Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling

Subject: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 13 Sep 05 - 04:53 AM

Hi all,

We were offered my Mother-in-Law's piano a couple of years ago, which had been her sister's piano before that. When it was delivered the delivery man also unloaded a very large cardboard box. I asked hubby what it was and he said it was the pianola rolls. I had no idea until that point that it was a pianola.

It has taken me a long time to get to the point financially where I could get the pianola repaired but on Sunday it was all fixed, after they took the mechanism away a couple of months ago and have been working on it to get it back to playable condition.

Also, since the piano hadn't been played by anyone for at least 30 years the hammers and felts all needed replacing, so now I can find a piano teacher again and start taking lessons, and this time I will be able to practise on the piano and not just an electronic keyboard.

But, the pianola being repaired is the real story.

When my sister and I were around 7 - she is one year older than me - we used to go to my Dad's Mother's house and while the grownups were sitting in the kitchen or the sitting room drinking endless cups of tea and talking about boring oldies-type stuff, we were in the lounge room playing the pianola or tinkering about on the keys making our own kind of totally untrained music. It was the best! The very best memories of my life include those times, right near the top of the list.

When my step-Grandfather died my Grandma decided to move out of that big house and into a smaller house. My Uncle (by marriage) took control of the clearing out of the house and decided to sell the pianola for a song (pun intended) even though my sister and I begged and pleaded to get it. It needed repairs and even then it would have cost a fortune but we would have loved to have the piano even without being able to play the pianola,

And that was the last time - except for one occasion - that I have ever been able to play a pianola.

The other occasion was when I was on holidays in South Australia and there was a pianola in the big room which was a restaurant of a motel but also had a dance floor. I saw the pianola and went over to play it but it was totally wrecked inside and it just wheezed and sucked and I was so, so disappointed.

Anyway, now finally we have a working pianola and I have been trying out the rolls in the box. I wish I could remember some of the tunes we had at Grandma's house. The only one I definitely remember was Woody Woodpecker. I'll probably start trying to find other rolls on e-bay or something.

But I just wanted to share my joy at finding again a pleasure from over 40 years ago, and at reliving those memories of Grandma & Da's house.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 13 Sep 05 - 07:56 AM

Great story! Does it look like any of these?

SRS

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: GUEST,steve benbows protege off line
Date: 13 Sep 05 - 12:32 PM

Do check out the music museum at Brentford if you are in the u.k as they have alot of rolls for pianola etc aswell as my families barrel piano!!

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 13 Sep 05 - 04:56 PM

SRS, It is an upright piano, dark brown varnish which needs a lot of TLC, and the brand is Schumann. I was lucky that the pianola repairman was able to repair the mechanism. He and his nephew re-made a significant part of it - the stacks - out of wood with a clever design of their own.

Since playing the pianola I've been remembering my Grandma's loungeroom. It was always dark, with dark furnishings. There were masses of Victoriana in her house which my Uncle took to the rubbish tip and there were people there raiding the stuff and waiting for the next trailer load. My Uncle always was very difficult to deal with. I don't know if I ever forgave him for cleaning out Grandma's house. I managed to convince them to not throw out a carved chiming clock which my Dad now has.

It reminds me the most of the powerlessness of childhood. I had no negotiating power, no financial clout, no financial reserves to make an offer for any of it. I wasn't old enough to know that he could have taken the Victoriana to an antique dealer and made some money on it.

Frustration, plus!

And, steve benbows protege, sorry - wrong end of the world, exactly inverse in fact. Antipodes, Oz, i.e. Australia. :-)

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Alan Day
Date: 13 Sep 05 - 05:57 PM

Hallo Helen your story reminds me of my Aunt and Uncle`s Pianola which stood in their Front Room in East London near to where the Olympics are being held,like you it was great fun to play as a child,particularly that if you pedalled faster the music went faster and visa versa.
Many come up for auction in the UK for almost very little and I sat at one the other day having a pedal.
My problem is that now whenever I think of a Pianola, I think of Laurel and Hardy in "Night Owls" there they are creeping around the Police Chiefs house and Olly leans against the on switch.When I think now as I am writing this, it must have been electrically operated, but it was so funny the first time I watched it I had to turn it off as I was laughing so much.
When my Wife`s Grandmother used to talk about disposing of her Mother`s belongings when she died,lovely old lamps,paintings,jewelry
furniture etc all went as rubbish.Her reply to my wife saying she would have loved some of the items "What would you want with all that old stuff" and sadly that was the attitude.Now some of the things I threw away twenty years ago are fetching good prices at auction,so what do I know?
Have great fun Helen with your Pianola and well done for getting it going again and thank you for my little memory.
Al

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 18 Sep 05 - 03:11 AM

Hi Alan,

Thanks for your family memories too. Maybe if someone never had the pleasure of playing a pianola as a child they would find it hard to get excited about it, but because it is one of my cherished memories it was really important to me to get this one fixed.

Another thing I have been thinking about while watching the piano roll as it plays is that it is a very visual way of hearing music. On one of the rolls I tried out the other day there is a big flourishing "riff" which moves downwards i.e. leftwards in a repetitive rhythm pattern. You can see the repetitive pattern moving leftwards on the roll. It's like seeing as well as hearing the music.

The piano roll I am most taken with at the moment - after having tried only about 1/5 of the ones in the box - is Bye Bye Blackbird, which is a beautiful arrangement. Now I hear it in my head almost constantly. It always was a brilliant tune, but it's much more immediate on the pianola, somehow.

So far, too, I really like Kitten on the Keys, Mexicali Rose, and The Old Piano Roll Blues. But I am still working my way through them.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Alan Day
Date: 18 Sep 05 - 01:25 PM

You are right Helen,it is something I had not thought about,all those pianola rolls you have and the ones seen at auction in boxes contain valuable music arrangements.Also played very very slowly you have a superb tutor to learn to play the piano in the Victorian style.
Al

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 01 Oct 05 - 09:04 AM

While surfing the 'Net I found this incredible resource of midi files which have been created from scanned images of piano rolls.

PLAYER PIANO REBIRTH

Website owner Terry Smythe says: "The principal purpose of this web site is to provide a repository of midi conversions emerging from the scanning processes of original player piano rolls produced in the golden era of player piano music."

What a treasure trove!

There are 3,276 titles to date available for download in 19 zip files. There is also a full list available on a spreadsheet for download.

If you haven't heard a pianola then this is a new treat for you, but if you have then it is, I think, an even bigger treat because it will bring back fond memories and open up so many new tunes. Being able to hear different arrangements of the same tune is wonderful too.

So, to hear the Victor Arden version of Bye Bye Blackbird you can download Batch 14, and listen to midi no 3502 S. I'm addicted to his arrangement of this song. I have to play it twice every time I load the roll onto the pianola. I'm going to wear it out, I know.

And Kitten on the Keys is in Batch 7, midi no S 353.

There is a lifetime of music there. So much music, so little time.

I discovered a US site the other day which sells ragtime piano rolls. I think I know what I'll be spending my money on over the next few years.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 01 Oct 05 - 11:02 AM

Helen, although we haven't bought new rolls for some time,many of the ones we did buy were actually made in Oz! Good luck with yours, cracking fun and good exercise!

RtS

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 01 Oct 05 - 08:17 PM

Hi Roger,

Were the Oz rolls made by Mastertouch ?

Sadly they have gone out of business this year. As far as I know their museum of player pianos and rolls did not find a home either so I don't know what has happened to that. I didn't even know that the museum existed otherwise I would have been down to Sydney and visited it.

and you are right about it being good exercise. A musical exercise machine with instant motivation - no exercise, no music. I think the gyms could develop something similar and charge people to use it.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 01 Oct 05 - 08:28 PM

In a previous thread, I mentioned that the owner of the Oz factory wants to close.

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Ron Davies
Date: 02 Oct 05 - 08:11 AM

Great stuff! I played a few of Robert Perry's midis. Sound was wonderful. Also fascinating information--e.g. a pseudonym that one of the producers used when he wasn't totally satisfied with the result.


I recognized some of the names--Zes Comfrey, for instance---but most of them I'd never heard of.

Thanks so much for the info and the links.

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Mo the caller
Date: 02 Oct 05 - 08:30 AM

My aunt had one. My memories are of cousin Michael playing at Christmas. And particularly the Toreador march from Carmen, very loud when he thought that the discussion that Uncle Alf and I were enjoying had become too heated and was upsetting the infants.

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 02 Oct 05 - 10:24 AM

Yes, I think they were Mastertouch. QRS were another company we bought from. There were a couple of solicitors in E.Anglia somewhere (?Wisbeach)importing and dealing in rolls as a hobby that we dealt with. Sadly, the guy in Slough near us who restored ours was killed in a car crash about a year after doing our restoration. He was a real enthusiast.

RtS

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 02 Oct 05 - 04:16 PM

Roger,

The Victor Arden version I have of Bye Bye Blackbird is QRS and so are the other ones I like the most so far.

That's sad about the car crash. The man who restored our pianola is a local man who had a piano shop for a few decades and has now retired to just teaching piano and doing piano & pianola repairs. He is an enthusiast too, and a perfectionist, and a very nice man. One of the "old school" of repair people. He and his nephew came up with a brilliant idea to remake one part of the pianola stacks to overcome the problem over glue over the bleed holes from a previously botched repair job. If they had not been able to build the new part then it probably couldn't have been repaired.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 05 Oct 05 - 07:53 AM

Come on guys, I've got to share my excitement about the scanned piano roll midi files I linked to on 01 Oct 05 at 09:04 AM in this thread.

Am I the only one who gets goosebumps listening to reproductions of fantastic piano players playing right there in front of me on my own goanna? It's like ghostly hands. And the midis are nearly as good as the real thing.

Some of the ragtime stuff is amazing.

It's a method, not unlike recording midis from a keyboard, where what the performer actually plays is translated into something which can reproduced at home.

Please, someone listen to some of the midis at that site:

Player Piano Rebirth

I'm sure you won't regret it.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 05 Oct 05 - 09:24 AM

Cambridge Pianola Company The Limes Landbeach Cambridge CB4 8DR 01223 861348 01223 861408 01223 861507 Fax: [phone] E-mail: [e-mail] ...
www.cambridgepianolacompany.co.uk/home.html
was the E.Anglian company we bought rolls from. The Slough company seems to have gone out of business as I suspected and there is another in London I spotted.

RtS

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 07 Oct 05 - 07:25 PM

Well, don't say I didn't try.

Have a look at this site BluesTone Blues Rolls (Pianists, K - Z) and I might be able to interest you in listening to the midi files at Terry Smythe's page.

The blicky points to a supplier of blues and ragtime piano rolls, **played by the composer** on many of them. Not played by other people who can afford a midi keyboard and with variable degrees of playing and music interpreting ability, who who can copy transcribed sheet music into midi format, but played by the composer as he/she wanted it to be played.

If you could hear the original composer play a tune as if their ghost is playing it for you, not through tinny little speakers but right there in front of you in real "surround sound" on your own piano, wouldn't that just be like being in heaven.

So, for example, on Terry Smythe's pages you can download the zip files for batches 7, 8, 11, & 12 and hear Jelly Roll Morton play:

Grandpa's Spells (1926)
London Blues (1924)
Mr. Jelly Lord (1924)
Perfect Rag - Frog-i-More Rag

OR you could download batch 16 and hear Scott Joplin play:

Magnetic Rag
Ole Miss Rag
Something Doin'
Weeping Willow
Weeping Willow Rag

or batches 1, 7, 8, 10, & 11 to hear Joplin play:

Euphonic Sounds (1909)
Magnetic Rag (1914)
Maple Leaf Rag
Ole Miss Rag (1916)
Something Doin' (1903)
Weeping Willow Rag (1911)
Magnetic Rag
Something Doin

Or there is Fats Waller, or George Gershwin, or even Rachmaninoff.

Admittedly it's not going to be as exciting as hearing it on your own piano in surround sound, but it's as near as you can get on your computer.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: open mike
Date: 07 Oct 05 - 08:14 PM

ahh the memories
grandma had one of these
but sheliked to play it
and did it well so the
automatic feature was
rarely used. it is in
my cousin's basement
---in pieces last i heard.
no one alive could fix it
he said so he was attempting the
job himself via the internet.

i got a piano roll at a garage
sale of a tune i had the joy of
playing for grandma--on mandolin,
not piano--mockingbird hill

i will enjoy down loading some of those files!

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Alan Day
Date: 08 Oct 05 - 03:55 AM

Helen in your researches have you found any compositions that have been multi tracked?Thinking about the way the roll is put together I suppose it would be possible to do a ten finger arrangement.Or would the pianola disintegrate trying to cope with it?
Al

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 08 Oct 05 - 05:28 AM

I do believe that there were duets on pianola - I played duets on piano when a youngster. I also used to play trios on piano when a kid - no reason there should not have been some made for pianola.

I seem to remember a division in Eisteddfods for more than one player on a piano.

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 08 Oct 05 - 08:18 PM

Alan,

Some of the performers listed on the spreadsheet show more than one person, and a couple of rolls were performed by The Original Piano Trio.

I find with the pedals it is a lot easier to push when there are more notes playing at once than when there are less, so the sparse arrangements are harder to play, and harder to regulate the speed because one minute I'm pedalling as hard as I can and getting nowhere and the next I am pedalling really fast and the music goes really fast, too. It's a "feature" of my particular pianola type that the faster you pedal the faster it goes, but it is a disadvantage in another way, I think. I'm still getting used to the pedalling process and getting the speed right so it might not be as much of a problem when I am more comfortable with how it works.

I also wonder whether some of the old rolls might be sticking at some points, e.g. paper stuck at some points or something, and also I'm not sure whether it is best to roll the rolls a bit tighter bit before playing or play them as they have rewound which is a bit loose or whether it doesn't make any difference.

I'm desperately trying to find a new job at the moment because the temp contract I have runs out 31 December, but what I really want to do is just sit at home playing with the pianola or listening to the 3200 midi files at Terry Smythe's website.   Life is way, way too short to waste it working. :-)

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Alan Day
Date: 09 Oct 05 - 03:16 AM

Do you think that Sparkys Magic Piano was actually a Pianola?
Al

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 09 Oct 05 - 07:29 AM

Hmm. Could be. It wouldn't explain how the piano talked, though.

I only heard that for the first time on ABC Classic-FM a few months ago.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Alan Day
Date: 09 Oct 05 - 08:58 AM

Perhaps the footpedals needed oiling and he imagined it was talking to him.
Says he flapping for answers because he forgot the piano said "Sparkieeee".
Al

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 09 Oct 05 - 09:43 AM

Imperial rolls

91118 (1920)
64880 (1921)

both the tune 'Whispering' are apparently duets, for one example.

Often a giveaway is a rolling rhythm in the treble while the lower half of the keyboard is playing 4 or 6 part harmony

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 11 Oct 05 - 04:31 PM

Robin, I don't know if any of the rolls I have are by more than one performer. I know that some of them use vamping so it looks like they are all over the keyboard but it is still only one performer.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: GUEST,Bob Jenkins
Date: 13 Oct 06 - 09:48 PM

"It's a "feature" of my particular pianola type that the faster you pedal the faster it goes, but it is a disadvantage in another way, I think"


This was never a "feature" of a pianola - simply an excuse used by sub-standard pianola technicians! Every pianola has a mechanism called a governor that controls the pianola, so pumping faster should only EVER increase the volume of the music, NEVER the speed!

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 13 Oct 06 - 10:15 PM

G'day Helen,

I missed this thread, because it all happened while Patricia and I were off on our "Red Heart" odyssey: Broken Hill / Pt Augusta / Woomera / Coober Pedy / Alice Springs / Uluru - Kata Tjuta / Kings Canyon / Wilpena Pound / Broken Hill ... home (well, a few more overnights - 3 weeks and 6,000 km driving!).

I also have great memories of a pianola - my paternal Grandmother's ... and she lived next door for many years. Now that one is dessicating in my younger brother's home in Dubbo.

One of the Bush Music Club's members, Jim Dangarfield, who lives not too far from you - at Bullaroo - apart from his interest in concdertinas, old recordings, &c ... was studying the dance music sets available on Australian piano rolls. If you wish, I can dig out contact details and PM them to you ... so you can pick Jim's brains!

I was, also, recently over at the home of a photographic friend (ex-head of the School of Ohotography, Institute of Technology, Ultimo) and listening to the enhanced 'piano rolls' played on his (Duotone?) "Reproducing Piano", which has extra "code" for the player's touch and volume. He has both a full piano version and a "roll-up" "Piano Player", which is aligned with the keyboard of any standard piano ... and reproduces to 'exact' performance of the recorded artist!

Regards,

Bob

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 14 Oct 06 - 08:57 AM

"School of Ohotography"

??!!!! ooooooo...

:-P

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 14 Oct 06 - 12:02 PM

Bob,

Red Heart!! My favourite part of Oz! I hope you had a great time. I'm jealous. In my first posting above I mentioned being on holidays in South Oz. It was at a place not far from Coober Pedy. I've forgotten the name of the place.

Do you mean Boolaroo, a suburb of Newcastle/Lake Macquarie? That name sounds familiar to me. I think I've met him a few years ago at a music session in Newcastle.

I don't think I need to pick Jim's brains about anything pianola related at present, but if I do I'll let you know. Thanks.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: GUEST,thurg
Date: 14 Oct 06 - 12:39 PM

Okay: is a pianola the same as a player piano, or is it one type of player piano or what? And how's it differ from a barrel-piano?

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Ron Davies
Date: 14 Oct 06 - 12:42 PM

Marlene Dietrich has a great double-entendre song about her pianola. I'll see if I can find it.

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 14 Oct 06 - 07:40 PM

Have you been taking those piano lessons? How are they coming along, and what do you like to play?

I need to get my piano restored--no piano rolls, just a 120 year old piano that needs strings, felts, hammers, probably the works.

SRS

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Helen
Date: 14 Oct 06 - 09:23 PM

SRS,

I've been seriously job-stressed and financially-stressed for some years, but a month ago I started a permanent job, government pay and conditions (i.e. fantastic: Yippee!!) and doing the late shift, 4pm-11.30pm, which means I am now in a position financially to find a teacher, and also to go to lessons in the day time, and hopefully get some practice in without having to worry about annoying hubby with the racket.

Piano lessons, here I come! At last!

Guest, thurg

Player piano = pianola. I think pianola is a brand name but here in Oz they all tend to be referred to as a pianola.

Helen

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: JennieG
Date: 15 Oct 06 - 03:06 AM

A story I read several years ago about the late Norman Lindsay (Oz painter/writer/sculptor/model-maker/etc) said that he had a pianola at his home in Springwood, in the Blue Mountains west of Sydney. On one occasion he gave a 'recital' of Beethoven's Apassionata Sonata, compltete with annotated comments, to Nellie Melba when she was visiting.

Would have been a wonderful occasion to have been a fly on the wall.

Cheers
JennieG

Subject: RE: Pianola repaired - indescribable feeling
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 15 Oct 06 - 06:35 AM

G'day again Helen,

The point I was making about Jim is that he had been studying and collating the content of published piano rolls - relating to dances. I thought he might have some ideas of where you could pursue any specific rolls you remembered from you first contact with the Pianola. His address probably is Boolaroo ... I think I'm simply using my phonetic version of what he mentioned on the phone - I've never been there. I don't seem to have his contact details on this computer ... so we haven't been in contact since my last big hard-drive crash!

The Mastertouch factory used to be only about 1½ kilometres from my home ... the old factory is now an evangelic church ... and I think the box-making concern they took over, when David Jones stopped making fancy / bespoke boxes, was in the nearby disused fire station. Possibly that still operates ... but doesn't box up piano rolls!

Regards,

Bob