BS: Iraq vets on tv

Subject: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: GUEST,wordy
Date: 29 Mar 06 - 05:23 PM

Just watched on BBC tv the vets marching to new orleans and telling their stories. No different to Vietnam. De-humanise the people, kill at will, carry shovels in your vehicle so when you shoot someone by the side of the road you can throw it out and say they were digging a bomb. One poor lad had killed a child and nothing could get it out of his head and his heart. Somehow they have returned as good people, who, having seen evil done, have changed. But at what a cost to the rest of their lives.
I don't suppose Fox news carries their story too much does it? How much does America hear from these men of testament?

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: Jeri
Date: 29 Mar 06 - 06:30 PM

Wordy, we don't seem to be getting squat on it. I just Googled, and aside from UK papers and local US ones, there isn't much on the march. Here's the story from the Guardian. I usually watch a bit of news, but not a lot, and I may have missed it.

I expect a lot of blinkered war enthusiasts who weren't there will object to what these people say they feel about killing civilians, including children, and say it's propaganda. It happens in war. It shouldn't ever be accepted, though, any more than torture should.

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Mar 06 - 06:48 PM

You haven't necessarily missed it. It should be available via the BBC website, when they update the "Newsnight weekly highlights" on Friday.

See this page.

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: artbrooks
Date: 29 Mar 06 - 07:47 PM

That's the march from Mobile to new Orleans last week, right? Here is the ABC coverage, and even something from Fox. There were marches all over the US.

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: katlaughing
Date: 29 Mar 06 - 10:08 PM

Jeri, thank you very much for the link to the Guardian article.

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: Barry Finn
Date: 30 Mar 06 - 12:10 AM

Where are the advanced notices of these marches that no one hears about until well after it's over. It's no wonder they're so small when they probably would've been massive if the public had known before hand. I don't have the good legs to march but I do have the time & will.
Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: katlaughing
Date: 30 Mar 06 - 01:47 AM

Good question, Barry. I went looking and found the Iraq Veterans Against the War site with lots of links to ways to help change the situation, including the Blue Ribbon Campaign.

There is also an interesting article on their site which talks about how under-reported their marching was: click.

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: Barry Finn
Date: 30 Mar 06 - 02:59 AM

Thanks Kat. I did get some good bookmarks.
Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: akenaton
Date: 30 Mar 06 - 03:43 AM

Hi Barry..I saw the Newsnight footage of the march to New Oreans.

I also remember the mass protests over the Vietnam war.
There was no similarity, I'm afraid people have changed and these protestors seemed to be viewed by most of the public as sad, eccentric, losers.

Even here in the UK the anger over the Iraq war, which always involved a large percentage of the population, is starting to subside.
Even film of the butchery of civilians no longer affects them ....maybe for a while ,a day,a week, but it looks like only a very small minority of people have any regard for their fellow creatures and that minority does not include all the "committed" Christians, who should have given their full support to these ex-soldiers on their march.
If the leaders of Christianity in America don't care how can we expect it of "Joe Public"....Ake

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 30 Mar 06 - 04:46 AM

It took an awfully long time before Vietnam became a focus for mass protests, in spite of the fact that the troops involved were conscripts.

As for the UK I think paradoxically the fact that most people are against the war, and the enormous scale of the march against the war on its eve, may actually have defused activism. There hasn't been the same sense of trying to change the way people feel about - people have shown how they feel about it, but there's appears that there is no way of applying that to change anything.

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: akenaton
Date: 30 Mar 06 - 07:37 AM

I think you may have a point McGrath, but what does that say of our "democracy".

How many more years, indeed in our case lifetimes, will need to be wasted on Parliamentary Democracy before we see any real change.

Any change I've seen,appeared on the surface to be beneficial but in the long term has thrown up more new problems than it solved...
I include so called socialist measures in that.
At the end of the day, the same system which promoted war and slavery in the 18th and 19th centuries still exists.

Trouble is when people call for change in the system it is automatically assumed that they wish to replace it with some other method of organising and manipulating one another like Communism or Socialism. These systems will also fail and have no hope of giving humanity what it really wants, freedom and happiness.

Only by embracing the environmental movements...beyond politics, can we begin to change how people think.
Non of the above systems can operate, if we decide the future of the planet and the future of our children mean more than a wasteful selfish lifestyle....Ake

Subject: RE: BS: Iraq vets on tv
From: kendall
Date: 30 Mar 06 - 07:48 AM

One thing we should remember is, those soldiers are in the service because they want to be there, and they don't want to remain Privates. This is especially true of the officers. They will never be promoted if they don't support the war, so they have to "Talk it up."
I've seen many interviews with the military and not one of them was a Private.All were career people.