that after rebates would only cost $299.00, and that supposedly came with a monitor and a printer... Hmmmmmm? Sounds cheap enough... Right? So I put over $800 worth of pudder/monitor and printer on the credit card thinking, well, okay, I'd be gettin' laike $500 of it back. Right?.....

..... No, well, not right....

This morning, being the last day to mail off my rebates, I finally cut up the boxes fir them code things and did this and did that, you know like them rebate folks have ya do, and mailed 'um off to Rebateburg where within 8 weeks 6 sepearte checks would be send back to me totaling $500. Right?.....

Well, not so fast. TRonight I looked at the copies that I made of the rebates and added them up and they came out to be $310.... Hmmmmmm?

In the words of Richard Hatch, "I've been bamboozled!"...

Like what's this all about?

Well, I have a theory about rebates. I think that when you get an MBA these days that you prolly took a course entiled "Marketing 401, How to rip off the public with rebates"... Yeah, I'm sure of it, matter of fact...

Anyone else have any particular "rebate nightmares" they would like to relate?

'Er just general comments on dishonesty and marketing?

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 11 Mar 05 - 08:50 PM

I have a whole bunch of those things to fill out, and have boxes galore around here until I find all of the bits to cut off and mail in. Thanks for the reminder.

Rebates are a gamble on the part of retailers. They're hoping we'll do the math quickly in the store, but do the paperwork slowly. Or not read the fine print ("for previous owners, a rebate on an upgrade).

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: CarolC
Date: 11 Mar 05 - 09:08 PM

We got ripped off by a rebate a couple of years ago. It was a local phone company and their DSL internet service. We told them that we were probably going to be moving within the next six months and we didn't want to commit to a whole year's worth of the service, and also to have to buy a modem if we weren't going to be able to continue to use it. They said we could send the modem back when we were done with it and get back the cost of the modem. Then they sent us a couple of rebates that in the fine print said (where you couldn't really see it) that if we cash in the rebates, we won't be able to return the modem. Modem cost a lot more than the amount of the combined rebates. Having totally missed that part of the fine print, we cashed in the rebate.

We tried to reason with them about it, but no dice. When we (after a somewhat prolonged attempt to get it straightened out) sent in the final payment to that phone company, in the little line for memos, I wrote, "extortion payment".

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: MAG
Date: 11 Mar 05 - 10:22 PM

Yah, I've been arguing with Sprint for over four months now about the rebate on a new phone I bought. Fortunately I have the email verification that they received my claim -- on November 20.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 11 Mar 05 - 10:42 PM

Although the most complete data I've seen is about a year old now, the "marketing news sites" were discussing the rebate scams in some detail a while back. Reports by market survey orgs at the time were that less than 10% of rebates (by dollar amount) were ever paid. Of course, the "big ticket" rebates more often do go through, but the little ones add up quite quickly, and are extremely profitable since they do, apparently, influence people to buy.

Marketing schools do teach the premise that "consumers are all idiots."

Rebate offers work because "consumers are all idiots."

Unfortunately, marketing methods only deal with the "herd," so those who actually realize how much of a scam they are have little choice but to pay attention, and attempt to minimize the loss - by applying for the rebates when they're worth it.

And as CarolC notes, fine print is the rebaters' friend. The last few rebates I've had to sort through averaged more than three hundred words of text in the "terms and conditions" one must follow to qualify for the "refund of extortion." In one case, I couldn't read it with 6x magnification, and had to resort to scanning the package so I could blow it up enough to see that "the purchase price must be circled in ink on the original sales receipt" in order to have the application processed. (in paragraph 4 of 11 in "terms of rebate offer.")

CompUSA, unfortunately about the only bit shop in my town, is notorious for showing only the "after rebate price" on items that require purchase of some other item to qualify for the rebate. The terms often are not shown on the outside of the package, so after you buy it and get to the rebate offer inside, you learn that you have to buy another $50 item to qualify for the $30 rebate. (Both Norton and McAfee have done this recently.)

John

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: DougR
Date: 11 Mar 05 - 10:48 PM

Bobert, I'm relatively sure you are past the age of 16, and you don't know there is no such thing as a free lunch? You liberals. :>)

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Bobert
Date: 11 Mar 05 - 10:57 PM

No, but there are marketers who have been taught the pea-under-the- shell game very well....

Like why can't folks just market their products without lieing? Best Buy had a big ol' sign up sayin' that I was gonna get $500 back in rebates and then they give me $310. That is like stealing to me. It is theft....

Like why is it that the folks who you seem to support are the creeps who get away with this stuff? Amd why is it that folks like me keep getting screwed by liars...

Makes me sick to get screwed out of $190.

Might of fact, I wouldn't mind if the *governemnt* made rebates illegal since with thew fine print they ain't worth nuthin'...

Jus' another of Boss Hog's scams as far as I can see...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: hesperis
Date: 11 Mar 05 - 11:16 PM

Rebates usually rely on people not following through on the rebate offer... but it's another thing entirely to say that the rebate is for $500 and then have it be less. That sucks, Bobert... probably in the fine print somewhere it says that you have to pay for the printer or monitor as well as the $299 for the computer in order to receive the rebate. :(

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Bobert
Date: 11 Mar 05 - 11:53 PM

Ahhhhh, heck with 'um. hes...

I won'r buy nuthin' else that has a rebate...

Tired of being screwed.... 'an don't have the bucks to hire a lawyer to take on these corporate crooks...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: open mike
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 02:14 AM

i sent iin the rebate on my new puter
and it was returned...after the deadline.
i bought the puter during the time of
rebate, but postmark did not fit in..
it has a big save $150.00 on it!!

i saved a bunch of pull tabs from drinks
to send in for breast cancer research..
they came back post office box closed.

Why don't things just cost a good rate
instead of having to jump thru all these hoops?

at some stores..mostly safeway..you can get a
card to get you member prices...or enter your
'phone number in the key pad if you do not have your card.
i often get 1 or 2 dollars back...but seems like
a bunch of hassle...and extra stuff just to have that happen.

I would rather have a good price to begin with..and let it go at that.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 04:00 AM

open mike -

When my local grocery chain started their "card discounts" I happened to have the receipts for my last two trips "BC" (before card). A complete check of all the items on the receipts (Total about $700.00) showed that they had INCREASED their "without card" prices by an average of 40%, then gave an average 28% "discount" if you had the card.

More recent spot checks indicate that with their card their prices average a little more than 15% higher that at competing non-card stores, yet they will smile cheerfully and tell you how much you "saved" because they lie and tell you that they "could have charged you more if you didn't have the card."

And a whole lot of people believe them.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: gnu
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 05:45 AM

Besides all the fine print and such, I get the saleman to write the main points on the bill of sale, preferably, or separately and refer to the number of the bill of sale. When I send in the rebate paperwork, immediately after I get everything running and checked out, I make copies of everything and send them by registered mail.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 05:49 AM

Dishonesty AND marketing, Bobert?

Same thing, surely.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: kendall
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 07:02 AM

It's the American way!
Consumer protection is not a priority in Washington these days. Never has been under republican administrations.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: gnu
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 07:25 AM

Caveat emptor.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: artbrooks
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 08:36 AM

I just got $135 in rebates from Dell and Intuit. I was expecting $135. I really can't recall being shafted by a rebate offer...maybe I don't buy enough?

I/we grocery shop at any of four stores, three chains and one local place, depending upon the prices in their ads - and will travel from one to another to get the deals. 'Course, herself likes grocery shopping. We have little cards from two of them, and get the "you have saved $0.00 today" on the sales slip, but don't pay much attention. The one deal that we do like is that one of the stores (part of one of the Kroger chains) also gives a small cut to the local school based upon our purchases...but that's not likely to get us to buy there if something is cheaper elsewhere.

I guess that if you make your purchases based upon rebates rather than on quality.....

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 10:38 AM

It must be an American thing.
In the UK rebate offers are rare, and tend to be on large purchases only, especially cars. They also tend to be very simple, along the lines of "Register your new camera at www.nikon.com, and get £100 back"

Bunnahabhain.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: robomatic
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 10:52 AM

I will use CompUSA rebates if A)OF course I want the item and B) it's a minimum of $20 rebate. and C)It is at most one posting.

I've got nailed on C) when I had to mail off (2) envelopes one to manufact. and one to CompUSA for rebates to total to the advertized savings. I had asked about this in advance and been assured I didn't need to mail the actual UPC code off the box to both addresses, nevertheless the one I had sent the copy to, along with a note that the original UPC was going to the other rebate, refused to honor the coupon request.

I've also found that despite one's best efforts, distraction and life events can impede jumping through the hoops necessary to get off a rebate request. So I suppose when they price items they have statistical measures of how many more sales they will make versus how many rebates they can expect to honor. So the profit margin keeps marketing people employed and life goes on.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: wysiwyg
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 11:03 AM

We all want something for nothing, don't we? Nothing wrong with that, but is it quite right to cry foul when we don't get what we thought we'd gotten for nothing? Caveat Emptor-- it's the buyer's job to beware, and always has been.

So on the modem refund/rebate, if they had honored it, they'd have been paying the customer to try the modem-- get the original cost totally refunded PLUS receive the rebate? And it was a surprise they didn't go for that? Fair would have been to pro-rate the purchase cost based on how long you had it versus expected useful life, then deduct the rebate already paid from the remainder, due to the customer. (BTW, who was going to end up paying full price for the used modem someone else got a refund for? First reaction would be to blame the company, probably-- but is it ethical for the consumer to pass this on to another consumer?)

Not every consumer has to be a total idiot for the system to make a profit. Just enough of them. If people don't know by now to READ THE FINE PRINT, whaddaya gonna do?

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 12:12 PM

" Not every consumer has to be a total idiot"
No... it just seems like most of them are...

"If people don't know by now to READ THE FINE PRINT, whaddaya gonna do?"
Laugh at them...

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: wysiwyg
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 12:44 PM

Well you see it's a delicate balance-- companies will take advantage, believing it's fair since consumers don't pay attention, but could pay attention, and that consumers will get the best deal they can with no loyalty-- and consumers think the companies are so rich it's fair to get any deal you can-- the truth being, what any one consumer saves will be absorbed not by the company, but by other consumers. The two sides are assumed to be looking for any chance to take advnatgae of the other, so "all's fair."

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Bev and Jerry
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 08:13 PM

We had a terrible experience with a rebate from Corel see thread but we finally got it. On the other hand, we made two purchases from Best Buy last year. One had three rebates on it and the other one rebate - all from Best Buy. We got them all before we even paid the credit card bills. So, Bobert, until your posting at least, we had complete faith in Best Buy but no one else.

Bev and Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 08:43 PM

I bought a scanner from CompUSA some years ago. Said scanner had a rebate on it. I mailed the paperwork, kept copies and expected $25 back in about eight weeks. Well, about two weeks after said purchase I visited the scanner's web site. Lo and behold I found that the company was in bankruptcy, having filed on the very day of my purchase. I made several calls to CUSA and they agreed to make the rebate good...and they did! Yea CompUSA!

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Bobert
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 09:15 PM

Well, WYSusan is right, I should have read all the "Rebare Rorms" right there in line at the store...

But it had been a hectic day... We had tried to buy the package at another Best Buy and they didn't have all the stuff and so they sent us way down in Arlington with no parking and cranky people. The sales people were over their heads with cranky customers and the P-Vine actually got upset at being ignored and when some guy who had only been waiting 5 minutes, as oppsed to the 20 she we had been waiting, she got real testy with folks behind the counter...

Then another 30 minutes to round up everything and then the tape gave out right in the middle of runing the "Rebate Forms" and it was the last day fir the rebates so when, after an entire 5 hours was eaten up with the purhcase and the guy handed us the 6 Rebate forms, with folks behind us about half crazy, I just stuffed them in my coat p[ocket and assumed that what they had advertised would be reflected in the Rebate Forms...

Bad assumption...

Like they say, "Live and Learn" and I think I either not buy anything else witha rebate 'er be darned sure what that rebate is and how to get it...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 09:16 PM

Many in-store rebate offers are paid off in merchandise, often in the form of gift-cards. That's an easy way of inflating the face value of the rebate. When a store or manufacturer gives you a cash rebate, they're out exactly the amount of money you receive. But when they give you a gift-card, they are actually only out their cost of whatever you redeem the card for. Depending on the store's markup percentage, that may be as little as 50% of the face value of the card.

And, of course, giving you a rebate that can only be redeemed at their store is a sure-fire way to get you back through the door where, they hope, you'll probably spend way more than the face value of the gift-card they sent you.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: heric
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 12:03 AM

I'm not the kind to do rebates by choice (I would avoid them, just because I hate the time wasted), but if they're part of the deal, I do them. That has been at Best Buy and Costco only. Always simple, always fast, in my six or seven experiences over the past three years or so. With Costco, you don't even need to mail anything at all - Just go online and click a couple of buttons.

If either of those two big companies made a habit of screwing with rebates, they'd be sued in a New York minute.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: NH Dave
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 02:19 AM

Rebates and cents-off coupons while honest do work on the knowledge that most customers will not take the time to get all their coupons in order, or mail all their rebate paperwork in to what can turn out to be several different manufacturers.

I was quite pleased with the rebate policy of Office Max. They accept all of your rebate forms, send you your money promptly, and fight with the individual manufacturers individually, after you get your money back. They also offer to give you a second register tape so that you have proof of purchase later on after you have sent all of your original register receipts in for the rebate offer.

Dave

Standard disclaimers apply here. I neither work for, have any connection with, or profit in any way from Office Max. Their store is   usually clean and neat, with none of the dingyness or warehouse-like look of some stores.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 02:53 AM

I find it's best to save copies of everything. If you don't get your rebate within the time specified on the form, CALL the company if possible. If the company has a number I can call, I've always been able to get things settled in my favor.
But still, those rebates are a damn hassle.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Troll
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 03:24 AM

I've only ever gotten rebates from Lowes but I've never had a problem.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: wysiwyg
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 08:29 AM

Bobert, it isn't so much that you opught to read the fine print-- just assume that if you don't, that may be one deal that doesn't go down. I figger if it's worth my time to look it over, I do it, but if it's not-- heck, I don't look at it either. I just put the anticipated money in the "maybe" category instead of the "counting on it" category.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 02:17 AM

I spent the evening filling out forms and running back and forth to cut the barcodes and serial numbers off of boxes, and to make copious copies (some rebates double up, and in that instance places like CompUSA need only a copy of the serial numbers or barcodes). Nine envelopes later I still don't have everything I need. Two of the rebate forms were cut off short so there's no information about where to send them (they're for Fry's, so I'll go online there and see if the offer is posted--they usually are).

I figure the insurance company isn't going to pay me the full price on all of this equipment, they're at the very least going to take off the price of the rebates, whether I collect or not. And on some of these I have only a few days before they expire. Via nickle and dime over the next couple of months I'll get a few hundred dollars back. And be checking them off of the copies of the forms as they dribble in.

I wish the insurance company paperwork was as easy as the rebate part.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 03:24 AM

I got a tax rebate recently that pissed me off. About a thousand quid. the money was nice but the point was that the particular year when I paid that, I was in deep shit moneywise and it caused real hardship and worry - paying them money they weren't entitled to in the first place.

They can't give you a rebate on the distress they have caused.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: GUEST,jeffp
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 11:22 AM

CompUSA just signed an agreement with the FTC (I think) that holds CompUSA (and presumably sets a precedent for other retailers in the future) responsible for rebates that they advertise, even if they are offered by the manufacturer. Apparently, a mfgr offered a rebate that was advertised by CompUSA, then the mfgr went out of business. CompUSA agreed to be liable under the terms of the settlement. It was in the Washington Post this past weekend.

Subject: RE: BS: Grrrrrr!!! Rebates are a Rip-Off....
From: GUEST,jeffp
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 11:24 AM

BTW, DougR:

Is deceptive advertising, to wit, advertising a rebate for a different amount that is actually offered or that will not be honored, one of your conservative "values"?

Just wondering