Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)

Subject: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: Fiolar
Date: 27 Jun 06 - 08:58 AM

The great Kenneth Griffith (1921 - 2006) has sadly passed away on June 25th. He was probably one of the most underated actors of his generation and his work as a film-maker was second to none. Who can forget his fantastic documentary on Michael Collins entitled "Hang Out Your Brightest Colours" which was banned for over twenty years by the Independent Broadcasting Authority. Farwell Kenneth. Say "Hello" to Michael.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: fat B****rd
Date: 27 Jun 06 - 03:46 PM

A bit of a reactionary as I recall. Was he not asked to leave South Africa for stirring things up ?.
Loved him in "Lucky Jim" and other black and white classics. RIP Mr. G.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 27 Jun 06 - 03:54 PM

He was renowned for tackling controversial subjects, including the Boer War (on which he was an expert) and Ireland.

God be kind to him. May he rest in peace.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: Folk Form # 1
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 07:42 AM

I am sorry that he is dead, but I never liked him. His documentaries were controversial, but he always talked to his audience like an impatient school master trying to explain things to a dim child, whom he didn't much like in the first place. He was a self-righteous prig and thought apartheid a good thing. A great loss to humanity -NOT!

Although if you are anti-English (which he was), then you would probably love him. Hence the Boer and IRA sympathies. We (the English) had to endure him living in our country for most of his life. I hope we don't have to endure the indignity of having him buried next to our own dead for eternity.

He was a limited actor and a bit mad too.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 09:20 AM

Wouldn't do to speak out against the English.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: Paco Rabanne
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 09:34 AM

You do more than enough of that yourself Divis. It really is about time that you took that big fat sulky chip off your shoulder.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 09:39 AM

My enemies enemy is my friend!
G

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: Paco Rabanne
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 10:19 AM

My emenies friend is a arse.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 11:37 AM

If and when I require the advice of a snob without substance, be assured Teddy I will call on you.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: GUEST,Martin
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 11:47 AM

Fighting talk from the old "Ginger Beer" in the bow tie !

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: GUEST,r.miat
Date: 10 Jul 06 - 07:58 PM

Griffith happened to be the first westerner to be exspelled for anti apartheid actions in 1952..soooo mr "so pathetically off the mark..the truth to which the english seem to avoid"..go and actually do somthing like Griffith did and make a differance..what a pratt..

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: GUEST,r.miat
Date: 10 Jul 06 - 08:21 PM

A last word for the penguin bloke...Can you really...really be in suuuch denial about the british...the lack of truth..the greed..enjoy the freefall mate 'cos your in a dive..and im sure your just the perfect pilot to bring her down....and trying to get through to people like yourself..well .....the fxxxxx truth of the matter perhaps requires a school master approach..getting through to his dim pupils...no ..actually its a waste of time..

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Kenneth Griffith
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 10 Jul 06 - 08:23 PM

which one was he in Lucky Jim?

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Jul 06 - 11:30 PM

Lucky Jim

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 11 Jul 06 - 05:12 AM

Also in The Abominable Dr Phibes I see, a certain Portaferry lass's semi eponymous film.
G

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 11 Jul 06 - 06:30 AM

I remember him now, he was brilliant. that's what I call a significant contribution to the nation's culture. he was an artist, and in my book they're allowed to be a bit bonkers.

In fact several of my favourite artists have been raving mad. Are you going to forego and demonise WH Auden because he proclaimed himself a comuunist when Stalin was at his homicidal worst.

bury the bugger wherever he wants. Its the least we can do for him.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 11 Jul 06 - 07:00 AM

Read some of his work on the Boer War Al. A great guy, will be remembered. Bless him.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: kendall
Date: 11 Jul 06 - 07:45 AM

Speaking of the Boer War, has anyone seen BREAKER MORANT? One of the best films I have ever seen.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 11 Jul 06 - 09:04 AM

No wasn't aware of it, but will watch out for it, thanks Kendall.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Fiolar
Date: 12 Jul 06 - 08:59 AM

Kendall: I agree. Edward Woodward as Morant was great.
Divis: It was released in 1980 and is the true story of Harry Harbord Morant who was born in Somerset and went to Australia in 1883. Under the pseudonym "Breaker" he contributed ballads to the Sydney magazine "The Bulletin". He joined the Australian army in 1899 and fought in the Boer War. He was executed for the shooting of some Boers who were apparently coming to surender. It was mainly politics that caused his execution. One of the lines in the film is great. When asked by what rule he fought, he retorted "Rule Three-O-bloody-Three".
I recall watching an interview with Edward Woodward on TV. He discussed the film and said that when he and his fellow actor were walking to the execution site, he reached out and took his hand and together they walked to the chairs in which they sat. That was not in the script and he said it was a very moving moment.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 12 Jul 06 - 10:39 AM

Thanks Fiolar for that. Just checked there on ebay, see it there on DVD. Will get it. Again thanks for that.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Jul 06 - 12:01 PM

I only remember him in 'Only Two Can Play' - exchange with Peter Sellers on the doorstep:

"Are you going out?"
"If I was coming in I'd be pointing the other way, wouldn't I."

(Or words to that effect, it was a long time ago)

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: ard mhacha
Date: 12 Jul 06 - 12:15 PM

His potrait on film of Michael Collins was a masterpiece, a very much underrated man, he will be sadly missed by those people who opposed colonialism, may the sod rest lightly on this son of Wales.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 13 Jul 06 - 12:16 PM

BBC Wales Obit

Nigel

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Jul 06 - 06:47 PM

A fine actor. At his best when others wrote the lines.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Jul 06 - 06:48 PM

PS - what is it about acting that people so respect?

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: GUEST,Penguin Egg
Date: 14 Jul 06 - 07:40 AM

Griffith's film about Michael Collins was Griffith at his worst. His school-masterly delivery and pompus proclomations totally distracted from the subject. He could talk down to a giraffe without any problem.
Say hello to Michael in Hell, Kenneth.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: GUEST,Penguin Egg
Date: 14 Jul 06 - 07:46 AM

r.miatt. fighting my way through the dense fog of your grammer, I gather you think I am in denial of the British. Explain yourself. I am fully aware of our contribution to science, the arts, literature, philosophy, music etc. God, what a great country. It makes me so proud.. but then I suppose it depends on where I look...as it depends on where you look.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: ard mhacha
Date: 14 Jul 06 - 01:51 PM

His potrait of Collins was a masterpiece, so good that the BBC were frightened to show it , God rest your Soul Ken. a great Welshman and friend of Ireland.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Jul 06 - 04:57 PM

never seen the film about Collins. i liked the line about talking down to a giraffe, is it original? well done anyway.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Folk Form # 1
Date: 15 Jul 06 - 01:10 PM

Not my line, weelittledrummer,I got it from Time Out magazine who were talking about someone else. I wish I had thought it up.

Trust you to like Griffith, ard.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 15 Jul 06 - 02:59 PM

you know what they say PE: talent borrows, genius steals......nice use of metaphor. well done!

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 15 Jul 06 - 03:11 PM

Al if you want the film Grifith did on Collins it's called "Hang out your brightest Colours" pm me address again. He also did another one Called "Curious Journey" about the rising of 1916,will post both of on Monday if you want them.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: ard mhacha
Date: 15 Jul 06 - 04:08 PM

I had another look at that Griffiths masterpiece on Collins, he really lashed into the colonial scum, a great man.
His Boer War series pointed out the cruelty of Britains concentration camps, Baden `puffter` Powell the boy scouts founder was the brains behind this abomination, Griffiths Boer War series was another exposure of the evil empire.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Jul 06 - 06:13 PM

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 15 Jul 06 - 06:55 PM

Dear Fiolar and Kendall.
Many thanks for the leg up about the film Breaker Morant. Taking your advice,I won a copy on ebay which arrived today, watched it tonight. Without doubt one of the finest films I have seen recently. Many thanks
DS

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: GUEST,Richard Miat
Date: 15 Jul 06 - 07:12 PM

Well...Mr Penguin...."a huge loss to humanity-not" is really a ridiculous statement...i mean come on now....He really made an exercise for delivering a point of view to what he deemed a conditioned audience...i.e an ignorant audience,people who refuse,probably out of lazyness,to question the TRUTH(you know that one) about the appalling track record this country has commited through the centuries in a style,whether you liked his style or not compelled people to watch him..its DIFFERANT ..its INNOVATIVE .The fact that we have succeeded in those fields you mentioned is certainly at the exspense of many campaigns of brutality and GREED that resulted in a third of the worlds surface being British..
As for his Boer/Irish sympathies or any subject Griffith tackled...you find me one...one historical fact that was incorrect..just one ...i mean the very second the british got a sniff of cash..diamonds..they set out with huge brutality to take south Africa like a spoilt child ..simple greed..and with regards to Ireland,i cant point you out the injustices there,that is for you to do,if i had to i'd be here all night..is it that people like yourselves just potter along blindfolded..relishing in the great artistic,scientific trophies of nationhood.(hehe).shall you not for a second spare a thought about how we became so 'great'..we have sooo much,really,to be ashamed of..
Dont fret,he was buried in Wales ...I can imagine him loving someone like yourself...He would have demolished you intellectually...very quickly.xxi know my grammer is appalling,sorry.RM//

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Folk Form # 1
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 04:43 AM

Well Mr Miat,I do not deny that the British have done some terrible things in their time and I never have done. I have not even critised Michael Collins, whom I do admire. The British concentration camps in South Africa deserve nothing but condemnation. I would not argue otherwise. I was criticising Griffith's style- his delivery, if you will. I do not like being talked to like a child. I was also suspicious of his agenda - ready to criticise Britain (England especially), slow to put britain and it's actions into context. In the 19th Century, imperialism was accepted as normal, as it had been throughout history going back 1000s of years. The concentration camps were closed down by the British when the people realised what was going on, and they were the exception, not the norm. As for Ireland, it should be noted that it was a part of the United Kingdom and it's people had the same rights (including voting rights) as the people of, say, Kent. Would you say that the people of Kent were oppressed by Britian? Incidentally, South Africa belonged neither to the Boers or the British, but to the Africans. Griffith said not a word about them, but then they are black, aren't they and so don't count-well, at least not in Griffith's world.

My sympathies go out to the people of Wales where he is going to be buried. What have they ever done to him?

Your grammer is improving, by the way.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Folk Form # 1
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 04:56 AM

Just to support my argument, even the golden age of Athens had slavery, genocide and imperialism. You should not try and view the past through modern eyes. You could go on about "appalling track record this country has commited through the centuries." I could go on about it's achievements. Unfortunately, they often go together. The fact that Griffith's concentrated on one and ignored the other made me suspect his motives. His death is a loss to the enemies of Britain and to self loathing Englishman, like yourself Mr Miat.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: ard mhacha
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 05:22 AM

During the Boer War the British Concentation camps were responsible for the deaths of 27,000 Boers, of whom 24,000 were children, these people were held as hostages to hasten the Boers surrender.
Kitchener seen that they had the desired effect and had them closed down when the Boers were on the verge of defeat.

The closure of these Camps and public opinion in England arrived too late for the unfortunate Boers, who died to foster the evil empire.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Folk Form # 1
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 06:56 AM

Not true, ard.... you should not listen to everything that Griffith tells you. The british government closed them down when they realised what was going on in those camps. It is a shame Griffith's lies did not die with him. The British Empire was no more evil than, say, The French Empire, or Spanish, or Portugese. More of a mixture of good and bad.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 07:08 AM

So Penguin Egg, who did run the camps, Billy Butlin ?

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Folk Form # 1
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 07:11 AM

The British army in South Africa. Concentration camps were never government policy.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 07:26 AM

Lots of events that occurred throughout history Received the convenient label of NOT BEING POLICY. Doesn't take away from the fact they happened.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: ard mhacha
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 08:19 AM

I didn`t have to listen to Griffith to learn of the atrocities committed bt the British in South Africa, the 27,000 were a mere drop in the ocean in comparision to the evil empires record of colonial opression, in the rest of her usurped colonies.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 10:24 AM

My Irish grandad was in the Boer war at the siege of ladysmith. it was very tough living conditions for the average soldier. To give you some idea, he fought throughout the the First World War, and reckoned the conditions in the trenches were a piece of piss compared to the Boer War.

One or two of the things he said to my Grandma about his experiences and thoughts bring you up very sharp. i think it was pretty much a case of no quarter asked or given on either side. And if we are honest - that is how wars are won. Anything else is a betrayal of the men who put their lives on the line for you. Isn't it?

I know personally my family made no profit from the campaign.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: ard mhacha
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 02:00 PM

Weelittledrummer it is highly unlikely that any of the soldiers engaged in any war will profit from it, afterwards some have to march to Jarrow to beg a crust, some reward for spilling their guts for the empire.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: ard mhacha
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 02:13 PM

That should be Jarrow to London,

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 02:38 PM

I dunno Ard - maybe. Certainly my generation benefited greatly from not being under the Nazi jackboot. And from what you've said in previous posts, you yourself seem to feel your country has benefitted from the struggles of the IRA.

The Boer War of course must have been quite popular in England, at least from the point of view of people who did not have to fight it. There were quite a few jolly music hall songs. The Baby's Name, Goodbye Dolly, and I think the By Jingo one. And Wilde was very pro British over the war apparently.

A lot of the lads they gave an army medical to, before signing up were underweight - literally starving. I imagine conditions in England for ordinary folk were that shitty, the Boer war looked like a career opportunity.

A bit like the soldiers on the streets of Nortern Ireland in the Thatcher era. Of course THEY weren't starving when they signed up. But we live in a more materialistic age, people expect more. I expect it looked a better option than the dole queue.- and doing without all those things they advertise on the telly.

like someone said before, you just have to be grateful if you weren't confronted with those sort of choices yourself. well that's what I think.

Subject: RE: Obit: Actor Kenneth Griffith (June 2006)
From: ard mhacha
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 03:45 PM

Weelittle drummer, In all of the 32 counties of Ireland the British Army had soldiers who were glad to sign up for the Brit shilling, poverty and starvation left them with little choice.
Those that were luckly to return from helping their Brit paymasters had learned a salutary lesson, there were no prizes to be had except the dole queue.
I am old enough to have listened to men who were in WW1 and WW2 and the majority were sorry they had ever put on a uniform, the first World War had our local Orangemen singing up in their thousands, unfortunately   many of those men they were sent to to their death at the Somme and also in other fronts they met a similar fate.

The lesson learned the hard way by the Orangemen stood their sons in good stead as conscription, thanks to the southern government was abolished in WW2, and this was met with little protest from our loyal brethern, they were not willing to be cannon fodder in another war. The Orange Order cancelled all marches during the war, it was better that   all of those able-bodied marching behind their banners should not show their faces, at a time when Britain was facing a deadly foe.