BS: Folk combined with other genres

Subject: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: gnu
Date: 24 Apr 05 - 03:56 PM

I know. I know. Why isn't this above the line? I don't know... I just felt like it.

I just posted to another thread about music by "Harmonium", a band who first produced, in the 70's, in Quebec, Canada, a mix of French Canadian folk, rock, orchestral (or should that be called "long hair", anyone?) and jazz. It was truly magic; a joy to listen to.

I am wondering, what other bands do you know that have successfully or originally combined the old with the new.

The first that comes to my mind, and, perhaps the ultimate success in this regard, in my feeble mind anyway, is Jethro Tull. JT is one of, if not the first, "Heavy Metal" bands, but, so much of their music is old English style folk combined with rock and orchestral. The music of the minstrels, repleat with the musical instruments of those days of yore (Middle English - minstral) is prominent and is blended into the extreme at both ends of this music mix, almost to the point of turning it down, as it were. The result is true music magic (if you ignore some of the more distasteful subject matter found on the odd cut).

I am also reminded of 10cc, who have combined French cabaret with rock and orchestral. Perhaps the caberet could be twisted to be a sort of French folk so it may be accomodated in this forum? Non?

From nearby me, we have Rawlins Cross who "Reel and Roll" with bagpipes and dirges with rock vocals; and Natalie McMaster who can take that jig and jazz it up just fine; and Great Big Sea... well, forget GBS - their gone off on a tangent of their own lately which defies definition and which appeals to few.

So, who else?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: wildlone
Date: 24 Apr 05 - 04:03 PM

Bonzo Dog Doo Dah Band.
dave

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Leadfingers
Date: 24 Apr 05 - 04:49 PM

I have this strange tendency to play Jazz tin whistle when I am working with the O'Reelys !! But thats just ME !!

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: gnu
Date: 24 Apr 05 - 04:58 PM

No, that's the progession. That's what I am getting at, I hope.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Once Famous
Date: 24 Apr 05 - 05:31 PM

Back in the middle 1960s, besides being known as a guitar genius, Chet Atkins, then top A&R man and producer in Nashville had a marketing vision that reached out to many of the then just about played out folk-scare fans.

A group of albums from RCA artists such as Waylon Jennings, Bobby Bare, and George Hamilton IV carried a "folk-country" logo on them, and along with songs by contemporary Nashville writers of the time, also featured folk-flavored material by writers such as Gordon Lightfoot and Ian Tyson.

This is how I and I am sure many others started to be exposed to country music, as the combination of folk and country quickly took me from the folk world to the world of country music. Flatt & Scruggs had something to do with the combined genre, also.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Apr 05 - 06:41 PM

Gnu, when you ask this question you are also re-introduce the topic "What is folk?".

To expand this conversation, if roots Hip-Hop is considered part of folk music, then examples of jazz/Hip-Hop fusions should be included in this discussion.

See these comments from TalkBass discussion forum:

"ryan morris 04-10-2001, 08:57 PM
hey, anyone listen to music like this? it is kind of like feel good rap music with some neat bass lines here and there. examples would be:
digable planets
arrested development
jurassic 5
mos def
black star"

-snip-

"winston 04-10-2001, 09:09 PM
Don't forget Spearhead! And if you want to check out some of the roots of jazz/hip-hop fusion be sure to look into Gil-Scott Heron. Lauryn Hill's "Miseducation" also has some fine basswork."

-snip-

"ryan morris 04-11-2001, 10:08 AM
awesome, so you guy do listen to some of this stuff. i am going to be going music shopping today. it's like a weekly thing now. i can't wait to check out some of the suggestions.
some more similar artist would be:The Pharcyde,OutKast(older stuff), DJ Spooky, Dr. Octagon, Blackalicious, Company Flow, Common Latyrx, Black Sheep, The Roots,The Coup ,Lootpack, The Dust Brothers, The Automator, DJ Shadow, Q-Tip FreestyleFellowship, A Tribe Called Quest,Afrika Bambaataa, De La Soul, just to name a few"

-snip-

Click here ro read more posts about this topic from that music forum:
Jazz/Hip-Hop fusion

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Apr 05 - 06:47 PM

If interested, you might also want to check these out:
List of Jazz/Hip-Hop fusion CDs

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: gnu
Date: 25 Apr 05 - 08:37 AM

Azizi..."Gnu, when you ask this question you are also re-introduce the topic "What is folk?"."

My apologies. I withdraw my posts. Got to think more and drink less.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Azizi
Date: 25 Apr 05 - 08:57 AM

Gnu..couldn't you have corrected my typo when you quoted me?
I meant to say "...You are reintroducing the topic 'What is folk [music]?

And sorry- once you press that submit button, your posts can't be withdrawn just cause you re-introduced a topic that probably has no answer that everyone can agreed on.

So, you just gotta live with it..

and,yeah, drinking some forms of liquid does tend to impair thinkin...

But water now-I hear tell that people are supposed to drink lots of water since it's supposed to be good for you..but I guess even that depends on where you live..

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 25 Apr 05 - 11:02 AM

It could be said that the old traditional polka bands play Folkas. But perhaps it's best not to say it, after all..

Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Once Famous
Date: 25 Apr 05 - 11:28 AM

I really can't stand it when everyone claims any type of music is folk music.

I certainly don't hear any polkas or rap on any of the folk music programs I have listened to over the years.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Apr 05 - 07:15 PM

I certainly don't hear any polkas

Considering how many wonderful polkas there are in the traditional repertiore you obviously have some crap radio stations.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 25 Apr 05 - 08:28 PM

I grew up hating polkas... probably because they often played them at 5 in the morning, along with the morning Hog Reports. It wasn't until much later in life that I realized what agreat wealth of music there is around the world that are polkas. I particularly was mesmerized by a program of Mexican polkas I heard on the radio driving in my car many years ago. There are certainly plennnnnty of polkas that are as much folk music as fiddle tunes. Because they go back so far in time and tradition, they are certainly more "folk" music than bluegrass.

Whether people "like" them or not has nothing to do with whether or not they are folk music.

Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Hand-Pulled Boy
Date: 26 Apr 05 - 07:36 PM

If it tells a story it's folk. Stick in a drum solo for good measure.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: coldjam
Date: 26 Apr 05 - 09:01 PM

Gotta add that perhaps a drum solo (unless it's on a bodhran!) might just be the thing that disqualifies a song from the folk genre.That may be why "country" music is not usually included in "Folk" even though it might have quite a story (dog, wife, truck- all gone, and now I'm drinkin'... or vice versa.) But given the topic here, and the great musical minds on this site, I again emphasize "perhaps"!

My hubby and I combine traditional folk with rock oldies and even what some might consider musical comedy or musical theatre style. We've been discussing whether we should take the "folk" title out of what we do, It seems to trigger some pretty preconceived notions, we're just not sure what those are! Anybody care to comment on what they might be? I'd be interested in your opinion.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: michaelr
Date: 26 Apr 05 - 10:54 PM

This should be above the line!

The purists may sic the Folk Police on me for this, but I sincerely believe that:

Combining folk and trad material with more modern sounds is a great way to carry on the tradition by making it interesting to younger audiences. In Ireland, Donal Lunny has done this with his Moving Hearts and Coolfin bands. In Scotland there's artists like Martyn Bennett, Runrig and Shooglenifty. AfroCelt Sound System and Salsa Celtica are other examples.

If it's done tastefully and with respect for the underlying tradition, this sort of fusion may well keep alive the trad music we love for another century or two.

Cheers,
Michael

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 27 Apr 05 - 12:13 PM

Music either does something for you or it doesn't. Most jazz and classical music leaves me cold but diddly tunes always do something to please my brain.

Labels are useful. I don't know what you call the Afro-celts but they are folky and the hit the same spot as the Chieftains, Albions, Swarb and friends and of late Whapweasal and Blowhead.

So are Whapweasal English country dance with two tone/ carribean influences?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 27 Apr 05 - 12:23 PM

Folk and Pop music have been intertwined for centuries. Folk is what remains after several decades after when the rest is forgotten

Subject: RE: BS: Folk combined with other genres
From: Once Famous
Date: 27 Apr 05 - 01:00 PM

Guest, we do not have crappy folk music on the radio.

Chicago has long been a hot bed of American folk music. Polkas are not played on those stations and neither is rap.

What you are describing is ethnic music. That stuff can be found in the Polish section or the rap section at Borders, not in the folk music section.

Like I said, calling everything folk music is just to inconvenient.