BS: Americans addicted to oil

Subject: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 04:39 AM

As if we did not know that already!
My god Bush is learning fast!

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 06:45 AM

Bloody 'ell what are you yanks doing, injecting it, or snorting it ?

eric

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Dave (the ancient mariner)
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 06:51 AM

Eric, they call it Texas Tea so they must be drinking it mate..

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: gnu
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 07:33 AM

I thought most heads smoked grass or hash. Guess I am behind the times.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Bobert
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 07:50 AM

Makes those notes that Cheney won't release on the last "Energy Policy" all that ore intriguing...

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,Larry K
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 09:23 AM

Quick history quiz:

Who was the first american president to reject Kyoto?

Did congress support that action?

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 09:35 AM

Nobody seems to want to consider the one approach that's been tried (and worked well): Legally mandate fleet fuel-consumption averages for car manufacturers. One of Jimmy Carter's rare successes--dropped by guess who.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Irish sergeant
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 04:50 PM

WE Americans will continue to be Addicted to oil as long as our politicians are bought and sold by the oil companies and big business. Neil

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 05:51 PM

DO YOU RUB IT ON OR DRINK IT

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Wesley S
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 05:53 PM

So this thread is NOT about the Robert Palmer song ?

"You know you might as well face we're addicted to oil"

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 07:42 PM

tsk! 'addicted' is a bad word...Yeah, oil was first discovered here, and we had quite a large supply for many years. It's easy to get used to having it...and with a huge country, it takes more driving to get places than in England. Do we need to change both habits and fuel sources? Sure....but what's the point in all the finger pointing and cute remarks? You got any REALLY helpful ideas on how to change a hundred years of one direction without painful withdrawal? Some Americans DO...and are working on it. You read only the bad news...

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 08:30 PM

My name is George W and I'm an petroleum addict....

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 09:03 PM

Nobody expects it to be painless.

No pain, no gain.

There are alternatives. Its just that the alternatives aren't easy and cheap. Since when did anyone promise you a free ride?

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Arkie
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 11:21 PM

We are not addicted to oil. We are addicted to getting from one place to another and getting there quickly. Development of alternate forms of fuel have been stymied by those who have the power to do so.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: bobad
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 11:32 PM

Bill

When I read your post somewhere in the back of my mind I thought I remembered hearing this :

1857 – Commercial Oil Production

Geology and time have created large deposits of crude oil in various parts of Canada. Until the mid 1800s, this vast untapped wealth lay mostly hidden below the surface of the earth. Some oil seeped naturally to the earth's surface and formed shallow pools. These oil seeps had long been known about and used for medicinal purposes, to caulk boats and buildings and to lubricate machinery. But they were not commonly used as a fuel, as the oil had foul-smelling fumes. Better refining techniques and surging demand for kerosene and lubricants in the late 19th century changed this. Canada would be thrust to the forefront of commercial oil production when James Williams drilled the first oil well in North America in 1857.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: bobad
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 11:34 PM

Sorry forgot to attribute http://canadianeconomy.gc.ca/english/economy/1857Commercial_Oil_Production.html

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Ron Davies
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 11:37 PM

Bush has managed to mightily annoy many of his own "true believers" by the phrase "addicted to oil".

According to the Wall St Journal editorial page, which frequently reflects the "more Bushite than thou" crew, liberals "want to live in a world that runs on wood chips, and it's hardly useful to have a conservative President telling the country he agrees with them".

They ain't happy.

The subtext of this, is of course, they will fight any program that subsidizes a push for energy from other than fossil fuels.

And, of course there's no sign Bush is willing to put money where his mouth is in funding such programs in a meaningful way. He's offering $150 million next year, which, as the Journal reporting--- as distinguished from the editorials--- points out, is "hardly enough to revolutionize a multibillion dollar energy market".

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Bert
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 01:33 AM

Oil be loving you, always...

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,Whistle Stop
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 08:29 AM

It's a catchy phrase, but it's just a catchy phrase. I will believe that Bush is serious about it when he puts forward a serious plan to conserve energy (thorugh fuel efficiency standards and other means), develop truly viable alternative energy sources, and start the painful process of restructuring our society so that we're not dependent on such large quantities of petroleum for absolutely everything. This is a big problem, and it needs a big solution, with a deep and sustained governmental commitment behind it. A catch phrase isn't going to get us there; we need a plan.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Wolfgang
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 09:00 AM

I've no idea whether Bush means what he says, but what he said regarding restriction of oil consumption is a good step.
If he goes on with the present international poilitics (I think I'll leave that typo as it is) on other fields as he has started he may have to implement the reduction of oil consumption earlier than planned.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,Larry K
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 09:12 AM

Words are just words.   We need action.   Mentioning renewable energy and setting a goal for 75% oil independece are a good start.   Thats more than we got in th past 13 years with Clinton and Bush. Lets see what action they really take.

Note:   President Bush has been awful for wind energy. Governor Bush was great for wind energy. During his term as Governor Texas installed more windmills than anyone in the coutry except California.

There are 6,000 MW of wind energy in the USA and Texas has over 1,300 MW of them. (almost 25% of the total country) A pretty impressive record for an "oil" state.   Austin Energy is considered one of the leading renewable companies in the country.

If we could only get Ted Kennedy and Walter Cronkite on board with wind energy......maybe if we put a martini on each blade of a windmill Kennedy will endorse it.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,Russ
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 01:13 PM

It is called a "blame the victim" explanation of a problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Troll
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 10:21 PM

Clinton signed the Kyoto accord in 1998 but never sent it to Congress for ratification. Which is probably just as well since, in 1996(?) the Senate passed a unonimous (sp) resolution that they would not ratify it in the form then presented because it would wreck the US economy.

It was flawed, feel-good legislation at best which exempted two of the worlds largest polluters, India and China, from the provisions of the Accord.

Just my opinion, of course.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Teribus
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 02:39 PM

Americans addicted to oil?

This is the fault of the President of the United States of America?

If the first is true then blame should be put firmly whre it lies - with the population of the United States of America. It is not the President that dictates what the consumption of individual Americans citizens is, that is entirely within the control of each individual - TRUE?

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 03:04 PM

An NPR commentator pointed out that most of the oil that we're addicted to comes from those volitile nations of Canada, Mexico, and Venezuela.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Sorcha
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 04:20 PM

Well, the gubmint keeps giving money to the oil lobbies to smother the alternative energy sources.....

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 05:10 PM

"...because it would wreck the US economy."

What good is your economy if the earth is uninhabitable?

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 12:11 AM

The business sections of the press I've been reading taday [Sunday] are assuring readers that the future energy requirements of the oil-addicted [!!] USA will NOT be assured by alternative energy sources,, but by the oil sands of Alberta, Canada. Nobody really believed GW., ---did they----?

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,dianavan
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 01:19 AM

Ah, yes. Thats where Stephen Harper, our new Canadian PM comes in.

Funny enough, he comes from Alberta. Imagine that!

Not much difference between Alberta and Texas. Both are controlled by oil interests that stand firmly behind the leaders of both Canada and the USA.

The next two years will be critical! Thats all the time they have and they will be moving as fast as they can to secure control of all energy resources at the expense of the environment. That means they control the economy, too.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Kaleea
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 01:39 AM

When a texas oilman (who just happens to be the prez & don't forget that the vice prez's family fortune was made being a texas oilman despite his place of residence) tells people that they are "addicted" to oil, it can only mean that he is looking for a place to point the finger (guess which one). Even a texas oilman can see that the at some point in the not too distant future the world will have to find other sources of energy, but first--cutting us off from foreign/middle eastern oil will mean that he will be able to sell more of his domestic oil, thus making the maximum $$ off of john q public before someone else gets into office and decides to limit domestic oil production, & put funding into serious alternative energy.

guest--yes, it is rubbed on, as most hand & body lotions/moisturizers are made from oil products. As are a multitude of other products such as carpet & rugs, plastics (did you ever wonder why carpets & plastics smell so foul nowadays?), & whatever else the oil companies can invent to sell us to get "addicted" to.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Teribus
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 07:01 AM

GUEST,Boab - 05 Feb 06 - 12:11 AM

"The business sections of the press I've been reading taday [Sunday] are assuring readers that the future energy requirements of the oil-addicted [!!] USA will NOT be assured by alternative energy sources,, but by the oil sands of Alberta, Canada. Nobody really believed GW., ---did they----?"

All a matter of economics, oil as conventionally extracted and refined costs something between $4 and $7 dollars a barrel, to produce that same barrel of oil from oil-sand or from shale costs something in the region of $35 to $40 dollars a barrel. With the market price for oil up at $65 dollars a barrel the oil-sand and shale alternatives become economically viable. In terms of reserves of oil from shale sources alone within the United States of America you have supplies for the next 400 years.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: gnomad
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 09:31 AM

Wonder if it went anything like this?

About 1999, scene is a Texas yard lunch meeting, informally dressed gents of middle age are attended by a number of younger men and women. They are more formally (and expensively) dressed, they are of the "sharpest lawyer/accountant that nobody else ever heard of" caste.

1] Life's looking good about now, hmm?

2] Yeah, but we need to think long term. The way we're pumping right now US supplies won't last another couple-a generations, and the Arabs are just waiting to screw us when there's only their stuff left.

1] You're right there, I'm moving a bit into those Cannuck interests, no good for now of course, but when the price goes up and they come on stream, well I'll be in there.

2] Did alright that way with the Limeys didn't you?

1] OK, but it was just pocket change, and look attem now, blown it all and having to import again. No, what I need is to sort out the Arabs.

2] But how, we just had a war there and it made no diff?

1] Another war, only this time we make it hurt. If we stay we can maybe get ahold of their oil, good for us, we use their stuff until it runs out, and we still got our own. Or maybe we just stir that pot until nobody can get anything from there and we get even more for ours.

2] I like how that sounds, but we still end up running out don't we? Even with your Cannuck interests?

1] So what are you doing?

2] I'm thinking about alternatives, you know renewables, nuclear?

1] No money there, just a lot of crunch-heads and treee-huggers.

2] Maybe, but we get in at the ground floor, then when the big switch comes it's still our hands on the wheel. I got my guy Grunt researching outfits, buying into probable players, you want some of that?

1 beckons an aide across.

1] You have a new assignment. Talk with Grunt, he'll fill you in, we're looking into alternative energy technology.

Aide] ?

1] No, this time we're buying, not sabotage, but ve-e-ry quietly, don't want to startle the horses just yet. Oh and see about setting up a few perfesserships and scholarships in the same line, a few tame eggheads could be useful and it'll be tax-deductible.




2006, evening inside Northfork ranch, 1 is at the telephone.

1] ..so it ain't going well in Iraq, George, well we did see that as a possible outcome, history only forgets the leaders who don't have a war. Just stir the pot like we said, you'll come out OK.

G] Inaudible

1] Of course we covered your tracks, ours too, we've all been in this a long time remember?

G] Inaudible

1] Yes, it's time to start the withdrawal treatment, all the ducks are in line. You tell 'em they're hooked and have to swear off, and that you'll help. Come on like Mr Goodguy who puts tax money into research, save the nation an' all, and who owns the research, WE DO. Peachy.

G] Inaudible

1] No we have't sold-out in oil, that's the beauty of it. Sure they'll squeal while there's any left, and they'll pay whatever they've got. Some will buy the last of the oil whatever it costs 'em, some will sell their kids' eyes for the latest woodchip-powered lentil farm. It's all good as long as it's us that's selling.
They're addicted I tell you, addicted to power. Who knows addiction better than a dealer? Say, you might use that in the speech, addicted to power?

G] Inaudible

1] Yeah, better say oil, not power, don't want that idea floating free.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: kendall
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 02:54 PM

When Bush took office, gasoline was $1.50 per gallon. Recently, it peaked at over $3.00 per gallon. EXXON/Mobil sucked in over $36,000.000 in profits last year, and our government allows this profiteering to go on. Now, I'll make a prediction, the day congress agrees to allow drilling in the last pristine wilderness in the country, the price will drop because that's what they really want, and we are being held hostage until the thieving bastards get it.

RE ELECT NO INCUMBENT

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,dianavan
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 04:46 PM

You're right, kendall.

They not only want to drill in Alaska and jeopardize the calving grounds of the cariboo, they want to drill in Johstone Strait, an important feeding ground for several pods of killer whales. Until they get to drill in these wilderness areas, the price of oil will continue to climb. It is the cariboo and whale who are being threatened and we must pay the ransom to the hostage-takers.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Ron Davies
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 04:58 PM

Teribus--

You don't have much of a memory, do you? Any smug assurance that the oil sands of Alberta will take care of the US should be tempered with the realization that the US is not the only bidder for that energy. Try Canada itself, China--and possibly India. And this has been discussed before.

Also, pray tell, what is your source that there are "shale sources alone" within the US to take care of US needs "for the next 400 years"? I can tell you that is not what the Wall St Journal reporting is saying.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Deda
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 05:19 PM

Since about 1980 we have lost 500,000 square miles of ice in the arctic circle. That's twice the size of Texas that used to be ice and isn't anymore. See photos here.
And Government-appointed idiots at NASA refuse to allow the reports to go out unedited. Political appointees and THE WHITE HOUSE are reviewing all climate-related press releases.
NY Times story here, if you can access it.

Can't let the lemmings (oh, that would be us, by the way -- and our children and grand-children) get high blood pressure before they leap, now, can we?

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 08:46 PM

It's bad enough being tagged as an addict--it's worse when the guy tagging you is a pusher.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 06 Feb 06 - 11:34 AM

$3.00 a gallon and you are complaining ! Try paying $3.00 a litre NOW that Hurts.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 06 Feb 06 - 11:51 AM

OK so I exagerate a little.

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: DougR
Date: 06 Feb 06 - 09:18 PM

Bush is criticized because he is the tool of "Big" oil. Bush says we are too dependent on oil and he is criticized. Suppose Bush could say "anything" (other than I quit) that critics here on the Mudcat would not criticize?

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: GUEST,dianavan
Date: 07 Feb 06 - 12:41 AM

Well, you know Doug, I think we are beyond criticizing and are now laughing out loud. Why should be believe anything he says?

Subject: RE: BS: Americans addicted to oil
From: Ron Davies
Date: 07 Feb 06 - 06:29 AM

Sorry Doug, Bush would have to take Cheney with him to warrant a bit of praise.

There might also be the little matter of confessing that the Iraq war was unnecessary, entirely his choice, and that he had misled the country into it by his regime's classic propaganda campaign. He might possibly have to admit that, far from considering all points of view, he had made his decision to invade--and then communicated, long before the invasion itself, all the way down the line, that he did not want to hear any information which contradicted his decision to go to war.

There might even possibly be some other items, which I suspect other posters could mention.