Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change

Subject: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 05:16 AM

Starting with a Tech thread so that those who may be affected will be more certain to see it. It may be appropriate to move it below the line if "debate" starts.

The Washington Post has the first report I've seen that an amendment to a finance bill passed by the US Congress a year ago also changed the dates for the starting and ending of Daylight Savings Time in the US. For the past 20 years or so, clocks moved ahead an hour at 02:00 (AM) on the first Sunday in April, and moved back at 02:00 on the last Sunday in October.

In the US, beginning very soon:

Daylight Savings time will begin at 02:00 on MARCH 11, the second Sunday in March, with clocks moving forward one hour.

Daylight Savings time will end on NOVEMBER 4, the first Sunday in November, with clocks moving back one hour.

Story at WP: Clocks to spring forward early. I hope they know what they're talking about, as this is the first - and only - report I've seen.

Apparently few people have noticed this change, including most banks.

The airlines are screaming due to the need to adjust schedules.

Microsoft has reportedly indicated that they expect to have a patch to make the change automatic for some systems, but have indicated that WinXP SP1 users will have to make at least the first change manually. Since many systems probably will make an incorrect change automatically at the old switchover date, that will likely mean TWO manual adjustments, March and April, for SP1 users, and for those using many if not most older systems.

The only ones that the WP found happy with the change were the candy manufacturers, since the change from Oct to Nov will put Halloween within the DST period, giving little beggers and extortionists an extra hour of daylight to acquire candy.

Local publicity can be expected to build, but those who might be travelling across national borders, for gigs or otherwise, should be aware of of the change, and should check to make sure that contacts in the US are aware of it, as it seems to be something that at present everyone responds to with a "SAY WHAT?."

John

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 05:45 AM

G'day JohnIK,

I hadn't realised the US had such a long period of Daylight Saving: formerly (~) 7 months ... and this will make the total closer to 8 months!

Here in Australia we (currently) have 5 months of daylight Saving time (~) November to March... except that Summer Time starts the last Sunday morning before November and changes back the last Sunday morning of March ... and that only applies to the Southern states of the eastern end, since most of the north is tropical and doesn't benefit from Daylight Saving changes (and the big lump in the west ... well, it's the big lump in the west ...).

Regards,

Bob (down where them silly guv'ment changes don't fade the curtains quite so much ...)

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 06:35 AM

Sounds like a nightmare John.
Expect loads of trouble when all the planes from the rest of the world arrive an hour or two earlier or later than you think they are scheduled.
Quack!
GtD.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 09:35 AM

GtD -

I'm sure that's why the airlines are complaining. It couldn't be because they have to reprint all the schedules and are too cheap to hire proofreaders - and KNOW what they're going to get.

Another tinkle in the bucket is that DST is a local option thing, and some local communities (and airports) could just decide to "opt out" due to the "inadequate notice" on this change. That should really wind up the pilots, if two ends of the same runway are in different locales that decide to do it differently.

The article also notes that most BANKS contacted were unaware of this change. Electronic banking transactions are extremely tightly tied to exact timestamps, so the whole system actually could crash over this.

John

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: jeffp
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 09:38 AM

At work, they've already pushed out the patch to handle it. We sent it out to our remote sites this past Monday.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 10:03 AM

Daylight "saving" time is such a crock. I wish they'd leave it always standard time. In the summer, when it is so hot here, I get up and walk my dogs before I go to work. By pushing the work day earlier, it is harder for me to get out in the daylight before my workday begins (I don't walk the dogs in the dark much). I'd like some of that daylight for myself, not only for commerce and such.

SRS

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: MMario
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 10:08 AM

This was announced multiple times when the bill passed; over a year of lead time.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 10:11 AM

Yep, I remember hearing about it in the past year or so. I wish they'd leave it completely alone and get back to what my dad called "gawd's time."

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 10:43 AM

I LOVE daylight savings time and I wish they would extend it even further - perhaps 12 months. I am NOT an early riser by nature. I cherish the summer evenings when I can get home from work and still have a couple of hours of light to putter around the yard. I dread the winter when the sun creeps away so early. It may be "gawds" time, but I do think that we can fool Mother Nature!! Long live daylight savings time!

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 01:21 PM

I love DST also, and I follow the news....and I'll confess *I* never heard about it! Since I am at home most of the time, it's not a big deal for me, but I sure don't envy some folks who have to cope.

The one thing that strikes me is that it will hit during the FSGW Getaway this year...Sunday morning, Nov 4....we may just decide to ignore it for one day.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: bobad
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 01:32 PM

Canada too.

In 2007 Daylight Saving Time begins on the second Sunday in March and ends on the first Sunday in November. This pattern will be followed by all provinces which observe daylight saving time and each province has amended their legislation to reflect this change. Previously, Canada had observed Daylight Saving Time from the first Sunday in April until the last Sunday in October.

This change in Daylight Saving Time will keep Canada's Daylight Saving Time pattern consistent with the United States which enacted into law a broad energy bill that will extend Daylight Saving Time in the same manner.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Ebbie
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 03:10 PM

Good gracious. How did (some of)you miss this? As said above, it was discussed and published more than a year ago. In fact, I remember that I had been under the impression that the change might take place LAST year and had to check on it.

Since time of day is an arbitrary, manmade thing we could easily switch to DST all year 'round and we'd hardly even think about it.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 03:37 PM

Why not just leave the clocks the same all year round, and avoid all this nonsense?

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Donuel
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 04:20 PM

Was it Roosevelt who first employed DST?
I think the last time it was changed was during Nixon's presidency.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 04:22 PM

It is just nuts having it period. It has something to do with cows needing to be milked and factories in WWII. But now that we have elctricity all over...it makes no sense. mg

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Donuel
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 04:34 PM

Maybe if we switched time by 12 hours we would not have to turn on any lights at night.
We would only needs lights during the official day.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 04:44 PM

There are some places that don't use it. I think Indiana finally made the shift (some cities didn't change, as I recall). Arizona stays put all year round.

SRS

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: KB in Iowa
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 04:55 PM

I think Ben Franklin was an early proponent (I guess I could look it up) but I don't know when it became a reality.

I seem to recall that during the energy crisis of the 70's the U.S. proposed going to DST all the time but people were against it because it meant kids would be waiting at the bus stop in the dark. Don't recall if it ever happened or not.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Ebbie
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 04:56 PM

Excerpted From:


"The federal law that established "daylight time" in this country does not require any area to observe daylight saving time. But if a state chooses to observe DST, it must follow the starting and ending dates set by the law. From 1986 to 2006 this has been the first Sunday in April to the last Sunday in October, but starting in 2007, it will be observed from the second Sunday in March to the first Sunday in November, adding about a month to daylight saving time.

"Arizona (with the exception of the Navajo Nation) and Hawaii and the territories of Puerto Rico, Virgin Islands, Guam, and American Samoa are the only places in the U.S. that do not observe DST but instead stay on "standard time" all year long. And if you've spent any time in the sweltering summer sun in those regions you can understand why residents don't need another hour of sunlight.

"Until April 2005, when Indiana passed a law agreeing to observe daylight saving time, the Hoosier state had its own unique and complex time system. Not only is the state split between two time zones, but until recently, only some parts of the state observed daylight saving time while the majority did not.

"Under the old system, 77 of the state's 92 counties were in the Eastern Time Zone but did not change to daylight time in April. Instead they remained on standard time all year. That is, except for two counties near Cincinnati, Ohio, and Louisville, Ky., which did use daylight time.

"But the counties in the northwest corner of the state (near Chicago) and the southwestern tip (near Evansville), which are in the Central Time Zone, used both standard and daylight time.

"As of April 2, 2006, the entire state of Indiana joined 48 other states in observing Daylight Saving Time. But it wasn't quite as simple and straightforward as all that—telling time in Indiana remains something of a bewildering experience: eighteen counties now observed Central Daylight Time and the remaining 74 counties of Indiana observe Eastern Daylight Time."

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Peace
Date: 01 Feb 07 - 04:58 PM

'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone,' it means just what I choose it to mean, neither more nor less.'

'The question is,' said Alice, 'whether you can make words mean so many different things.'

'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master - that's all.'

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Barry Finn
Date: 02 Feb 07 - 12:51 AM

Funny how an Act of the US Congress changes the way nature & the world works, they must be the Gods. May they sleep forever.

Barry

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 02 Feb 07 - 01:10 PM

Nature, last time I looked, does not wear a watch so this change means nothing to them.   For most of us that do wear a watch and punch clocks, daylight savings time is a good thing.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Barry Finn
Date: 02 Feb 07 - 03:13 PM

Does the rest of the world follow our changes, when our changes suit US?

Barry

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Feb 07 - 06:07 PM

it meant kids would be waiting at the bus stop in the dark.

Because the schools wouldn't have the common sense to notice it was dark, and change the school day to match?

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Ebbie
Date: 03 Feb 07 - 03:57 AM

Good point, McGrath. I've never heard of a school district accommodating the change.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: GUEST, Topsie
Date: 03 Feb 07 - 04:55 AM

Anything to do with the fact that this year, without the dates being altered, the change would have happened ON APRIL FOOL'S DAY.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 03 Feb 07 - 08:59 AM

In the UK the chane between Grenwich Mean Time (Winter) and British Summer Time (That wet cold season that feels like winter, but has longer days) always took place on the Sunday following the equinox. Recently it keeps happening on the wrong Sunday. I am pretty sure this is because Government computers have been set to change time by Bill Gates's bods who have their heads stuck so far up where the sun don't shine that they wouldn't know Summer if it bit them.
Quack!
GtD.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 02:37 AM

G'day GeofftD,

I presume that, if you were changing to "British Summer Time" on the Sunday following the [northern Spring] equinox" (say: Sunday 23 April, 2006) ... that you would change back, perhaps, the Sunday following the [northern Autumn] equinox (say: Sunday 23 September 2007) ... so you would have an even 6 months of Daylight Saving (British Summer Time).

What surprised me was that a nation - somewhat closer to the equator and thus deriving less benefit from Daylight Saving Time - should have 7 months of it ... and now change to nearly 8! (I know the 'Merkins' don't believe in doing anything by halves ... but ... ?!?

Regard(les)s,

Bob

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: Bert
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 04:55 PM

I'm with SRS and Kat on this one. Leave the bloody time alone.

If the government were to be truthful about it and say what it really is "WE ARE GOING TO FORCE YOU TO GET UP AN HOUR EARLIER" then nobody would put up with it.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 06:22 PM

"If the government were to be truthful about it and say what it really is "WE ARE GOING TO FORCE YOU TO GET UP AN HOUR EARLIER" then nobody would put up with it."

Well, that's more or less how they put it when it was introduced in the UK, I believe. But that was as part of the War Effort in the Great War, so they could get away with it.   

Why it didn't get abolished back in 1919, I've never understood. Inertia, I suppose.

Subject: RE: Tech: US Daylight Savings Time Change
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 05 Feb 07 - 07:42 PM

A patch is available from Microsoft for WinXP¹ people, to change the switchover date to conform for "many countries" that have adjusted their DST on/off dates.

A separate patch is available for Aussies, but there's no description of what the "special changes" were there. Apparently they're "complex?"

Both of these' patches, since they're not "Security Critical," are shown as "optional" at the Microsoft Update site, and likely will be the same at the Windows Update site. THEY WILL NOT BE SENT AUTOMATICALLY.

If you want your WinXP 'puter fixed to switch automatically on the "new modified change dates" YOU MUST VISIT THE UPDATE SITES and do a CUSTOM patch and select the appropriate optional one(s).

There may be a patch for Win2K SP4 users, but I didn't try to look for it.

¹ Win XP SP1 is officially "unsupported" now so this patch may or may not be available if you're not up to SP2 status.

John